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Offlineblackegg
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Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws?
    #7882223 - 01/15/08 08:54 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

What do you all think of this line of reasoning...

It seems to me that the states that have the worse history of arresting and fining peaceful people for possessing/growing recreational drugs are invariably Republican?

I'm not trying to bash anybody out there but, if you're leaning Republican, how do you reconcile the party's stance against "illegal drugs" and your presence here at the Shroomery?

Personally, I agree with the Republican platform of a strong military and little government interference with buisness (and really with little government interference with my life.)

As a side note, I'm running a small experiment to see if I can actually take part in a reasonable, well intentioned, intellegent discussion on the internet.

Thanks for reading...


--------------------
'Pain is meant to wake us up. People try to hide their pain. But they're wrong. Pain is something to carry, like a radio. You feel your strength in the experience of pain. It's all in how you carry it. That's what matters. Pain is a feeling. Your feelings are a part of you. Your own reality. If you feel ashamed of them, and hide them, you're letting society destroy your reality. You should stand up for your right to feel your pain and leave the Shroomery.' ~ Jim Morrison


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: blackegg]
    #7882288 - 01/15/08 09:12 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Both Republicans and Democrats are equally retarded when it comes to drug laws. They're all cut from the same dough.

The republicans tend to be the ones who propose harsher penalties though. 10 Years ago Newt proposed a bill that would give the death penalty to anyone caught importing 1lb or more of pot into America.

What is this? Southeast Asia? Fuck that shit.


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Offlinewortiesbo
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: BrAiN]
    #7882304 - 01/15/08 09:17 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Quote:

BrAiN said:

10 Years ago Newt proposed a bill that would give the death penalty to anyone caught importing 1lb or more of pot into America.

What is this? Southeast Asia? Fuck that shit.




this is what i dont understand. where do they get their reasoning for this kind of harsh penalty?


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: wortiesbo]
    #7882315 - 01/15/08 09:21 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Because they still believe 70 year old propoganda


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Offlineblackegg
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: BrAiN]
    #7882352 - 01/15/08 09:35 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

"Both Republicans and Democrats are equally retarded when it comes to drug laws. They're all cut from the same dough"

To use an well-worn expression:
"Sshit floats"
Both parties do seem to have reasonable, 'progressive' candidates that are simply laughed off the stage every time. That's my opinion at least.


"The republicans tend to be the ones who propose harsher penalties though. 10 Years ago Newt proposed a bill that would give the death penalty to anyone caught importing 1lb or more of pot into America.

What is this? Southeast Asia? Fuck that shit. "

Exactly, that's why I'm wondering: How can people defend the Republican Party here at a site thats (at least partially) about the study of psychoactives?

It's a strange phenomenon to me.

Are they reacting to the Democrats Bullshit?
Do they truly believe that Republicans are better for the common Shroomery Member?
Are they business people who thrive in Anti-Drug Hysteria?
Inquiring minds WANT TO KNOW...


:grin:


--------------------
'Pain is meant to wake us up. People try to hide their pain. But they're wrong. Pain is something to carry, like a radio. You feel your strength in the experience of pain. It's all in how you carry it. That's what matters. Pain is a feeling. Your feelings are a part of you. Your own reality. If you feel ashamed of them, and hide them, you're letting society destroy your reality. You should stand up for your right to feel your pain and leave the Shroomery.' ~ Jim Morrison


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OfflineRosettaStoned
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: wortiesbo]
    #7882376 - 01/15/08 09:41 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Quote:

this is what i dont understand. where do they get their reasoning for this kind of harsh penalty?




Some of the major politicians have been involved in smuggling drugs into this country. Clinton comes to mind. They have the power to get planes into this country that do not get suspected since they are congressmen/governors/cia/ect. They make a killing off keeping drugs illegal so they can help finance wars, elections, bribes, "aid" money and the like.

It was well learned during prohibition what happens when you make something people want illegal: they get it anyway. People like Al Capone got filthy rich and built empires within the US. The govt learned from it, either that or the mob people joined the govt. Which ever happened the govt started joining the drug trade. Very easy way to get money without having to have to ask congress so they can spend it whatever criminal way they choose with almost zero risk.

Don't believe me? On 9/11/01 jeb bush ordered the airports where the "hijackers" came from to be raided. They confiscated all material related to the arabs who trained there. Along with that material they confiscated a plane which was leased or owned by a republican congressman that was FULL of heroine. It certainly didn't make front page news as 2 buildings had fell in new york. But it read in the papers as "Largest Heroine Bust In FL State History". No one was ever jailed for it. It was buried in the news. I don't remember the congressman as its been a while but someone can research it if they feel like it. He is no longer in congress but I'm sure he's still filthy rich. Probably belongs to Zappa's lobbying firm :lol:


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"Government big enough to provide you with all you need is also big enough to take everything you have." ~ Thomas Jefferson

"Without stupid, faggy potheads we wouldn't have wars." - Zappa


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InvisibleTHE KRAT BARON
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: blackegg]
    #7882385 - 01/15/08 09:44 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Some people who sell (insert illegal substance x) want nothing more than the drug war to go on because they would be out of business if drugs were to become legalized and taxed by the government. I don't know anything about the government smuggling conspiracy theories the guy above me mentioned, I'm just talking about your average Joe dealer.


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m00nshine is currently vacationing in Maui. Rumor has it he got rolled by drunken natives and is currently prostituting himself in order to pay for airfare back to the mainland but he's having trouble juggling a hairon addiction. He won't be back for a long while.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: blackegg]
    #7882408 - 01/15/08 09:51 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Quote:

It seems to me that the states that have the worse history of arresting and fining peaceful people for possessing/growing recreational drugs are invariably Republican?




And what if my feeling is that the states with the worst track record are Democrat?

Anyone can say anything if they disregard fact. Where is the evidence which leads you to conclude the states with the most draconian drug policies are Republican?





Phred


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Offlinevintage_gonzo
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: RosettaStoned]
    #7882412 - 01/15/08 09:52 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Yea, you need a link for that one.


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: Phred]
    #7882433 - 01/15/08 09:59 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

It's tough to say so maybe we should limit our references to post WWII era... seeing as how the name "democrat" and "republican" seem to shift evert 30-40 years or so.

What may have bene considered very "demorat" during teddy roosevelt's time may be considered quite "republican" by today's standards.

And if we limit ourselves to this time period I'd say Republicans definately have been more of the aggressors against drugs. One word: "REAGAN".

Then again, lately, republians have been in control, it seems, generally more than the democrats so for a lot of drug legislation it may be easy to blame the republicans.


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OfflineRogerRabbitV
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: BrAiN]
    #7882589 - 01/15/08 10:30 AM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Quote:

Where is the evidence which leads you to conclude the states with the most draconian drug policies are Republican?





Ten years ago in Oklahoma, a republican stronghold, law enforcement raided my place because they 'discovered' my sons patch with ten small plants. They filed charges of cultivation against me for being the property owner, and were seeking a 500 year sentence. Really.

After moving to Washington State, a democratic stronghold, my daughter was discovered doing something similar, as well as having a huge collection of bongs and other glassware. They pulled up her plants, and took her weed, but she kept all her pipes and didn't get busted or have any charges filed whatsoever. Pretty big difference.

The reasoning is simple. Republicans are the largest recipients of pharmaceutical bribes(oops, campaign contributions). Who the hell is going to pay $15 per pill for Prozac when you can grow your own weed in the backyard for free?
RR


--------------------
Download Let's Grow Mushrooms



semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #7883131 - 01/15/08 12:13 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

---


Edited by EntheogenicPeace (02/13/21 09:37 AM)


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: blackegg]
    #7883161 - 01/15/08 12:17 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

---


Edited by EntheogenicPeace (02/13/21 09:37 AM)


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #7883171 - 01/15/08 12:19 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Nothing wrong with a big military if you don't use it for the wrong purposes.. in fact.. it's neccessary. If you're a superpower and you DON'T have an advanced military, you're a sitting duck for the next Hitler.


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Offlineblackegg
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #7883212 - 01/15/08 12:27 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Well, this is a map of the marijuana laws in the US:
http://norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=4516

and here's a link to a map that shows how the states voted in the last two presidential elections:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:2004_US_elections_map_electoral_votes.png

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:ElectoralCollege2000-Large-BushRed-GoreBlue.png

These maps kinda work in reverse, showing states that have *decriminalized* marijuana or have medical mj and how they voted in 2000 and 2004.


Those are just a few links that I know of offhand.





Personally, I have also lived in Portland, Eugene, Olympia WA,  Northern California, Rochester NY and I was born and raised in San Antonio Texas...so from that perspective I can speak about the differences between the conservative leaning state in which I was born and those I have lived in / visited.

I have been arrested only twice in my life... both times in Texas.

Once because my friends from NY went to observe two police officers 'roughing up' a homeless man across the street as we stopped for gas. I wasn't aware of this..I was inside buying a beer otherwise I would've warned them!
(They 'observed' the incident then as we were leaving the gas station in the car we were pulled over for 'failing to yield to on-coming traffic'.)

The police officer came up to the BACK window where my friend from NY was seated and asked to see HER I.D. not the driver.

She said "Let me see *your* I.D.!"  (Which again shows how different the norms are in these two states, I wouldn't even DREAM of saying that to a cop! or 'observing' police in the first place.)

  After this he ordered all of us out of the car... asked if he could search the car I told my friends we had the right to say "no" which they did, he ordered up some drug dogs from his car and we spent the night in jail.

The other time wasn't quite so blatant but still ridiculous. I was pissing in a field, in the dark, and a park ranger drove up and floodlighted me then searched my truck which was parked and locked nearby. I was lucky to get away without an indecent exposure conviction and have to register as a sex offender the rest of my life because the guy was a real sleaze-bag and said I was facing traffic and could be seen from the road.
Which , honestly, was a lie.
He was also talking at length with the cop who came to take me in about a stripper he met that liked to have sex with men in uniform.
classy.


anyways, there are my war stories.
for what they're worth.
hope that didn't veer too far off topic.
:crazy:


--------------------
'Pain is meant to wake us up. People try to hide their pain. But they're wrong. Pain is something to carry, like a radio. You feel your strength in the experience of pain. It's all in how you carry it. That's what matters. Pain is a feeling. Your feelings are a part of you. Your own reality. If you feel ashamed of them, and hide them, you're letting society destroy your reality. You should stand up for your right to feel your pain and leave the Shroomery.' ~ Jim Morrison


Edited by blackegg (01/15/08 11:25 PM)


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: BrAiN]
    #7883224 - 01/15/08 12:30 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

---


Edited by EntheogenicPeace (02/13/21 09:38 AM)


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #7883286 - 01/15/08 12:39 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

Quote:

EntheogenicPeace said:
Yes, the U.S. military is solely used as a force of "freedom" in the world, never to advance the economic interests of a small minority of the world's population.




I'm not talking about what it's CURRENTLY being used for I'm just saying you need an extremely strong defense.

Quote:

When you're far & away the world's largest arms dealer,




I call B.S. on that... every country where we get accused of selling a bunch of crap to fuel a fire going on, Russia/USSR has always sold TONS more than us.

And how the fuck did you jump to Iran? All I said is that countries that are superpowers like us need a strong military to defend ourselves if another hitler comes along. I never said anything about endorsing any kind of regime change. If you've read ANY of my posts over the past year you'd know I'm against that type of policy.

You reek of straw men. With your last post you've successfully won many arguments, arguments that I've never even made. Congrats. You just beat up a straw man. Here's a cookie.


Edited by BrAiN (01/15/08 12:45 PM)


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Offlineblackegg
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: blackegg]
    #7883299 - 01/15/08 12:43 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

"How do you reconcile your support for a "strong military" (i.e. excessive military spending for the purpose of enriching military contractors & companies who benefit by being able to dictate the economics of subjugated nations) with your professed belief in limited government, being as war & militarism are the primary & foremost examples of big government in the world? "

Good point... I should've been more precise about "Big Government".

In addition to what BrAin said, let me say that...
I don't mind a Big Government who takes care of it's citizens, picks people up out of the gutter occasionally and makes sure we aren't being needlessly screwed by monopolies / environmental waste, or terrorists.
Of course some would like to think they're 'taking care' of me by keeping me off 'illegal drugs' and making sure I read my bible every day...

But this is kinda beside the point.
If you want to start another thread about 'People Who SAY They Hate Big Government and Yet Support Big Military' I'll be glad to contribute to it!


:sun:


--------------------
'Pain is meant to wake us up. People try to hide their pain. But they're wrong. Pain is something to carry, like a radio. You feel your strength in the experience of pain. It's all in how you carry it. That's what matters. Pain is a feeling. Your feelings are a part of you. Your own reality. If you feel ashamed of them, and hide them, you're letting society destroy your reality. You should stand up for your right to feel your pain and leave the Shroomery.' ~ Jim Morrison


Edited by blackegg (01/15/08 11:26 PM)


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: blackegg]
    #7883307 - 01/15/08 12:46 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

I totally agree with you... but this entire thread has been full of people putting words in my mouth. I never said anything about a big gov't.

All I said was that we need a strong military for national defense and suddently everyone thinks I'm talking about how we need to invade other countries.

What's wrong with just saying that I want the U.S. to be able to defend it's own people? Why does not wanting to have a nuke detonated in my backyard or an army invading my neighborhood suddenly make me a target for a bunch of people's rants that have nothing to do with anything I'm talking about?

Apprently some people just don't mind being an open target.


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Offlineblackegg
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Re: Republicans = Anti Recreational Drug Laws? [Re: BrAiN]
    #7883331 - 01/15/08 12:51 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

"What's wrong with just saying that I want the U.S. to be able to defend it's own people?"
nothing.

Um..I've started another thread for this "Military Spending" issue ...not that you *have* to use it or anything.
:cheers:


--------------------
'Pain is meant to wake us up. People try to hide their pain. But they're wrong. Pain is something to carry, like a radio. You feel your strength in the experience of pain. It's all in how you carry it. That's what matters. Pain is a feeling. Your feelings are a part of you. Your own reality. If you feel ashamed of them, and hide them, you're letting society destroy your reality. You should stand up for your right to feel your pain and leave the Shroomery.' ~ Jim Morrison


Edited by blackegg (01/15/08 12:58 PM)


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