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Offlinedeadatdusk
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Violence while tripping *DELETED*
    #7889500 - 01/16/08 06:19 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

Post deleted by deadatdusk

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Offlinewickedscepter
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
    #7889558 - 01/16/08 06:31 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

I have never heard of that before but if we don't like it when people do stupid things on drugs and then blame the drugs leading to further demonization of said drug, then we shouldn't allow it to happen ourselves. Stupid people do stupid things sober or otherwise. Although if he was loyal and friendly then who knows however if he is as good a guy as he says he is then he will man up and take responsibility.


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Offlinedevilzmike
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
    #7889562 - 01/16/08 06:31 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

I think you should indeed be sympathetic to the fact he had a bad trip. There is no way a person should be fully accountable for his action as he would if he was sober. 3.5 g is enough for some individual to loose control of themselve. If he had been very nice and friendly before this day, i guess he just had a very bad trip. You should not get so mad at him for that. It was not cool for you but it was sure not cool for him either. I've already got out of control on 4g of shroom, acting like shit with my friend and even punching them. I don't even remember this and my friends got over it. It was everything but me this time. You should do the same with your friend.


--------------------
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OfflineK20A2
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
    #7889576 - 01/16/08 06:34 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

I would have zero tolerance for something like that. Period. I can be a bit of a tyrant though, so....

Is this type of behavior completely out of character for this guy, or is it more like the fungus amplified what was already there?

If I was in your shoes, I would never trip with him again. Id still chill with the guy but tripping with him....NO.

Myself and a friend had a problem with another buddy of ours in high school. He would get all sorts of worked up and wanting to wrestle and play fight after he smoked weed. Needless to say, the three of us never smoked together again after the situation got to a breaking point. We did address this though, and told him our thoughts on everything, but some people cant be changed.


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OfflinePreparationH
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: devilzmike]
    #7889601 - 01/16/08 06:38 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

yea, i can definitely see someone going off the deep end for a few hours and go into a violent fit. was this his first time tripping? while on an 8th of the most potent shrooms i've come across i convinced myself i killed someone because they were unresponsive face down on their bed and I was ready to start knocking people out at this party because no one even knew my name and they were yelling at me "He's not moving!" i started gettin my shit together, btw i used to box so all these kids would have been no problem. Then, the kid rolled over and i breathed a sigh of releif. for about 2 minutes my world crashed in, i was sure i was 1. smashing faces in, or 2. going to prison for life. and im not that type of person but to save my ass, yea i guess i am that type of person w/e.


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InvisibleKrishnaDreamer
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: devilzmike]
    #7889605 - 01/16/08 06:38 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

sounds like he has pent up psychological issues he needs to deal with. possibly abuse from family members. if he gets violent in the future my advice would be to knock him out, either with drugs or trauma to the brain, tell him to stay far away from psychedelics unless he can fix himself.


--------------------
Everybody's a ninja...


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InvisibleEll Ess Bree
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: devilzmike]
    #7889612 - 01/16/08 06:40 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

Quote:

devilzmike said:
I think you should indeed be sympathetic to the fact he had a bad trip. There is no way a person should be fully accountable for his action as he would if he was sober. 3.5 g is enough for some individual to loose control of themselve. If he had been very nice and friendly before this day, i guess he just had a very bad trip. You should not get so mad at him for that. It was not cool for you but it was sure not cool for him either. I've already got out of control on 4g of shroom, acting like shit with my friend and even punching them. I don't even remember this and my friends got over it. It was everything but me this time. You should do the same with your friend.





I agree with the bolded part of this statement. 3.5g of shrooms is more than enough to make some people loose control of themselves.

I disagree with the rest of it.

That person should be held entirely accountable. Or, if there were people that told him he'd be ok, if he didn't know any better.

It is 100% true that 3.5 grams of shrooms can FUCK SOMEONES SHIT UP.

It's on that fucking person to KNOW if he can fucking handle 3.5 grams of shrooms. The world is still afraid of drugs. It's easy to find all the information if you're looking for it. IF YOU'RE LOOKING FOR IT. We're told not to look, so a lot of people don't.

Information on safe drug use isn't basic criteria in school, ya know what I'm saying. It's on the fucking user to know. If he didn't know he could handle it and ate them, his fault. His fucking fault. Or the people that misinformed him, if that scenario is the case.

And that's all I got for that.


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OfflinePreparationH
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: KrishnaDreamer]
    #7889619 - 01/16/08 06:41 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

yea, i'd tell him your thoughts and tell him how your not going to trip with him again. my story at least i didnt hit anybody but i shit you not the terror in my bones was so real and so scary, i felt like i was having a heart attack.


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Invisiblepoke smot!
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Re: Violence while tripping *DELETED* [Re: deadatdusk]
    #7889673 - 01/16/08 06:52 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

Post deleted by poke smot!

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Invisibleawesomebastard
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: poke smot!]
    #7890074 - 01/16/08 08:10 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

ive had some bad trips and have done some stupid regretable things during bad trips but none have been violent. I will always get violent tworad myself before others but thats just the way i am i dont feel fighting is necessary exept in survival type sitautions.


--------------------
"Absolute certainty is a privilege of uneducated minds and fanatics." ~ C.J. Keyser



Mr. Cypher said: "I just tell the girls how sexy I am and their panties melt."


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OfflineOrbital_Saucer
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: KrishnaDreamer]
    #7890084 - 01/16/08 08:12 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

Quote:

KrishnaDreamer said:
sounds like he has pent up psychological issues he needs to deal with.




This is exactly what I was thinking. Psychedelics are not going to change a person into a killer. If this guy is normally as mild-mannered as you say he is, then he's either an excellent actor, or there is something else going on.

I would strongly suggest he investigates any psychiatric conditions he may have.


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Offline12468
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: poke smot!]
    #7890121 - 01/16/08 08:20 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

Hey there deadatdusk,

I wanted to reply quickly to your story because I've ben in the same scenario twice now.

I no longer trip with anyone except my wife and a couple close friends.

Long story short: Camping trip, ounce of mushrooms. Myself and two friends. Guy says he's shroomed before, we later find out he hasn't - we hadn't weighed any out, but he had to have had 5-7 grams. We warned him but didn't realize how much he had eaten. He didn't talk for about 18 hours after he ate them and he flipped. He tore apart the campfire with his bare hands, picked up burning logs and threw them everywhere. flung three or four dozen beers into the forest, slobbered and screamed, just freaked.

It was fucked up and scary. We had to lock him into the cab of his own truck for the night, where he went totally nuts. He has never really come back.

Bottom line is, like someone else said, underlying psychological issues cause that sort of behavior while on psychadelics. On some fundamental level, that person is 'broken'.

After shrooming for a while, you develop a sense for who these people are - in sober, everyday life. I flatly refuse to be around anyone who is inexperienced or talks big about psychadelics because I've seen so many come completely unglued.

Your friend is responsible for the state of his own mental health - he took the chemical, he ought to be held responsible for what he did. Drugs bring out people's true colors - don't out with him anymore, he's a sick person and needs to get help.


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Invisiblefushock
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
    #7890156 - 01/16/08 08:26 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

Ya, I think that guy just might be a dick. Sorry, but in my worst trips the only thing I want to do is curl up in a little ball.

That more drunk behavior.


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Invisiblemanyc
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
    #7890168 - 01/16/08 08:28 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

I can relate to this 100%. I'm serious as hell.

I posted a trip report detailing my experience in which me and two other friends (C & S) took 18 hits of acid, a quarter of mushrooms, and a roll. C totally lost control, running around bellowing these primal howls screaming about "spirals and swirls!", screaming "you dont even know man, you dont even know!" He was looking at S and I as though we were the enemy - he didn't trust us, no matter how many tears we shed thinking our friend had lost his mind permanently. No matter how hard we tried to patiently guide him back to sanity, he remained in this possessed state for 3 hours. The longest 3 hours of my short god damn life.

Before he got into pulling his pants down and walking around beating off sticking water bottles and his iPod up his ass, he even slapped S whilst prancing around outside the farmhouse, with this confused and terrified look on his face. I want to know exactly what the mother fuck was going on in his head, because I personally have never "lost control" in such a way.

Part of me can't help but think.. that he let go simply because he had an excuse to. He took advantage of the situation, and totally ruined what should've been the greatest experience of our lives. It was a rite of passage. It was his 18th birthday (hence us all taking 18 hits each), and my 18th is literally exactly a month later.

Even though afterwards he said he couldn't remember what happened, I kind of knew he did. He was just putting up walls in his psyche to block out the traumatic experience he had LET HIMSELF FALL INTO. Keep in mind, S and I handled the onslaught of drugs perfectly well. It was only C's freak-out that tainted the experience.

I didn't know what to think of him after this. My entire perception of him changed. Before the event, he has always been an asshole, but I've tolerated it because for a while we were close smoking and tripping buddies. But after this, I feel like I saw into his soul... and I truly did. When he was on the floor, tears gushing from his eyes and him screaming about being in hell, I stared into his dilated eyes and saw nothing there.

It was the most irritating thing I have ever experienced (his belligerence, attempted homosexual acts, and screaming), and is the only bad trip I've ever had.

This happened a year ago in 2 days. January 18. The first anniversary of it, and I've been talking about it on here trying to find some closure.

C and I don't talk - in fact S and I don't either, and I know now things will never be the same between any of us (also for some other reasons that I don't have the time to discuss).

I can't help holding it against him - you know what? I was told that not that long ago, he took some shrooms with one of his buddies and at a random point in the trip he stood up, said something like "You know what? Fuck you and your felonous ways!" Or some weird shit like that.

The dude cannot control himself, and I don't believe he should be taking psychadelic drugs at all. He has a lot of bad psychological problems to deal with, and I think it's mostly a deep-seated hatred of his own sexuality.

He's a womanizer - the kind that looks at all women as "hoes," and that their only real purpose is to have a penis stuck in them.

God damn man, now that I have seen his soul - I don't know why the fuck I ever hung out with him.

Sorry this was so long - I tend to make these too long when I get into it.


--------------------

Hemp could Save the World.

"There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian


:mushroomgrow:Know Thyself.:mushroomgrow:

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."
-Terence Mckenna


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Invisiblefushock
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: fushock]
    #7890169 - 01/16/08 08:29 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

That was too harsh of me. You shouldn't judge an entire person on just one night of their lives. :thumbdown: to you, fushock


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InvisibleKrishnaDreamer
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: fushock]
    #7891170 - 01/16/08 11:49 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

really, when someones in that kind of state they are very dangerous. they are not used to being in that mindstate. first off, you should try to get their attention, look them in the eye without fear, and try to get them to calm down, if they are responsive, any drugs that would help should be administered, ie. benzos or opiates. if they are unresponsive, try to contain them, hell, knock em out with a 2x4 if you have to, force administer drugs if need be.


--------------------
Everybody's a ninja...


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Offlinedeadatdusk
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: KrishnaDreamer]
    #7891405 - 01/17/08 12:40 AM (16 years, 16 days ago)

Hello all, thanks for the replies. I thoroughly enjoyed reading your stories, and most of them are quite shocking to hear. Some of them are just so over the top it's hard to believe someone can lose themselves like that. Keep sharing! It seems like the majority of people here believe he should be held fully accountable for his actions despite his bad trip, a few seem to lean toward the more sympathetic side. I noticed a few main things people pointed out I'd like to touch over.

1. Was it his first trip? Yes, it was his first trip. It was also the first trip for 3 other individuals who would've otherwise had a great time. Looking back, it was a mistake to dose the guy 3.5 g's. he would have been offended had he been given any less than anyone else, and at one point he even insisted on taking more and his request was declined.

2. I would've knocked him out. This was seriously debated as a last resort, an attempt was going to be made to physically restrain his arms and legs. If he was uncontrollable at this point, it's likely that in the situation we would've attempted to knock him unconscious to protect himself, and others.

3. He must have some underlying psychological issue. He tends to be very sensitive, and gets scared easily. Sometimes he plays too rough when he's drunk, perhaps he has some tendencies toward aggression that I once dismissed as shenanigans. I agree he has some pent up psychological issues, and the mushrooms brought those issues to the surface. Everyone has issues, and in my experience mushrooms have helped me face those issues and deal with them. I suppose he was faced with something he wasn't ready to deal with.

4. The best thing to do is to calm them down. An attempt was made after the throwing of the keys to help talk him down and guide him into a more positive state of mind. Mental exercises involving positive imagery were attempted, and while he seemed to respond to what was being said to them he wasn't "hearing" anybody if that makes sense. This attempt was quickly abandoned, as it was impossible to get him to sit still listen, and participate in the conversation.


5. Tell him your thoughts, don't trip with him again.

I attempted to talk to him the morning after, but he looked as though he'd just seen a ghost. He was sober again, but completely unresponsive and almost like a statue. He recalled hitting his girlfriend, and some other things so it's clear he didn't have a memory lapse but he claims that "it wasn't him" who did those things. I haven't tried to talk to him since, I will probably try in a day or two. And I don't think anyone ever will trip with him again for sure!


On a side note, I think everything was done to ensure a safe experience. He was in a safe location, with people who he was close with and he was given a "typical" dose (which was a bad idea on after thought). He was given forewarning as to the in's and out's of the experience beforehand, and ground rules were established to ensure everyone's safety. He was very aware of psychedelics nature to bring out preexisting mental conditions before he ate the mushrooms.


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Invisiblemanyc
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: deadatdusk]
    #7891932 - 01/17/08 07:13 AM (16 years, 15 days ago)

Quote:

2. I would've knocked him out. This was seriously debated as a last resort, an attempt was going to be made to physically restrain his arms and legs. If he was uncontrollable at this point, it's likely that in the situation we would've attempted to knock him unconscious to protect himself, and others.




I mean to mention this:

My friend was walking around while he was still in his fucked-up state, and there was a yellow axe sitting on the ground in front of me because before we started tripping we were chopping firewood... and I'm not gonna lie, the thought went through my head that I was going to have to use it before he had the chance to...

It was not even nearly his first trip - his first trip taking so MUCH, but not his first trip by a long shot. He should have been prepared, but he wasn't. He should have known this. I believe he had a lingering thought before he ever took all the drugs, in which he felt he wasn't ready for it... this subconscious influence could've convinced him he DIDN'T have the capacity to control the drugs - so they controlled him.

I honestly had a scenario go through my head where I had to kill my (then) best friend, with a big fucking axe, because he went into LSD psychosis and tried to attack me with it first. Luckily though, after he paced around it for a while, I realized he didn't even realize it was there. Thank god. Thank whatever force it is that kept him from killing one of us, destroying my grandfather's farmhouse, and moreover, killing himself. It felt like it came very very close to being a situation of that serious magnitude.

God damn.. it's fucked up man. I appreciate all of you, though, who actually takes the time to listen to my story. It really does help me understand & cope with the experience further. And deadatdusk, I hope my story helped you come to some closure in some way as well.


--------------------

Hemp could Save the World.

"There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian


:mushroomgrow:Know Thyself.:mushroomgrow:

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."
-Terence Mckenna


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Offlineeve69
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: manyc]
    #7891972 - 01/17/08 07:28 AM (16 years, 15 days ago)

That's a bummer. Well, shit happens. I remember a Mardi-Gras where this friend got stuck in this loop saying over and over for hours, Guy, I love you, but you're an asshole. I mean every fucking sentence. But everyone held themselves in check. It was a way for all there to bind closer. We all remember that guy better than the rest of Mardi Gras.


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...or something







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OfflineQuerjek
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Re: Violence while tripping [Re: manyc]
    #7892016 - 01/17/08 07:51 AM (16 years, 15 days ago)

It's too bad that this happened to your friend, and yes, part of this happening is his fault, but is it safe to assume that the other four people involved have tripped before (especially on a dose like this)?

If so, I personally don't think it's entirely fair to blame the guy entirely for what happened. Sure, maybe he has "underlying psychological issues" or whatever, but wasn't it irresponsible of the others (assuming they actually have had experience with this) to let his first dose be so high (even though he wanted more, you could have worked the plan around him taking less or something)?

He should probably apologize (assuming he realizes the severity of what happened), but the others should make sure they've let him know how they feel about what happened.



What if this happened to any of you out there?


--------------------
tripping eyes and flooded lungs
northern downpour sends its love


Edited by Querjek (01/17/08 07:54 AM)


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