|
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
|
svasanvedana
johnson

Registered: 09/02/05
Posts: 47
Last seen: 13 years, 8 months
|
how much cappi do you use?
#8023957 - 02/14/08 07:00 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Hello, This weekend I'm giving ayahuasca another try, and this time I want it be as powerful as I've tried to make it the last 3 times.
The only time it ever worked was the previous time. That time I had about 1/4lb or so. I dont like to compare ayahuasca's effects to other plants because it (to me) is so much more, but my intoxication level was equivolent to the body high of 50mg of oxy or so, and the mental high of half an 8th of cubensis. I made it by boiling the shredded vine (can't remember exact temp but not to high to risk alkaloid decay); with 3 extractions/filterings over around 20 hours, then a reduction to a drikable amount. For the last extraction I added about 1/3cup of apple cider vinegar.
What is you all's opinion on this? Am I simply not using enough vine for a caapi-only experience? I've read full doses used in the amazon can be up to a pound of super-fresh/potent vine. I certainly think I"m boiling the stuff long enough, and have done all the necessary mental/spiritual preparation.
This time I'm going to give half a pound a try. All the times I've made it its been from the same vendor (out of respect for them I wont post their name =P), but for this run I got whole vine instead of shredded (doing so by hand is a real bitch BTW!) so Im hoping maybe this will be more fresh?
Also two other things I was curious about. 1) freezing ayahuasca--only found one post referencing it being fine, just want to make sure since Ill have an extra half pound made. 2) why the heck dont people use yopo seeds for DMT extractions? a little bit of seed powder is way easier to extract than a pile of hard root bark...
Thanks for any insight,
|
svasanvedana
johnson

Registered: 09/02/05
Posts: 47
Last seen: 13 years, 8 months
|
Re: how much cappi do you use? [Re: svasanvedana]
#8024039 - 02/14/08 07:15 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Just found the reference that had made me skeptical about MAOI breakdown. A poorly treated sample over a hundred years old had nearly identical content to a new sample. http://www.erowid.org/library/books_online/tihkal/tihkal13.shtml (under further extensions and commentary)
Anyone know of any major studies of the content of alkaloids among numerous specimens of vine? I'm aware that shamans have their own special caapi sources, and recipes I've read on shroomery list vine dosage anywhere from 1 to 5 ounces.
|
ReoSpeedwagon153


Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
|
Re: how much cappi do you use? [Re: svasanvedana]
#8026978 - 02/15/08 11:46 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
You'll get a better answer in another forum (psychedelic experience maybe).
Caapi potency varies a WHOLE lot, so there is no standard dosage. They say to start with 30-50g and work your way up though.
And people don't extract yopo because you would yield a lot of 5-meo DMT and other similar alkaloids, and most just want straight up n,n DMT.
-------------------- “I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”
|
schmutzen
King of the side-pins


Registered: 12/03/02
Posts: 15,314
Loc: Miss Kitty's Lounge
Last seen: 4 hours, 34 minutes
|
Re: how much cappi do you use? (moved) [Re: svasanvedana]
#8026997 - 02/15/08 11:52 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
This thread was moved from Other Drugs Discussion.
Reason: No dosage advice in ODD.
|
primativezen
dream yogi


Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 132
Loc: sunny country
Last seen: 15 years, 3 months
|
Re: how much cappi do you use? [Re: svasanvedana]
#8027046 - 02/15/08 12:11 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
you should check out http://forums.ayahuasca.com/ there is one tek called the hummingbird's brew by napoleon blownapart, and you only need 30 grams of caapi and 5 grams of mimosa for a powerful experience. the key is the acid your using, and apparently phosphoric acid is the way to go. if you wanna try this out, you can get the acid here for only $3 plus shipping. i've read countless rave reviews of this tek, can't wait til i have enough money to get some mimosa and caapi and give it a go.
good luck and let me know if you try it out
-------------------- Deadly, tasty, or bitter and spacey!
|
ReoSpeedwagon153


Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
|
Re: how much cappi do you use? [Re: primativezen]
#8027242 - 02/15/08 01:06 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
30 grams of caapi is NOT GOING TO DO IT if it's not potent enough, no matter what tek you use...
-------------------- “I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”
|
svasanvedana
johnson

Registered: 09/02/05
Posts: 47
Last seen: 13 years, 8 months
|
|
I dont see why acid should be NECESSARY, considering its never used traditionally. Its also never quadruple extracted-filtered, and I doubt temp is regulated much when you're using a wood fire with a cauldron.
The more I read the more it seems the huge variation in ayahuasca potency is due to different alkaloid level among specimens (not to mention the possible variation in intensity due to different ratios of the various alkaloids found in caapi!). Plants like cannabis certainly have great variety in potency and effect among specimens--Maybe Caapi is the same?
|
OneMoreRobot3021



Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 61,024
Loc: the sky
|
Re: how much cappi do you use? [Re: svasanvedana]
#8028395 - 02/15/08 05:47 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
svasanvedana said: I dont see why acid should be NECESSARY, considering its never used traditionally.
Why are we, as 21th Century psychonauts, supposed to adhere to the traditions and customs of indigenous plant-and-vine-using tribes when creating our own psychedelic rituals and experiences? To me it's actually silly to try and recreate those indigenous traditions and rituals outside the context of actually sitting in with one of those tribes.
-------------------- Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake. -Erik Davis
|
svasanvedana
johnson

Registered: 09/02/05
Posts: 47
Last seen: 13 years, 8 months
|
|
I could care less about native traditionals in a ceremonial sense--their ceremonies are designed to psyche out people of THEIR culture into a stronger trip, not people of my own. However, they have been cooking powerful batches for thousands of years, and if they never needed an acid to get the desired alkaloid content, why do I?
Simply a combination of several-thousand-year-old psyche-out-inducing ritual + very potent specimens of vine?
|
primativezen
dream yogi


Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 132
Loc: sunny country
Last seen: 15 years, 3 months
|
Re: how much cappi do you use? [Re: svasanvedana]
#8042137 - 02/19/08 10:07 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
svasanvedana said: I dont see why acid should be NECESSARY, considering its never used traditionally. Its also never quadruple extracted-filtered, and I doubt temp is regulated much when you're using a wood fire with a cauldron.
The more I read the more it seems the huge variation in ayahuasca potency is due to different alkaloid level among specimens (not to mention the possible variation in intensity due to different ratios of the various alkaloids found in caapi!). Plants like cannabis certainly have great variety in potency and effect among specimens--Maybe Caapi is the same?
[quote="I am"]I dreamt about this tec.. My dream guide followed the directions precisely and advised me to cut all normal dose of caapi in half and add mhrb as needed. (Normal is 30g Caapi, 20-30g mhrb)
This was a really smooth experience from the beginning and I found that dreaming with 15 g of caapi and app. 5g of mhrb produced an experience that was as strong as 30-30 using ascorbic acid. (I'm pretty sensitive so I am usually careful about going overboard in dreams)
Thanks for the tec. and the cautions about the strength.
There are countless more of these reviews on an 11 page thread about this tek. For a decently potent brew, you MUST use an acid, whether is HCL or lemon juice, otherwise you will just be wasting tons of expensive vine. It only costs $8 for the phosphoric with shipping, how can you refute that if just a few drops halves the amount of ingredient you normally use?? I find your statement to be just plain ignorant.
As to varying potency, yes that does occur. The larger older vines are almost always more potent. Also, when buying caapi, the purple core is sometimes sold without the outer bark, which is more potent, but also more expensive. If your serious about ayahuasca, get off shroomery.org and check out ayahuasca.com. You can find everything you need there, including where to get the most potent vine (for the price and reliability 100 Herb Galaxy)
And why don't the shamans use an acid? Because they have all the vine they need, they just walk around and find it for free
Don't take my word for it though.....
-------------------- Deadly, tasty, or bitter and spacey!
Edited by primativezen (02/19/08 10:09 AM)
|
thedudenj
Man of the Woods

Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 14,684
|
Re: how much cappi do you use? [Re: primativezen]
#8043153 - 02/19/08 02:43 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
ill answer that other question yes freeze it freeze the remains of my brew and sometimes the brew if it isnt all drank. I do single brews most the time tho there occasional triple brews which i still save that stuff and reuse it. i really question at what point it becomes spent, where that line of water to drug soluablity lies( in the sense of where people that say do this and they are liers and where the actually point of maxium soluablity is.) but then again they arnt entirly lieing if they dont know, and only giving from experience.
--------------------
  "You all are just puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain..."" you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours
Edited by thedudenj (02/19/08 02:45 PM)
|
ReoSpeedwagon153


Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
|
Re: how much cappi do you use? [Re: primativezen]
#8046470 - 02/20/08 09:33 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Dude, the average dose of caapi ranges from fifteen grams to over four hundred.
That sounds like a pretty wide variance in caapi potency, too much to offer a comprehensive 'tek' complete with dosage guides.
Maybe you can get a good dose from fifteen grams by using phosphoric acid AND potent vine, but some vine is not going to work at fifteen grams.
And of course, maybe some of us don't want to add an extremely strong acid to a brew we plan to drink. Go ahead and call it ignorance if you want...
-------------------- “I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”
|
|