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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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InvisibleIcelander
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Romance=Spiritual???
    #7887719 - 01/16/08 10:03 AM (16 years, 16 days ago)

Romantic love. I have felt it and the chemicals that flood my brain. It doesn't get much better it seems to most of us. In fact it's hard not to believe feeling that good isn't somehow connected with something greater like spirit or soul (soul mates). But after living into my 50s and having had this experience more than several times I believe it was just natures way of getting me to procreate. This is now self-evident to me from observing myself and friends and a lot of the human race.

If there actually is something spiritual and soulful about all this it's that over some time (years) you can actually develop a real friendship with your partner and possibly unconditional acceptance of the fact that they didn't really hold up to your romantic ideals and expectations over time and you really often want different things from life and view it somewhat differently. You can also learn how not to be attached to owning this person and the relationship which could also be considered very spiritual and soulful.

Most people live their whole lives IMO or most of it without ever realizing this. Hence lots of human suffering and a few murders.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisiblemushbaby
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: Icelander]
    #7887887 - 01/16/08 11:13 AM (16 years, 16 days ago)

If romantic love is spiritual then I have definitely lost a portion of my inner self. I have never felt it.

Oh I love people. But never felt that "can't live without you" or "you are my whole world" that I have heard other people say they feel.

I've always thought that kind of love was a myth.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: mushbaby]
    #7888213 - 01/16/08 01:14 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

You're way ahead of the curve.:thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinevigilant_mind
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: Icelander]
    #7888242 - 01/16/08 01:22 PM (16 years, 16 days ago)

I forget who said this, but here is what I believe to be a relevant quote:

Quote:

Every girl I've dated was the one to die for.




I don't think romantic love is spiritual. The "feelings" I formed as a result of being with the girls I have were typically the same, and are thus more than likely rooted in my brain chemistry and not so much my spiritual self (if such a thing exists).


Edited by vigilant_mind (01/16/08 01:25 PM)


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OfflineGrok
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: Icelander]
    #7897116 - 01/18/08 11:54 AM (16 years, 14 days ago)

Well, it's hard not to want to believe that there isn't more some deeper substance to the biological mayhem we're enslaved to. Otherwise life might seem kind of futile and cold, and that's kind of a hard prospect for anyone to face. We're inherently superstitious for the most part, so when we get all moose-eyed, bombarded by intense feelings, and our IQ's plummet, we're inclined to believe that there must be something deeper to the whole bit. And then it doesn't hold to our expectations, all falls apart, hurts a lot, and we become deeply unspiritual.

Good post, I had been considering these concepts recently.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: Grok]
    #7897123 - 01/18/08 12:02 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

Yes, it's hard to face because it's a deeply embedded program. But face it we must if we are ever to create a space for unconditional (real IMO) love to flourish.

"If not now, when?"


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineLove Cap
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: Icelander]
    #7897933 - 01/18/08 03:48 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

I've had spiritual out of body experiences from making love with my very special one... I do think it's another open door to that 'light' or enlightened feeling, love is one of the many ways to get you there... because that's what it feels like when you get there too! When you get there from meditation, or the peak of a trip, it's pure love. (and so much more)


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: Love Cap]
    #7897965 - 01/18/08 03:57 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

I have no idea what that has to do with what I just said?:confused:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: Icelander]
    #7898051 - 01/18/08 04:14 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

Well, by your parameters pretty much nothing is spiritual. Personally, my 'spiritality' lies in opening to the wonder of living in an awe inspiring, infintely vast and essentially mysterious universe. Any experience that causes you to feel a sense of oneness, of connection with something beyond the boundaries of your own skin is 'spiritual.' Romantic love counts, walking down the sidewalk on a quiet rainy evening counts. Tending to a garden and being filled with joy that it's living and growing counts... Every experience can be explained in rational terms, and that is all well and good. I find those explanations incredibly interesting, but that does not diminish the experience. What other definition of spirituality makes any goddamn sense? Should "spiritual" things be completely removed from material explanation? If that's the criteria then I can't think of a single thing that counts, can you?

I think it's funny how people lament being 'chained' to the world, to thier bodies when the world is so VAST and so awe inspiring! Spirituality is immersion, is merging, is joyfully experiencing...


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Offlinebackfromthedead
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #7898093 - 01/18/08 04:21 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

'the world is so VAST and so awe inspiring!'

Awe is right.:thumbup:


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #7898157 - 01/18/08 04:33 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

Romantic love counts,

While I can entertain the idea of spirit I don't know if it exists as most people define it.

If romantic love is spiritual then everything is, as one can feel connected by just about any experience depending on the person.

My point being that most people are unrealistic about the extent of romantic loves potential to transcend our earthly animal plane. Most people IMO are addicted to romantic love like a drug and go into withdrawal when it is withheld. They give it meaning that is not justified.

Unconditional acceptance or "love" would be a much better candidate for the term "spiritual" IMO.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: Icelander]
    #7898273 - 01/18/08 05:08 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)


While I can entertain the idea of spirit I don't know if it exists as most people define it.


Sure, I'm with you here.

If romantic love is spiritual then everything is, as one can feel connected by just about any experience depending on the person.

Exactly. This is what I'm on about.


My point being that most people are unrealistic about the extent of romantic loves potential to transcend our earthly animal plane. Most people IMO are addicted to romantic love like a drug and go into withdrawal when it is withheld. They give it meaning that is not justified.


Yep, I'm with you here too.

Unconditional acceptance or "love" would be a much better candidate for the term "spiritual" IMO.

Why? Do 'spiritual' things have to be eternal? Can they not be temporal? Can there not be temporary experiences or things that trigger an altered state, allowing us to glimpse something bigger than ourselves? Nothing lasts 'forever.' Impermanence doesn't diminish the weight of a moment.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #7898289 - 01/18/08 05:12 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

Why? Do 'spiritual' things have to be eternal? Can they not be temporal? Can there not be temporary experiences or things that trigger an altered state, allowing us to glimpse something bigger than ourselves? Nothing lasts 'forever.' Impermanence doesn't diminish the weight of a moment.


But, but, but, unconditional acceptance and love is temporal. It acts moment to moment and then moves on to the next thing. Its part of every single thing in our lives. I think you think that I think something other than I do.:lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (01/18/08 05:13 PM)


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: Icelander]
    #7898306 - 01/18/08 05:16 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

Perhaps. But my point still stands. No matter how fleeting an experience-- one night stands included-- it can still be experienced as 'spiritual.'


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Romance=Spiritual??? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #7898347 - 01/18/08 05:24 PM (16 years, 14 days ago)

:doggystyle::thumbup: Yeah baby yeah!


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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