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Invisiblebuttonion
Calmly Watching

Registered: 04/04/02
Posts: 303
Loc: Kansas
Re: Alan Watts is the bizz-omb! [Re: chrispc]
    #800199 - 08/06/02 03:31 PM (19 years, 1 month ago)

Thanks. I'll check it out.


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Concepts which have been proved to be useful in ordering things easily acquire such an authority over us that we forget their human origins and accept them as invariable.- Albert Einstein


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/10/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 7 months, 18 days
Re: Alan Watts is the bizz-omb! [Re: Swami]
    #800812 - 08/06/02 08:00 PM (19 years, 1 month ago)

Good Question. [I thought it was 64 Rolls Royces...but who's counting?]
I met Thomas Moore, whose first book I really liked. Asked him to autograph it (there were only 3 o4 people standing with him including my ex girlfriend). He said 'he wasn't giving autographs tonight.' He was so-o-o full of himself; and nodding approval at my girlfriend, while some babe in tight scarlet top waited for him. Ex-monk with equal and opposite psychic reaction. If we hadn't been standing in front of a Catholic altar, I would have said something choice.

Eckhart Tolle's book is terrific, but I've seen weekend seminars for $450.00. Chogyam Trungpa's books were also terrific, but I've heard first hand accounts of his behaviors including coming on to a former friend's wife (he was a notorious womanizer); and cutting Bhagwan Das' long dreads off while he was in a drunken stupor (Trungpa also was an alcoholic/nicotine addict).

I could go on, but I'll only add that this is why I have never treated any human as an avatar.

My take on this predicament is that 'power corrupts.' It is difficult to ignore the adoration of masses, especially when one secretly has an underlying power motive - an Adlerian or Manipura Chakra psychology at the center of the personality. Ego-inflation, grandiosity, pride (which Trungpa would rationalize as "Vajra Pride," for example). As soon as one begins to receive worldly power in the form of money, fame, adoration - one is exploiting something that should not be exploited. Like Pachino as the Devil in the film 'The Advocate,' said: 'Ah, Pride, my favorite sin.' Indeed, Pride is THE sin that was behind the mythological 'Fall' from Heaven, in Western Christianity. This mythos explains much in the way of human evil.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: Alan Watts is the bizz-omb! [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #800875 - 08/06/02 08:26 PM (19 years, 1 month ago)

Neither Watts or Lilly ever started religious cults with themselves as leaders. Neither of them ever claimed to be God. They wrote books. To disrespect them by calling them "major alcoholics" and "major Ketamine fiends" as our friend swami did is both pathetic and stupid. Not to mention plain wrong.


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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Alan Watts is the bizz-omb! [Re: Nomad]
    #801368 - 08/07/02 03:44 AM (19 years, 1 month ago)

The obvious difference being that to judge someone because of his alcohol consumption is a culture-bounded judgement.

I hardly think it culture-bound to expect some sort of behaviorial distinction.

Would you rather have Arnold Schwarzenneger or Woody Allen as a personal trainer? There are extreme physical differences because physical training ACTUALLY works!

Sounds like what you are saying is that there is no noticable difference between a master and a non-master - and you know my take on a difference that makes no difference...



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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflinePaleE
journeyman

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 55
Loc: Who are you? And why do ...
Last seen: 18 years, 10 months
Yawn... [Re: buttonion]
    #801453 - 08/07/02 05:16 AM (19 years, 1 month ago)

oh my...things get garbled up in here at times...

I just thought since this thread was realated to good sir Watts, i'd offer some reference info, so that, i dunno, people could talk about watts with better insight...
here is a collection of FANTASTIC works Deoxy.org Watt's page .
I loved his Zen Bones transcribed lecture (funny, funny), and the value of the psychotic experience (if you've ever felt crazy, here's a heapin helping of healing for your troubled mind, haha). I've got some audio lectures/radio (if anybody's interested, hook up via ICQ and I'll hook ya up!).

Much of my recent research has leaned towards Watts.
If you've ever thought there might be more to Bhuddism beyond "life is suffering", he's soon to be your hero.
He's got a FANTASTIC theory on meditation (if you're into that sorta thing) @ Still The Mind It's a few chapters, but well worth the time. He writes it as a grandfather, and there is a remarkable lack of pious pretention...all straight goods...he's just some guy....sharing some thought for his entertainment and yours (if you've got a good sense of humor, anyway, haha). Oh yeah, credit for that cool 'stiil the mind' link belongs to a lurker in these fourms. I forget his handle.


K...before i get boooooo-ed of the stage of this fourm (or heaven forbid, bore you), i'll finish with a quote from a lecture of his;
I'm going to tell you that indeed, as you've suspected, you are the whole and complete of the universe; but in a way that'll ensure it doesn't go to your head.
k...that's not a quote. It's a very course paraphrase (sue me, hahaha, and thank whatever that he's a MUCH better speaker/writter than I, haha)

LIst of Tracks you may wanna seek (if you're too lazy to ICQ me )
Alan Watts - Wisdom of the Mountains (Tibetan Buddhism)
Alan Watts - Seminar On Tibetan Buddhism - Wisdom of the Mountains 4
Alan Watts - Buddist Mystisism
(self help) Alan Watts - Fundamentals of Buddhism 1 and 2 (love that start tag haha)
Alan Watts - Readings from Hindu scriptures

HAve fun all!

thx,
the pale e

Oh yeah...
Any christians lurking in here, be warned...
If you're very happy in your pew, better steer clear from this guy until you're ready to look around some more. just some friendly caution in respect for your beliefs.



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