|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: zouden]
#8720290 - 08/03/08 04:00 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
zouden said: America spends FAR more on defence than it does on social programs. I'd be complaining about my tax dollars being wasted in Iraq first.
Stunningly ignorant. http://mwhodges.home.att.net/fed_budget-a.htm
Quote:
SOCIAL PROGRAM Spending, which consumes 56% of the budget..... Defense is next at 20% of the budget.
Social programs consume nearly 3 times the amount of Defense. Further, a great deal of defense spending would occur with or without Iraq.
--------------------
|
pothead_bob
Resident Pothead


Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 1,811
Loc: Your computer screen
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: Prisoner#1]
#8720341 - 08/03/08 04:17 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
local tax dollars, lol
That's what I'm saying. You need some form of taxation. I wasn't just talking about federal taxes. Although, you'll still need some federal taxes, too, just not nearly as much as we pay now.
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
|
zouden
Neuroscientist


Registered: 11/12/07
Posts: 7,091
Loc: Australia
Last seen: 14 years, 3 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: zappaisgod]
#8720342 - 08/03/08 04:17 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Interesting, the figures I have are quite different to that. But I just checked wikipedia, and both sets of figures are different, though mine were definitely incorrect. However the "War on Terror" is not covered by the Defence allocation of the budget. It's a special appropriation and it's approximately $115 billion, which means the Bush government is spending more money just on its War On Terror than the Department of Energy and federal research spending combined. If that was the other way around there'd be a lot less oil dependence already...
-------------------- I know... that just the smallest part of the world belongs to me You know... I'm not a blind man but truth is the hardest thing to see
|
pothead_bob
Resident Pothead


Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 1,811
Loc: Your computer screen
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: zouden]
#8720350 - 08/03/08 04:20 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Even if only 20% of taxes go to defense, that's too much in my opinion. Especially considering how much we pay in taxes. The US should not only get the hell out of Iraq, but they should get our troops out of all the other countries we're stationed in. Big money wasted.
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
|
Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!


Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 193,665
Loc: Pvt. Pubfag NutSuck
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: pothead_bob]
#8720358 - 08/03/08 04:21 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
pothead_bob said:
Quote:
local tax dollars, lol
That's what I'm saying. You need some form of taxation.
theres taxes on goods manufactured, taxes on goods sold, taxes on transporting and fuel... almost half my income is consumed in taxes
|
pothead_bob
Resident Pothead


Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 1,811
Loc: Your computer screen
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: Prisoner#1]
#8720373 - 08/03/08 04:25 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Don't forget about the inflation tax. Hell, if you're rich and in the top tax bracket, you probably pay more than half your income in taxes.
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
|
zouden
Neuroscientist


Registered: 11/12/07
Posts: 7,091
Loc: Australia
Last seen: 14 years, 3 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: pothead_bob]
#8720385 - 08/03/08 04:30 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Just remember that the US still has lower taxes than most other countries
-------------------- I know... that just the smallest part of the world belongs to me You know... I'm not a blind man but truth is the hardest thing to see
|
Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!


Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 193,665
Loc: Pvt. Pubfag NutSuck
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: zouden]
#8720391 - 08/03/08 04:33 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
it may seem that way on the surface but they tax us at both ends
|
pothead_bob
Resident Pothead


Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 1,811
Loc: Your computer screen
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: Prisoner#1]
#8720410 - 08/03/08 04:38 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
What can I say? It's expensive to run an empire.
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: pothead_bob]
#8720435 - 08/03/08 04:45 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Just say nothing. It's better than making shit up.
--------------------
|
pothead_bob
Resident Pothead


Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 1,811
Loc: Your computer screen
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: zappaisgod]
#8720454 - 08/03/08 04:57 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
And we don't have soldiers stationed in countries all over the world?
haha, okay.
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: pothead_bob]
#8720474 - 08/03/08 05:03 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
That's what you call an empire? What diminished expectations you have. Not surprising but, still, somehow sad.
--------------------
|
pothead_bob
Resident Pothead


Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 1,811
Loc: Your computer screen
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: zappaisgod]
#8720509 - 08/03/08 05:15 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
From Wikipedia:
Quote:
An empire (from the Latin "imperium", denoting military command within the ancient Roman government) is a state that extends dominion over populations distinct culturally and ethnically from the culture/ethnicity at the center of power. Scholars still debate about what exactly constitutes an empire, and other definitions may emphasize economic or political factors.
Like other states, an empire maintains its political structure at least partly by coercion. Land-based empires (such as the Mongol Empire or the Achaemenid Persia) tend to extend in a contiguous area; sea-borne empires, also known as thalassocracies (the Athenian, Portuguese and the British empires provide examples), may feature looser structures and more scattered territories.
Okay, let's see:
1. America annexed Texas, which belonged to Mexico. 2. America took California, Nevada, Utah and other states from Mexico after the Mexican-American War. 3. Spain was forced to cede control of Guam, Puerto Rico, and the Phillipines to the US after the Spanish American War. 4. America annexed the Panama Canal Zone in the early 1900's.
And I suppose you're going to say that the US doesn't push our belief system on other parts of the world, either?
Just what is your definition of an empire?
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
|
Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: pothead_bob]
#8720546 - 08/03/08 05:24 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
> Okay, let's see:
Comparing pre-WWII to post-WWII is kinda like comparing apples to oranges.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: pothead_bob]
#8720628 - 08/03/08 05:40 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
pothead_bob said:
Okay, let's see:
1. America annexed Texas, which belonged to Mexico. 2. America took California, Nevada, Utah and other states from Mexico after the Mexican-American War. 3. Spain was forced to cede control of Guam, Puerto Rico, and the Phillipines to the US after the Spanish American War. 4. America annexed the Panama Canal Zone in the early 1900's.
And just what does that have to do with having troops in other countries? I'll help you with that quiz. NOTHING. Tell me again about our presence in the Canal Zone. I seem to recall some adjustment there. Things aren't quite the same in the Philippines either.Quote:
And I suppose you're going to say that the US doesn't push our belief system on other parts of the world, either?
Oooooh pushing our beliefs. And McDonalds. What a bunch of hegemonyQuote:
Just what is your definition of an empire?
Eastern Europe for most of the second half of the twentieth century. Now there was an empire.
--------------------
|
pothead_bob
Resident Pothead


Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 1,811
Loc: Your computer screen
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: Seuss]
#8720645 - 08/03/08 05:45 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Comparing pre-WWII to post-WWII is kinda like comparing apples to oranges.
The US still has control of Guam and Puerto Rico without them having all the rights and benefits of statehood.
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
|
pothead_bob
Resident Pothead


Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 1,811
Loc: Your computer screen
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: pothead_bob]
#8720666 - 08/03/08 05:51 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
And just what does that have to do with having troops in other countries?
I believe it's you who is arguing with me that America doesn't exhibit the traits of an empire. So do you want me to prove my case or not?
Quote:
me again about our presence in the Canal Zone. I seem to recall some adjustment there
America had control of it from 1903 to 1979. It's an example of how America exerted it's influence by taking control of a territory in another country.
Quote:
Oooooh pushing our beliefs. And McDonalds. What a bunch of hegemony
Militarily pushing our beliefs. I thought that was obvious when I made that statement. There's no need to be so cocky in your responses.
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: pothead_bob]
#8720716 - 08/03/08 06:04 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
pothead_bob said:
Quote:
And just what does that have to do with having troops in other countries?
I believe it's you who is arguing with me that America doesn't exhibit the traits of an empire. So do you want me to prove my case or not?
You're the one who brought up American troops in other countries as "proof" of Empire, then dropped it. Probably because you realized it was a loser. Instead you brought up other losers. I can't wait to see the next loser.Quote:
Quote:
me again about our presence in the Canal Zone. I seem to recall some adjustment there
America had control of it from 1903 to 1979. It's an example of how America exerted it's influence by taking control of a territory in another country.
Well, I didn;t have to wait long. America fucking built it and then gave it to them. Some imperial behavior. Keep rippin' them bong hits.Quote:
Quote:
Oooooh pushing our beliefs. And McDonalds. What a bunch of hegemony
Militarily pushing our beliefs. I thought that was obvious when I made that statement. There's no need to be so cocky in your responses.
Where do we militarily push our "beliefs"?
--------------------
|
pothead_bob
Resident Pothead


Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 1,811
Loc: Your computer screen
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: zappaisgod]
#8720844 - 08/03/08 06:30 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
You're the one who brought up American troops in other countries as "proof" of Empire, then dropped it. Probably because you realized it was a loser. Instead you brought up other losers. I can't wait to see the next loser.
I didn't drop it. I made the point and moved on because you wanted more proof. We have over 1 million servicemen deployed worldwide with military bases in 36 countries so that we can police the world.
Believe what you want to believe, but that, in my opinion, is a trait of an empire.
Quote:
Where do we militarily push our "beliefs"?
We enforce the survival of countires like Israel and South Korea.
What about Iraq? Didn't we say we were going there to bring "freedom" to them? I'm not asking you if it's right or wrong. It's us pushing our belief system onto a sovereign nation with military force. Now we have had a military pressence there for the past 5 years. What would you think if Chinese soldiers were standing on the streets in your town armed with assault rifles?
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
Re: john edwards for a min. wage increase to 9.50$ [Re: pothead_bob]
#8720880 - 08/03/08 06:39 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Iraq was no longer sovereign after the first gulf war. They were in violation of their surrender agreement and hence had forfeited sovereignty. In no country do we have troops against the will of that country.
You think protecting our friends is Imperial? You are quite absurd.
--------------------
|
|