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Invisiblecricket
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: dumbfounded1600]
    #7981427 - 02/05/08 03:24 AM (15 years, 11 months ago)

What kind of rattlers?
Let me know if you end up with any extras.
Snakes, not venom.


RogerRabit: Have you come across any info on effects from different spiecies or snakes?


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Invisibledumbfounded1600
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: cricket]
    #7981949 - 02/05/08 09:55 AM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Eastern Diamondbacks...really any type of ratler that has venom...Im thinking of just milking it at home and dripping the venom on the plate of agar


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OfflineShivaMeme
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: dumbfounded1600]
    #7987104 - 02/06/08 02:53 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

In the paper RR links to, they mention nicotinic acid which is simply niacin - available for a couple bucks in the vitamin section and won't kill you if you acidentally prick yourself. The trade off seems to be reliability based on their document but I think the vast difference in accessability might far outweigh the lack of relaibility. They even mention the easy way to determine success in that paper...

So, you might have to inoculate 10 dishes to get one hybrid. I don't really see this as a balance to the trouble/expense/danger of snake venom. Has anyone tried niacin? Is the success rate more like in the 100s of attempts? At that point I suppose it might start to approach a balance.

Anyone know the concentration of niacin that can be used for hybridization?


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The curse of Genius is the constant scrutiny of lesser minds...
The curse of Stupidity is the constant delusion of Genius...
The curse of Insanity is the constant perception of scrutiny...

Keirsey Temperament: ENTP (Take it Here)


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: ShivaMeme]
    #7987376 - 02/06/08 03:47 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

There's a lot more to it than the chemicals. The chemicals simply help, but don't provide a fool proof method for sure. The trick is to get the different mycelium to exchange genetic material. Most cubensis strains will do this without venom or anything else added. With few exceptions, cubensis strains are compatible.
RR


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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison


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OfflineShivaMeme
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #7989809 - 02/06/08 11:23 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

I don't follow. So hybridization can be done without anything to weaken to cell wall: They occasionally will exchange genetic material and hybridize anyway? But snake venom is just to raise the reliability of this process to a "very reliable" level and nicotinic acid raises it to a not-as-reliable level. Correct?

If all of that is correct then I'm still curious if anyone has used the methodology described in the paper with niacin (nicotinic acid). How many tries did it take? How reliable was the method in actual numbers? And as for reliable, why does it matter if you can simply transplant three chips of mycelium into another dish from your hybrid attempt and if they all stay separate you're go for launch...

Sounds too good to be true but I don't see why it would not be.


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The curse of Genius is the constant scrutiny of lesser minds...
The curse of Stupidity is the constant delusion of Genius...
The curse of Insanity is the constant perception of scrutiny...

Keirsey Temperament: ENTP (Take it Here)


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: ShivaMeme]
    #7990570 - 02/07/08 05:46 AM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Various strains of a single species are usually compatible and will exchange genetic information via anastomosis.
RR


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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison


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Offlinejoesmithjoe
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #7990985 - 02/07/08 10:01 AM (15 years, 11 months ago)

This is a little beyond me but would it be possible then to use this technique to create a hybrid between a pan and a cube or are we saying that you could possibly cross pan florida with pan suphanburi. Are hybrids usualy more hardy or weaker then the parent species/strain?


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OfflineShivaMeme
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: joesmithjoe]
    #8064774 - 02/24/08 02:36 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

In almost every plant and animal hybridization can produce a stronger, faster and better offspring. However some hybrids may lose some of their reproductive abilities. This can someties be overcome through re-breeding with one of the originals. IE a 66/33% mix can reproduce again.

In cattle, hybrids of bovine(normal cattle) typically grow faster and produce more meat on less feed. However a mix of a Bison and a Bovine can only reproduce if the male is bovine. The resulting offspring calve easier, are more resistant to cold and north american diseases and convert feed into meat at a better ratio.

Same is true in humans... Hitler was a tard (ever hear of in-breeding you goose-stepping moron?)


I'm curious about the pan/cube breeding though. Since domesticated cattle and buffalo are totally different species and they can be crossed but with more difficulty I'd assume that the difficulty is inversely proportionate to the similarity of the subjects, but possible. I guess making sure they like the same substrate might be something to keep in mind.


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The curse of Genius is the constant scrutiny of lesser minds...
The curse of Stupidity is the constant delusion of Genius...
The curse of Insanity is the constant perception of scrutiny...

Keirsey Temperament: ENTP (Take it Here)


Edited by ShivaMeme (02/24/08 02:41 PM)


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Invisibledumbfounded1600
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #8089845 - 03/01/08 01:26 PM (15 years, 10 months ago)

Where can I get it RR? What's the site? You don't have to i'm just wondering


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: dumbfounded1600]
    #8089861 - 03/01/08 01:32 PM (15 years, 10 months ago)

You have to be a lab to get it. Trust me, you don't want the investigation that goes with ordering it. It would be the near-perfect murder weapon and they know it. I went through two written applications and two separate telephone 'interviews' before being allowed to order it.
RR


--------------------
Download Let's Grow Mushrooms



semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison


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Invisibledumbfounded1600
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #8089961 - 03/01/08 02:01 PM (15 years, 10 months ago)

FUUUCK that haha...I thought it was easy as ebay....

I've heard of people in India smoking cobra venom and it didn't seem lethal then or when ingested..


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Offlinebryanbzl
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #8113252 - 03/06/08 08:50 PM (15 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
You have to be a lab to get it.  Trust me, you don't want the investigation that goes with ordering it.  It would be the near-perfect murder weapon and they know it. I went through two written applications and two separate telephone 'interviews' before being allowed to order it.
RR




Let's just put it in poor mans terms, your better off milking a rattlesnake yourself :cool:, plus, you get some cool points! get that sucker to juice and then drop some on agar :grin:.

Has anyone tried hybridizing different species of Psilocybin mushrooms? There is a possibility that, in some way, a cube can take some characteristics from a azur. maybe? Say, an Azur. with a cubies size :cool: that would be way revolutionary.


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Cheers,

bzl

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"From 1898 through to 1910 heroin was marketed as a non-addictive morphine substitute and cough medicine for children."

conclusion:
poor fucking children of the early 1900's.


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Offlineshoeareyou
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: bryanbzl]
    #8229844 - 04/02/08 05:44 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Yeah dude, Seriously If you feel up for handling a couple of rattlesnakes I say go for it. just make sure you buy THICK THICK THICK industrial full length arm gloves. And be careful, for gods sake. LOL!


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Invisiblelipa


Registered: 07/24/07
Posts: 2,684
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: dumbfounded1600]
    #8230694 - 04/02/08 08:54 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Thanks roger for the link to this most interesting article. I have a friend that I work with who has some of these rattlesnakes and he said he would milk them for me to give this a shot. He is a expert in the field and is proficient with the techniques. I have 2 Coprinus Comatus strains that I would like to work with and if standard mating strategies do not come through I just might give this a shot. Thanks! If you have any more links for this I would love to see them. I take it if I try this I would have to supply him with a sterilized milking container, yes? I would like to know how they purified venom.


Edited by lipa (04/02/08 09:05 PM)


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Offlinestriker
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: lipa]
    #8620703 - 07/11/08 08:09 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

could they sterilize the venom with a germicidal UV lamp?


Edited by striker (07/11/08 08:14 AM)


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Invisiblelipa


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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: striker]
    #8620900 - 07/11/08 09:08 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

striker said:
could they sterilize the venom with a germicidal UV lamp?




Thats a good question. I would like to know as well.


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OfflineMaverick
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: lipa]
    #8620928 - 07/11/08 09:19 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

This is interesting and all, and it's far from the first time I've read it, but what I'm wondering is, does the type of rattlesnake venom matter?  Some rattler species have more of a neurotoxin that won't break down cellwalls the way hemotoxins do.

Also, the venom should be sterile, or at least very clean for a secreted liquid from a snake's organs.


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Invisiblelipa


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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: dumbfounded1600]
    #8620977 - 07/11/08 09:34 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

They said it is the western diamondback rattler (Crotalus atrox) venom  that they use. Did you read the link Roger provided.


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InvisibleJrsxt
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #8621084 - 07/11/08 10:08 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
Quote:

oh and RR, on that note if you didnt use all of your red boy spores why dont you repeat it with your PR and RB hybrid and make it 75% RB and 25% PR




Isn't that exactly what I said I did in my last post? :shrug:

The 75% RB/PR cross used up the last of the original 20 year old spores.  It's all covered in the Redboy thread from four years ago.
RR




I did some trades with PF when he came on here a few years ago to sell his flowhood. I got a container full of some RB spores he had. I'm not sure if they would have been the ones you are talking about. I still may possibly have some left.


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Offlinedstark
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Re: Snake Venom Into Hybrids [Re: Jrsxt]
    #8624344 - 07/12/08 04:25 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Be carfull guys! that was a snake byte might cause!

















here is the snake


Goodluck and be SAFE!!!


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