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OfflineGrylls
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Registered: 10/15/07
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A New Perspective
    #7905020 - 01/20/08 09:05 AM (16 years, 12 days ago)

The result of spiritual awakening of any kind--naturally induced or psychedelic induced--is an altered view of the society, the self, and how the self lives in it. The new perspective may involve observing the behaviors and actions of their fellow man more objectively and questioning their actions and beliefs. They may begin to Observe their own thoughts more objectively (hopefully)and begin rescind old, limiting, false beliefs while overcoming fears. This growth is positive, and leads to an improved quality of life.

But it has been mentioned many times by those who are awakened by the use of psychedelics or studying certain material that they may feel a sense of alienation. They seem to develop a personal complex, that is not necessarily limiting but creates a sense of alienation from societal constructs and collective behaviors that they've been so well adapted to for many years. They begin to see through the arbitrary structures of their society (modern American namely) that is wholly based on false needs/desires. A society where the media (news and advertising) is more influential to its denizens now, it seems, than the loving and well meaning instruction of parents.

Let's not forget that the decisions and instructions modern parents of children are being taught by the media: What foods are OK. How to feel about certain topics in news. What new cars make you feel the best. The best medicine for your children. How the other brand doesn't perform as well as 'this' brand. How 'beefy' and manly this hamburger makes you. What substances to demonize. Butter is good. Butter is bad. Butter is good again. How the acts and blunders of a teenage celebrity is outrageous.

Seeing through all of the mental muck is vastly relieving, but simultaneously creates a feeling of disappointment in oneself that is transient. This disappointment is more of the realization--wow, I believed in this garbage? I gave in a believed it all?

To sum it up, I have noticed the changes I mentioned in myself. I haven't had much experience with psychedelics, so I can't owe my awakening to them alone. My awakening was a year long process of cognitive behavioral based therapy and meditation--not to mention studying material such as super-sentience lessons, nature of personal reality, philosophy of mind, some concepts termed today as new age, transpersonal psychology and general psychology.

I was out with a client (I'm a caregiver) in a Karl's Jr. yesterday and my new perspectives were more apparent that ever before. As I sat in a booth, holding a seat for the both of us, I was observing everyone's demeanor and outward appearance as if I were from another intelligent planetary system (it was almost dissociating). I was disappointed at the eating habits of others' (I'm a vegan by the way). I wondered how anyone could eat the over processed, hormone and chemically enhanced, deep fried crap that was at one time good food: fresh potatoes, lettuce, tomatoes and live cows. Children were misbehaving. The noise of 30 people talking loudly at once was dissonant. The harsh artificial lighting was straining my eyes. The Television set to CNN was droning on at a loud level.

It started out as an interesting observation of the general public. But after 20 minutes of noise and large amounts of disgusting food and conversation being consumed, I needed to get out of there. Getting back into my quiet car with relaxing classical music was a relief, but the busy machine-like city was still in view, reminding me of the artificial environment.

Our next destination was a walking trail--away from the mind fuck of the city! I'm noticing more and more of a need to be close to nature. I've always been a nature oriented person and I believed that physical fitness is imperative, but lately my connection to nature is strong and very spiritual. I used to just enjoy being out 'there.' Now I feel like I'm connected to it and if I'm separated from a good hike too long, I desire it strongly as if it were a physical need like water. My friend sometimes thinks my spontaneous need to go hiking is just an attempt to make myself feel productive, but it isn't that at all.

I know this is an oversimplification of a complex topic, but to the ones that are awakened, this makes perfect sense.

*A great book on the powerful influence of media in our lives and the mediation of experience is Four Arguments for the Elimination of Television by Jerry Mander. It was written in 1978, but it is more true now than it ever was.*


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Alone in the clouds all blue.  Lying on an eiderdown.  You can't see me, but I can you.


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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: Grylls]
    #7905531 - 01/20/08 12:04 PM (16 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

*A great book on the powerful influence of media in our lives and the mediation of experience is Four Arguments for the Elimination of Television by Jerry Mander. It was written in 1978, but it is more true now than it ever was.*




I'll start with this because earlier you were talking about the media dictating people how to live their lives.
On the general mentality that's out there, don't you think that a book like that would turn into a trend? I strongly feel so.
You see, it's not the media's fault for the way people think, the media is doing it's business and those who live their lives by it don't have the smallest notion about what the media stands for. It's a corrupted matter by definition, anything of this magnitude is.
Why not keep it on a more lucid method of analysis?
People lack of instruction and it's their choice to do so. It's easier for some to live their lives in this manner, so they prefer this immediate comfort instead of a longer batter and confrontation with their hidden selves. But remember that it's through that route that all of us got to different conclusions as well, so it must be something related to what each if us need at the moment. Who are we to judge that it's bad for our cousin or third floor neighbor to watch TV or eat processed food? Do you really think that a book can make one change who they are, if they don't have this impulse already? And if they already had this impulse, isn't it only a matter of time anyways?
I've learned that personal experience and personal conclusions helps one best, if some people choose to live their lives as induced by the media, then it might be what they need at this stage of their evolution.

I for one know for sure that if I weren't to get all that hyper load of crap from the media, I would have never grown tired of it. :lol:

Quote:

Our next destination was a walking trail--away from the mind fuck of the city! I'm noticing more and more of a need to be close to nature. I've always been a nature oriented person and I believed that physical fitness is imperative, but lately my connection to nature is strong and very spiritual. I used to just enjoy being out 'there.' Now I feel like I'm connected to it and if I'm separated from a good hike too long, I desire it strongly as if it were a physical need like water. My friend sometimes thinks my spontaneous need to go hiking is just an attempt to make myself feel productive, but it isn't that at all.




Yes, I consider nature to be wonderful too. :yinyang:
It's simply breath taking in every way and it's what make me feel good as soon as I find myself there, so I understand you perfectly.
I hardly can see how it can make you feel "productive" in the sense your friend was trying to suggest, but I don't think you should be bothered by his explanation, as it's merely his own interpretation about what he would perhaps feel in such a circumstance.


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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OfflineGrylls
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Registered: 10/15/07
Posts: 394
Loc: East of the Continental D...
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
Re: A New Perspective [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7905658 - 01/20/08 12:47 PM (16 years, 12 days ago)

You are right about people wanting to change, but some really cannot see what it is like to live differently. Through the process of becoming--which is constantly evolving with experience and thought--some of them lack the introspection to make decisions to want that change. They only see themselves as a person rather than a complex system of thoughts, behaviors, actions and emotions.

I agree that a book alone cannot change an entire group of people. Change is slow and so is reading a book. The change is always gradual and long lasting. A book like that DOES NOT go well with corporate business. The mentality that that book conveys is the antithesis of them. However it is Mander's best known book--which isn't saying much sadly.

What my friend meant by productive, is he knows I have anxiety and he thinks that I can't just enjoy a day of doing nothing. He thinks, that I believe I must always be doing something or the day will feel wasted.


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Alone in the clouds all blue.  Lying on an eiderdown.  You can't see me, but I can you.


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
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Loc: underbelly
Re: A New Perspective [Re: Grylls]
    #7905695 - 01/20/08 12:57 PM (16 years, 12 days ago)

I was disappointed at the eating habits of others' (I'm a vegan by the way). I wondered how anyone could eat the over processed, hormone and chemically enhanced, deep fried crap that was at one time good food: fresh potatoes, lettuce, tomatoes and live cows. Children were misbehaving. The noise of 30 people talking loudly at once was dissonant. The harsh artificial lighting was straining my eyes. The Television set to CNN was droning on at a loud level.

The issue here is one of attachment (yours) as I see it. You are attached to things being a certain way. This is a common problem we all have. You are right back into the fire of suffering. What is the difference between fast food restaurants and the great outdoors besides your perception and belief about what they represent? Is one natural and the other not?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineLove Cap
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Registered: 09/16/07
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: Icelander]
    #7911434 - 01/21/08 07:16 PM (16 years, 11 days ago)

That's exactly the difference. One is chemical filled food to make you keep coming back, and the other is what the earth gave you. I think the problem here is the common attachment to fast food and processed meat. This is also what helps destroy the environment.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Registered: 06/13/04
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: Icelander]
    #7911484 - 01/21/08 07:22 PM (16 years, 11 days ago)

Well spoken.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Registered: 04/01/07
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: Love Cap]
    #7911488 - 01/21/08 07:23 PM (16 years, 11 days ago)

Which is better to eat:

A. A natural poisonous mushroom

B. An unnatural doughnut.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7911493 - 01/21/08 07:23 PM (16 years, 11 days ago)

The mushroom is organic!!!


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7911533 - 01/21/08 07:29 PM (16 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
Which is better to eat:

A. A natural poisonous mushroom

B. An unnatural doughnut.




Trick question: they are BOTH poisonous, but the mushroom will kill you immediately.  :tongue:


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: Veritas]
    #7911675 - 01/21/08 07:55 PM (16 years, 11 days ago)

The mycotoxins in poisonous mushrooms usually take up to a week.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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OfflineSra_sephiroth0
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: Veritas]
    #7911898 - 01/21/08 08:27 PM (16 years, 11 days ago)

its funny i am one of those who even as gross as i would think bacon is eat it fully knowing the grotesqueness of if even if i saw the whole process it under went from once being a pig. even if i vomited. My perspective from time to time changes and it all depends on where and when im standing.
but i do have to say natural light and fresh forest air is a totally differnt and healing thing as where in this man made world things just are either negitive feeling or neutral and the only thing that can make it healing or good feeling are people that are broken free of the medias control. People that are under the medias control do make me feel slightly like wanting to throw a book at them or something.
i can say tho for almost a year i felt one with shiva and that energy and it was a way way differnt presecptive of the world and everything but that has faded since the summer of 07 and i have a whole differnt presepctive that i cant even really rememeber what that was like. Its strange how that works infact it bewilders me but one mind i know ill never go back to is that media controled one but if i ever did or were i dont think i would be able to remember this mind in any way.
I feel as every couple weeks i have a total new prespective. lol maybe mind is going or something who knows.


--------------------
"You all are just puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain...""
you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #7912098 - 01/21/08 08:59 PM (16 years, 11 days ago)

A week is pretty immediate.  :eek:


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OfflineSra_sephiroth0
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: Veritas]
    #7912152 - 01/21/08 09:06 PM (16 years, 11 days ago)

lol its less then a week to die more like 3 days


--------------------
"You all are just puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain...""
you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours


Edited by Sra_sephiroth0 (01/21/08 09:07 PM)


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Offlineevolprim
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: Grylls]
    #7914121 - 01/22/08 10:45 AM (16 years, 10 days ago)

i don't really think you have seen through anything. you are playing the same game as everyone else but you have called it a different name. being conditioned by spirituality and philosophy is the same as being conditioned by American consumerist society. and your new mental muck is not any better than your old one.

that being said, i dont think there is anything to see through because all seeing through something is, is describing it. you dont describe how a rainbow works and then hate it do you? for the same reason you can learn all about and describe the way the human game works, but still enjoy it.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: evolprim]
    #7914167 - 01/22/08 10:56 AM (16 years, 10 days ago)

While I agree here for the most part, I think some muck is muckier than other muck. Everythink is belief. (misspelling intentional)


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (01/22/08 10:57 AM)


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Offlinebackfromthedead
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Re: A New Perspective [Re: Grylls]
    #7914193 - 01/22/08 11:03 AM (16 years, 10 days ago)

Gets to a point where its anything for that tranquil tingle.


--------------------


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