|
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
|
Seventy
equanimitor



Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 912
Loc: Canada (PNW)
Last seen: 6 months, 28 days
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Caribou_Lou]
#7898483 - 01/18/08 06:00 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
drinking is a more recreational way to dose..it would probably dumb down the effect and take the edge off for people who aren't quite prepared to take the 'whole plunge'
I'd rather just eat the damn things, maybe smoke some herb, not get wasted
|
KrishnaDreamer
I bleed nicotine...


Registered: 09/23/07
Posts: 4,132
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Seventy]
#7898553 - 01/18/08 06:13 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
beer is psycho-active. plus who says you can't use alcohol without getting wasted?
-------------------- Everybody's a ninja...
|
coulterIV
Technopagan


Registered: 11/07/07
Posts: 285
Loc: as above, so below
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: KrishnaDreamer]
#7898663 - 01/18/08 06:40 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
KrishnaDreamer said: beer is psycho-active. plus who says you can't use alcohol without getting wasted?
KRISHNA wouldn't get drunk
-------------------- BREATHE IN LOVE BREATHE OUT FORGIVENESS (If you’re not in your breath, you’re in your mind)
|
bmiles
artist



Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 2,299
Loc: on the left side
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Phonerothyme]
#7899047 - 01/18/08 08:28 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
They don't produce opposite effects. Damn close to it, though. If you want to start talking about the opposite of psychedelics on the psychoactive-spectrum, then consider opiates.
I've hallucinated on opiates, but never alcohol. I think you are wrong about this.
-------------------- Never go with a hippy to a second location.
|
Phonerothyme
Audiomancer



Registered: 07/27/06
Posts: 453
Last seen: 13 years, 8 days
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: bmiles]
#7899172 - 01/18/08 08:56 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
bmiles said:
Quote:
They don't produce opposite effects. Damn close to it, though. If you want to start talking about the opposite of psychedelics on the psychoactive-spectrum, then consider opiates.
I've hallucinated on opiates, but never alcohol. I think you are wrong about this.
Just because you hallucinated on opiates doesn't mean that your hallucination had anything to do with the visuals you get from psychedelics. Those are two fundamentally different things. Opiate hallucinations are delirious, psychedelic visuals don't even literally fit the definition "hallucination." These two classes of psychoactives take you in polar opposite directions -> apathetic senseless hedonism vs. the profound and mystical. Opiates turn the volume down on reality and psychedelics crank it up.
If you want the opposite of CNS depressents, I point you to CNS stimulants.
-------------------- http://erothyme.net
|
somebody041
bud tester


Registered: 06/04/07
Posts: 476
Loc: California
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: xandor]
#7899185 - 01/18/08 08:58 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
seems like a lot of alcohol to be drinking on a totally empty stomach...
|
bmiles
artist



Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 2,299
Loc: on the left side
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Phonerothyme]
#7899187 - 01/18/08 08:59 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
i agree with what you just said, but i don't believe that opiate is the opposite of mushrooms.
-------------------- Never go with a hippy to a second location.
|
Devin
Fucked Up



Registered: 11/27/07
Posts: 59
Last seen: 15 years, 10 months
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Caribou_Lou]
#7899259 - 01/18/08 09:15 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
When I was tripping face I bit through a can and drank it like that, but it was only one beer. I felt great. That many shots with beer might be a bit much though.
--------------------
|
Feanor


Registered: 05/07/06
Posts: 1,546
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Phonerothyme]
#7899613 - 01/18/08 10:43 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
-------
--------------------
May Terence McKenna Live Long The DMT Chronicles
Edited by Feanor (01/19/08 08:50 PM)
|
Phonerothyme
Audiomancer



Registered: 07/27/06
Posts: 453
Last seen: 13 years, 8 days
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Feanor]
#7899727 - 01/18/08 11:11 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said:
Quote:
Phonerothyme said:
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said:
Quote:
coulterIV said: alcohol is the worst drug
Agreed. 
Mushrooms and alcohol produce exactly opposite effects. Mushrooms attack your culture, while alcohol embraces it. It's stupid and rather pointless to combine the two.
They don't produce opposite effects. Damn close to it, though. If you want to start talking about the opposite of psychedelics on the psychoactive-spectrum, then consider opiates.
ps if I were you I wouldn't make such sweeping generalizations about what certain psychoactives do concerning your "culture." That's incredibly subjective, and also depends on what kind of culture you are talking about.
Western Civilization is inhabited by a vast variety of cultures; however, for the most part, these cultures are extremely similar, for they are all denominations of Western Civilization, the dictorial ruling body of most of the world. Now, I don't know if you live in a cave over in New Guinea or not, but it seems to me that you don't know what you're talking about concerning culture.
First off, you said that opiates are more different than psychedelics than alcohol is, which makes absolutely no sense and shows that you are speaking from inexperience. When you are speaking about mushrooms and alcohol, you have to understand that the only quality that the two of them harbor is the ability to alter consciousness. They are similar in this respect, but they are completely dissimilar in every other aspect. Around the world, where Western Civilization is most prevelant or even only slightly present, alcohol is seen as a conditioner, for it embraces and strengthens every aspect of of that culture. The government knows this.
Have you ever wondered why alcohol is the only legal, widely distributed, and conscious altering mechanism in the U.S. and many other places?
Have you ever wondered why psychedelic mushrooms are the most illegal of substances?
Open up your eyes and your ears. Mushrooms and psychedelics are DECONDITIONERS. Alcohol is a CONDITIONER. They produce completely oppisite effects. My advice to you - Take 5 dried grams of P. Cubensis and go to a party where people are all drunk.
Reality is a kind of chemical habitat, which is sanctioned by culture, that says it's ok to do this and do that; however, when you transcend all of the preconditioning contrived by culture and return to the unique, original wisdom possessed by the animal mind, then you will see a large dimension of opportunity. This is the Ego Loss. This is the psychedelic experience. This is deconditioning. Now, when you drink alcohol, you are drinking it to escape reality. In other words that some alcohol drinkers don't like to acknowledge, you are drinking it to get fucked up. Alcohol doesn't produce a psychedelic experience. It does not result in the loss of one's Ego, but rather, it results in the strengthening of one's Ego. It conditions! It teaches you not to think for yourself. It basically does the exact opposite of psychedelics.
None of this is in the least bit new to me. Alcohol is only the polar opposite of psychedelics if your argument lies solely in the context of its role our society. If you want to talk about the effects of the drug, alcohol stands opposite to CNS stimulants. Psychedelics do have CNS stimulation properties, yes, but they have much more. Incidentally, opiates have CNS depression properties, plus more. In both of these cases, the effects piled on top of the excitation or calming of the CNS, respectively, take you further in effectively the same direction.
ps that's a pretty damn loose interpretation of the "ego loss" phenomenon there, especially considering that "ego loss" refers to a condition in which you entirely lose cognisance of your "identity."
-------------------- http://erothyme.net
Edited by Phonerothyme (01/18/08 11:15 PM)
|
Feanor


Registered: 05/07/06
Posts: 1,546
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Phonerothyme]
#7899845 - 01/18/08 11:42 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
|
|
------
--------------------
May Terence McKenna Live Long The DMT Chronicles
Edited by Feanor (01/19/08 08:50 PM)
|
coulterIV
Technopagan


Registered: 11/07/07
Posts: 285
Loc: as above, so below
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Feanor]
#7900807 - 01/19/08 08:51 AM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said:
Quote:
Phonerothyme said:
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said:
Quote:
Phonerothyme said:
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said:
Quote:
coulterIV said: alcohol is the worst drug
Agreed. 
Mushrooms and alcohol produce exactly opposite effects. Mushrooms attack your culture, while alcohol embraces it. It's stupid and rather pointless to combine the two.
They don't produce opposite effects. Damn close to it, though. If you want to start talking about the opposite of psychedelics on the psychoactive-spectrum, then consider opiates.
ps if I were you I wouldn't make such sweeping generalizations about what certain psychoactives do concerning your "culture." That's incredibly subjective, and also depends on what kind of culture you are talking about.
Western Civilization is inhabited by a vast variety of cultures; however, for the most part, these cultures are extremely similar, for they are all denominations of Western Civilization, the dictorial ruling body of most of the world. Now, I don't know if you live in a cave over in New Guinea or not, but it seems to me that you don't know what you're talking about concerning culture.
First off, you said that opiates are more different than psychedelics than alcohol is, which makes absolutely no sense and shows that you are speaking from inexperience. When you are speaking about mushrooms and alcohol, you have to understand that the only quality that the two of them harbor is the ability to alter consciousness. They are similar in this respect, but they are completely dissimilar in every other aspect. Around the world, where Western Civilization is most prevelant or even only slightly present, alcohol is seen as a conditioner, for it embraces and strengthens every aspect of of that culture. The government knows this.
Have you ever wondered why alcohol is the only legal, widely distributed, and conscious altering mechanism in the U.S. and many other places?
Have you ever wondered why psychedelic mushrooms are the most illegal of substances?
Open up your eyes and your ears. Mushrooms and psychedelics are DECONDITIONERS. Alcohol is a CONDITIONER. They produce completely oppisite effects. My advice to you - Take 5 dried grams of P. Cubensis and go to a party where people are all drunk.
Reality is a kind of chemical habitat, which is sanctioned by culture, that says it's ok to do this and do that; however, when you transcend all of the preconditioning contrived by culture and return to the unique, original wisdom possessed by the animal mind, then you will see a large dimension of opportunity. This is the Ego Loss. This is the psychedelic experience. This is deconditioning. Now, when you drink alcohol, you are drinking it to escape reality. In other words that some alcohol drinkers don't like to acknowledge, you are drinking it to get fucked up. Alcohol doesn't produce a psychedelic experience. It does not result in the loss of one's Ego, but rather, it results in the strengthening of one's Ego. It conditions! It teaches you not to think for yourself. It basically does the exact opposite of psychedelics.
None of this is in the least bit new to me. Alcohol is only the polar opposite of psychedelics if your argument lies solely in the context of its role our society. If you want to talk about the effects of the drug, alcohol stands opposite to CNS stimulants. Psychedelics do have CNS stimulation properties, yes, but they have much more. Incidentally, opiates have CNS depression properties, plus more. In both of these cases, the effects piled on top of the excitation or calming of the CNS, respectively, take you further in effectively the same direction.
ps that's a pretty damn loose interpretation of the "ego loss" phenomenon there, especially considering that "ego loss" refers to a condition in which you entirely lose cognisance of your "identity."
Frankly, when people consider similarity, they don't actually take into account the anatomical reactions that are produced by certain mechanisms when taking into consideration the psychological experience. That argument, when speaking about the effects of psychedelics, alcohol, opiates, etc., really stands no ground in a thread like this. Just because it triggers a certain biological process, doesn't mean that the effect is going to be even remotely similar. Take for instance, Ritalin and Cocaine, which both have very similar neurological reactions, for they both increase dopamine levels. Now, wait a second, since they both have this slight chemically reactive similarity, they must be the same! Why don't doctors just prescribe Cocaine instead of Ritalin? Hmmmm.... Maybe because they produce completely different effects....
All conscious altering substances that are ingested are going to be similar because they react on the brain. In other words, what you are doing is making an extremely broad categorization.
Maybe you don't know what an Ego Loss is. That interpretation was provided by none other than Terence McKenna, who once said just what I typed almost word for word.
P.S. - Your whole little P.S. thing is really gay!
so which is the worst drug, cocaine?? rittalin?? or maybe, adderall!
-------------------- BREATHE IN LOVE BREATHE OUT FORGIVENESS (If you’re not in your breath, you’re in your mind)
|
Phonerothyme
Audiomancer



Registered: 07/27/06
Posts: 453
Last seen: 13 years, 8 days
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Feanor]
#7900869 - 01/19/08 09:22 AM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: Frankly, when people consider similarity, they don't actually take into account the anatomical reactions that are produced by certain mechanisms when taking into consideration the psychological experience. That argument, when speaking about the effects of psychedelics, alcohol, opiates, etc., really stands no ground in a thread like this. Just because it triggers a certain biological process, doesn't mean that the effect is going to be even remotely similar. Take for instance, Ritalin and Cocaine, which both have very similar neurological reactions, for they both increase dopamine levels. Now, wait a second, since they both have this slight chemically reactive similarity, they must be the same! Why don't doctors just prescribe Cocaine instead of Ritalin? Hmmmm.... Maybe because they produce completely different effects....
Thank you, Lieutenant Blatant. I never said anything about their neurotransmitter-related actions. I was talking about how they effect you psychologically, GIVEN that the effects are because of their actions on neurotransmitters. This is what we have classifications for. Psychedelics, CNS stimulants, dissociatives, CNS depressents, opiates, deliriants, hypnotics, and so forth. It is indicative of what their effects on your body and your perception are. As far as the Ritalin/cocaine comparison goes, while they are very different, they are both CNS stimulants, which drastically takes away from your point.
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: All conscious altering substances that are ingested are going to be similar because they react on the brain.
Obviously. Who disputed this? Hahahaha, I love your assumptions about your audience. 8)
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: In other words, what you are doing is making an extremely broad categorization.
Point me to when I did that, please. I'm personally very adament about not generalizing psychoactives any more than is necessary. I'm quite sure that the only categorization I made involved categorizing psychoactives with analagous action.
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: Maybe you don't know what an Ego Loss is.
"An Ego Loss"? Are you kidding? I'll just give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that was either a typo or intentional for some reason.
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: That interpretation was provided by none other than Terence McKenna, who once said just what I typed almost word for word.
Uhh, so? Are you going to prostrate before him and build a temple or what? Having been stated by Terence McKenna is not a measure of correctness. Taking the word of Terence McKenna as literal truth is akin to fundamentalist religion. Terence McKenna was fantastic; I've listened to/watched/read a great deal of his material, and in most cases, none have said it better. He also used a lot of metaphors which you are free to interpret poorly and, particularly in speech, like most people, didn't always state things perfectly, and stumbled occasionally. If I could find a video of Terence McKenna saying "my cock is a sock," would you state it as truth?
You couldn't be in a party with ego loss going on. You'd be on the floor.
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: P.S. - Your whole little P.S. thing is really gay!
Oh, are you under the impression that it stands for "penis sex," sir? Because I can assure you that it is not the case. Sorry, I want to trust you, but it's difficult for me to believe that a post script is homosexual.
P.S. - don't get me wrong, I agree with essentially your whole point and have made virtually the same speech straight from my own mind at least a dozen times, and have even called alcohol the opposite of psychedelics. After learning more about psychoactives, however, I learned that while alcohol is on the opposite side of the spectrum, and has effects which wholly contradict those of psychedelics, it is not the most direct opposites, and that is what I have been talking about.
-------------------- http://erothyme.net
Edited by Phonerothyme (01/19/08 09:27 AM)
|
Phonerothyme
Audiomancer



Registered: 07/27/06
Posts: 453
Last seen: 13 years, 8 days
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Phonerothyme]
#7900875 - 01/19/08 09:25 AM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
|
|
edit -- oops, hit "quote" instead of "edit," hahaha.
-------------------- http://erothyme.net
Edited by Phonerothyme (01/19/08 09:26 AM)
|
2end4
Fuckin Immortal



Registered: 02/15/07
Posts: 774
Loc: Aristonda
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Phonerothyme]
#7900940 - 01/19/08 09:58 AM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Phonerothyme said:
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: Frankly, when people consider similarity, they don't actually take into account the anatomical reactions that are produced by certain mechanisms when taking into consideration the psychological experience. That argument, when speaking about the effects of psychedelics, alcohol, opiates, etc., really stands no ground in a thread like this. Just because it triggers a certain biological process, doesn't mean that the effect is going to be even remotely similar. Take for instance, Ritalin and Cocaine, which both have very similar neurological reactions, for they both increase dopamine levels. Now, wait a second, since they both have this slight chemically reactive similarity, they must be the same! Why don't doctors just prescribe Cocaine instead of Ritalin? Hmmmm.... Maybe because they produce completely different effects....
Thank you, Lieutenant Blatant. I never said anything about their neurotransmitter-related actions. I was talking about how they effect you psychologically, GIVEN that the effects are because of their actions on neurotransmitters. This is what we have classifications for. Psychedelics, CNS stimulants, dissociatives, CNS depressents, opiates, deliriants, hypnotics, and so forth. It is indicative of what their effects on your body and your perception are. As far as the Ritalin/cocaine comparison goes, while they are very different, they are both CNS stimulants, which drastically takes away from your point.
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: All conscious altering substances that are ingested are going to be similar because they react on the brain.
Obviously. Who disputed this? Hahahaha, I love your assumptions about your audience. 8)
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: In other words, what you are doing is making an extremely broad categorization.
Point me to when I did that, please. I'm personally very adament about not generalizing psychoactives any more than is necessary. I'm quite sure that the only categorization I made involved categorizing psychoactives with analagous action.
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: Maybe you don't know what an Ego Loss is.
"An Ego Loss"? Are you kidding? I'll just give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that was either a typo or intentional for some reason.
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: That interpretation was provided by none other than Terence McKenna, who once said just what I typed almost word for word.
Uhh, so? Are you going to prostrate before him and build a temple or what? Having been stated by Terence McKenna is not a measure of correctness. Taking the word of Terence McKenna as literal truth is akin to fundamentalist religion. Terence McKenna was fantastic; I've listened to/watched/read a great deal of his material, and in most cases, none have said it better. He also used a lot of metaphors which you are free to interpret poorly and, particularly in speech, like most people, didn't always state things perfectly, and stumbled occasionally. If I could find a video of Terence McKenna saying "my cock is a sock," would you state it as truth?
You couldn't be in a party with ego loss going on. You'd be on the floor.
Quote:
longbottom_leaf said: P.S. - Your whole little P.S. thing is really gay!
Oh, are you under the impression that it stands for "penis sex," sir? Because I can assure you that it is not the case. Sorry, I want to trust you, but it's difficult for me to believe that a post script is homosexual.
P.S. - don't get me wrong, I agree with essentially your whole point and have made virtually the same speech straight from my own mind at least a dozen times, and have even called alcohol the opposite of psychedelics. After learning more about psychoactives, however, I learned that while alcohol is on the opposite side of the spectrum, and has effects which wholly contradict those of psychedelics, it is not the most direct opposites, and that is what I have been talking about.
P.S. Just wait to drink till after you peak. p.p.s. people take shit way to personally on the internet sometimes, including me.
-------------------- Praise Bob!
|
Feanor


Registered: 05/07/06
Posts: 1,546
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: 2end4]
#7901203 - 01/19/08 11:22 AM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
|
|
----------
--------------------
May Terence McKenna Live Long The DMT Chronicles
Edited by Feanor (01/19/08 08:51 PM)
|
notapillow
I want to be a fisherman



Registered: 09/29/03
Posts: 31,129
Loc: A rare and different tune
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Feanor]
#7901496 - 01/19/08 12:36 PM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
|
|
stop quoting everyone. just accept that booze is no good, never has and never will be
--------------------
|
Phonerothyme
Audiomancer



Registered: 07/27/06
Posts: 453
Last seen: 13 years, 8 days
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: notapillow]
#7901527 - 01/19/08 12:43 PM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
notapillow said: stop quoting everyone. just accept that booze is no good, never has and never will be
quoted
ps I agree with you
-------------------- http://erothyme.net
|
Helpme1
freak



Registered: 07/06/06
Posts: 1,424
Loc: shlums-of-meltbanana
Last seen: 14 years, 4 months
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Caribou_Lou]
#7901639 - 01/19/08 01:03 PM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
|
|
expect to get way too fucked up way too fast
you will probably puke. (key: DONT SMOKE ANY BUD AFTER YOU HAVE DRUNK THE ALCOHOL AND HAVE EATEN THE SHROOMS, it will fuck your world over, in the worst imaginable way...i cant stress this point enough)
if you want drunk trippin, try DXM, its sorta like drunk trippin. but seriously, i would never mix mushies with alcohol and here is why, the mushies are bound to already give you some stomach discomfort, especially if its your first time, and the alcohol is going to amplify that, hardcore.
you are gonna have a lot of shit in your stomach, keep trashcans near by. a quarter of mushies and that much alcohol is virtually begging to have a bad time. if anything, take a couple shots to calm your nerves and eat an 1/8....
--------------------
      "woah, that cat was really buggin out man, you should have put on some grateful dead so he could relax and enjoi his trip" -random shroomerite
|
KrishnaDreamer
I bleed nicotine...


Registered: 09/23/07
Posts: 4,132
|
Re: loads of beer + loads of shrooms = trouble? [Re: Phonerothyme]
#7902266 - 01/19/08 03:50 PM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Phonerothyme said:
Quote:
notapillow said: stop quoting everyone. just accept that booze is no good, never has and never will be
quoted
ps I agree with you
yeah, except that alcohol was probably the most important substance to mankind in history.
-------------------- Everybody's a ninja...
|
|