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grasshoppa
traveling healer


Registered: 09/03/06
Posts: 59
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to the believers
#8023724 - 02/14/08 06:17 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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first off. i think valentines day should go back to being a feast for the 2 or possibly more christian martyrs named valentine like it use to be. love is for every day. secondly i just want to ask you what was the exact moment or expierience that made you believe 100% and what is it you believe in 100%?
-------------------- THE FIVE PRINCIPLES OF REIKI Just for today I will not be angry. Just for today I will not worry. Earn your living honestly. Honor your parents, teachers and elders. Show gratitude to every living thing.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: to the believers [Re: grasshoppa]
#8023747 - 02/14/08 06:22 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Why should one believe in something for which there is exactly zero evidence?
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deranger


Registered: 01/21/08
Posts: 6,840
Loc: off the wall
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Re: to the believers [Re: grasshoppa]
#8023750 - 02/14/08 06:22 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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grasshoppa
traveling healer


Registered: 09/03/06
Posts: 59
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Re: to the believers [Re: deranger]
#8023783 - 02/14/08 06:27 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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thats what i am trying to find out. what is it that brings people to that point. it looks cool and all but seems highly illogical
-------------------- THE FIVE PRINCIPLES OF REIKI Just for today I will not be angry. Just for today I will not worry. Earn your living honestly. Honor your parents, teachers and elders. Show gratitude to every living thing.
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Kamek


Registered: 01/08/05
Posts: 2,923
Last seen: 8 months, 6 days
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Re: to the believers [Re: grasshoppa]
#8023873 - 02/14/08 06:46 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Invalid poll...
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AlteredAgain
Visual Alchemist



Registered: 04/27/06
Posts: 11,181
Loc: Solar Circuit
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Re: to the believers [Re: grasshoppa]
#8023989 - 02/14/08 07:06 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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i believe in the possibility of an after life, but won't revolve my life around the idea.
and yes, the poll fails.
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WhiskeyClone
Not here



Registered: 06/25/01
Posts: 16,509
Loc: Longitudinal Center of Canada ...
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Re: to the believers [Re: grasshoppa]
#8026328 - 02/15/08 09:08 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I wonder if there is anything I believe 100%. Is there ever a reason to believe something 100%?
-------------------- Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man. For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire. Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it. ~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Is there ever a reason to believe something 100%?
How about fear.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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WhiskeyClone
Not here



Registered: 06/25/01
Posts: 16,509
Loc: Longitudinal Center of Canada ...
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Re: to the believers [Re: Icelander]
#8026525 - 02/15/08 10:17 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Touche
-------------------- Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man. For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire. Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it. ~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"
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backfromthedead
Activated


Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 3,592
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
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Re: to the believers [Re: grasshoppa]
#8026790 - 02/15/08 11:13 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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An organizing force. I saw it working its magic by advancing my consciousness to surf the crest of this moment. Now is an interference pattern. Its produced by highly organized systems of interaction. The sum of whose parts would be called God. The experience was one of recognizing what exactly was influencing the flow of reality. I believe and am relieved but was deceived when seemingly achieved. I only fear those who can run plays effectively and manipulate the collective that we are all plugged into. (911)
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backfromthedead
Activated


Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 3,592
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
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Afterlife?? Yes. Only because it is useful in this life.
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Ginseng1
Elegant Universe



Registered: 09/02/04
Posts: 3,310
Last seen: 9 years, 4 months
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I choose to believe that there is a possibility of an after-life, considering the possibility of extra-dimensions and energy that we have yet to expose.
-------------------- Flowing through beginningless time since time without beginning...
Edited by Ginseng1 (02/15/08 01:40 PM)
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Ginseng1
Elegant Universe



Registered: 09/02/04
Posts: 3,310
Last seen: 9 years, 4 months
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Quote:
backfromthedead said: Afterlife?? Yes. Only because it is useful in this life.
-------------------- Flowing through beginningless time since time without beginning...
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mushbaby
woodswalker




Registered: 09/30/06
Posts: 2,645
Loc: in my own lil world
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Re: to the believers [Re: grasshoppa]
#8029561 - 02/15/08 11:00 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I don't know, but I hope so.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: to the believers [Re: mushbaby]
#8029670 - 02/15/08 11:36 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I know there is an afterlife, and I hope to survive it with memories of this incarnation intact.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: to the believers [Re: Middleman]
#8029999 - 02/16/08 02:13 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
I know there is an afterlife...
B-e-c-a-u-s-e ?
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: to the believers [Re: Middleman]
#8030039 - 02/16/08 02:48 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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This is the rational forum wherein we at least make some small attempt to share our reasoning. Making flat statements with no backing precludes any form of learning.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Oh so we are here to learn, not to strengthen our sense of self by proclaiming our opinions and making wise cracks while chastising those with different views. Cool.
I just thought I would spare you the tale of my subjective flat-line experience, and hearsay from questionable sources.
Consider the possibility that the elaborate preparations for death and methods of navigation through the afterlife, developed over thousands of years by ancient Asians, Indians, Egyptians, Native Americans and Western Occultists, were not 'mere superstition' and they just might have known what they were doing...
I guess we have just have different definitons of 'evidence'. 
How does one substantiate the insubstantial?
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: to the believers [Re: Middleman]
#8030092 - 02/16/08 03:41 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Oh so we are here to learn, not to strengthen our sense of self by proclaiming our opinions and making wise cracks while chastising those with different views. Cool. Nice editorial, I guess.
Quote:
Consider the possibility that the development of elaborate preparations for death and methods of navigation through the afterlife over thousands of years by ancient Asians, Indians, Egyptians, Native Americans and Western Occultists were not 'mere superstition' and they just might have known what they were doing...
There is no evidence that anyone has 'navigated the afterlife' except in tall tales.
Age and numbers, eh? Does that make truth?
Primitive cultures still alive today have many erroneous views on disease and the transmission of pathogens. So what? A longly held ignorant belief is still false. Time does not really come into the equation, now does it?
Millions of believers hold views contrary to the belief of other groups of millions of believers. Which to believe? I say neither. (See the fallacy of large numbers as Diploid stickied.)
While I have no doubt that your flatline experience had a powerful effect on you, it is only evidence of the powerful experience of a severly traumatized LIVING organism and tells us nothing about a dead organism.
In the same way, powerful psychedelic epxeriences speak only about living organisms undergoing a powerful psychedelic experience.
Does a trip to Hawaii tell me anything about Australia?
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Like I said, the sources are questionable, but the possibility exists.
Impressive argument though, your logic is rock solid. Good luck with that. 
I for one am learning how to lucid dream and will prepare for death in natural surroundings. I suspect that it's important. 
Have you seen the documentary about the kid in India that described his previous life, found his previous parents and had a birth mark where he was previously shot?
It's very interesting...
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: to the believers [Re: Middleman]
#8030112 - 02/16/08 04:05 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Impressive argument, your logic is rock solid. Good luck with that.
There is no luck with rationality. It is the way ALL advancements are made. Every single one. Superstition only leads backwards not forwards.
And your argument contains several standard recognized fallacies that one having been here for so long should have learned by now. Diploid stickied that thread for a reason.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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What can I say, my logic is fuzzy. 
Why do skeptics seem to have a genuine disinterest in pursing valid leads?
"What the skeptic thinks, the disprover disproves."
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: to the believers [Re: Middleman]
#8030122 - 02/16/08 04:20 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Why do skeptics seem to have a genuine disinterest in pursing valid leads?
*emotional noise overlooked*
Where is the valid lead?
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