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deadatdusk
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Registered: 12/02/05
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Violence while tripping *DELETED*
#7889500 - 01/16/08 06:19 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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Post deleted by deadatduskReason for deletion: deleted
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wickedscepter
Freedom Fighter



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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
#7889558 - 01/16/08 06:31 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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I have never heard of that before but if we don't like it when people do stupid things on drugs and then blame the drugs leading to further demonization of said drug, then we shouldn't allow it to happen ourselves. Stupid people do stupid things sober or otherwise. Although if he was loyal and friendly then who knows however if he is as good a guy as he says he is then he will man up and take responsibility.
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devilzmike
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
#7889562 - 01/16/08 06:31 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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I think you should indeed be sympathetic to the fact he had a bad trip. There is no way a person should be fully accountable for his action as he would if he was sober. 3.5 g is enough for some individual to loose control of themselve. If he had been very nice and friendly before this day, i guess he just had a very bad trip. You should not get so mad at him for that. It was not cool for you but it was sure not cool for him either. I've already got out of control on 4g of shroom, acting like shit with my friend and even punching them. I don't even remember this and my friends got over it. It was everything but me this time. You should do the same with your friend.
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Holy jesus puffy fluffy whoopy cheesy shwoopy manly oh!
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K20A2


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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
#7889576 - 01/16/08 06:34 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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I would have zero tolerance for something like that. Period. I can be a bit of a tyrant though, so....
Is this type of behavior completely out of character for this guy, or is it more like the fungus amplified what was already there?
If I was in your shoes, I would never trip with him again. Id still chill with the guy but tripping with him....NO.
Myself and a friend had a problem with another buddy of ours in high school. He would get all sorts of worked up and wanting to wrestle and play fight after he smoked weed. Needless to say, the three of us never smoked together again after the situation got to a breaking point. We did address this though, and told him our thoughts on everything, but some people cant be changed.
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PreparationH
apply daily


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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: devilzmike]
#7889601 - 01/16/08 06:38 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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yea, i can definitely see someone going off the deep end for a few hours and go into a violent fit. was this his first time tripping? while on an 8th of the most potent shrooms i've come across i convinced myself i killed someone because they were unresponsive face down on their bed and I was ready to start knocking people out at this party because no one even knew my name and they were yelling at me "He's not moving!" i started gettin my shit together, btw i used to box so all these kids would have been no problem. Then, the kid rolled over and i breathed a sigh of releif. for about 2 minutes my world crashed in, i was sure i was 1. smashing faces in, or 2. going to prison for life. and im not that type of person but to save my ass, yea i guess i am that type of person w/e.
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KrishnaDreamer
I bleed nicotine...


Registered: 09/23/07
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: devilzmike]
#7889605 - 01/16/08 06:38 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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sounds like he has pent up psychological issues he needs to deal with. possibly abuse from family members. if he gets violent in the future my advice would be to knock him out, either with drugs or trauma to the brain, tell him to stay far away from psychedelics unless he can fix himself.
-------------------- Everybody's a ninja...
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Ell Ess Bree
reppin state tostate, wat uneed?

Registered: 04/25/07
Posts: 914
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: devilzmike]
#7889612 - 01/16/08 06:40 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
devilzmike said: I think you should indeed be sympathetic to the fact he had a bad trip. There is no way a person should be fully accountable for his action as he would if he was sober. 3.5 g is enough for some individual to loose control of themselve. If he had been very nice and friendly before this day, i guess he just had a very bad trip. You should not get so mad at him for that. It was not cool for you but it was sure not cool for him either. I've already got out of control on 4g of shroom, acting like shit with my friend and even punching them. I don't even remember this and my friends got over it. It was everything but me this time. You should do the same with your friend.
I agree with the bolded part of this statement. 3.5g of shrooms is more than enough to make some people loose control of themselves.
I disagree with the rest of it.
That person should be held entirely accountable. Or, if there were people that told him he'd be ok, if he didn't know any better.
It is 100% true that 3.5 grams of shrooms can FUCK SOMEONES SHIT UP.
It's on that fucking person to KNOW if he can fucking handle 3.5 grams of shrooms. The world is still afraid of drugs. It's easy to find all the information if you're looking for it. IF YOU'RE LOOKING FOR IT. We're told not to look, so a lot of people don't.
Information on safe drug use isn't basic criteria in school, ya know what I'm saying. It's on the fucking user to know. If he didn't know he could handle it and ate them, his fault. His fucking fault. Or the people that misinformed him, if that scenario is the case.
And that's all I got for that.
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PreparationH
apply daily


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yea, i'd tell him your thoughts and tell him how your not going to trip with him again. my story at least i didnt hit anybody but i shit you not the terror in my bones was so real and so scary, i felt like i was having a heart attack.
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poke smot!
floccinocci floofinator



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Re: Violence while tripping *DELETED* [Re: deadatdusk]
#7889673 - 01/16/08 06:52 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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Post deleted by poke smot!Reason for deletion: x
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awesomebastard
Lost



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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: poke smot!]
#7890074 - 01/16/08 08:10 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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ive had some bad trips and have done some stupid regretable things during bad trips but none have been violent. I will always get violent tworad myself before others but thats just the way i am i dont feel fighting is necessary exept in survival type sitautions.
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"Absolute certainty is a privilege of uneducated minds and fanatics." ~ C.J. Keyser Mr. Cypher said: "I just tell the girls how sexy I am and their panties melt."
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Orbital_Saucer
Other


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Quote:
KrishnaDreamer said: sounds like he has pent up psychological issues he needs to deal with.
This is exactly what I was thinking. Psychedelics are not going to change a person into a killer. If this guy is normally as mild-mannered as you say he is, then he's either an excellent actor, or there is something else going on.
I would strongly suggest he investigates any psychiatric conditions he may have.
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12468
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: poke smot!]
#7890121 - 01/16/08 08:20 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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Hey there deadatdusk,
I wanted to reply quickly to your story because I've ben in the same scenario twice now.
I no longer trip with anyone except my wife and a couple close friends.
Long story short: Camping trip, ounce of mushrooms. Myself and two friends. Guy says he's shroomed before, we later find out he hasn't - we hadn't weighed any out, but he had to have had 5-7 grams. We warned him but didn't realize how much he had eaten. He didn't talk for about 18 hours after he ate them and he flipped. He tore apart the campfire with his bare hands, picked up burning logs and threw them everywhere. flung three or four dozen beers into the forest, slobbered and screamed, just freaked.
It was fucked up and scary. We had to lock him into the cab of his own truck for the night, where he went totally nuts. He has never really come back.
Bottom line is, like someone else said, underlying psychological issues cause that sort of behavior while on psychadelics. On some fundamental level, that person is 'broken'.
After shrooming for a while, you develop a sense for who these people are - in sober, everyday life. I flatly refuse to be around anyone who is inexperienced or talks big about psychadelics because I've seen so many come completely unglued.
Your friend is responsible for the state of his own mental health - he took the chemical, he ought to be held responsible for what he did. Drugs bring out people's true colors - don't out with him anymore, he's a sick person and needs to get help.
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fushock

Registered: 10/14/07
Posts: 428
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
#7890156 - 01/16/08 08:26 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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Ya, I think that guy just might be a dick. Sorry, but in my worst trips the only thing I want to do is curl up in a little ball.
That more drunk behavior.
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manyc
♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫


Registered: 01/03/04
Posts: 571
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
#7890168 - 01/16/08 08:28 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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I can relate to this 100%. I'm serious as hell.
I posted a trip report detailing my experience in which me and two other friends (C & S) took 18 hits of acid, a quarter of mushrooms, and a roll. C totally lost control, running around bellowing these primal howls screaming about "spirals and swirls!", screaming "you dont even know man, you dont even know!" He was looking at S and I as though we were the enemy - he didn't trust us, no matter how many tears we shed thinking our friend had lost his mind permanently. No matter how hard we tried to patiently guide him back to sanity, he remained in this possessed state for 3 hours. The longest 3 hours of my short god damn life.
Before he got into pulling his pants down and walking around beating off sticking water bottles and his iPod up his ass, he even slapped S whilst prancing around outside the farmhouse, with this confused and terrified look on his face. I want to know exactly what the mother fuck was going on in his head, because I personally have never "lost control" in such a way.
Part of me can't help but think.. that he let go simply because he had an excuse to. He took advantage of the situation, and totally ruined what should've been the greatest experience of our lives. It was a rite of passage. It was his 18th birthday (hence us all taking 18 hits each), and my 18th is literally exactly a month later.
Even though afterwards he said he couldn't remember what happened, I kind of knew he did. He was just putting up walls in his psyche to block out the traumatic experience he had LET HIMSELF FALL INTO. Keep in mind, S and I handled the onslaught of drugs perfectly well. It was only C's freak-out that tainted the experience.
I didn't know what to think of him after this. My entire perception of him changed. Before the event, he has always been an asshole, but I've tolerated it because for a while we were close smoking and tripping buddies. But after this, I feel like I saw into his soul... and I truly did. When he was on the floor, tears gushing from his eyes and him screaming about being in hell, I stared into his dilated eyes and saw nothing there.
It was the most irritating thing I have ever experienced (his belligerence, attempted homosexual acts, and screaming), and is the only bad trip I've ever had.
This happened a year ago in 2 days. January 18. The first anniversary of it, and I've been talking about it on here trying to find some closure.
C and I don't talk - in fact S and I don't either, and I know now things will never be the same between any of us (also for some other reasons that I don't have the time to discuss).
I can't help holding it against him - you know what? I was told that not that long ago, he took some shrooms with one of his buddies and at a random point in the trip he stood up, said something like "You know what? Fuck you and your felonous ways!" Or some weird shit like that.
The dude cannot control himself, and I don't believe he should be taking psychadelic drugs at all. He has a lot of bad psychological problems to deal with, and I think it's mostly a deep-seated hatred of his own sexuality.
He's a womanizer - the kind that looks at all women as "hoes," and that their only real purpose is to have a penis stuck in them.
God damn man, now that I have seen his soul - I don't know why the fuck I ever hung out with him.
Sorry this was so long - I tend to make these too long when I get into it.
--------------------
Hemp could Save the World. "There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian Know Thyself. "If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on." -Terence Mckenna
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fushock

Registered: 10/14/07
Posts: 428
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: fushock]
#7890169 - 01/16/08 08:29 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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That was too harsh of me. You shouldn't judge an entire person on just one night of their lives. to you, fushock
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KrishnaDreamer
I bleed nicotine...


Registered: 09/23/07
Posts: 4,132
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: fushock]
#7891170 - 01/16/08 11:49 PM (16 years, 16 days ago) |
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really, when someones in that kind of state they are very dangerous. they are not used to being in that mindstate. first off, you should try to get their attention, look them in the eye without fear, and try to get them to calm down, if they are responsive, any drugs that would help should be administered, ie. benzos or opiates. if they are unresponsive, try to contain them, hell, knock em out with a 2x4 if you have to, force administer drugs if need be.
-------------------- Everybody's a ninja...
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deadatdusk
Stranger

Registered: 12/02/05
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Hello all, thanks for the replies. I thoroughly enjoyed reading your stories, and most of them are quite shocking to hear. Some of them are just so over the top it's hard to believe someone can lose themselves like that. Keep sharing! It seems like the majority of people here believe he should be held fully accountable for his actions despite his bad trip, a few seem to lean toward the more sympathetic side. I noticed a few main things people pointed out I'd like to touch over.
1. Was it his first trip? Yes, it was his first trip. It was also the first trip for 3 other individuals who would've otherwise had a great time. Looking back, it was a mistake to dose the guy 3.5 g's. he would have been offended had he been given any less than anyone else, and at one point he even insisted on taking more and his request was declined.
2. I would've knocked him out. This was seriously debated as a last resort, an attempt was going to be made to physically restrain his arms and legs. If he was uncontrollable at this point, it's likely that in the situation we would've attempted to knock him unconscious to protect himself, and others.
3. He must have some underlying psychological issue. He tends to be very sensitive, and gets scared easily. Sometimes he plays too rough when he's drunk, perhaps he has some tendencies toward aggression that I once dismissed as shenanigans. I agree he has some pent up psychological issues, and the mushrooms brought those issues to the surface. Everyone has issues, and in my experience mushrooms have helped me face those issues and deal with them. I suppose he was faced with something he wasn't ready to deal with.
4. The best thing to do is to calm them down. An attempt was made after the throwing of the keys to help talk him down and guide him into a more positive state of mind. Mental exercises involving positive imagery were attempted, and while he seemed to respond to what was being said to them he wasn't "hearing" anybody if that makes sense. This attempt was quickly abandoned, as it was impossible to get him to sit still listen, and participate in the conversation.
5. Tell him your thoughts, don't trip with him again.
I attempted to talk to him the morning after, but he looked as though he'd just seen a ghost. He was sober again, but completely unresponsive and almost like a statue. He recalled hitting his girlfriend, and some other things so it's clear he didn't have a memory lapse but he claims that "it wasn't him" who did those things. I haven't tried to talk to him since, I will probably try in a day or two. And I don't think anyone ever will trip with him again for sure!
On a side note, I think everything was done to ensure a safe experience. He was in a safe location, with people who he was close with and he was given a "typical" dose (which was a bad idea on after thought). He was given forewarning as to the in's and out's of the experience beforehand, and ground rules were established to ensure everyone's safety. He was very aware of psychedelics nature to bring out preexisting mental conditions before he ate the mushrooms.
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manyc
♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫


Registered: 01/03/04
Posts: 571
Loc: Axis Mundi
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
#7891932 - 01/17/08 07:13 AM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
2. I would've knocked him out. This was seriously debated as a last resort, an attempt was going to be made to physically restrain his arms and legs. If he was uncontrollable at this point, it's likely that in the situation we would've attempted to knock him unconscious to protect himself, and others.
I mean to mention this:
My friend was walking around while he was still in his fucked-up state, and there was a yellow axe sitting on the ground in front of me because before we started tripping we were chopping firewood... and I'm not gonna lie, the thought went through my head that I was going to have to use it before he had the chance to...
It was not even nearly his first trip - his first trip taking so MUCH, but not his first trip by a long shot. He should have been prepared, but he wasn't. He should have known this. I believe he had a lingering thought before he ever took all the drugs, in which he felt he wasn't ready for it... this subconscious influence could've convinced him he DIDN'T have the capacity to control the drugs - so they controlled him.
I honestly had a scenario go through my head where I had to kill my (then) best friend, with a big fucking axe, because he went into LSD psychosis and tried to attack me with it first. Luckily though, after he paced around it for a while, I realized he didn't even realize it was there. Thank god. Thank whatever force it is that kept him from killing one of us, destroying my grandfather's farmhouse, and moreover, killing himself. It felt like it came very very close to being a situation of that serious magnitude.
God damn.. it's fucked up man. I appreciate all of you, though, who actually takes the time to listen to my story. It really does help me understand & cope with the experience further. And deadatdusk, I hope my story helped you come to some closure in some way as well.
--------------------
Hemp could Save the World. "There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian Know Thyself. "If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on." -Terence Mckenna
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: manyc]
#7891972 - 01/17/08 07:28 AM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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That's a bummer. Well, shit happens. I remember a Mardi-Gras where this friend got stuck in this loop saying over and over for hours, Guy, I love you, but you're an asshole. I mean every fucking sentence. But everyone held themselves in check. It was a way for all there to bind closer. We all remember that guy better than the rest of Mardi Gras.
-------------------- ...or something
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Querjek
Friend


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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: manyc]
#7892016 - 01/17/08 07:51 AM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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It's too bad that this happened to your friend, and yes, part of this happening is his fault, but is it safe to assume that the other four people involved have tripped before (especially on a dose like this)?
If so, I personally don't think it's entirely fair to blame the guy entirely for what happened. Sure, maybe he has "underlying psychological issues" or whatever, but wasn't it irresponsible of the others (assuming they actually have had experience with this) to let his first dose be so high (even though he wanted more, you could have worked the plan around him taking less or something)?
He should probably apologize (assuming he realizes the severity of what happened), but the others should make sure they've let him know how they feel about what happened.
What if this happened to any of you out there?
-------------------- tripping eyes and flooded lungs northern downpour sends its love
Edited by Querjek (01/17/08 07:54 AM)
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manyc
♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫


Registered: 01/03/04
Posts: 571
Loc: Axis Mundi
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Querjek]
#7892024 - 01/17/08 07:57 AM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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I imagine it's like having one of those dreams where you're naked in public, only this time.. you wake up from that dream, and, it ain't no dream.
I can't imagine the humiliation. But I think people tend to put walls up in their minds around such memories, like I said earlier.
Repressing it even further, when obviously the repression of feelings is probably what caused the psychotic break (induced of course by the drugs) in the first place.
It's a vicious cycle that needs prompt intervention to remedy.
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Hemp could Save the World. "There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian Know Thyself. "If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on." -Terence Mckenna
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citricacidx
FunGuy




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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
#7892285 - 01/17/08 09:51 AM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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If he made the decision to take the drugs, he should be responsible for his actions. I doubt anyone in your group put a gun to his head and forced him to eat the shrooms.
At the absolute least, he needs to apologize. Also, don't trip with him again. If he reeally understood the power of psychedelics, then taking a lesser dose than everyone else wouldn't be offensive. I have a friend who pretty much trips off weed, and we've all agreed to never give him any sort of psychedelic because he would go fucking insane.
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Chronic7

Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 13,679
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Querjek]
#7892361 - 01/17/08 10:19 AM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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ABCDEFGHIJKLMOPQRSTUVWXYZ
I have never tripped aorund people like you guys are talking about, if sumone did this shit around me i would walk away and never ever offer them to chance to trip with me ever again.
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citricacidx
FunGuy




Registered: 07/23/07
Posts: 9,027
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Chronic7]
#7892420 - 01/17/08 10:39 AM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
chronic777 said: ABCDEFGHIJKLMOPQRSTUVWXYZ
You forgot N
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krypto2000
Unknown


Registered: 12/05/06
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Chronic7]
#7892423 - 01/17/08 10:40 AM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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I don't blame you if you were to hold it against him, but I do feel it being his first experience and taking such a high dose (for a first timer) that you should be sympathetic. Regardless if he wanted more or not, he clearly did not know what he was getting himself into having never experienced psychedelics before.
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Orbital_Saucer
Other


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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: krypto2000]
#7893507 - 01/17/08 03:36 PM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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lol...
Most of manyc's story sounded like a 60's anti-drug propaganda thing.. what with the axe and all.
Not to make fun or anything, but yeah. 
I honestly believe that these reactions are no fault of the drug, but instead the person's mind. I'm not some sort of oblivious hippy-type preaching about how "LSD can do no wrong!", but the fact remains that it is just a chemical key to what was there all along.
People need to be cautious when unleashing their inner demons.
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awesomebastard
Lost



Registered: 12/16/07
Posts: 4,891
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: manyc]
#7893651 - 01/17/08 04:04 PM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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dude manyc after 18 hits of bomb acid i would probably end up sticking my own head up my ass.lol
seriously how did you take that much, shit
but yes his decision his mind he cant handle it tough titties he needs to apolagize. and to the poster, this guy never siad sorry to anyone thats fucked up.
--------------------
"Absolute certainty is a privilege of uneducated minds and fanatics." ~ C.J. Keyser Mr. Cypher said: "I just tell the girls how sexy I am and their panties melt."
Edited by awesomebastard (01/17/08 04:07 PM)
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Grill Master
Its always natturday


Registered: 06/11/07
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Loc: NW PA
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Querjek]
#7893830 - 01/17/08 04:33 PM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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Stories like the ones posted in this thread is the exact reason i will propbably only trip by myself or with my brother because you just cant know if who ur tripping with can handle their shit.
Although, it is the person who flips own resposibility for their actions, its also ur responsibility to know who ur tripping with and if they might have problems.
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Banana03
The 3rd Conchord



Registered: 04/16/06
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This thread was a great read.
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origami.octopus
Mycoporn fanaticin training


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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Banana03]
#7894063 - 01/17/08 05:31 PM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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wow. wack.....
people who think "oh whatever, i can handle my drugs" piss me the fuck off. Partly because they dont hold any respect for the mushrooms themselves, and partly because they doubt the intensity/authenticity of the experience.
Most of the experiences on here seem pretty frightening, for all involved. Especially the one about the guy camping who ate like 5 or 6 grams and got locked in his truck.
Knowing yourself, knowing your substance, and staying calm. Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy anyone? DONT PANIC
-------------------- I like to look at mushrooms the way most people like to look at flowers. this is an amazing game http://www.kongregate.com/games/customlogic/sprout
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g00ru
lit pants tit licker



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I cannot in my wildest imagination think of getting to a state where I acted like that. My hardest trip EVER all I did was just lie on a couch and mutter to myself, I could never imagine getting violent. Psychedelics just don't fucking do that to me. I'm always myself, usually much MORE of myself. I never even consider getting violent with myself. My last bad trip, when I downed 6g's, I was convinced that I would be stuck in the trip forever, and I still remember saying in my head "no matter what, I will never hurt myself or others." Yeah, he has to take responsibility imo, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't empathize with him. People never know how they're gonna react to shrooms.
-------------------- check out my music! drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss
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kronik08
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Querjek]
#7894140 - 01/17/08 05:54 PM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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i once tripped on salvia and had verbal lashouts toward one of my really good friends. after the trip was over and i realized what was going on. the rest of my friends told me about what happened. i chose to apologize on my own. and there was no further problem. the way i see it is that ur friend owes everyone an apology that he got to that state and all friends should accept with no problem. then just move on. live and learn.
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Coaster
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: kronik08]
#7894349 - 01/17/08 06:45 PM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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my friend punched a cop in the face in his boxers on shrooms he went completely nuts and thats why a bad friend called the cops on him, it cost him 20K bail and he said he was in dreamland, it happens most ppl cant control themselves on shrooms and unfortunately it is that minority that forces shrooms to become illegal
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Mandark


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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: g00ru]
#7894534 - 01/17/08 07:30 PM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
guruu said: I cannot in my wildest imagination think of getting to a state where I acted like that.
I think those people hadn't imagined it either until it happened.
Quote:
People never know how they're gonna react to shrooms.
Exactly. None of you can really be sure it won't happen to you some day.
-------------------- "One might ask why tobacco is legal and marijuana not. A possible answer is suggested by the nature of the crop. Marijuana can be grown almost anywhere, with little difficulty. It might not be easily marketable by major corporations. Tobacco is quite another story." - Noam Chomsky
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rizingfire
Mycoticus psychoticus




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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Querjek]
#7894918 - 01/17/08 08:58 PM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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IMO it just shows he is a shitbag deep down. Bad trip or not I would never hit my wife. You are still in control despite losing reality. I would give him some leeway but not too much. I have an explosive temper but even trippin I know what is going on. I think it was him choosing to act like an ass cuz he felt he could blame it on the trip. He wasn't having a good time so he had to ruin everyone elses night too....ya never know though, there is always that freak occourance so you know how he is, if he is a dick sober then you have your answer
-------------------- aka NHMI
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SalviaShroom
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Querjek]
#7895809 - 01/18/08 01:12 AM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
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One of my friends got kinda crazy slamming into shit and being kind of wreckless.
I mean we all ate around 5-7g and we all were having an amazing trip but somewhere towards the end he could of really lost it.
what i think this might be from could be that maybe between you and your tripping buddies someone may have said something..and he got paranoid thinking he was getting hella judged. Or maybe a jealousy wouse of somekind.
but the point i think im trying to get to is.....maybe you and your friends made it worse "trying to calm him down". like trying to say what he should think and what he should see..i can see something like that getting out of hand. you know? like sometimes you just gotta shut up if its not happy and gleeful.
anyway...thats one thing i noticed on my last trip of mushrooms with my 3 other friends. To try not to control their issue but simply change the atmosphere...
and i believe i did change their most frightening thoughts.
by playing my Guitar. haha
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BlargIAmDead
Shroom Samurai




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All of you who state bad experience say "Well it happened to a friend like this". I'll go ahead and relate my own, but the person who flipped out was me. I took 2.5-3 grams and as we started to come up it was pleasant enough. I was playing with poi and other trip toys while some other people were looking at posters. I trusted most of the people enough to trip around them and I had my girlfriend there so I was okay. But about halfway through things started to go really downhill.
We were in one guys room and my girlfriend rolled over and stopped moving. She closed her eyes and stopped responding to all stimulus. I called her name, nudged her, picked up her arm, and even shook her. I peeled back her eyelids but no one was home. And in my altered state it was terrifying for me to think that I might lose this person who was so very important to me. What upset me even more is that it seemed like I was the only one who cared that she might not be alive (stupid I know but it seemed real enough at the time). So after a couple incidents involving bodily functions we managed to get her into the tub while I sat on the toilet and kinda blacked in and out.
My mind would throw up memories and images of times with my family and friends and then my mind would ask "Am I this way around them? Was I tripping at this time? I can't remember. Do my parents know? What would they think?" And it just kept rolling back into itself in one big negative feed back loop. And whenever this would go on long enough or my mind thought it was too much for me I would black out until some stimulus brought be back to the surface (like someone coming into the bathroom or when my girlfriend starting throwing up). At times I found myself biting the large fleshy part of my thumb to keep from clenching my jaw and at one point I woke up to find my teeth resting on top of the tub as if I was going to bite it.
I will say that the thought of punching a hole in the door (or trying and snapping my wrist like the twig that it is ) seriously crossed my mind, or forcing one of the others to see the predicament my girlfriend was in (by physical means if necessary).
It is terrifying...there is no other word. It is the monkey huddled in the tree as something unknown, incomprehensible, and totally outside of your will to control takes the things you know and love. After I realized that my girlfriend was going to be okay I wandered around for a while with both hands shoved down the back of my pants...And that's my trip.
Try not to be so hard on people if they're having a bad trip. But if they lied to you about what they're comfortable with, then you shouldn't be comfortable with them.
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KrishnaDreamer
I bleed nicotine...


Registered: 09/23/07
Posts: 4,132
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Quote:
SalviaShroom said: anyway...thats one thing i noticed on my last trip of mushrooms with my 3 other friends. To try not to control their issue but simply change the atmosphere...
another good suggestion.
-------------------- Everybody's a ninja...
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Blindfysh
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Querjek]
#7896052 - 01/18/08 04:25 AM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
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I don't think you can shun someone who has had a lifetime of being mild in temperament for one nights violence especially if your gonna tinker with the ol' grey cells.
The nature of the drug is to change ones perception of reality, I was happy to shroom for ten years until one day I took masses and masses of liberty cap that I had procured earlier in the day, I got into one of those mind cycles where I would look down, not remember if I had had any, take some, remember I had, panic, look down, not remember if I had taken any.... and so on for ages I pretty much took an entire carrier bag.
The experience was terrifying and thank F@ck I was on my own because the walls started bleeding, there were people talking to me and wondering around the room, everything stank of evil, best friends appeared to me the as the devil in carnet, memories of my past were altered to seem twisted and vile, traits that I pride my self on like being mild mannered, patient and gentle all twisted to seem like weakness and cowardliness. I hate to think what would have happened if someone had been with me whilst I was that confused and scared.
I don't know how much I was conscious for but I woke the next morning and I had trashed my room, ripped up clothes, written garbled messages about losing my soul, smashed my fish tank, kicked through my door, It really shook me up and I thought that there was the possibility of underlying psychosis for sometime and obviously lay off the brain candy for a long time.
That was one time though, in a decade of tripping with no problems. Everybody has a flight or flight instinct and the capacity for violence, its a human condition if you kid yourself you don't you will be more unprepared for if it comes out through mind meddling.
All drugs bring out a different side of you... How many people do you know who become self obsessed and erratic from coke? Boring and paranoid from smoking, confrontational from drinking? Mushrooms are even more unpredictable because they go deeper into your mindset.
Don't get me wrong I'm pro self-exploration and mind-expansion but those words get banded around mostly with positive experiences If you all learned something from the evening then thats the name of the game, somewhere inside him your boy has that trait as does everyone else but we choose not to action it.
Ok. thats a bit of a mixed message but I know what I'm on about!
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blackegg
...has left the building.



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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Querjek]
#7896570 - 01/18/08 09:00 AM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
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If it would've been me losing it... I would apologize profusely!
This guy should've gotten the shit kicked out of him.
No hard feelings friend...but...you gotta know *yourself* before you trip, it's not my responsibility to babysit or put up with your bullshit violent behavior, and I'd have let this guy know that from the first thrown bottle or punch.
Of course if he's some monster body builder I guess you're just shit out, know your set and setting better. Live and learn.
This is why I trip alone or in small group of *good* long term friends.
Otherwise...
Too many opportunities for interpersonal miscommunication, ego tripping, etc. and not enough self exploration and 'life progress checking'.
-------------------- 'Pain is meant to wake us up. People try to hide their pain. But they're wrong. Pain is something to carry, like a radio. You feel your strength in the experience of pain. It's all in how you carry it. That's what matters. Pain is a feeling. Your feelings are a part of you. Your own reality. If you feel ashamed of them, and hide them, you're letting society destroy your reality. You should stand up for your right to feel your pain and leave the Shroomery.' ~ Jim Morrison
Edited by blackegg (01/18/08 09:08 AM)
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handicappedrat
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
#7897072 - 01/18/08 11:32 AM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
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If he was tripping his first time on 3.5g's, I can sympathize for him and easily forgive him. It all makes sense when you said that.
I've tripped harder on 2gs of the right shrooms than some acid I've taken, sometimes being as potent as 3 hits. I don't know how strong your shrooms were but 3.5 is alot.
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J.T
Condensed to a singularity



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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: Blindfysh]
#7900340 - 01/19/08 03:11 AM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
Blindfysh said: I don't think you can shun someone who has had a lifetime of being mild in temperament for one nights violence especially if your gonna tinker with the ol' grey cells.
The nature of the drug is to change ones perception of reality, I was happy to shroom for ten years until one day I took masses and masses of liberty cap that I had procured earlier in the day, I got into one of those mind cycles where I would look down, not remember if I had had any, take some, remember I had, panic, look down, not remember if I had taken any.... and so on for ages I pretty much took an entire carrier bag.
The experience was terrifying and thank F@ck I was on my own because the walls started bleeding, there were people talking to me and wondering around the room, everything stank of evil, best friends appeared to me the as the devil in carnet, memories of my past were altered to seem twisted and vile, traits that I pride my self on like being mild mannered, patient and gentle all twisted to seem like weakness and cowardliness. I hate to think what would have happened if someone had been with me whilst I was that confused and scared.
I don't know how much I was conscious for but I woke the next morning and I had trashed my room, ripped up clothes, written garbled messages about losing my soul, smashed my fish tank, kicked through my door, It really shook me up and I thought that there was the possibility of underlying psychosis for sometime and obviously lay off the brain candy for a long time.
That was one time though, in a decade of tripping with no problems. Everybody has a flight or flight instinct and the capacity for violence, its a human condition if you kid yourself you don't you will be more unprepared for if it comes out through mind meddling.
All drugs bring out a different side of you... How many people do you know who become self obsessed and erratic from coke? Boring and paranoid from smoking, confrontational from drinking? Mushrooms are even more unpredictable because they go deeper into your mindset.
Don't get me wrong I'm pro self-exploration and mind-expansion but those words get banded around mostly with positive experiences If you all learned something from the evening then thats the name of the game, somewhere inside him your boy has that trait as does everyone else but we choose not to action it.
Ok. thats a bit of a mixed message but I know what I'm on about!
Holy shit. That's all I have to say to that. Just reading that gave me insane chills.. Brrr. Finally someone that has a decent recognition of what psychedelics can do to you. Most people on here can't seem to comprehend that nothing is text book with psychs. People do flip out and not know what they are doing, not because "The drugs gave them an excuse to act in such a way" or such-like ulterior-motives. If you can't understand that then WHY THE FUCK ARE YOU DABBLING WITH THESE THINGS?
Word to what what written above this, take heed people, and FFS [to who edulged with 18 trips], 18 fucking trips on your 18th as a 'Rite of passage' ??? You nob.
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CMACD
The Sto)))ve


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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
#7900576 - 01/19/08 05:54 AM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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I had a violent bad trip once. And for about a month I was actually dumb enough to believe that "there was nothing I could have done about it, it was the mushrooms". Then after that, I shifted the blame over to "the monster inside me".
Fuck that shit. I feel like a fucking retard even bringing that up now. EVERYONE is responsible for their own actions. Even if you get super pissed & snap when you're not tripping, there's no excuse for it. I watched an episode of Dexter where his british g.f. said it best: (butchered quote): People go around blaming "the monster inside them" or just saying "it's cause I'm pathetic, a piece of shit". Blaming something inside you & just leaving it at that instead of just admitting that you're wrong & trying to better yourself is pathetic.
Anyways, certain phases of the mushroom trip do inspire me to want to "unleash" on someone. Sometimes I can't resist hitting the heavy bag with the hardest fastest haymakers possible. There is always a strange phase of the trip right after the peak where I feel invincible & like I could take on Kike Tyson in his prime. hahahaha
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manyc
♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫


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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: J.T]
#7900610 - 01/19/08 06:42 AM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
Holy shit. That's all I have to say to that. Just reading that gave me insane chills.. Brrr. Finally someone that has a decent recognition of what psychedelics can do to you. Most people on here can't seem to comprehend that nothing is text book with psychs. People do flip out and not know what they are doing, not because "The drugs gave them an excuse to act in such a way" or such-like ulterior-motives. If you can't understand that then WHY THE FUCK ARE YOU DABBLING WITH THESE THINGS?
Word to what what written above this, take heed people, and FFS [to who edulged with 18 trips], 18 fucking trips on your 18th as a 'Rite of passage' ??? You nob.
18 trips? It was 18 hits... douche bag.
Your attitude is totally self-contradictory.
How the hell are you, not knowing the guy who freaked out, going to assume that it WASN'T a conscious (or even subconscious) choice to just let go because he was in nature and on a shitload of drugs? He's not the kind of guy that really takes entheogens to reach spiritual stages - even though he says he is, he really just wants to get fucked up. I know this was the way it was, anyway, because I just know the guy (once you've stared into someone's soul, it's safe to say you've known them) I don't agree with just getting fucked up - I think that's why he freaked out so much. He wasn't ready for that kind of dosage. I go into every trip having meditated and prepared myself for what may come.
You don't know what my perception of entheogens is, and what I do think means fucking NOTHING to you, so why don't you just keep your biased opinions to yourself mk?
It wasn't me who freaked out - I was fine the entire time, oh except for the fact that my friend went into primal mode.
Do you have any idea how many cultures have utilized entheogens as a rite of passage into adulthood dude???
Sorry, but you seem very misinformed.
--------------------
Hemp could Save the World. "There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian Know Thyself. "If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on." -Terence Mckenna
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eggy
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: manyc]
#7901526 - 01/19/08 12:43 PM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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Excellent thread. Never considered the possibility of stuff like this happening. Personally I would prefer to stick to the 2g- range with a potentiator for more (intense) experiences instead of doing 2g+ of shroomz. I have a feeling this route would reduce any chance of tending towards violence (just a feeling).
-------------------- *** "a trippy absolute.eye tripping disease.no resolution no auto save" ***
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Silent_Vinny
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: blackegg]
#7901922 - 01/19/08 02:04 PM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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For some reason a lot of people are into fighting. Fighting technique; martial arts, bruce lee. I mean the stuff is fairly neat, I'm a fan. But under mushrooms I'd never imagine such a rage....unless of course you had too. Luckily I got to try it out, with my cousin, (Who I haven't seen since child hood years.)
He's a very compulsive individual. It can be a bit weird at times, but mostly he's just being himself....energetic, over the top outgoing, speaking his 1st thoughts on his brain that turn out for the most part as paranoia.
I didn't fully know it at the time...it was a weird trip..but oh so beautiful at the same time. It was a 2.5er each..after a few brew and some joints in the beautiful early Saturday afternoon. Unfortunately I just went through a bad car wreck, (motor replacement, transmission rebuild.) Ended up paying the same 5 grand price I paid for my very first car (I'm 20), right the fuck over again. It was a terrible feeling, because I worked hard like a grunt in the factory for a year and a half, and it was something I really did not want to get into. I'm not ready for post secondary yet, because I wanted to go in there with money and a car.
Anyways I knew I had to get over it and it was such a beautiful day out in the forest, drinking beer, smoking weed, talking about my very first Acid trip I had two weeks before...(a week before the car damage).
I never felt so energetic on that trip. maybe it was because he was. We both road on our bikes through the trail, went into the mall, road down a busy street to a big park, in which we had a play fight that was pretty violent I'd say. He was coming on strong, haha. It ended pretty fucking heavy because I ended up ripping his shirt. If I didn't I would of lost my footing and landed, probably face first, on to the stone rocked surface. It felt great because it just sort of happened while we were sitting there talking about Wolfs and a bunch of other crazy shit.
He was fairly pissed. I enjoyed it big time..., the whole experience made me turn into some old warrior that took mushrooms for battle.
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Silent_Vinny
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Oh and to answer why people flip out on mushrooms. I truly believe it's just a bad case sceneiro from the start. From the moment you took them to the moment something went wrong while you peaked. Confusion, where you are, what's been going on.
That's why there is always a time and place, and amount, for everything.
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KrishnaDreamer
I bleed nicotine...


Registered: 09/23/07
Posts: 4,132
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all i know is, if you got a monster inside of you, im gonna try and kill it.
-------------------- Everybody's a ninja...
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manyc
♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫


Registered: 01/03/04
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I think all humans have a monster inside them. Some are just more in tune, and submissive to it, than others
--------------------
Hemp could Save the World. "There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian Know Thyself. "If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on." -Terence Mckenna
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JstHereFrTheCake
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I personally think this is something your just gonna have to deide on yourself.
I mean how much do you like the guy, is it worth the friendship to forgive him kinda thing.
He should have been apologizing profusely from the moment he became sober. If he didn't then I would say fuck him. If his first thought after he regained control (and remembered what he had done as you've said he did) wasn't about the safety of his friends and he didn't have an uncontrollable urge to apologize, then he is probably just a shitty dude even if he seemed cool till now, you probably have never been in this kinda situation with him before.
That's what would get me is the lack of apologizing. I mean the way he acted would make me look at him differently, but the not immediately wanting to set things right is even more revealing if you ask me. If he isn't begging for anyone's forgiveness then he doesn't deserve it.
As far as my input on psychedelic psychosis, I think it would be stupid to not look at it from a case to case basis simply because of all the factors involved in tripping and mental states.
Losing control is something I tend to have little respect for, and I have done it, of course I was drunk (I drank most of a bottle of Goldschlager in like a half an hour cause I'm a douche). But even then I didn't get violent towards other people just myself and the only thing that stopped me was the overwhelming guilt I felt when my friend stuck his hand between my head and the tool cabinet I was beating it against. I had issue's, it wasn't the alcohol it was me, I just could no longer suppress them because I lost my inhibition.
My point is that the drugs don't make you do the things you do. They just keep you from not doing them. I would say he has repressed aggression that he needs to recognize and deal with and probably some other problems.
Mushrooms helped me realize that I had some issues I needed to confront the first time I did them, but I never lost control I just had time to think about the things I was doing (off mushrooms) and realized most of it was pretty unhealthy and weirding out my friends.
Again my point is that if this guy does regain your trust and you forgive him then maybe a low dose (no more than half of what you did) would be a good way to get him to get help. I am not saying to go do mushroom therapy with him, but maybe a low dose would get him to see what he had done the first trip in a way that would convince him he needs regular therapy.
But yeah like I said I tend to have no respect for people who lose control (really lose control), it has to do with mental constitution and willingness to maintain control. I have taken pretty larger doses (not huge) and even when I was on acid and literally everything around me disappeared I was still in control. I was in a bad place I made rational decisions about how to get myself out (decisions that actually I may not have been able to make sober because they obviously dealt with being vulnerable) and I made them and actually my relationships with one of my friends is much stronger because of it. Yeah there was confusion but if you trip you need to be able to recognize confusion and panic so that you don't start to make decisions based on it.
I feel that is a skill that not many people who trip have and it is an important one. Remaining at all times self-conscious (or at least when you need to decide things and act). Losing yourself has many benefits but the ability to poise yourself for rational thinking and decision making from that state, is a skill that I feel is necessary and ignored by a lot of people.
Edited by JstHereFrTheCake (01/19/08 05:54 PM)
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