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TheShroomJew23
The Chemist


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 1,611
Loc: Temple
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LSD-25
#7922533 - 01/23/08 11:11 PM (16 years, 9 days ago) |
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Just took 4x the normal dose and am waiting for it to hit me. My roommate took only the normal dose and has his head in a cabinet watching the designs.
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 You will be missed
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Sophistic Radiance
Free sVs!



Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 43,135
Loc: Center of the Universe
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Awesome. What exactly is the "normal dose"?
Good vibes on your trip, I just love the heavy ones.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
Edited by Tchan909 (01/23/08 11:16 PM)
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SuperD
Cacti junky



Registered: 10/05/03
Posts: 6,648
Loc: The bridgesii bridge
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Safe journeys to you and your roommate. I was actually considering tripping tonight too, but I shall wait until tomorrow.
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   D Manoa said: I need to stop spending all my money on plants and take up a cheaper hobby, like heroin. Looking for Rauhocereus riosaniensis seeds or live specimen(s), me if you have any for trade
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Varman
Stranger




Registered: 07/16/06
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: SuperD]
#7922569 - 01/23/08 11:19 PM (16 years, 9 days ago) |
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what in the world is a normal dose?....
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"Its A circular vortex..."
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TheShroomJew23
The Chemist


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 1,611
Loc: Temple
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I got it in individual little plastic vials, each vial is considered one dose, so I took 4 just to be safe.
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 You will be missed
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PilzeEssen


Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 7,312
Loc: USA
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
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what form is it in? vials containing one dose? that sounds odd to me.
-------------------- "The soul has greater need of the ideal than of the real. It is by the real that we exist, it is by the ideal that we live." If you want to get a hold of me, my email address is in my profile. Just click on my screen name. I got banned from using private messages cause I didn't follow the rules...
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TheShroomJew23
The Chemist


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 1,611
Loc: Temple
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its liquid, he said I could put it on sugar cubes but i just ingested it straight
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 You will be missed
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Seventy
equanimitor



Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 912
Loc: Canada (PNW)
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how much liquid was there in each vial?
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Acaterpillar
A little mad...



Registered: 06/09/07
Posts: 18,693
Loc: Down the rabbit hole
Last seen: 3 months, 26 days
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: Seventy]
#7922633 - 01/23/08 11:34 PM (16 years, 9 days ago) |
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Most liquid you only take a drop unless they diluted for a dose to be a vial...I really hope so.
-------------------- Aaa...E I O Uuu...A E I O Uuu..A E I O uh Uuu.. *Cough* *Cough* Ooo...U E I O Aaa...U E I Aaa..A E I O Uuuuu... At first sight, The Perfection of Wisdom is bewildering, full of paradox and apparent irrationality.
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Seventy
equanimitor



Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 912
Loc: Canada (PNW)
Last seen: 6 months, 28 days
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I really hope so too, or he's in for one hell of a ride.
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TheShroomJew23
The Chemist


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 1,611
Loc: Temple
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: Seventy]
#7922678 - 01/23/08 11:46 PM (16 years, 9 days ago) |
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it wasnt diluted its been about a half hour and this is the first time i have ever seen sounds
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 You will be missed
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StonedGnome
Stranger


Registered: 12/21/07
Posts: 25
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wow, i need to find some lsd
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flangenips
Batshitinsanse


Registered: 01/20/08
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4 undiluted vials :O that is awesome. have a good trip!
-------------------- All are lunatics, but he who can analyze his delusions is called a philosopher. - Ambrose Bierce
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Frost
Inside a locked room


Registered: 02/24/07
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Loc: Florida
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
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interesting.
-------------------- “I have lived on the lip of insanity, wanting to know reasons, knocking on a door. It opens. I've been knocking from the inside.” - Rumi “The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” - Carl Sagan
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Overclock22
Here, There andBack Again



Registered: 09/19/07
Posts: 208
Loc: NY
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Quote:
TheShroomJew23 said: it wasnt diluted its been about a half hour and this is the first time i have ever seen sounds
It couldnt have been diluted, was the bottle the size of a visene bottle?
-------------------- He did not laugh as his eyes stopped in awareness of the earth around him. His face was like a law of nature-a thing one could not question, alter or implore. It had high cheekbones over gaunt, hollow cheeks; gray eyes, cold and steady; a contemptuous mouth, shut tight, the mouth of an executioner or a saint. If you wake up at a different time in a different place, can you wake up a different person? Cf. A.C. Doyle "I'll rise above this, you can't keep me down, for I am Divine, and I know it all too well."
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emrandel
Love iS freeD


Registered: 03/03/07
Posts: 94
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What... an entire undiluted vial? Four of them? That's anywhere from 12,000 to 60,000mcg depending on potency. Tha fuck?!
You must have your hands on some kind of single hit vials I have never heard of...
-------------------- "No drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, green and love of power!" - P.J. O'Rourke
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Overclock22
Here, There andBack Again



Registered: 09/19/07
Posts: 208
Loc: NY
Last seen: 13 years, 1 month
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If he drank 4 bottles odds are hes passed out and in for a trip to the hospital.
-------------------- He did not laugh as his eyes stopped in awareness of the earth around him. His face was like a law of nature-a thing one could not question, alter or implore. It had high cheekbones over gaunt, hollow cheeks; gray eyes, cold and steady; a contemptuous mouth, shut tight, the mouth of an executioner or a saint. If you wake up at a different time in a different place, can you wake up a different person? Cf. A.C. Doyle "I'll rise above this, you can't keep me down, for I am Divine, and I know it all too well."
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Artnotwar
Chemical Researcher



Registered: 04/07/06
Posts: 3,379
Last seen: 8 months, 29 days
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i think he would know by the orice he paid if it were more than one dose per vial. it was obviously diluted.
-------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Until the 20th century, reality was everything humans could touch, smell, see, and hear. Since the initial publication of the charged electromagnetic spectrum, humans learned that what they can touch, smell, see, and hear... is less than one millionth of reality. --------------------------------
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g00ru
lit pants tit licker



Registered: 08/09/07
Posts: 21,088
Loc: georgia, us
Last seen: 5 years, 1 month
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If he drank 4 strait vials of cid he would be tripping harder than he ever had within 5 minutes, and within 20 he would need to be hospitalized. They HAD to have been diluted and his dealer just does it weird.
-------------------- check out my music! drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss
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ReoSpeedwagon153


Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: g00ru]
#7923425 - 01/24/08 08:51 AM (16 years, 8 days ago) |
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Something tells me that drinking four (undiluted) vials wouldn't be that much more intense than drinking two or three.
-------------------- “I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”
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04281969
Hobbyist



Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 1,406
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My bet is that he was sold LSA as LSD.
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



Registered: 04/30/03
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Quote:
ReoSpeedwagon153 said: Something tells me that drinking four (undiluted) vials wouldn't be that much more intense than drinking two or three.
Hehe
Yeah. Look, some people at times sell liquid in vials. It can happen. It's hard to take just one drop though so maybe someone puts some distilled water in it. To make the vial out to usually it was five tabs is how I saw it for 20 bucks. But that was in the ninetys. Used to be five drops liquid with 20 of water to make five hits of five drops each. Each vial = 25 drops of water. That still would be alot for liquid even one of those. I know.
-------------------- ...or something
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04281969
Hobbyist



Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 1,406
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: eve69]
#7923557 - 01/24/08 09:42 AM (16 years, 8 days ago) |
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When they sold LSD-25 in vials, one clear drop on a sugar cube was a dose.
The vials he got were probably each full of black/dark purple MG water extractions. Taking too much LSA will wipe you out. No wonder we haven't heard from him since.
He took a huge dose of an unfamiliar substance. That's actually really stupid.
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citricacidx
FunGuy




Registered: 07/23/07
Posts: 9,027
Loc: GA
Last seen: 10 years, 6 months
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I got some liquid once, it barely made up like an 1/8th of an inch from the bottom of it, but it had like 12-15 hits in it. So I doubt he consumed 4 full vials of undiluted acid.
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Sell Your Soul
Nutmeg shaman



Registered: 03/15/00
Posts: 40,819
Loc: Over there
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Who gets a single does in one vial? That's unheard of. Usually, a vial would have enough for 100 doses, with a single droping going into a sugar cube or something.
Anyway, hope all goes well for you.
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2859558484
Growery is Better



Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 8,752
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
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sounds like a RC. I know methylone, bromo drgonfly and a few others come in individual liquid "vials" that hold 1 dose. You could put anything in there man. I wouldnt eat any liquid if the dose was more than a few drops. kinda shady
but then again its entirely possible that its LSD. shits everywhere
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TheShroomJew23
The Chemist


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 1,611
Loc: Temple
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Im ok I just woke up naked in my attic, I have no recollection of what happened last night except for a few things. It was LSD but each vial held 5 doses with 5 drops of water. So if you can figure it out I took 20 hits or 10 doses. My roommate found this out from asking the guy who made it and packaged this. I might post a trip report if I can remember enough. The guy said that its a good thing I made the mistake of washing down the last vial with tap water otherwise I wouldve had to go to the hospital. LSD-25 is a gift from G-D and the Heavens. Turn on, Tune in, and Drop out.
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 You will be missed
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Artnotwar
Chemical Researcher



Registered: 04/07/06
Posts: 3,379
Last seen: 8 months, 29 days
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why would you have had to go to hospital?
-------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Until the 20th century, reality was everything humans could touch, smell, see, and hear. Since the initial publication of the charged electromagnetic spectrum, humans learned that what they can touch, smell, see, and hear... is less than one millionth of reality. --------------------------------
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Artnotwar
Chemical Researcher



Registered: 04/07/06
Posts: 3,379
Last seen: 8 months, 29 days
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how much did the vials cost?
-------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Until the 20th century, reality was everything humans could touch, smell, see, and hear. Since the initial publication of the charged electromagnetic spectrum, humans learned that what they can touch, smell, see, and hear... is less than one millionth of reality. --------------------------------
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Caribou_Lou
Stranger

Registered: 10/17/07
Posts: 2,510
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Normal dose?? you mean you took 4 hits?
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TheShroomJew23
The Chemist


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 1,611
Loc: Temple
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Im not sure why I would have to go to the hospital, thats just what he said. I got 5 vials for 175. I also got 10 single dose sugar cubes and blotters for 90.
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 You will be missed
Edited by TheShroomJew23 (01/24/08 03:07 PM)
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pasteface
pasty


Registered: 04/27/07
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Last seen: 13 years, 8 months
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Why would the water mater at all?
-------------------- "In this state, dig it, you get twenty years for sale of dope to a minor. You only get five to ten for manslaughter. So like the thing is, if you're selling to a kid and cops come, shoot the kid real quick!" - Abbie Hoffman
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wendel
Stranger
Registered: 08/06/07
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Last seen: 15 years, 11 months
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I do have to ask why you would take all five vials at once and spend that much money on a trip.
But I can kind of relate. I took seven hits my first time and was out of this world for awhile. I don't remember much from the trip but it was glorious. The "one-ness" and complete satisfaction you can feel on acid is great.
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Sophistic Radiance
Free sVs!



Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 43,135
Loc: Center of the Universe
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Yeah, it's about the difference between WAY WAY WAY TOO INTENSE and WAY WAY TOO INTENSE.
Though I've never heard of a hit taking up a whole vial, I can't see anything else being the case here.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
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2859558484
Growery is Better



Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 8,752
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
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Quote:
TheShroomJew23 said: Im ok I just woke up naked in my attic, I have no recollection of what happened last night except for a few things. It was LSD but each vial held 5 doses with 5 drops of water. So if you can figure it out I took 20 hits or 10 doses. My roommate found this out from asking the guy who made it and packaged this. I might post a trip report if I can remember enough. The guy said that its a good thing I made the mistake of washing down the last vial with tap water otherwise I wouldve had to go to the hospital. LSD-25 is a gift from G-D and the Heavens. Turn on, Tune in, and Drop out.
lol what did it taste like? salty? haha. coulda been some ghb
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dtugg
Druggie


Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 355
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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This sounds really fishy. I have never even heard of people selling acid like that. Liquid L vials are pretty much always sold in 100 hit increments (usually in visine or mint bottles). If someone wanted to sell you some out of that they would drop a dose on some sort of candy, a sugar cube, or even straight on your tongue.
My guess is that you were sold something other than LSD. It could have been any number of substances, really know way of guessing unless I saw a trip report.
I would NEVER buy five different vials with each supposedly having five doses in in. Just doesn't make sense.
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TheShroomJew23
The Chemist


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 1,611
Loc: Temple
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: dtugg]
#7925159 - 01/24/08 05:04 PM (16 years, 8 days ago) |
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I have been to the suppliers house and studied his process and even helped him isolate the ergotamine tartrate (ET). This was LSD, he just got these really cool containers and they are great for him to distribute it so he uses them in a weird way. He has sugar cubes and blotter paper and all the other good stuff but I got large dose vials.
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 You will be missed
Edited by TheShroomJew23 (01/24/08 05:30 PM)
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2859558484
Growery is Better



Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 8,752
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
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Quote:
I have been to the suppliers house and studied his process and even helped him isolate the ergot alkoloids.
dude? i dont think you got LSD
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TheShroomJew23
The Chemist


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 1,611
Loc: Temple
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Im pretty sure I did and no matter what you say you cant change my mind.
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 You will be missed
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2859558484
Growery is Better



Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 8,752
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
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what do you mean isolate the ergot alkaloids? what does this have to do with selling LSD? Please explain so i will know
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dtugg
Druggie


Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 355
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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Quote:
TheShroomJew23 said: I have been to the suppliers house and studied his process and even helped him isolate the ergot alkoloids. This was LSD, he just got these really cool containers and they are great for him to distribute it so he uses them in a weird way. He has sugar cubes and blotter paper and all the other good stuff but I got large dose vials.
Are you saying that you know somebody who actually makes it? If so I am calling BS on this whole story.
If you really knew a supplier and/or chemist, you would get a way better price than 25 liquid hits for $175 or a ten strip for $90. I can get better prices than that and I am many levels below any chemist.
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Sophistic Radiance
Free sVs!



Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 43,135
Loc: Center of the Universe
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: dtugg]
#7925288 - 01/24/08 05:27 PM (16 years, 8 days ago) |
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Did ShroomJew ask you for your advice on dealer reputability, or the likelihood that he actually got LSD? No. Therefore, who cares what you think? Certainly not me, and doubtful anyone else.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
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TheShroomJew23
The Chemist


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 1,611
Loc: Temple
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from TiKHAL [ Tryptamines i Have Known and Loved ] by Alexander Shulgin #26. LSD-25 ACID; LYSERGIDE; D-LYSERGIC ACID DIETHYLAMIDE; METH-LAD; D-LYSERGAMIDE, N,N-DIETHYL; N,N-DIETHYL-D-LYSERGAMIDE; 9,10-DIDEHYDRO-N,N-DIETHYL-6-METHYLERGOLINE-8b-CARBOXAMIDE SYNTHESIS : A solution of 6.7 g KOH in 100 mL H2O, under an inert atmosphere and magnetically stirred, was brought to 75 °C, and 10 g ergotamine tartrate (ET) added. The reaction mixture turned yellow as the ergotamine went into solution over the course of 1 h. The stirring was continued for an additional 3 h. The reaction mixture was cooled to about 10 °C with an external ice bath, and acidified to a pH of about 3.0 by the dropwise addition of 2.5 N H2SO4. White solids started to appear early in the neutralization; approximately 60 mL of sulfuric acid was required. The reaction mixture was cooled overnight, the solids removed by filtration, and the filter cake washed with 10 mL Et2O. The dry solids were transferred to a beaker, suspended in 50 mL 15 % ammonia in anhydrous ethanol, stirred for 1 h, and separated by decantation. This extraction was repeated, and the original decantation and the second extract combined and filtered to remove a few hundred milligrams of unwanted solids. The clear filtrate was stripped of solvent under vacuum, the residual solids dissolved in 50 mL of 1% aqueous ammonia, and this solution was acidified as before with 2.5 N H2SO4. The precipitated solids were removed by filtration and washed with Et2O until free of color. After drying under vacuum to a constant weight, there was obtained 3.5 g of d-lysergic acid hydrate, which should be stored in a dark, sealed container. A suspension of 3.15 g d-lysergic acid hydrate and 7.1 g of diethylamine in 150 mL CHCl3 was brought to reflux with stirring. With the external heating removed, there was added 3.4 g POCl3 over the course of 2 min, at a rate sufficient to maintain refluxing conditions. The mixture was held at reflux for an additional 5 min, at which point everything had gone into solution. After returning to room temperature, the solution was added to 200 mL of 1 N NH4OH. The phases were separated, the organic phase dried over anhydrous MgSO4, filtered, and the solvent removed under vacuum. The residue was chromatographed over alumina with elution employing a 3:1 C6H6/CHCl3 mixture, and the collected fraction stripped of solvent under hard vacuum to a constant weight. This free-base solid can be recrystallized from benzene to give white crystals with a melting point of 87-92 °C. IR (in cm-1): 750, 776, 850, 937 and 996, with the carbonyl at 1631. The mass spectrum of the free base has a strong parent peak at mass 323, with sizable fragments at masses of 181, 196, 207 and 221.
This base was dissolved in warm, dry MeOH, using 4 mL per g of product. There was then added dry d-tartaric acid (0.232 g per g of LSD base), and the clear warm solution treated with Et2O dropwise until the cloudiness did not dispel on continued stirring. This opaqueness set to a fine crystalline suspension (this is achieved more quickly with seeding) and the solution allowed to crystallize overnight in the refrigerator. Ambient light should be severely restricted during these procedures. The product was removed by filtration, washed sparingly with cold methanol, with a cold 1:1 MeOH/Et2O mixture, and then dried to constant weight. The white crystalline product was lysergic acid diethylamide tartrate with two molecules of methanol of crystallization, with a mp of about 200 °C with decomposition, and weighed 3.11 g (66%). Repeated recrystallizations from methanol produced a product that became progressively less soluble, and eventually virtually insoluble, as the purity increased. A totally pure salt, when dry and when shaken in the dark, will emit small flashes of white light.
DOSAGE : 60 to 200 micrograms, orally
DURATION : 8 - 12 hrs
QUALITATIVE COMMENTS : In the case of LSD, it seems presumptuous to attempt to select typical comments for quotation. Literally thousands of reports are in the literature, from early exploratory research, to clinical applications for treatment of autism, of alcoholism, or mental illness, to assisting in psychotherapy and in the dying process, to the adventures of the military in both intelligence and chemical warfare, to innumerable anecdotal tales of pleasure and pain. Dozens of books have been devoted to these topics.
EXTENSIONS AND COMMENTARY : LSD is an unusually fragile molecule and some comments are in order as to its stability and storage. As a salt, in water, cold, and free from air and light exposure, it is stable indefinitely. There are two sensitive aspects of its structure. The position of the carboxamide attachment, the 8-position, is affected by basic, or high pH, conditions. Through a process called epimerization, this position can scramble, producing isolysergic acid diethylamide, or iso-LSD. This product is biologically inactive, and represents a loss of a proportionate amount of active product. A second and separate point of instability is the double bond that lies between this 8-position and the aromatic ring. Water or alcohol can add to this site, especially in the presence of light (sunlight with its ultraviolet energy is notoriously bad) to form a product that has been called lumi-LSD, which is totally inactive in man. Oh yes, and often overlooked, there may be only an infinitesimal amount of chlorine in treated tap water, but then there is only an infinitesimal amount of LSD in a typical LSD solution. And since chlorine will destroy LSD on contact, the dissolving of LSD in tap water is not appropriate.
There are many synthetic methods developed and reported for the preparation of LSD. All of them start with lysergic acid, and for that reason it has been listed as a Schedule III controlled drug, as a depressant, under Federal law. The amide lysergamide, a component of several varieties of morning glory seed, is also a controlled drug and, by law, a depressant. The earliest syntheses of LSD involved the used of an azide intermediate (the original Hofmann process, 1955), mixed anhydrides with trifluoroacetic anhydride (1956) or sulfuric anhydride (SO3-DMF on the lithium salt, 1959), with the peptide condensation agent N,N'-carbonyldiimidazole (1960), or with the acid chloride as the active intermediate with POCl3, PCl5 or thionyl chloride (1963) or just phosphorus oxychloride (1973). Most methods are faulted due to excessive moisture sensitivity, generation of side-products, or epimerization or inversion at the 8-position carbon to form d-iso-LSD. The POCl3 procedure is clean and fast, and is the preferred process today for the synthesis of a wide variety of substituted lysergamides.
The term LSD comes from the initials of the German for lysergic acid diethylamide, or Lysersäure Diethylamid. The number "25" following it has many myths attached to it, such as it was the 25th form of LSD that Hofmann tried, or it was his 25th attempt to make LSD. From my own experience with chemical companies that are allied with pharmaceutical houses, I had assumed that the chemical name (which might be a mouthful for the pharmacologist) was simply replaced with a pronounceable code number equivalent. But the answer here is yet simpler. Hofmann, in his LSD, My Problem Child wrote: "In 1938, I produced the twenty fifth substance in a series of lysergic acid derivatives: lysergic acid diethylamide, abbreviated LSD-25 ... for laboratory usage."
Within a few years of the discovery of the extraordinary potency of LSD, a large number of close analogues were synthesized by Hofmann and his allies at Sandoz. Over the following decade many were tested in humans, both in patients and healthy subjects, with the qualitative descriptions and dosages published in the medical literature.
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A number of analogues of LSD have maintained the diethylamide group unchanged, but additions or changes have been made in the pyrrole ring.
--indole-ring substituent-- at N-1 at C-2 Code -H -COCH3 -CH3 -CH2OH -CH2N(CH3)2 -H -H -CH3 -CH3 -H -H -H -H -H -B -I -Br -I LSD-25 ALD-52 MLD-41
BOL-148
MBL-61 MIL
ALD-52. 1-Acetyl-N,N-diethyllysergamide.This material has been explored in the 50-175 microgram range and there are a number of human trials reported, with varying conclusions. One found that there was less visual distortion than with LSD and it seems to produce less anxiety and was somewhat less potent than LSD. Another report claimed it was more effective in increasing blood pressure. Yet another could not tell them apart. ALD-52 just may have been the drug that was sold as "Orange Sunshine" during the "Summer of Love" in the late '60's. Or "Orange Sunshine" may have been, really, LSD. This was the focus of a fascinating trial where two defendants were accused of distributing LSD, whereas they claimed that it was ALD-52 which was not an illegal drug. The prosecution claimed that as it hydrolyses readily to LSD, for all intents and purposes it was LSD, and anyway, you had to go through the illegal LSD to get to ALD-52 by any of the known chemical syntheses. The defendants were found guilty. And yet, I do not know who has actually measured the speed or ease of that reaction. If ALD-52 hydrolyses so easily to LSD, and the body is indeed a hydrolytic instrument, then these two drugs should be absolutely equivalent in every particular, This is the ergot equivalent of the psilocybin to psilocin argument, except this is an acetamide rather than a phosphate ester. MLD-41. 1-Methyl-N,N-diethyllysergamide. The 1-methyl homologue of LSD is has more of somatic than sensory effect, has fewer visuals and is less well accepted than LSD, with the range of dosages being from 100 to 300 micrograms. This indicates that it is perhaps a third the potency of LSD which is in accord with both pupilary dilation and reflex action. However, the cardiovascular responses are actually increased. Besides being less potent than LSD, it appears to have a slower onset but it is equally long lived. There is cross-tolerance between MLD-41 and LSD.
BOL-148. 2-Bromo-N,N-diethyllysergamide. This synthetic ergot derivative, along with its 1-methyl homologue MBL-61 (mentioned below) should be used as powerful tools for studying the mechanism of action of LSD in the human animal. It does not have LSD-like effects in man. At 6 to 10 milligrams orally, there are some mental changes noted. But in another study, 20 milligrams was administered a day to a subject for 7 days, and there were no reported effects. And yet it is as potent a serotonin agonist as is LSD. How can serotonin be argued as a neurotransmitter that is a major player in explaining the action of psychedelic drugs, when this compound is nearly without activity.
There are some suggestions that an intravenous route may be more effective. I have heard of effects being noted at maybe a milligram and a short (2-3 hour) intoxication following 20 milligrams administered over a 20 minute period. I was involved many years ago in a study of radio-labelled BOL-148 which was made by the bromination of LSD. I was quite sure that the only radioactive material present was BOL-148, but there could well have been some unreacted LSD still present which would, of course, still be psychoactive. The synthesis is not clean -- I was tempted to make an entry for this compound if only to reproduce Albert Hofmann's original published experimental procedure. He reacted 13.2 grams of N-bromosuccinimide (in 400 mL dioxane, with 1.2 liters of dioxane containing 25 grams of LSD. This gave 11 grams of crude produce which had to be recrystallized. The radioactive syntheses uses effectively elemental bromine, and gave yields of from 5 to 15%. Visualize that reaction! A warm flask containing over a quart of warm solvent in which there was maybe half a million doses of LSD.
1-Hydroxymethyl-LSD, 1-dimethylaminomethyl-LSD and 2-iodo-LSD. These three additional compounds are shown here because they were described in a synthetic flurry that followed the discovery the activity of LSD. But at the moment I know neither their internal Sandoz codes nor if they had ever been explored in man. This is a kind of frustrating catch-all entry, in that the long index will send you here, and once here you realize that nothing is known. Well, at least the compounds are known, and perhaps there is something in the Sandoz vaults that might be interesting. I do not have access to them.
MBL-61. 2-Bromo-N,N-diethyl-1-methyllysergamide. This is the compound BOL-148 (mentioned above) with a methyl group attached to the 1-position of the indole ring (LSD has a hydrogen there). This would be an even more tantalizing challenge to the serotonin theory for central activity of the psychedelics, in that it is without any activity in man at an oral dose of 14 milligrams (similar to the inactivity of the BOL-61 compound, but it is some five times more potent as a serotonin agonist. With it, as with the iodiniated analogue MIL, there are many examples of the compromising of scientific integrity in the quest for funds and recognition. Both compounds are as effective as LSD itself in displacing labelled LSD that is bound to the post-synaptic serotonin receptor sites in animal brains. But neither of them show any LSD-like activity. But both have been labelled with 11-C or 122-I to give positron emitting forms that can be administered to man and localized in a positron emission tomography instrument (a PET scanner).
I was at a meeting of a NIDA study section a few years ago, where some one presented some findings with a group of subjects who were complaining of continuing mental problems allegedly due to LSD exposure. A chart was put up showing the outline of the brain showing the locations of the EEG foci that were observed in one of these subjects. Along side it was a PET scan showing the distribution of radioactive LSD in a subject. The purpose was to discuss the similarities and differences of the coordinates of electrical activity and radio-isotope concentration. I innocently asked what positron isotope had been used, as I did not know of any successful positron labelling of LSD. Carbon 11, I was told. Where in the molecule was the label incorporated, I asked. In the 1-position methyl group. It was finally acknowledged that the compound that had actually been used was 2-iodo-1-methyl-LSD, our MIL compound, which is quite a different world. A pharmacologist might say that they are similar in action (looking at serotonin, not psychedelic action), and a chemist might say they are of similar structure (looking at the upper 80% of the molecule. But they are different compounds. This is a most subtle form of deceit. It is, in fact, out and out dishonest, but it looks good up there on the screen at a lecture.
Let me mention in passing, that there are three stereoisomers possible for d-LSD. There are d-iso-LSD, l-LSD, and l-iso-LSD. The inversion of the stereochemistry of the attached diethylcarboxyamido group of d-LSD gives the diastereoisomer (d-iso-LSD) which is a frequent synthetic impurity of d-LSD itself. The corresponding optical antipodes l-LSD and l-iso-LSD are also known and have been tasted. All three are completely inactive: d-iso-LSD shows no psychological changes at an oral dose of 4 milligrams; l-LSD none at up to 10 milligrams orally; and l-iso-LSD none at 500 micrograms orally. These dramatic decreases in potency show both the stereoselectivity of the native LSD molecule in producing its central effects, and the LSD-free purity of these isomers.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The second major location of variations in the structure of LSD has been in the nature of the alkyl groups on the amide nitrogen atom. Some of these are Sandoz syntheses, some are from other research groups, and a few of them are found in nature. Some of these have been studied in man, and some have not. A few of the original clutch of Sandoz compounds have both 1-substituents and amide alkyl (R) group variations: indole --- amide nitrogen substituents --- R= R= R= code name -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -H -CH3 -CH3 -COCH3 -CH3 -H -CH3 -CH2CH3 -(CH2)2CH3 -CH(CH3)CH2OH -CH(CH3)CH2OH -(CH2)CH3 -CH(CH3)CH2CH2OH -(CH2)4CH3 -CH(CH3)CH2CH2CH3 -CH(CH2CH3)2 -(CH2)5CH3 -CH(CH3)CH2CH2CH2CH3 -(CH2)6CH3 -CH(CH3)CH2CH2CH2CH2CH3 -CH3 -CH2CH3 -(CH2)2CH3 -CH(CH3)2 -CH(CH3)CH2C6H5 -CH2CH3 -(CH2)2CH3 -(CH2)2CH3 -CH(CH3)2 -CH2CH=CH2 -(CH2)2CH3
-CH2CH2CH2CH2- -CH2CH=CHCH2- -CH2CH2CH2CH2CH2- -CH2CH2OCH2CH2- -CH2CH3 -CH(CH2CH3)CH2OH -COCH3
-CH2CH2CH2CH2- -H -H -H -H -H* -H -H* -H* -H -H* -H -H -H* -H -H* -CH3 -CH3 -CH3 -CH3 -CH3* -CH2CH3 -CH2CH3 -(CH2)2CH3 -CH(CH3)2 -CH2CH=CH2 -(CH2)3CH3
-H -H* -CH2CH3
LA-111
LAE-32
Ergonovine
Methergine
DAM-57
LAMP
LSD-25
DAL
LPD-824
LSM-775 MLA-74 UML-491 APA-10 MPD75
In the amides marked with "*" there has been the introduction of a new asymmetric center, which of course doubles the number of isomers that is possible. In each case the resulting two optical forms were prepared separately, and evaluated separately as to their pharmacology.
This listing is not intended to be thorough, but it is shown to suggest the amount of synthetic effort that has been made towards the exploring and understanding the high potency associated with those two remarkably important ethyl groups on the amide nitrogen of LSD. I have given the Sandoz code names, again, as far as I know them. Although none of these really warrant a dedicated recipe, there is sufficient animal and human pharmacology reported to justify listing them below as separate items. Most of these reports appeared in the mid-1950's but some studies are still being done and papers are published even today with new ideas but, sadly, only with animal pharmacology. I have been as guilty as the next person who has tried to mount all these compounds into a table with a "human potency" factor that compares them directly to LSD. This is an uncomfortable simplification. Here are the actual reported observations, and I'll let the reader provide his own potency index.
LA-111, ergine, d-lysergamide. This is an active compound and has been established as a major component in morning glory seeds. It was assayed for human activity, by Albert Hofmann in self-trials back in 1947, well before this was known to be a natural compound. An i.m. administration of a 500 microgram dose led to a tired, dreamy state with an inability to maintain clear thoughts. After a short period of sleep, the effects were gone and normal baseline was recovered within five hours. Other observers have confirmed this clouding of consciousness leading to sleep. The epimer, inverted at C-8, is isoergine or d-isolysergamide, and is also a component of morning glory seeds. Hofmann tried a 2 milligram dose of this amide, and as with ergine, he experienced nothing but tiredness, apathy, and a feeling of emptiness. Both compounds are probably correctly dismissed as not being a contributor to the action of these seeds. It is important to note that ergine, as well as lysergic acid itself, is listed as a Schedule III drug in the Controlled Substances Act, as a depressant. This is, in all probability, a stratagem to control them as logical precursors to LSD.
LAE-32, N-ethyllysergamide.Different people have observed and reported different effects, with different routes of administration. Subcutaneous administrations of from 500 to 750 micrograms have been said to produce a state of apathy and sedation. Clinical studies with dosages of 500 micrograms i.m. were felt to be less effective than the control use of 100 micrograms of LSD. And yet, oral doses of twice this amount, 1.6 milligrams, have been said to produce a short-lived LSD-like effect with none of these negatives.
LPD-824, N-Pyrrolidyllysergamide. Five trials at a dosage of 800 micrograms orally led to the reporting of a fleeting effect that was similar to one tenth this amount of LSD.
LSM-775, N-Morpholinyllysergamide. There are conflicting reports; one states that 75 micrograms is an effective dose, comparable to a similar dose of LSD, and the other stated that between 350 and 700 micrograms was needed to elicit this response, and that there were fewer signs of cardiovascular stimulation and peripheral toxicity.
DAM-57, N,N-Dimethyllysergamide. This compound did induce autonomic disturbances at oral levels of some ten times the dosage required for LSD, presumably in the high hundreds of micrograms. There is some disagreement as to whether there were psychic changes observed.
DAL, N,N-Diallyllysergamide. As the tartrate salt, there is at best a touch of sparkle seen at 600 micrograms orally, but there is a sedation also reported. It is certainly an order of magnitude less potent than LSD itself.
UML-491, Methysergide, Sansert. This is the synthetic homologue of methergine (1-methyl) and is employed clinically as a treatment for migraine headaches. When the usual therapeutic dosage of two milligrams is scaled up by a factor of ten, there is a profound LSD-like response described by most subjects. A number of these ergot analogues from nature can be considered as potential precursors for the preparation of LSD. But here, there is a 1-methyl group that is effectively permanently attached, so it cannot play this role.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The third location of structural modification of the LSD molecule has been at the 6-position in ring D. This is the LAD series with any of several alkyl groups attached to the nitrogen atom. The methyl group is found with LSD itself, and is reason for using METH-LAD in the title as a synonym. The ethyl, allyl and propyl substitutions provide ETH-LAD, AL-LAD, and PRO-LAD, and each of these commands a separate entry.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The most frequently encountered precursor for the manufacture of LSD is ergotamine, a major alkaloid of the ergot world. It is totally unknown in the morning glories. The usual commercial form is the tartrate salt, and is often referred to under the code abbreviation of ET, for ergotamine tartrate. It has found medical use in the treatment of migraine headaches, and as an oxytocic (an agent that is used in childbirth to stimulate uterine contractions. Care with the ET terminology must be taken, in that in the drug world it has two additional associations; a-ET for alpha-ethyltryptamine and NET for N-monoethyltryptamine. Ergonovine is a naturally occurring, water-soluble ergot alkaloid, found in both ergot preparations and in many species of morning glory seeds, and there are several reports of LSD-like action at oral levels of between two and ten milligrams. It has an important use in obstetrics, again as an oxytocic, at about a tenth of this dose. This pharmacological potential must be respected in psychopharmacological trials. The one-carbon homologue (the butanolamide rather than the propanolamide) is called methergine or methylergonovine. It is a synthetic ally and is orally effective as an oxytocic at a dosage of 200 micrograms. It also has an LSD-like action at ten times this level.
Although there are many other chemical treasures in the ergot fungal world, I would like to wrap this commentary up with a return to the topic of morning glory seeds. Four additional alkaloids of the ergot world must be acknowledged as being potentially participating factors in the MGS story. With each of these, the primary ergoline ring system is largely intact but the amide function is completely gone. The carboxyl group has been reduced to the alcohol to give elymoclavine. There is the related molecule present which is the isomer with the double bond moved to be conjugated with the aromatic ring; it is called lysergol. There is the same molecule but with a hydroxy group attached to the 8-position carbon atom (an ethyleneglycol!) ; it is called penniclavine. And lastly, that D-ring can actually be opened between the 5 and 6 positions, to give us a secondary amine tryptamine derivative, chanoclavine. To be completely anally retentive in this Ipomoea inventory, mention must be made of five alkaloids that are present in truly trace amounts, all of which have no oxygen atoms present whatsoever on that substitution on the ergoline 8-position. These are the 8-methyl isomers agroclavine, setoclavine, festuclavine and cycloclavine, and the methylene analogue lysergene. These structures in effect define absolute obscurity, and most probably do not contribute to the morning glory intoxication state. But the others, some present is sizable amounts, may someday help explain why the pharmacology of these seeds is so different than that of the major isolates, the ergines.
MDMA Professor X Salvia Divinorum The Potential of LSD The Good Drug Guide Utopian Pharmacology The Doors of Perception High Times at the Delphic Oracle? Psychiatric experimentation with LSD Soldiers On Acid (Video; mp4; 6.55Mb) LSD, Francis Crick and the Secret of Life Albert Hofmann's LSD : My Problem Child
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 You will be missed
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2859558484
Growery is Better



Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 8,752
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ah, another great thread
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dtugg
Druggie


Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 355
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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So you are saying you know a chemist? Yeah right.
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TheShroomJew23
The Chemist


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 1,611
Loc: Temple
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: dtugg]
#7925378 - 01/24/08 05:38 PM (16 years, 8 days ago) |
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I live on a fucking college campus, I could get a dime a dozen.
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 You will be missed
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dtugg
Druggie


Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 355
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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So every chemist on a given college campus makes LSD?
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2859558484
Growery is Better



Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 8,752
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: dtugg]
#7925426 - 01/24/08 05:44 PM (16 years, 8 days ago) |
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brah, we got our ovens blazin out these heady doses down here at the campus labz
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Sell Your Soul
Nutmeg shaman



Registered: 03/15/00
Posts: 40,819
Loc: Over there
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: dtugg]
#7925430 - 01/24/08 05:45 PM (16 years, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
dtugg said: So every chemist on a given college campus makes LSD?
This may not be a bad time to enroll again for some bullshit courses.
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Sophistic Radiance
Free sVs!



Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 43,135
Loc: Center of the Universe
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: dtugg]
#7925432 - 01/24/08 05:45 PM (16 years, 8 days ago) |
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Dude. Who fucking cares.
I'm so tired of these "I know a cook" "NO YOU DON'T" threads cluttering up the TPE. They are stupid. And you are stupid for igniting such a stupid, meaningless flamewar.
This thread should be locked immediately before it gets even stupider.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
Edited by Tchan909 (01/24/08 05:46 PM)
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sui
I love you.



Registered: 08/20/04
Posts: 31,853
Loc: Cali, Contra Costa Co.
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Quote:
TheShroomJew23 said: I live on a fucking college campus, I could get a dime a dozen.
lol
-------------------- "There is never a wrong note, bend it." Jimi Hendrix
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Overclock22
Here, There andBack Again



Registered: 09/19/07
Posts: 208
Loc: NY
Last seen: 13 years, 1 month
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Well lyserigic acid comes from a rye fungus called ergot. if somones messing with ergot then its gotta be acid not lsa. Was he messing with seeds?
Edit: I r slow
-------------------- He did not laugh as his eyes stopped in awareness of the earth around him. His face was like a law of nature-a thing one could not question, alter or implore. It had high cheekbones over gaunt, hollow cheeks; gray eyes, cold and steady; a contemptuous mouth, shut tight, the mouth of an executioner or a saint. If you wake up at a different time in a different place, can you wake up a different person? Cf. A.C. Doyle "I'll rise above this, you can't keep me down, for I am Divine, and I know it all too well."
Edited by Overclock22 (01/24/08 05:52 PM)
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dtugg
Druggie


Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 355
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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Quote:
Tchan909 said: Dude. Who fucking cares.
I'm so tired of these "I know a cook" "NO YOU DON'T" threads cluttering up the TPE. They are stupid. And you are stupid for igniting such a stupid, meaningless flamewar.
This thread should be locked immediately before it gets even stupider.
I am bored, thats why I calling this guy out. If you don't care why are you even bothering posting a reply? Just ignore it.
I'll leave it at this: If I knew a cook, I wouldn't be so stupid to post about it on a messageboard that anybody could read.
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Sophistic Radiance
Free sVs!



Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 43,135
Loc: Center of the Universe
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Re: LSD-25 [Re: dtugg]
#7925511 - 01/24/08 05:57 PM (16 years, 8 days ago) |
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Ok, so now we know what you wouldn't do if you were ShroomJew. Great.
I wouldn't be calling YOU out if your arrogant, egocentric opinions had been asked for, but they were not.
I come here when I'm bored too, but it just irritates me when people heckle each other over whether their acid is "real." This happens constantly in this forum and is nothing but an excuse for people to flap their jaws regarding how smart they are about acid. It pisses me off, and I'd rather be bored than pissed-off. Therefore, I am now leaving this thread forever, goodbye.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
Edited by Tchan909 (01/24/08 05:59 PM)
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Sell Your Soul
Nutmeg shaman



Registered: 03/15/00
Posts: 40,819
Loc: Over there
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Quote:
Tchan909 said: Ok, so now we know what you wouldn't do if you were ShroomJew. Great.
I come here when I'm bored too, but it just irritates me when people heckle each other over whether their acid is "real." This happens constantly in this forum and is nothing but an excuse for people to flap their jaws regarding how smart they are about acid. It pisses me off, and I'd rather be bored than pissed-off.
This is why I haven't been coming around here lately.
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2859558484
Growery is Better



Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 8,752
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stfu
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dtugg
Druggie


Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 355
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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Quote:
Tchan909 said: Ok, so now we know what you wouldn't do if you were ShroomJew. Great.
I wouldn't be calling YOU out if your arrogant, egocentric opinions had been asked for, but they were not.
I come here when I'm bored too, but it just irritates me when people heckle each other over whether their acid is "real." This happens constantly in this forum and is nothing but an excuse for people to flap their jaws regarding how smart they are about acid. It pisses me off, and I'd rather be bored than pissed-off. Therefore, I am now leaving this thread forever, goodbye.
I honestly don't care. If you don't like what I have to say, ignore me.
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PilzeEssen


Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 7,312
Loc: USA
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
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Quote:
TheShroomJew23 said: Im pretty sure I did and no matter what you say you cant change my mind.
dont be ignorant. you have to admit that you dont know everything.
possibly AMT or one of the DOx's.
-------------------- "The soul has greater need of the ideal than of the real. It is by the real that we exist, it is by the ideal that we live." If you want to get a hold of me, my email address is in my profile. Just click on my screen name. I got banned from using private messages cause I didn't follow the rules...
Edited by PilzeEssen (01/24/08 07:26 PM)
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Ransford
Stranger

Registered: 04/05/07
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All im saying is no way you can see sound and still type on the computer. Hell I couldn't even have anything that permitted any light on. White shirts in a dark room even created there own glow.
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yageman
already dead


Registered: 01/26/06
Posts: 4,965
Last seen: 14 years, 9 months
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Quote:
Ransford said: All im saying is no way you can see sound and still type on the computer. Hell I couldn't even have anything that permitted any light on. White shirts in a dark room even created there own glow.
Never tried it.
But I can call bullshit on that statement.
Im 100 percent sure that this is possible, and I have never used a computer while tripping.
Sorry, some people have different ways of looking at things. Im a jazz musician, and I must say, BULLSHIT.
Im 100% sure about this. Im not saying that all people can see music and still type on the computer. I mean, some people cant see visuals on 1/8th of shrooms. I see visuals on .1 grams of shrooms.
Fuck off, you ignorant, mushroom eating, trustfundy, common-ass, forum visiting kid.
"all I was saying"........."Im just saying".......derrrrrrrrrrr
NOTHING.
Some balls. Sorry mods, this type of shit needs to be said sometimes.
You think I cant see music when sober? Im a musician who has tripped over 170 times and can see visual geometries with music ANY time im really listening to it. Sorry, I see music.
This ability influences visuals for some people.
Your visuals are a representation of cognition. The smallest part of visuals are on the surface and most people can see them depending on dose. Its way deeper than that. Its called synesthesia.
Its all connected and is a hologram of neurology.
Sorry you cant see anything like this, but its very real and happens to many people.
---->way too much effort to call out some dipshit, I know. Its worth it though because its true, and some people just dont understand the scope of human condition.
Hope this helps..................
-------------------- [quote]Me_Roy said: You moron. Material is material is material. No 'thing' fixes any situation. If anything were so simple we would be living in a much better world.[/quote] <-----the dumbest thing I have ever read in my life. Thanks shroomery.
Edited by yageman (01/24/08 10:59 PM)
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PilzeEssen


Registered: 12/24/07
Posts: 7,312
Loc: USA
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
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Quote:
Ransford said: All im saying is no way you can see sound and still type on the computer. Hell I couldn't even have anything that permitted any light on. White shirts in a dark room even created there own glow.
ok seriousl question, how old are you?
-------------------- "The soul has greater need of the ideal than of the real. It is by the real that we exist, it is by the ideal that we live." If you want to get a hold of me, my email address is in my profile. Just click on my screen name. I got banned from using private messages cause I didn't follow the rules...
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SeeWithEyesShut
Stranger
Registered: 06/09/08
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any lsd users in socal =P?
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zootroid
Stranger

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You can definitly see music and type on a computer. You haven't experienced it, so that doesn't mean it's not true.
The first time I smoked an entire joint to myself I was with my 4 best friends. We were at edgefest and I had several firsts that day. It was the first time I had experienced slowed vision. It was the first REAL concert I ever went to and it was the first time I SEEN music.
Everytime the bass drum sounded a massive transparent (exactly like the mirages you see on the road in the summer) "shock wave" type of blast showed itself. It was fucking amazing.
So basically just because you don't believe it, doesn't mean it's not really there.
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Ima Trooper
Chilldog Extraordinaire



Registered: 02/21/08
Posts: 13,533
Loc: United States
Last seen: 2 days, 21 hours
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Quote:
zootroid said: You can definitly see music and type on a computer. You haven't experienced it, so that doesn't mean it's not true.
The first time I smoked an entire joint to myself I was with my 4 best friends. We were at edgefest and I had several firsts that day. It was the first time I had experienced slowed vision. It was the first REAL concert I ever went to and it was the first time I SEEN music.
Everytime the bass drum sounded a massive transparent (exactly like the mirages you see on the road in the summer) "shock wave" type of blast showed itself. It was fucking amazing.
So basically just because you don't believe it, doesn't mean it's not really there.
That would be cool as shit!
-------------------- "Its moving of its own accord...and I like that in a shirt!" - Me, tripping. deCypher said: Schizophrenia beats dining alone, you know.
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doitagain
He-Bro



Registered: 02/22/07
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nope, no one in so-cal has ever taken lsd.
-------------------- now i hear the police comin after me
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MushroomMarkk
Stranger


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fuck, there have been plenty of times ive seen music and typed on a computer. Seeing the music is the thing that motivated me to type and search for new songs to see. Each song had its own colors, but if i wasnt able to type i wouldnt have been able to search for the other songs now would i?
I do admit though, when i was a beginner with mind expansion techniques it was very difficult to even understand wtf a computer was.
I am talking about tripping to see sounds btw.
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