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Blue Fish Group Registered: 04/01/07 Posts: 45,414 Loc: Under the C |
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Is it wrong to approach a red-haired hippie chick in the wild?
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Fading Slowly ![]() Registered: 06/13/04 Posts: 10,685 Loc: On the Border |
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Quote: You cannot respect somethings "rights" if you kill it and eat it. If you can kill it then it must follow that it has no rights. If it had rights (something that it could proclaim) then you WOULD NOT be able to kill it. If you want to be an animal rights supporter fine, but you can't really ride the fence on this issue. They either have rights or not. The right to be treated humanely until something kills you for food is NOT a right. Who is being ridiculous now You do have rights. Can we kill you for food?Quote: This means that animals cannot have rights. We merely have a responsibility to our world as it's self proclaimed lords...or not. -------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda Edited by Huehuecoyotl (01/22/08 04:20 PM)
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Dr. Teasy Thighs Registered: 12/02/05 Posts: 14,794 Loc: red panda villag Last seen: 2 years, 10 months |
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Quote: Why? Because others say so? For example I love cows and I also love to eat their meat. And I don't see any contradiction in that. I guess it depends on how you understand this issue regarding respecting life. We were hunters once and in the same time we treated life with respect, we did not practice overkilling. I think that what he meant by "respectful, careful and intelligent manner" leaves room for enough interpretation so it does actually make sense. Let me give you an example: the E.U. has taken some important steps regarding the methods in which animals are killed: Quote: From: http://www.vegansociety.com/html Also: Quote: From: http://www.ari-online.org/pages/ Now, aren't these also animal rights? Couldn't one argue that this method of killing has taken steps towards being more respectful and intelligent? Now let's imagine this scenario: for some reason red pandas will start reproducing at such a speed that it becomes a threat to them (lack of space, food or other means of survival). How do you see killing & eating some of them in such a circumstance? Does such a measure respect life or not? What I am trying to point out is that it's not all that black and white. Situations may vary and change and also our views on them. Why should we tie ourselves to a strict and rigid definition of what "rights" are? Quote: Of course it does. We can pick on the signals that animals are sending and we can understand how they feel. Let's say we observe the behavior of red pandas. We become aware of their main personality traits and soon we realize that these playful animals seem to enjoy living life. In a certain but definite measure I can say that this is how their exercise their will to live, it's still an initiative on their side, the intention to live. ![]() It might not be expressed in the same manner as we humans are used to do it (in an invasive manner), but we can still understand what's happening there. When you see new born crying, you can't say that he is not expressing his sadness or fear regarding something just because he didn't tell you that, can you? Keeping that in mind, the same thing goes for any other living creature, in this case I shall keep the example with red pandas, because that's the subject. We realize what's happening to them, and if our intention is to be honest we will soon realize that, through their actions, they make an affirmation, a statement: that living creates joy for them.Let's take a look at them: I take this as an affirmation of love for life.
-------------------- ![]() ![]() ![]() All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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Teh Cat.... Registered: 09/07/04 Posts: 5,908 Loc: My Youniverse... Last seen: 14 years, 11 months |
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Quote: Well now.... I don't think the cow will be complaining....! ![]() ![]() You guys sure seem to be taking this panda thing seriously.... I like the pictures, and I have learned a lot more about Red Pandas, that is fo~ sho~.... >^;;^< -------------------- "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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The Minstrel in the Gallery Registered: 03/15/05 Posts: 95,368 Loc: underbelly |
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For example I love cows and I also love to eat their meat. And I don't see any contradiction in that.
I love you Mushroom trip. I would also like to kill you and eat you.![]() Well at least eat you.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Sexy.Butt.McDanger Registered: 03/12/02 Posts: 24,855 Loc: Pandurn Last seen: 1 year, 12 days |
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Quote: Of course, the idea of tripping with a dog or a cat is perfectly common, and happens with positive benefits. Grizzly bears and black panther are naturally carnivores that are likely not very receptive to direct interaction with humans, although that is really just a question of how they are raised from babies in relation to humans, no different than the manner in which puppies and kitties are raised in relation to humans. I've heard of pet bears before, though. Quote: Appeal to authority? Nah, it couldn't be. Quote: That's wonderful. ![]() Quote: I'm not seeing here any credible arguement agansit an animal and a human sharing a symbiotic relationship in this manner, certainly the idea that it is more a conscious decision of the human for it to happen is not relevant. Once again, you're riding agansit the grain of evolution and history on this one. From camels and llamas to horses, elephants, and parrots, humans have made conscious decisions to enter into such a relationship, and I see no true fault in this. Animals that are more conscious than others, such as dolphins and chimpanzees, even approach playing with a human being on their own. The idea that animals do not have inner experiences and that humans cannot directly interact with them in a way that serves the quality of that experience is baseless. Quote: No, that is simply your projection. The relationship between humans and dogs is a great testament to our success, and the benefits we have received from living with dogs and cats. The idea you propose that human beings could not begin a path of understanding the environment and the animals that exist within it, learning how to interact in order to better the situation for everyone, is not worth serious consideration. Perhaps you fail to understand that human behavior is a natural force as well, and that, as life, we may begin to understand more about ourselves as a result, while giving other life an opportunity to continue to exist and to have quality experience while they stay on this planet with us. Quote: And drawbacks for the people keeping them, and lots of advantages to these animals as well. Quote: We could learn how to act in accordance with the nature of reality in order to influence its course. Humans have developed agriculture thousands of years ago, so I don't comprehend where this perspective of yours results from, perhaps not this planet. When we have an intention of observing and understanding reality, we begin to actually do so, for the benefit of ourselves and other aspects of reality. Our entire history as a species is a great demonstration of this. The line you are drawing is unreasonable. Quote: Habitat resoration and maintenance is important. The first step to achieving this is to understand the environment itself, which would require an intimate understanding of that which exists within the environment. I wonder how that starts without someone actually becoming involved with this. Quote: Have I? Not yet, and thankfully, there is plenty of information that demonstrates that red pandas are receptive to interacting with humans in the same habitat, and that is reason enough to gain interest in pursuing this, to see and observe what actually happens. Stress is a sign that the psychological needs of an animal are not being met. If those needs are met, no stress. Ferrets are kept as pets and they are far too happy playing around, moving around like crazy, and getting into trouble to show any signs of stress. Of course, this is the case for almost any animal kept as a pet, of which there are a great number of, but it just goes to show how history has manifested and supported this viewpoint. Quote: We all start somewhere, and I've started a path of learning, from reading books on dogs by psychologists, to finding research articles on red pandas and bamboo, to planning an interest in zoology. Quote: A decent bit for my living situation. I look forward to spending more time doing so. You seem to hold onto a very predefined conception of the nature of life which tends to stand agansit the grain of history and what we have learned regarding evolution. -------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Sexy.Butt.McDanger Registered: 03/12/02 Posts: 24,855 Loc: Pandurn Last seen: 1 year, 12 days |
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Quote: Well, perhaps you don't really understand what it means to be a living creature. Nature demonstrates nothing but the food chain in action. This statement of yours has no relationship with the nature of reality. Perspectives from Native American thought show us that it is likely that it was tradition for these humans to fully respect and embrace the life of other animals, even if they were taking that life. They understood that they were just the perpetuation of a natural cycle that would one day take them as well, eventually becoming the soil, providing nutrients to benefit the evolution of more life. Clearly, this perspective you propose has no relation to nature. Quote: This seems to be far too simplified a viewpoint to bear relevance to the discussion. Quote: Exactly, we can either assume the role of being stewards for life and evolution on this planet, or not. I choose that role. Our presence on this planet to this point designates that we either choose this role or simply stand back and watch as massive extinction continues to ensue. -------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Sexy.Butt.McDanger Registered: 03/12/02 Posts: 24,855 Loc: Pandurn Last seen: 1 year, 12 days |
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Quote: A lot of people continue to hunt and fish, and the majority of them are responsible stewards of the earth. If it were not for hunting and fishing, there would not be nearly as strong of a conservation effort in this country. While some animals do meet their end to become venison stocked in the deep freeze, populations of animals thrive, and their population is managed by the hunters, as regulated by the state (which receives its funding to do so from hunting), so that they do not overpopulate, consume too many resources, and face a slow death of starvation and pestilence. Hunting has raised millions of dollars for the protection of natural habitat throughout the United States. Surely, our natural habitat does not disappear because of the interest of those who seek to utilize natural habitat to maintain a symbiotic relationship with other life. All of this is well documented and is directly demonstrated to benefit the survival and well-being of all sorts of animals that were otherwise facing extinction due to the nature of our presence. Around 1930, in the United States, white-tailed deer were thought to have a population of about 30 thousand. Conservation programs begun, funded and participated in by hunters, and now the number of white-tailed deer in the United States is around 30 million. The Greater Canadian Goose was thought to be extinct by the 1950's, until a small flock was discovered in the '60's. It is now populated throughout its range, thanks to conservation efforts. This holds true for the wild turkey, as well as many other animals. Quote: All evidence points to it being more effective for populations to be regulated through hunting (in the absence of predators that perform a necessary check to maintain balance, just like all natural systems ). The interest in hunting creates incentive for habitats to be sustained and restored. The Native Americans took hides from buffalo, coyote, etc. etc. etc. and used them to keep themselves warm and comfortable. They migrated with buffalo herds with tipis with a canopy made from buffalo hides to keep shelter. They did not overhunt the buffalo and did not waste the precious resources that they provided. Symbiotic relationships are mutually beneficial, the buffalo thrived and lived what would seem a preferable life. Quote: Fear, judgement, misconceptions? ![]() Quote: No, you can't say that, and humans traditonally have deep misconceptions of the usage of language by animals. We carry with us human bias that assumes that life must match up to our standard. Dogs don't talk because their physical nature, the shape of their skull, for instance, limit the ability for muscles to develop that allow them to manipulate air passing through in a great variety of ways. Bees have a very refined language that they can use to communicate new locations, maybe a mile away, to other bees. Researchers who have studied these bees were capable of cracking the code and arriving at the location before the bees did. Quote: They want to play.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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The Minstrel in the Gallery Registered: 03/15/05 Posts: 95,368 Loc: underbelly |
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I've heard of pet bears before, though.
On one of these forums right now there is a great vid of a woman being seriously mauled by a "pet bear" . This woman was just sitting there and the bear noticed her and just full out attacked. Nice pet, nice pet. From camels and llamas to horses, elephants, and parrots, humans have made conscious decisions to enter into such a relationship As their captors. I'm sure the parrot just flew into the cage and said hey dude clip my wings I hate flying and moving about. The animal that seems to have sought human co-habitation is the dog. benefits we have received from living with dogs and cats. Yes, we have received benefit but for the most part they have not. If you spend any time at an animal shelter you will become aware of that. Not to mention the folk that don't interact with there pets, leave them alone or always on a leash, make them a surrogate for the friends and children they can't acquire. It's really sad when you take a good look at it. I certainly doubt that red pandas want to be your pet and leave their environment. The idea you propose that human beings could not begin a path of understanding the environment and the animals that exist within it, learning how to interact in order to better the situation for everyone, is not worth serious consideration. Perhaps you fail to understand that human behavior is a natural force as well, Many humans do (but obviously not many and less and less) already understand the environment and the animals that exist in it. They are trying to preserve it rather than altering it to fit our desires. There's enough of that already IMO. Of course I understand that human behavior is a natural force. That's why I'm disputing your ideas here.there is plenty of information that demonstrates that red pandas are receptive to interacting with humans in the same habitat, Any animal in captivity would have to interact with humans in the same habitat. A tortured parrot in a small cage will interact with humans in an attempt to postpone insanity. I saw lots of this at the zoo and in my work with dog training and volunteering at the animal shelter, and of course in daily life. Is your information based on these animals in captivity or the wild? I doubt red pandas willfully enter into captivity. ![]() . You seem to hold onto a very predefined conception of the nature of life which tends to stand against the grain of history and what we have learned regarding evolution. ![]()
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Beyond Registered: 05/07/04 Posts: 6,697 Loc: Between Last seen: 3 years, 16 days |
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LEAVE RED PANDAS ALONE !
![]() [ ]
--------------------
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Sexy.Butt.McDanger Registered: 03/12/02 Posts: 24,855 Loc: Pandurn Last seen: 1 year, 12 days |
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Quote: I've already stated that I personally feel that certain animals are not receptive to being kept as pets by humans. This is only logical; there isn't much benefit for either moose or man if there is a moose in a man's living room. The question regarding the "pet bear" is the specifics of the situation in question, but its a side-point to the main discussion. I only mentioned it in passing, acknowledging that I had heard of as much. Clearly the potential for risk is there if someone attempts to live in course quarters with an animal that is naturally a carnivore and over-powers you in ways that will threaten your own survival. It is only common sense, thankfully, I'm not proposing the idea of keeping a bear as a pet in this thread. Quote: Amazingly enough, people keep parrots whose wings do not get clipped, and the people who tend to them take great steps towards creating an environment for them that is well-suited for the animal's needs. I've already referred to the concept of a micro-habitat. What you might not understand is that responsible pet owners go to great strides to provide their animals with the best possible treatment, to ensure their quality of life and that their psychological needs are met. Humans are capable of controlling enough variables in an environment to specifically suit them in a capable, effective manner - this is why cichlids from the lakes of Africa can flourish in a living room in America, in a tank of water weighing half a ton, the exact requirements of their water being regulated by an amateur scientist at work. Clearly, this is why scientific understanding regarding the nature of animals is necessary, in order to understand them and what their needs are. This is also why you ensure responsible owners through unobstructive regulation, promoting education and understanding. Quote: This isn't true, neither dogs nor humans actively sought out a symbiotic relationship with the other. The fact that similar needs brought them to share the same living space, thus leading to their interaction, brought forth the relationship and the subsequent evolution of both species. I still see no reason why humans cannot consciously make decisions to seek out these cirumstances with other animals, provided that it is done in an educated, responsible manner. Quote: Balderdash. Dogs and cats have shared loving, playful relationships with humans. Dogs are often used in hunting and other work, and performing tasks with their alpha male, the sense of being that they derive from social interaction, benefits them. They have diets that are specially formulated for their nutritional needs, so they are healthier than ever with proper exercise, which no doubt benefits quality of life. They receive more stimulation through human interaction, since human beings are capable of interacting with them in a limitless number of ways. Dogs communicate through smell much more prominently than we do, and our world offers them a cornucopia of new sensations and experiences. I've seen dogs develop state of being that is not so evident in some humans. Anyone with a positive sense of keeping pets would not be so dismissive of the idea. Quote: Most people are too stupid to know how to raise their own children; how likely is it that you think they understand the nature and needs of another form of life? This is why there should be more educational regulation at the point at which an animal leaves the care of a responsible, experienced person into the hands of a new owner. Pointing to the failure of those who were incapable of knowing what they were doing as failure of the concepts and ideas I have presented is a strawman. Quote: Right, it is sad, but it didn't really need mentioned, beyond to present the opportunity for me to clarify that I'm not talking about what you are talking about. Quote: What environment? They don't have much of one left. They have very specific dietary needs that are very difficult to be catered to in the environment, needs that could be amply satisfied with a bamboo grow room. This isn't just about pets, this is about the brink of extinction. I certainly doubt that they want to be in zoos with your logic, but its either that or extinction at this point, and the care of loving humans in a personal setting will be much more satisfying than being on display in some zoo, especially considering the observed nature of red pandas as well as their adaptability to getting along with human beings. I can understand that, for whatever reason, you would rather let a wonderful animal go extinct because of our presence on this planet, but I see it more compassionately than that, and I'm not going to let it happen. Its a lack of interest in life itself that condemns an innocent creature to extinction, at the expense of an opportunity of a wonderful symbiotic relationship among red pandas and human beings. Quote: An attempt to preserve certainly sounds like an attempt to alter the course of reality to fit our desires to me. At any rate, evolution is a progressive movement, change. Humans typically hold misconceptions of the nature of consciousness and the fact that other animals could very well be on a path of evolving consciousness as well. Perhaps we are afraid of competition, but the idea of another animal evolving to be as aware of the nature of reality as we presently are seems a very natural one, an expected course for reality to take, especially as we continue along our path of becoming more aware ourselves. Red pandas seem very receptive to a very positive, mutually-beneficial, symbiotic relationship with human beings. Quote: Yes, and I'm certain that some animals are more receptive to positive interaction with humans than others are. Red pandas have been observed to be very receptive to getting along with humans, at least enough for some individuals to become interested in learning more, gazing through a new perspective on the matter. Quote: Seems likely, but we aren't talking about a tortured parrot in a small cage, we are talking about fluffy red pandas receiving stimulating interaction from friendly humans and red panda buddies in a relaxed, natural, spacious setting, in which great care is taken to meet the physical and psychological needs of red pandas. Such is unprecedented, so to dismiss the idea based in reason and observation with irrelevant references to entirely dissimiliar hypotheticals is not necessary in this discussion. Quote: Neither do humans, but they still seem adequately satisfied with a system where an institution forcefully takes your wealth to economically ruin you. The power of being born into a pre-existing environment that is already suited for your presence. Quote: Its plainly evident in the perspective you have put forth. Its like thinking in the past while imagining the future, without understanding the sense of the present moment and a path existing in accordance with nature to lead to that imagined future, all lying dependent upon the action we take right now. We really prevent ourselves from changing for the better when we stay stuck in unchallenged conditioning. -------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Dr. Teasy Thighs Registered: 12/02/05 Posts: 14,794 Loc: red panda villag Last seen: 2 years, 10 months |
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Quote: Pets become violent when they're being harassed. Also a "pet bear" is kind of vague, as there are lots of kinds of bears, all with different personality traits. Did you know that children can become violent with their parents IF the parents are acting stupid and tiresome? What does this say? That it's dangerous to grow children or that it's a good thing to learn how to behave and treat them? I recall when I was four and I was with my mother. She kept talking to me on & on and she was really annoying, playing with my hands and other things she thoughts they were "cute" to do to child. She wouldn't notice my obvious irritation so I pinched the tip of her nose so hard that she had a small mark for a few days. Does this mean that I was a dangerous kid? ![]() Pets borrow traits from their owner's character. If the owner is hysterical or has some form of anxiety, the pet will pick up on it too. If the owner is relaxed and loving, the pet will be loving too. Just out of curiosity, did you watch any of those red panda videos? You say you have experience with animals, I am sure that you could create an idea about what kind of animals they are. ![]() I have been around animals since I was a child and I've always love playing and connecting with them. I not even once feared animals and I realized that this makes a HUGE difference for them. Quote: Yes, it is true that some people do that. ![]() But you know very well that it doesn't happen like that in all cases. We can really connect with other animals, in a true way and not forced. Why emphasize only a not so intelligent way of interacting with those critters? Quote: Are all pets in this situation? It sounds to me like an over-generalization. Just because some people behave irresponsibly with animals and they make them sad, it doesn't mean that animals are unhappy around humans. It only means that animals are unhappy around irresponsible people. I am sure you can see the difference. Also what I am thinking about is EXACTLY trying to work on developing a deeper understanding regarding what our pets need and what makes them happy. I feel that there's so much to explore in this direction that it would be a pity to just think that there's nothing to see there. This is probably because I had some experiences which made me think that there IS indeed room for creating a deeper bond with them. If I am mistaking I guess I shall learn, but as you seriously doubt that red pandas could enjoy our company, I seriously doubt that they wouldn't. What I do know is that I am not going to turn my back on this before trying it. ![]() I still have something not quite clear and I hope you will shed some light for me. Are you trying to make a point that NO animals feel happy as pets, or are you referring only to red pandas? Have you ever had a pet? If yes, could you say whether it was happy or not? I found some interesting info about the domestication of the cat: Quote: Now I don't know what you know about cats, but it's a well known fact that they have a strong personality and that they do only what they want. How do you explain yourself the fact they stay around humans? Even if they leave (because it's in their nature to wander around), most of them come back to their owners. Why do you think they would do that, for other reason than them wanting to be there? They love to cuddle and they love to get human attention in all it's forms. I have two cats, and let me tell you that it is THEM who seek attention (s well as other times they just turn their asses on me when they don't feel like seeing me around ). They are wonderful and loving beings. ![]() This is him And this is her While these particular cats are lovely and sweet, other cats can be a threat. I have a friend who was attacked by someone's Burmese and from what she told me she was pretty shocked by it's barbaric approach. From what I gathered, the owner has a very aggressive temper as well. Well, for me, that's a clear sign that some animals can borrow so much from our personality, which only leads me to the conclusion that they are compatible with us.
-------------------- ![]() ![]() ![]() All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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The Minstrel in the Gallery Registered: 03/15/05 Posts: 95,368 Loc: underbelly |
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How do you explain yourself the fact they stay around humans?
![]() Humans provide an easy living for them which insures their survival. Take away the food and warm house and see how long they stick around. Kittens are encultured around humans and so lose the ability to fend for themselves. Most feral cats that were once domestic starve or become easy prey because they have lost their instinctual edge. And of course they seek attention. That's natural enough. That doesn't mean much at all. A lion will seek attention from a zoo keeper when in the mood. But if you gave them their instincts back in full and opened the cage with a place to go. They would go. I believe the same is true for cats. The fact that they are domesticated keeps them in place. But I can see your POV as you are also domesticated. Just try not to masturbate in front of the paying customers.-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Stranger Registered: 04/06/06 Posts: 3,950 |
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http://www.shroomery.org/forums/
already been there feral red panda gang ON YO ASS.
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Sexy.Butt.McDanger Registered: 03/12/02 Posts: 24,855 Loc: Pandurn Last seen: 1 year, 12 days |
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Quote: No, that isn't how cats first began to interact with humans. The living circumstances of early humans would naturally attract the presence of cats, who benefited from a symbiotic relationship with humans. It isn't as though the first human went out from a cave with a dish and yelled "Here kitty kitty kitty". So, it could be said that the cat-human relationship started when both animals sought out an easier form of living, which brings question to your argument, as though an easier form of living was not preferable. I'd have to assume that it is in the interest of most animals to live and to not go extinct. Animals like red pandas are not capable of making conscious decisions like "Should I go live with humans and not go extinct here?", but it doesn't mean that we should not ask the question. Quote: Yes, but this arguement makes no sense when we aren't talking about taking animals out from the wild, raising them in relation to ourselves, and then going back out and dumping them in the wild, unable to survive in an environment in which they weren't raised in. The only legitamate question regarding this is whether or not it is ethical for humans to bring animals to coexist with them in a new environment, and whether it is psychologically satisfying to the animal. This is the question that we are interested in pursuing - not some kind of vicious neglect and irrelevant situations that you continue to present. Quote: Instincts as the defining factor of how animals are to be? Curiously enough, instincts haven't held humans back from evolution, although they still seem to manifest in our behavior, until that is consciously transcended as well. Evolution occurs over time. New instincts are manifested behavior emerge over time, over successive generations. This is plainly evident in the case of the dog. The ingrained psychology of a dog is very similar to that of a wolf pup. Did you know that the environment tends to favor the re-emergence of specific traits, through genetics? An appeal agansit evolution that is based upon the past denies the act of evolution, occuring in the present, changing the trends for the future. No one asked humans if they wanted to live this life. There is no preferred state for life to exist in, our environment determines how our genetics manifest. I see nothing unethical about bringing animals into new environments and taking good care of them. Quote: Every animal is conditioned into their state of existence. Do you feel it is more preferable for a human to be conscious and cultured, or feral and driven by instinct? Which one produces awareness and understanding of the nature of reality? Why do you have reservations agansit other species becoming more conscious, or, at the very least, living in a new environment and sharing a symbiotic relationship with humans? The concept of a micro-habitat is a plausible and interesting one, and could include interaction with human beings. I see human beings starting to create entire worlds of environment and experience for themselves and other life all over, especially as our technology and our understanding of our environment and other life increases. Entire ecosystems can be created in the backyard, and red pandas can cuddle up to sleep, touching our feet underneath the covers.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Moderator Registered: 01/11/08 Posts: 8,840 Loc: Down the rabbit Last seen: 11 years, 8 months |
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I want one.or 2 for population help.
Id make my backyard a bamboo jungle. -------------------- Sid and Mr. Madhat <part one> A story by Cubie P. Cubensis <> I WANNA SMOKE THIS BOWL <> <A comic by Cubie P. Cubensis>
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Fading Slowly ![]() Registered: 06/13/04 Posts: 10,685 Loc: On the Border |
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You missed my point. Unless you understand the meaning of "rights" you can't rebut my post. What you have posted does not relate to what I said.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Fading Slowly ![]() Registered: 06/13/04 Posts: 10,685 Loc: On the Border |
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Quote: Lol....I AM A LIVING CREATURE!!! Come on!!! -------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Fading Slowly ![]() Registered: 06/13/04 Posts: 10,685 Loc: On the Border |
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I think that it is a tragedy that the Red Pandas have to live in such an imperfect world as ours. So, lets hunt them to extinction.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Moderator Registered: 01/11/08 Posts: 8,840 Loc: Down the rabbit Last seen: 11 years, 8 months |
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I think everyone should have them as pets and love um and play with them. There obviously much cooler then cats or dogs. If they were available to people and a lot of people got um their population would go up pretty fast.
-------------------- Sid and Mr. Madhat <part one> A story by Cubie P. Cubensis <> I WANNA SMOKE THIS BOWL <> <A comic by Cubie P. Cubensis>
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You do have rights. Can we kill you for food?
We realize what's happening to them, and if our intention is to be honest we will soon realize that, through their actions, they make an affirmation, a statement: that living creates joy for them.







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Just try not to masturbate in front of the paying customers.
Curiously enough, instincts haven't held humans back from evolution, although they still seem to manifest in our behavior, until that is consciously transcended as well. Evolution occurs over time. New instincts are manifested behavior emerge over time, over successive generations. This is plainly evident in the case of the dog. The ingrained psychology of a dog is very similar to that of a wolf pup. Did you know that the environment tends to favor the re-emergence of specific traits, through genetics? An appeal agansit evolution that is based upon the past denies the act of evolution, occuring in the present, changing the trends for the future. No one asked humans if they wanted to live this life. There is no preferred state for life to exist in, our environment determines how our genetics manifest. I see nothing unethical about bringing animals into new environments and taking good care of them.

