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AlteredAgain
Visual Alchemist



Registered: 04/27/06
Posts: 11,181
Loc: Solar Circuit
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On Nothingness
#7999035 - 02/09/08 02:26 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Someone asks you what's up and you say nothing.
"What, nothing? That is not possible."
"How so?"
"Well, by saying nothing you have just said something."

Bingo.
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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I usually answer with "nothing" when I am really deep in my thoughts and look for a quick answer out.  Or when I'm doing something but I don't know how to define it.
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
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> "Well, by saying nothing you have just said something."
Mu
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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Jack Albertson
bismillah rahmani rahim



Registered: 04/14/06
Posts: 10,065
Loc: SOLARIS
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Re: On Nothingness [Re: Seuss]
#7999401 - 02/09/08 08:39 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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if nothing is something, then everything is nothing.
-------------------- Man is timid and apologetic; he is no longer upright; he dares not say "I think," "I am," but quotes some saint or sage. He is ashamed before the blade of grass or the blowing rose.Man postpones or remembers; he does not live in the present, but with reverted eye laments the past, or, heedless of the riches that surround him, stands on tiptoe to foresee the future. He cannot be happy and strong until he too lives with nature in the present, above time TRANSCEND
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AlteredAgain
Visual Alchemist



Registered: 04/27/06
Posts: 11,181
Loc: Solar Circuit
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MushroomTrip, surely this is the kind of application that we are accustomed to. I normally don't give it any conscious thought when I say it, most likely because it is very deeply ingrained in our language.
What I'm doing here is challenging nothing's representation of reality relative to the manner in which we commonly use the word.
Right now I am leaning towards the belief that we are possibly looking at a subtle fallacy in the English language, a kind of comically elusive phenomenon.
If somebody asks you what's up and you say nothing.
And I mean really say nothing-- not a single word.
Then somehow automatically, there is a problem perceived and the person will ask you
"What's wrong?"
I guess what I'm challenging here is whether the word nothing is really needed at all in the context of common conversation.
Why not be silent instead and read each other's eyes for clues of something.
How about just leaving nothing for what it is. 
Hmm...
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Yes, I think it became an accepted fallacy. But imagine this: two people are talking, one of them looking out the window. He is being asked "what do you see?" and he answers "nothing". It's kind of the same thing. But what if those two people were waiting to see something, and that certain something didn't happen? What if the question was referring to that event? This entirely changes the situation. Maybe somewhere back on our minds we think about something when we answer with "nothing". We know what certain people expect from us or usually ask, and this "nothing" means in fact I'm doing nothing from what you expect me to do?
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 3,910
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Not to mention nothing would be absolute zero which is not possible to obtain.
-------------------- ...or something
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Jack Albertson
bismillah rahmani rahim



Registered: 04/14/06
Posts: 10,065
Loc: SOLARIS
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Re: On Nothingness [Re: eve69]
#8002443 - 02/09/08 08:50 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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kelvin?
-------------------- Man is timid and apologetic; he is no longer upright; he dares not say "I think," "I am," but quotes some saint or sage. He is ashamed before the blade of grass or the blowing rose.Man postpones or remembers; he does not live in the present, but with reverted eye laments the past, or, heedless of the riches that surround him, stands on tiptoe to foresee the future. He cannot be happy and strong until he too lives with nature in the present, above time TRANSCEND
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Cubie
Moderator




Registered: 01/11/08
Posts: 8,840
Loc: Down the rabbit hole...
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
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Quote:
AlteredAgain said: Someone asks you what's up and you say nothing.
"What, nothing? That is not possible."
"How so?"
"Well, by saying nothing you have just said something."

Bingo.
I'm guessing you were really fucking bored when you thought this
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: On Nothingness [Re: Cubie]
#8002582 - 02/09/08 09:26 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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AA seems above boredom to me, he was probably just really high and really present.
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AlteredAgain
Visual Alchemist



Registered: 04/27/06
Posts: 11,181
Loc: Solar Circuit
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Re: On Nothingness [Re: Middleman]
#8002706 - 02/09/08 09:48 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Yes I would have never thought about it if I was bored. In boredom all I can think about is boredom itself.
Always transcend the loop.
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
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Re: On Nothingness [Re: eve69]
#8003681 - 02/10/08 04:59 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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> Not to mention nothing would be absolute zero which is not possible to obtain.
Might want to read up on Bose-Einstein Condensates before making such claims. 
From wiki:
Quote:
A Bose–Einstein condensate (BEC) is a state of matter of bosons confined in an external potential and cooled to temperatures very near to absolute zero (0 K or -273.15 °C). Under such supercooled conditions, a large fraction of the atoms collapse into the lowest quantum state of the external potential, at which point quantum effects become apparent on a macroscopic scale.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
Edited by Seuss (02/10/08 05:00 AM)
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 3,910
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Re: On Nothingness [Re: Seuss]
#8003789 - 02/10/08 07:26 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Very near and absolute zero are two different things, like very near NYC can be Jersey or even California, depending upon framework.
-------------------- ...or something
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Cubie
Moderator




Registered: 01/11/08
Posts: 8,840
Loc: Down the rabbit hole...
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
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Re: On Nothingness [Re: eve69]
#8005164 - 02/10/08 03:53 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Imposability and nothing don't exist. Making them nothing. Making nothing exist, oh god thought loop. My futuramma brain is gonna explode
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mushbaby
woodswalker




Registered: 09/30/06
Posts: 2,645
Loc: in my own lil world
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Quote:
MushroomTrip said: Yes, I think it became an accepted fallacy. But imagine this: two people are talking, one of them looking out the window. He is being asked "what do you see?" and he answers "nothing". It's kind of the same thing. But what if those two people were waiting to see something, and that certain something didn't happen? What if the question was referring to that event? This entirely changes the situation. Maybe somewhere back on our minds we think about something when we answer with "nothing". We know what certain people expect from us or usually ask, and this "nothing" means in fact I'm doing nothing from what you expect me to do?
This made me dizzy. Let me take a break and try it again.
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PhanTomCat
Teh Cat....



Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 5,908
Loc: My Youniverse....
Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
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Re: On Nothingness [Re: mushbaby]
#8015395 - 02/12/08 10:00 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Simplified, and in the context of having expectations, "nothing" means everything except what is expected.... 
That is what I got anyways.... 
>^;;^<
-------------------- I'll be your midnight French Fry.... "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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AlteredAgain
Visual Alchemist



Registered: 04/27/06
Posts: 11,181
Loc: Solar Circuit
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Re: On Nothingness [Re: PhanTomCat]
#8015529 - 02/12/08 10:24 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I read this really cool book called Unified Reality Theory. Wish I still had it because I would definitely recommend it.
In it the author mentions the idea that nothing and everything are really the same essence and what we know as somethings are points of awareness that emerge when we localize the ocean of no-thingness.
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Apollyphelion
Dungeon Master/Princess(1009)


Registered: 03/15/07
Posts: 16,757
Loc: Festival of Deaths
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"I'm looking at you looking at it" SUBSCRIBE TO MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL PLEASE! www.youtube.com/apollyphelion Creator of the World's Worst Comic Book
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thedudenj
Man of the Woods

Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 14,684
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well if someone lacks sense of smell and you ask what do they smell it would be nothing. In other words the inpreceivable by the body makes up nothing in human or anything living things existanence, and of course that does mean beyond their preception that nothing really is something. i dont believe there is a true nothing only limited preception. and oh for some word play "nothing in is just a bunch of non-sense and thats all it is"
so yeah as long as preception exists its impossible for nothing to even begin to exist aside from the fact that nothing is nothingness in it self which is something and we do have the word nothing for it so it cant really be nothing. the non existant is more true then nothing. cause there are alot of non exististing things tho its very possible in the future that they might exist or have existed before us or only in an idea cause peoples imginations come up with some crazy shit and not all of it is shared or even known to others ever. and this kinda goes back to the novelty theory of mc kenna, we are just expressions of novelties thats all
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  "You all are just puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain..."" you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours
Edited by thedudenj (02/13/08 08:52 AM)
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AlteredAgain
Visual Alchemist



Registered: 04/27/06
Posts: 11,181
Loc: Solar Circuit
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Here is what Osho had to say about this wonderfully elusive subject.
Being 'in the gap' can be disorienting and even scary. Nothing to hold on to, no sense of direction, not even a hint of what choices and possibilities might lie ahead. But it was just this state of pure potential that existed before the universe was created. All you can do now is to relax into this nothingness. . .fall into this silence between the words. . .watch this gap between the outgoing and incoming breath. And treasure each empty moment of the experience. Something sacred is about to be born. Buddha has chosen one of the really very potential words - shunyata. The English word, the English equivalent, 'nothingness', is not such a beautiful word. That's why I would like to make it 'no-thingness' - because the nothing is not just nothing, it is all. It is vibrant with all possibilities. It is potential, absolute potential. It is unmanifest yet, but it contains all. In the beginning is nature, in the end is nature, so why in the middle do you make such a fuss? Why, in the middle, becoming so worried, so anxious, so ambitious - why create such despair?Nothing to nothingness is the whole journey. 
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