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Hotnuts
old hand


Registered: 02/26/05
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: georgeM]
#8013413 - 02/12/08 02:45 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I firmly believe them to be Cortinarius oregonensis or a VERY close relative. If you could find buttons of this species with the caps just starting to open up, cortina should be easily visible, especially if you had a magnifying glass handy.
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CureCat
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: Hotnuts]
#8013485 - 02/12/08 03:09 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I will have access to a pyrosequencer soon. I may be able to sequence this mushroom, and then see what results Genbank returns. I am not sure if I will be allowed to use it for any random mushroom (as far as the lab is concerned) but I will certainly find out.
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landsnorkler


Registered: 09/26/06
Posts: 3,047
Loc: Montana
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: CureCat]
#8013536 - 02/12/08 03:23 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but myxacium cortinarius, like oregonensis, have a bitter tasting cap cuticle. And the cap and stem are sticky from a glutinous universal veil.
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist


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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: Hotnuts]
#8013564 - 02/12/08 03:31 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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> I firmly believe them to be Cortinarius oregonensis or a VERY close relative.
I don't see any mention of bluing or a strong odor in that species.
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Hotnuts
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Registered: 02/26/05
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As far as the odor, I can't say much on that. But the bluing on those mushrooms appear to be from subiculum of a Hypomyces. It certainly appears so. Again, I could be dead wrong.
An interesting i.d. request for sure!
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Hotnuts
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: Hotnuts]
#8014068 - 02/12/08 05:26 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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For those of you not familiar with Hypomyces, here's a site that describes the ones known. I ran through some of the taxon, but was unable to find a match. You may have found a new species of Hypomyces hosting whatever you've got there. Maybe not. Hehehe.
http://nt.ars-grin.gov/taxadescriptions/keys/FrameListAllTaxa.cfm?gen=Hypomyces
Edited by Hotnuts (02/12/08 05:28 PM)
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Subbedhunter420
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: georgeM]
#8014760 - 02/12/08 08:03 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Hotnuts, Ive seen many forms of hypomyces through cultivating and also in the site you just posted and I actually agree with you on your own words. "I was unable to find a match". I seriously believe it is some form of staining or bruising but not hypomyces.
For everyones reference, The caps and stipes were not sticky. They were very wet from the heavy rains which came a few days before. Also, they never smelled like radish to me. Honestly it smelled more like starch/semen.
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist


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> Also, they never smelled like radish to me. Honestly it smelled more like starch/semen.
Try rehydrating a little bit, it has a very strong smell, kind of sharp and spicy. Its not quite like radish, but I can't think of anything better to call it.
The pileipellis consists of a thin layer of interwoven hyphae:
Pileipellis 100x

Pileipellis 400x
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georgeM
Human



Registered: 07/05/05
Posts: 1,748
Loc: Osage Cuestas
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Well... that eliminates Agrocybe...
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist


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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: georgeM]
#8015683 - 02/12/08 11:14 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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> Well... that eliminates Agrocybe...
My thoughts exactly.
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CureCat
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: Hotnuts]
#8015994 - 02/13/08 12:40 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Hotnuts, we all thought it could be Hypomyces or mold based on the first photo posted, but the photos posted after that show that the mushrooms are obviously not being parasitized or rotten by anything. It's just how the first image looks.
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Subbedhunter420
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: CureCat]
#8016292 - 02/13/08 02:55 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I asked my friend who was with me when we found them whether he thought the mushrooms were slimy or sticky in any sense and he thought that the pluteus cervinus were slimier than these. I agree with him but I wanted to know what he thought nonetheless. It was just really wet.
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Hotnuts
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: CureCat]
#8017237 - 02/13/08 11:44 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
CureCat said: Hotnuts, we all thought it could be Hypomyces or mold based on the first photo posted, but the photos posted after that show that the mushrooms are obviously not being parasitized or rotten by anything. It's just how the first image looks.
Ahhh, i've been referring to the first photos too much. Wow, that is obvious bluing! Very neat indeed.
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist


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Quote:
Alan Rockefeller said:
Quote:
Tjakko Stijve said: As for the mushroom you sent me, the description is poor, and the pictures could also be improved. It would have been of help to know whether it was growing on the same wooden tronc as Pluteus cervinus. There's a fair chance that it could be Pluteus salicinus, because advanced specimens can really have a bluegreen Pileus . Raphanoid odor is also pointing in that direction. Alternatively, P. cyanopus Rea would be a candidate, but this customer is so rare that I cannot even find a good picture of it on the WEB.
Would you mind taking a look at this mushroom?
http://mushroomobserver.org/6780
Before you say, oh thats easy, its a Pluteus, consider that the gill attachment is not free, the spores are roughened, the gills are not as close as pluteus typically are, and the spore print color is brown, without pinkish hues.
I emailed Tjakko Stijve and asked if he was sure about the Pluteus thing, his reply is below:
Quote:
Tjakko Stijve said: I must apologize. When I received John Allen's message, I could not open the pictures, and I was in a hurry, because of having to meet a deadline. So I did not pay proper attention, and suggested some blueing Pluteus sp. WRONG! Your photos show indeed a mushroom closely resembling a Hebeloma, a darned difficult genus. I spend the better part of this early morning in going through keys provided by authors as RICKEN, K?hner & Romagnesi, Courtecuisse, Horak, and Breitenbach & Kr?nzlin, but nobody comes even close to a species exhibiting this discrete sky blue color. I also looked under Phlegmacium, but in vain. I am sorry I cannot do better. I have consulted some befriended mycologists. If anything comes up, I' ll inform you.
Best regards,
Tjakko Stijve
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CureCat
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Registered: 04/19/06
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Loc: clawing your furniture
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Quote:
When I received John Allen's message
OMFG!

alan rockefeller = john allen (???)
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georgeM
Human



Registered: 07/05/05
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Loc: Osage Cuestas
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: CureCat]
#8026754 - 02/15/08 11:03 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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No puppets allowed!! 
There is a strong possibility this mushroom has yet to be described. Hopefully the collection site can be checked periodically in the future for more samples.
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Subbedhunter420
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: georgeM]
#8027233 - 02/15/08 01:04 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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So what all the worlds mycologists are saying is that I discovered a freak mushroom with attributes of several genus and they have no idea what it is?
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landsnorkler


Registered: 09/26/06
Posts: 3,047
Loc: Montana
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I think you used blue sharpie on it.
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist


Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 48,276
Last seen: 2 hours, 50 minutes
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Re: Possible So cal active (pluteus?) [Re: CureCat]
#8027576 - 02/15/08 02:22 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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> alan rockefeller = john allen (???)
No, he is not my puppet. I don't know why we are always on the same IP address.
> So what all the worlds mycologists are saying is that I discovered a freak mushroom with attributes of several genus and they have no idea what it is?
Most experts have settled on Hebeloma, including Michael Wood from Mykoweb, who says its in Hebeloma based on macroscopic features, microscopic features, and odor.
No one has been able to find any species of Hebeloma with bluing, you you may have found a new species.
See if you can get some more samples.
Edited by Alan Rockefeller (02/15/08 03:53 PM)
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CureCat
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Registered: 04/19/06
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>No, he is not my puppet. I don't know why we are always on >the same IP address.
Hehehe, yeah, i was just kidding. I definitely don't think you would get yourself banned multiple times.
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