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Invisiblefastfred
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WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/
    #7898063 - 01/18/08 04:16 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

I just got this message in the status bar at the bottom of my browser when going to www.shroomery.org/forms "Opening page http://www.amazon.com/gp/site-directory/".

WTF is this?  Is this a problem with my browser or do you guys have something going on with amazon?


-FF


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Offlineimplee
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: fastfred]
    #7898245 - 01/18/08 05:00 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

/forms takes me to

Not Found!
We're sorry but the page you are looking for couldn't be found on the Shroomery. If you entered the URL by hand, please double-check it. Otherwise, you can use the search box below to find what you're looking for.


Maybe you got spy/adware?


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Invisiblefastfred
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: implee]
    #7898316 - 01/18/08 05:18 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

> Maybe you got spy/adware?

Maybe, that's what I'm hoping to figure out.

/forums will take you to the forums list. "/forms" is a misspelling.


-FF


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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: fastfred]
    #7898406 - 01/18/08 05:37 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

Yes i see that lol

when i goto http://www.shroomery.org/forms it takes me to not found and it looks like the faq section where you can search the shroomery website

Are you using firefox?


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Invisiblefastfred
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: implee]
    #7917922 - 01/22/08 11:02 PM (16 years, 10 days ago)

Well it looks like the shroomery is selling our clicks to amazon now.

Just what I always wanted, targeted advertising focusing on my semi-legal interests!

I'm curious what other companies the shroomery is selling my clicks (and also obviously IP address) to?


-FF


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Offlineflushme
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: fastfred]
    #7918226 - 01/23/08 12:22 AM (16 years, 10 days ago)

hmmmmmmmm im not likeing what im hearing


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Invisibleusg543
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: flushme]
    #7918272 - 01/23/08 12:31 AM (16 years, 10 days ago)

tsk tsk


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OfflineYthanA
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: fastfred]
    #7918297 - 01/23/08 12:40 AM (16 years, 10 days ago)

Er... we've had Amazon banners for years now, did you just notice them? We don't get paid by click but we do earn a commission if you follow a banner and buy something. There's a link to Amazon's privacy policy on all their banners and supporters can disable advertising through their display preferences. I don't see what the problem is. :shrug:


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Invisibleusg543
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: Ythan]
    #7918310 - 01/23/08 12:42 AM (16 years, 10 days ago)

i take back my tsk tsk


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Offlineimplee
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: usg543]
    #7918368 - 01/23/08 01:04 AM (16 years, 10 days ago)

Ive been using ad blocker for years. So i see the mushroom sponsores and text ads but not the big company ads :wink:


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InvisibleDontPlay
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: Ythan]
    #7919031 - 01/23/08 08:03 AM (16 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Ythan said:
Er... we've had Amazon banners for years now, did you just notice them? We don't get paid by click but we do earn a commission if you follow a banner and buy something. There's a link to Amazon's privacy policy on all their banners and supporters can disable advertising through their display preferences. I don't see what the problem is. :shrug:




Exactly it isn't a big deal, if you have a website you can do the same thing. You get a very small amount of money everytime a member clicks on the sponsors add. They don't get money for you clicking on a post to read it. And they won't get your IP address from being on the shroomery.


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Offlinedebianlinux
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: DontPlay]
    #7919485 - 01/23/08 11:31 AM (16 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

DontPlay said:
And they won't get your IP address from being on the shroomery.




I feel strongly that this is very likely to be untrue. It is a referrer link, after all.


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OfflineYthanA
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: debianlinux]
    #7919577 - 01/23/08 12:02 PM (16 years, 9 days ago)

Yeah when you load a banner your IP address could be (and probably is) logged by Amazon. However, if you don't want to be associated with the Shroomery they do give you a way to opt out:

Quote:

If you do not want us to keep a record of the Amazon Associate websites you visit, you may opt-out of such information collection by clicking here. After you opt-out, we will no longer collect or use this information. However, all previously collected information will be retained by our systems to better personalize your web experience and improve our Amazon services.




If it really bothers you, I still suggest you get a supporter account and just disable banners.


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InvisibleDontPlay
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: debianlinux]
    #7919579 - 01/23/08 12:02 PM (16 years, 9 days ago)

I was saying Amazon won't get it, if you don't click on ads.


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Edited by DontPlay (01/23/08 12:04 PM)


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OfflineYthanA
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: DontPlay]
    #7919595 - 01/23/08 12:08 PM (16 years, 9 days ago)

They do though, because the banner is loaded from their server. When your browser requests the banner for display, it includes your IP so the server knows where to send the response. That's the reason we give an option to block offsite images in posts as well. It's still not anything to worry about IMHO, but it's not accurate to say Amazon could never get your IP if you don't click on an ad.


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InvisibleSell Your Soul
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: Ythan]
    #7919685 - 01/23/08 12:33 PM (16 years, 9 days ago)

I don't see why anyone would make a fuss about their IP being revealed to offsite images, if that site has a known accepted reputation, like Amazon.
Those warez/porn sites on the other hand, I would think twice about clicking through them.


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OfflineYthanA
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: Sell Your Soul]
    #7920043 - 01/23/08 02:14 PM (16 years, 9 days ago)

Yeah that's kind of the way I see it too. It's good that people want to be cautious online but this seems like kind of a non-issue. :shrug: I don't think the feds are going to track someone down because they loaded an Amazon banner from a mushroom growing site. If the War on Drugs ever gets to that point we'll have much more serious problems...


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Offlinerizingfire
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: Ythan]
    #7929903 - 01/25/08 01:42 PM (16 years, 7 days ago)

All the more reason for anybody worried to just become a supporter and turn it off. IMO it's no big deal. I think it's good ythan, make $$ any way you can after all, look at the blood sweat and tears you put into making the shroomery the success it is today. I say good job! I initially never signed up here because I was scared about my info being on US soil but after lurking for a while and whatnot I am satisfied with everything and have come to the conclusion that it is a great site all around. If no one is stupid there is nothing to worry about right?


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Invisiblefastfred
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: rizingfire]
    #7930805 - 01/25/08 04:42 PM (16 years, 7 days ago)

In another thread somebody reported that they were still getting amazon errors after disabling banners.

Anyhow I don't see why you can't host the banner ads locally. You'll still get any click money when people click on them, and they will reasonably understand that they are going to amazon and will be sending their IP and referer.


-FF


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OfflineYthanA
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: fastfred]
    #7931841 - 01/25/08 08:02 PM (16 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

In another thread somebody reported that they were still getting amazon errors after disabling banners.




If you have banners disabled on your account and you are logged in, you should never get a banner for Amazon or any other sponsor. :shrug: I didn't see that thread but if they can tell me how to reproduce the behavior I'll look into it.

Quote:

Anyhow I don't see why you can't host the banner ads locally.




The Amazon-served banners are custom-tailored based on what you've viewed and purchased through their site, we couldn't do that locally.


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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: fastfred]
    #7932389 - 01/25/08 09:54 PM (16 years, 7 days ago)

> WTF is this? Is this a problem with my browser or do you guys have something going on with amazon?\

I don't see any connections to Amazon when I click on that link, even after I enabled banner ads.

I also agree with Ythan that its not a big deal.

This is what I see when I click the link you provided:


alan@southord:~$ sudo tcpdump -lnieth1 -s0
tcpdump: verbose output suppressed, use -v or -vv for full protocol decode
listening on eth1, link-type EN10MB (Ethernet), capture size 65535 bytes
20:48:00.139972 IP 69.28.174.162.80 > 10.0.0.16.60040: F 3548352934:3548352934(0) ack 583330751 win 2357 <nop,nop,timestamp 309193925 45257064>
20:48:00.176543 IP 10.0.0.16.60040 > 69.28.174.162.80: . ack 1 win 432 <nop,nop,timestamp 45260823 309193925>
20:48:00.982733 IP 10.0.0.16.60040 > 69.28.174.162.80: F 1:1(0) ack 1 win 432 <nop,nop,timestamp 45261024 309193925>
20:48:00.982944 IP 10.0.0.16.60041 > 69.28.174.162.80: S 610299151:610299151(0) win 5840 <mss 1460,sackOK,timestamp 45261024 0,nop,wscale 4>
20:48:01.022790 IP 69.28.174.162.80 > 10.0.0.16.60040: . ack 2 win 2357 <nop,nop,timestamp 309194808 45261024>
20:48:01.025148 IP 69.28.174.162.80 > 10.0.0.16.60041: S 3562020036:3562020036(0) ack 610299152 win 5792 <mss 1460,sackOK,timestamp 309194810 45261024,nop,wscale 2>
20:48:01.025230 IP 10.0.0.16.60041 > 69.28.174.162.80: . ack 1 win 365 <nop,nop,timestamp 45261035 309194810>
20:48:01.025518 IP 10.0.0.16.60041 > 69.28.174.162.80: P 1:787(786) ack 1 win 365 <nop,nop,timestamp 45261035 309194810>
20:48:01.078379 IP 69.28.174.162.80 > 10.0.0.16.60041: . ack 787 win 1841 <nop,nop,timestamp 309194863 45261035>
20:48:01.094018 IP 69.28.174.162.80 > 10.0.0.16.60041: . 1:1441(1440) ack 787 win 1841 <nop,nop,timestamp 309194875 45261035>
20:48:01.094093 IP 10.0.0.16.60041 > 69.28.174.162.80: . ack 1441 win 546 <nop,nop,timestamp 45261052 309194875>
20:48:01.095826 IP 69.28.174.162.80 > 10.0.0.16.60041: P 1441:2715(1274) ack 787 win 1841 <nop,nop,timestamp 309194875 45261035>
20:48:01.095851 IP 10.0.0.16.60041 > 69.28.174.162.80: . ack 2715 win 726 <nop,nop,timestamp 45261052 309194875>
20:48:02.195102 IP 10.0.0.16.60041 > 69.28.174.162.80: P 787:1504(717) ack 2715 win 726 <nop,nop,timestamp 45261327 309194875>
20:48:02.249607 IP 69.28.174.162.80 > 10.0.0.16.60041: P 2715:3311(596) ack 1504 win 2234 <nop,nop,timestamp 309196033 45261327>
20:48:02.249687 IP 10.0.0.16.60041 > 69.28.174.162.80: . ack 3311 win 906 <nop,nop,timestamp 45261341 309196033>
20:48:02.308303 IP 10.0.0.16.60041 > 69.28.174.162.80: P 1504:2224(720) ack 3311 win 906 <nop,nop,timestamp 45261355 309196033>
20:48:02.362208 IP 69.28.174.162.80 > 10.0.0.16.60041: P 3311:3907(596) ack 2224 win 2627 <nop,nop,timestamp 309196145 45261355>
20:48:02.362295 IP 10.0.0.16.60041 > 69.28.174.162.80: . ack 3907 win 981 <nop,nop,timestamp 45261369 309196145>
20:48:07.244890 arp who-has 10.0.0.16 tell 10.0.0.1
20:48:07.244927 arp reply 10.0.0.16 is-at 00:04:76:46:53:b0

20:48:17.359337 IP 69.28.174.162.80 > 10.0.0.16.60041: F 3907:3907(0) ack 2224 win 2627 <nop,nop,timestamp 309211146 45261369>
20:48:17.397614 IP 10.0.0.16.60041 > 69.28.174.162.80: . ack 3908 win 981 <nop,nop,timestamp 45265128 309211146>

23 packets captured
23 packets received by filter
0 packets dropped by kernel
alan@southord:~$
alan@southord:~$ n 69.28.174.162
Server: 207.7.4.6
Address: 207.7.4.6#53

Non-authoritative answer:
162.174.28.69.in-addr.arpa canonical name = 162.shroomery.174.28.69.in-addr.arpa.
162.shroomery.174.28.69.in-addr.arpa name = shroomery.org.

Authoritative answers can be found from:
shroomery.174.28.69.in-addr.arpa nameserver = crackrock.us.
shroomery.174.28.69.in-addr.arpa nameserver = ns.shroomery.org.
ns.shroomery.org internet address = 69.28.174.163

alan@southord:~$


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #7952580 - 01/29/08 08:23 PM (16 years, 3 days ago)

While I acknowledge its the shroomery's right to do so, I think it would be nice if the privacy policy and another site page would have disclosed this.


as it stands now, the privacy policy says:

"We may provide aggregate user information to third parties such as advertisers, but no personally identifiable information will be made available."

By any definition, your IP is a personally identifiable info, and the shroomery is initiating the transfer of this data to the third party via placing the banner ad.

In my opinion, the shroomery should change their privacy policy to reflect the fact that they have mechanisms by which the user is induced to send their IP address to third-pary advertisers which then engage in targeted advertising.


Again, I'm not saying this is particularly troubling, but for those of us without much tech-knowledge, it would be nice to have a privacy policy that was more clear, and in my understanding, as of now it isn't accurate ( I don't think it matters that the user is the one transmitting his IP address, not the shroomery, as it is the shroomery that embeds the code which induces the user to do so).


But on another note, I think this site is pretty cool in that this thread wasn't closed.  Alot of other sites would have said "it's none of your buisness" and closed it, so thanks.  Its nice that the admins aren't so sensitive w/ criticism that stuff like this can be complained of w/out reprisal. :thumbup:


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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: johnm214]
    #7954814 - 01/30/08 08:58 AM (16 years, 2 days ago)

That's a very good point, I added this to our privacy policy:

Quote:

Third Parties:
Like many websites, The Shroomery may display ads which are provided by third parties and hosted on domains we do not control. In such a situation, the third party would be capable of logging your IP and technical information when the ad is displayed. We will only accept hosted ads from established, responsible third parties who themselves have a published privacy policy. To prevent third party advertisers from receiving your information, you must access the site through a proxy server. Alternately, supporters have the option of disabling all banner advertising.




We really do try to take constructive criticism to heart. We're always courting new advertisers to help make ends meet, but our loyalty lies first and foremost with our members. :smile: Thanks everyone for your understanding and sorry for the omission in the privacy policy!


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Invisiblefastfred
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Re: WTF? amazon.com/gp/site-directory/ [Re: Ythan]
    #7958034 - 01/30/08 09:46 PM (16 years, 2 days ago)

> We really do try to take constructive criticism to heart.

I know you do. that's why I posted. I hope you take it as a compliment that I even bothered to bring it up.

Any cance of getting a list put in of places that might be getting this info?


-FF


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