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 OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,407
Loc: Under the C
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 Original Sin 
#7908986 - 01/21/08 10:16 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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And God spake unto Adam and Eve and said, "Behold I give you free will. You may choose A or B, but if you choose B, you and all your progeny are fucked for all time."
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redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 34,893
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i guess anybody can write their won version of a bible.
the censors will have a heyday.
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 đź§
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AnastomosisJihad
Hominid
Registered: 01/01/08
Posts: 700
Loc: Ohio
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No, just fucked for a little while until the messiah comes to redeem humanity, and all of creation with them.
You left out the best part of the story!
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come together
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redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 34,893
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the fucking is usually the best part?
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đź§
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 backfromthedead
Activated
Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 3,592
Last seen: 14 years, 9 months
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What a pickle.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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You believe in God?
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,407
Loc: Under the C
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 Re: Original Sin [Re: Icelander]
#7910417 - 01/21/08 04:32 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Do you know of any other entity who 'spakes' or starts a sentence with 'Behold'?
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fivepointer
newbie
Registered: 08/03/02
Posts: 1,428
Last seen: 6 years, 6 months
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Probation of Human Race in Adam
When God placed Adam on probation it pleased Him to place the whole human race on probation, for Adam’s posterity were not only in him seminally as their natural head, but they were also in him legally and morally as their legal and moral head. In other words, by divine constitution and covenant Adam stood and acted as the federal representative of the whole human race. Consequently, when he sinned, we sinned; when he fell, we fell. God justly imputed Adam’s transgression to all his descendants, whose agent he was: "By the offense of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation" (Rom. 5:18). By his sin Adam became not only guilty but corrupt, and that defilement of nature is transmitted to all his children. Thomas Boston said, "Adam’s sin corrupted man’s nature and leavened the whole lump of mankind. We putrefied in Adam as our root. The root was poisoned, and so the branches were envenomed."
"Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all sinned" (Rom. 5:12). We repeat that Adam was not only the father but the federal representative of his posterity. Consequently justice required that they should be dealt with as sharing in his guilt, that therefore the same punishment should be inflicted on them, which is exactly what the vitally important passage in Romans 5:12-21 affirms. "By one man [acting on behalf of the many], sin entered [as a foreign element, as a hostile factor] into the world [the whole system over which Adam had been placed as the vicegerent of God: blasting the fair face of nature, bringing a curse upon the earth, ruining all humanity], and death by sin [as its appointed wages]; and so death [as the sentence of the righteous Judge] passed upon all men [because all men were seminally and federally in Adam]."
It needs to be carefully borne in mind that in connection with the penal infliction which came upon man at the fall, he lost no moral or spiritual faculty, but rather the power to use them right. In Scripture "death" (as the wages of sin) does not signify annihilation but separation. As physical death is the separation of the soul from the body, so spiritual death is the separation of the soul from its Maker. Ephesians 4:18 expresses it as "being alienated from the life of God." Thus, when the father said of the prodigal, "This my son was dead" (Luke 15), he meant that his son had been absent from him—away in the "far country." Hence when, as the Substitute of His people, Christ was receiving in their stead the wages due them, He cried, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" This is why the lake of fire is called "the second death"—because those cast there are "punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord" (2 Thess. 1:9).
We have said that all of Adam’s posterity shared in the guilt of the great transgression committed by their federal head, and that therefore the same punishment is inflicted on them as on him. That punishment consisted (so far as its present character is concerned) in his coming under the curse and wrath of God, the corrupting of his nature, and the mortalizing of his body. Clear proof of this is found in that inspired statement "And Adam lived a hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image" (Gen. 5:3), which is in direct antithesis to his being created "in the image of God" (Gen. 1:27). That Adam’s first son was morally depraved was clearly evidenced by his conduct; and that his second son was also depraved was fully acknowledged by the sacrifice which he brought to God.
As a result of the fall man is born into this world so totally depraved in his moral nature as to be entirely unable to do anything spiritually good; furthermore, he is not in the slightest degree disposed to do good. Even under the exciting and persuasive influences of divine grace, the will of man is completely unfit to act right in cooperation with grace until the will itself is by the power of God radically and permanently renewed. The tree itself must be made good before there is the least prospect of any good fruit being borne by it. Even after a man is regenerated, the renewed will always continues dependent on divine grace to energize, direct and enable it for the performance of anything acceptable to God, as the language of Christ clearly shows: "Without me ye can do nothing" (John 15:5).
-From Arthur W. Pink's booklet "The Doctrine of Man's Impotence" Chapter 3
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
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Quote:
Do you know of any other entity who 'spakes' or starts a sentence with 'Behold'?
I do...
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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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AnastomosisJihad
Hominid
Registered: 01/01/08
Posts: 700
Loc: Ohio
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That's a neat story, but what do you make of man's sinful condition in light of evolution? There was death and suffering for millions of years before man evolved the mental capicities necessary to engage in sin. Chronologically speaking, death was here long before man was here to sin.
How about the natural brutality in nature, like Cordyceps which colonize living animals and fruit from their carcases, or Darwin's favorite, the wasp who lays it's eggs in a caterpillar. How is the caterpillar's suffering man's fault?
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come together
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Foolish man. The world, the universe and everythingy is only 6,800 years old.
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
Edited by Icelander (01/22/08 09:33 AM)
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fivepointer
newbie
Registered: 08/03/02
Posts: 1,428
Last seen: 6 years, 6 months
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Quote:
AnastomosisJihad said:
That's a neat story, but what do you make of man's sinful condition in light of evolution? There was death and suffering for millions of years before man evolved the mental capicities necessary to engage in sin. Chronologically speaking, death was here long before man was here to sin.
How about the natural brutality in nature, like Cordyceps which colonize living animals and fruit from their carcases, or Darwin's favorite, the wasp who lays it's eggs in a caterpillar. How is the caterpillar's suffering man's fault?
Man didn't evolve, he was created. Tracing back the genealogy of scripture places the age of the universe at about 13,000 years old.
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
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No sin is original. They have all been done before. I have spent my life searching for such a sin to commit, but have not found it. In the meantime I refuse to copy others.
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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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AnastomosisJihad
Hominid
Registered: 01/01/08
Posts: 700
Loc: Ohio
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13,000 years eh? I thought it was around 6,000.
I'm not trying to pick on you, I'm just trying to get an idea of your system. Recent polling data indicates that a significant portion of the American population hold young-earth creationist views. In my mind such opinions are an indication of scientific illiteracy.
What do you think of the historical debates about heliocentricism? Many folks argued that according to the word of God Earth was at the center of the universe, but after the evidence for heliocentricism became overwhelming, people finally realized they were interpreting scripture incorrectly.
Do you think the earth is the center of the universe, or do you think people sometimes misinterpret scripture?
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come together
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fivepointer
newbie
Registered: 08/03/02
Posts: 1,428
Last seen: 6 years, 6 months
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Quote:
AnastomosisJihad said:
13,000 years eh? I thought it was around 6,000.
I'm not trying to pick on you, I'm just trying to get an idea of your system. Recent polling data indicates that a significant portion of the American population hold young-earth creationist views. In my mind such opinions are an indication of scientific illiteracy.
What do you think of the historical debates about heliocentricism? Many folks argued that according to the word of God Earth was at the center of the universe, but after the evidence for heliocentricism became overwhelming, people finally realized they were interpreting scripture incorrectly.
Do you think the earth is the center of the universe, or do you think people sometimes misinterpret scripture?
When scripture describes genealogy the descendants are not necessarily immediate descendants. The way this is determined is too complex to go into here. Following back and using scripture it is possible to determine the time line of the earth. Assuming that scripture is true since it is God breathed and preserved we must arrive at an age that is thousands of years (around 13,000). Someone can say evolution, but this is not scriptural. To say evolution is true is to say that scripture is untrue. This would mean God did not write the scripture since God can not lie.
I do not see scripture stating that the earth is the center of the universe. It simply doesn't address the issue.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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This would mean God did not write the scripture
 You finally got it right.
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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AnastomosisJihad
Hominid
Registered: 01/01/08
Posts: 700
Loc: Ohio
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Quote:
I do not see scripture stating that the earth is the center of the universe.
Psalm 93 was at the center of the debate.
Quote:
The world is firmly established;
it cannot be moved.
Psalm 93: vs1
If the earth cannot be moved, then it most certainly can not be orbiting the sun.
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come together
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