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TreeMoss
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Registered: 12/05/08
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: SurReality]
#9526129 - 01/01/09 01:20 AM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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Don't let the water freeze, it's called freeze precipitation just because you use the freezer.
The mescaline will precipitate in cold water, darn near ice cold water but it will drop out before the water starts to ice......just check on it periodically.
Mescaline is nearly insoluble in cold water, it must be pretty warm to dissolve.....unless it's very acidic water...then room temp water will dissolve it.
-------------------- Drug chemicals are going to be more abundant and survive longer than any anti-drug agendas. Some of us are just ahead of the game, we already know what the future will understand. Drugs weren't bad but how some people used them were and some people just were bad because they had to be.
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04281969
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9526903 - 01/01/09 10:15 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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In your mind, do you believe that if you confuse people so that the TEK isn't "simple", you are somehow protecting San Pedro and Peruvian Torch so that they will not get banned? I don't get it.
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Don't worry, you can freeze the water. Carefully separate the water from the crystals with the pipette as soon as it thaws.
Edited by 04281969 (01/31/09 01:08 PM)
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TreeMoss
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: 04281969]
#9527027 - 01/01/09 11:07 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Ha, you are quite lame.......seriously, I do believe is is talking about how to get the mescaline out of the water and not away from the xylene.
You can evaporate or you can put it in the freezer and chill it down so crystals form then filter......
Your you can be an asshole like 04281969 and put it up the bung hole as an enema.......I hear that works wonders for DMT!
It always depends on your solvent, chloroform is nice if you can get it and you don't have to precipitate it out of water then.....ya can but it will form crystals out of your solvent as well.
Just put it in the freezer or evaporate.....if you don't water down your solvent it doesn't matter anyway......it can precipitate out of your solvent solution too.
-------------------- Drug chemicals are going to be more abundant and survive longer than any anti-drug agendas. Some of us are just ahead of the game, we already know what the future will understand. Drugs weren't bad but how some people used them were and some people just were bad because they had to be.
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04281969
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527083 - 01/01/09 11:29 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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TreeMoss
I live in a Fox Hole

Registered: 12/05/08
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: 04281969]
#9527097 - 01/01/09 11:34 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
04281969 said:
Ya, there is someone to idolize and quote; biggest loser in a movie ever.
-------------------- Drug chemicals are going to be more abundant and survive longer than any anti-drug agendas. Some of us are just ahead of the game, we already know what the future will understand. Drugs weren't bad but how some people used them were and some people just were bad because they had to be.
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Entropymancer

Registered: 07/16/05
Posts: 10,207
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527102 - 01/01/09 11:37 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
TreeMoss said: It always depends on your solvent, chloroform is nice if you can get it and you don't have to precipitate it out of water then.....ya can but it will form crystals out of your solvent as well.
if you don't water down your solvent it doesn't matter anyway......it can precipitate out of your solvent solution too.
You seriously have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. At all. So stop spreading misinformation, please.
You will not be able to precipitate crystals of mescaline out of chloroform, xylene, or any other nonpolar solvent. Because mescaline freebase isn't a fucking crystal; it's a liquid. That's why you have to salt it.
And if you're talking about precipitating it with other acids that have a very low volume of water, that has fuck-all to do with this thread, which is about extracting mescaline citrate. If you want to talk about alternate salts and salting procedures, there are threads for that, or you could create a new one.
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TreeMoss
I live in a Fox Hole

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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: Entropymancer]
#9527109 - 01/01/09 11:40 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
Entropymancer said:
Quote:
TreeMoss said: It always depends on your solvent, chloroform is nice if you can get it and you don't have to precipitate it out of water then.....ya can but it will form crystals out of your solvent as well.
if you don't water down your solvent it doesn't matter anyway......it can precipitate out of your solvent solution too.
You seriously have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. At all. So stop spreading misinformation, please.
You will not be able to precipitate crystals of mescaline out of chloroform, xylene, or any other nonpolar solvent. Because mescaline freebase isn't a fucking crystal; it's a liquid. That's why you have to salt it.
Really, then how does cocaine base preciptate out of water and cocaine HCL preciptate out of solvents? MMmkay
Maybe your used to evaporating and not filtering, is that it kiddies?
-------------------- Drug chemicals are going to be more abundant and survive longer than any anti-drug agendas. Some of us are just ahead of the game, we already know what the future will understand. Drugs weren't bad but how some people used them were and some people just were bad because they had to be.
Edited by TreeMoss (01/01/09 11:41 AM)
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TreeMoss
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527126 - 01/01/09 11:47 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Obviously we know that a solvent will dissolve and suspend in a solution bases........but when we precipitate it is because it is falling out of solution.....no longer being suspended because an acid was introduced.....thus this is called precipitation.
Now if you have a solution in a polar solvent, like water; then when you add a base you will preciptate since your solution is no longer basic.
But then there are some chemicals that will FREEZE PRECIPITATE, which means you don't need to make a polar solution that is acidic basic to precipitate what you will.......you can freeze it like DMT napatha, so crystals form and precipitate without making the DMT salt.
We know that the mescaline is the oil in the non-polar solvent, but you don't have to add large amounts of water during the salting.....you can add concentrated sulfuric acid to precipitate and gather crystals......if you do add citric acid ADD NO MORE WATER THAN NEEDED TO DISSOLVE THE CITRIC ACID CRYSTALS........
If you do add a lot of water, and then are FORCED to separate your layers of solvent away from your precious alkaloid rich salted out water......then you have to freeze precipitate, or evaporate; because your only option other than that (easy options) is to make it basic again and be left with an oil.......which can be salted but it is inefficient to do that.
-------------------- Drug chemicals are going to be more abundant and survive longer than any anti-drug agendas. Some of us are just ahead of the game, we already know what the future will understand. Drugs weren't bad but how some people used them were and some people just were bad because they had to be.
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04281969
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527127 - 01/01/09 11:48 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
TreeMoss said:
Quote:
04281969 said:
Ya, there is someone to idolize and quote; biggest loser in a movie ever.
I'm just trying to find someone you can relate to. Seriously though, would you please stop? You have a lot more to learn before you start mouthing off like that. You're not helping.
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TreeMoss
I live in a Fox Hole

Registered: 12/05/08
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527138 - 01/01/09 11:51 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Serously, make it easy and don't freeze your layer of water to pour of the xylene.........get a sep funnel for about 65 bucks (a nice 2000ml one) so you can make sure that you get all xylol away from the water....
If you add a concentrated acid to your solvent, you will see crystals form as that drop goes in.....these crystals will form on the sides of your glass and drop to the bottom......there shouldn't be much water if it's a very concentrated solution.......filter and dry then enjoy!
-------------------- Drug chemicals are going to be more abundant and survive longer than any anti-drug agendas. Some of us are just ahead of the game, we already know what the future will understand. Drugs weren't bad but how some people used them were and some people just were bad because they had to be.
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04281969
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527140 - 01/01/09 11:51 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
TreeMoss said: Obviously we know that a solvent will dissolve and suspend in a solution bases........but when we precipitate it is because it is falling out of solution.....no longer being suspended because an acid was introduced.....thus this is called precipitation.
Now if you have a solution in a polar solvent, like water; then when you add a base you will preciptate since your solution is no longer basic.
But then there are some chemicals that will FREEZE PRECIPITATE, which means you don't need to make a polar solution that is acidic basic to precipitate what you will.......you can freeze it like DMT napatha, so crystals form and precipitate without making the DMT salt.
We know that the mescaline is the oil in the non-polar solvent, but you don't have to add large amounts of water during the salting.....you can add concentrated sulfuric acid to precipitate and gather crystals......if you do add citric acid ADD NO MORE WATER THAN NEEDED TO DISSOLVE THE CITRIC ACID CRYSTALS........
If you do add a lot of water, and then are FORCED to separate your layers of solvent away from your precious alkaloid rich salted out water......then you have to freeze precipitate, or evaporate; because your only option other than that (easy options) is to make it basic again and be left with an oil.......which can be salted but it is inefficient to do that.
Wow.
Seriously.
Shut the fuck up.
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04281969
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527147 - 01/01/09 11:54 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
TreeMoss said: Serously, make it easy and don't freeze your layer of water to pour of the xylene.........get a sep funnel for about 65 bucks (a nice 2000ml one) so you can make sure that you get all xylol away from the water....
If you add a concentrated acid to your solvent, you will see crystals form as that drop goes in.....these crystals will form on the sides of your glass and drop to the bottom......there shouldn't be much water if it's a very concentrated solution.......filter and dry then enjoy!
No. Crystals start forming in the water. If you put that into the sep funnel, the water will pass out, but the crystals will hold up. Then they will be redissolved into the xylene as it passes.
Ideally you want to remove the water from the bottom of the xylene jar with a long pipette. Then freeze only the water collection jar.
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TreeMoss
I live in a Fox Hole

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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: 04281969]
#9527152 - 01/01/09 11:55 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
04281969 said:
Quote:
TreeMoss said:
Quote:
04281969 said:
Ya, there is someone to idolize and quote; biggest loser in a movie ever.
I'm just trying to find someone you can relate to. Seriously though, would you please stop? You have a lot more to learn before you start mouthing off like that. You're not helping.
I am giving good info, very correct information and your just tired of being a loser because you dressed like that in the eighties.......I am not going to relate to something that you were attracted to.......other than some of the things people are doing here.
I have very valid information concurred through several sources, precipitating out of the solvent is the preferred method.
Why don't you read why I wrote before being a smart ass......you haven't told him/her how to do anything yet.
-------------------- Drug chemicals are going to be more abundant and survive longer than any anti-drug agendas. Some of us are just ahead of the game, we already know what the future will understand. Drugs weren't bad but how some people used them were and some people just were bad because they had to be.
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TreeMoss
I live in a Fox Hole

Registered: 12/05/08
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Last seen: 15 years, 5 days
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527164 - 01/01/09 11:58 AM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Man, you are dumb as fuck
NON_POLAR SOLVENTS will not dissolve salts.......only polar solvents
God man, you are a fucking retard........Jesus fucking Christ,
Non-polar solvents dissolve bases, that is why SALTS SNOW/PRECIPITATE OUT
Polar solvents dissolve salts, THAT IS WHY BASES SNOW/PRECIPITATE OUT
YOU ARE FUCKING RETARDED AND ARE GIVING THE WORST INFORMATION, HOW HAVE YOU EVER MADE SOMETHING ACTUALLY PRECIPITATE??????????????????????????
-------------------- Drug chemicals are going to be more abundant and survive longer than any anti-drug agendas. Some of us are just ahead of the game, we already know what the future will understand. Drugs weren't bad but how some people used them were and some people just were bad because they had to be.
Edited by TreeMoss (01/01/09 12:03 PM)
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Entropymancer

Registered: 07/16/05
Posts: 10,207
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527181 - 01/01/09 12:04 PM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Seriously treemoss, why don't you just shut your piehole already? I'm known for being helpful without being a dick to people asking noob questions, but it pisses me off when a noob with rudimentary (and often incorrect) knowledge mouths off with boatloads of misinformation.
Quote:
Quote:
You will not be able to precipitate crystals of mescaline out of chloroform, xylene, or any other nonpolar solvent. Because mescaline freebase isn't a fucking crystal; it's a liquid. That's why you have to salt it.
Really, then how does cocaine base preciptate out of water and cocaine HCL preciptate out of solvents? MMmkay
Maybe your used to evaporating and not filtering, is that it kiddies?
Cocaine isn't mescaline. In case you missed that, let me repeat for emphasis, cocaine ISN'T mescaline.
Cocaine freebase (which does occur as a solid) will precipitate out of alkaline water because the water deprotonates the cocaine cation, making it a neutral molecule with poor solubility in water.
Mescaline freebase does not occur as a solid, as I said before, it's a liquid. It might form a seperate phase if a mescaline salt is dissolved in a little water and the solution is made alkaline, but it will not precipitate, becaus eit's not a fucking solid.
Cocaine HCl precipitates out of nonpolar solvents when you gas the solvent with HCl gas. The same would work for mescaline. But we're talking about forming mescaline citrate here, and I'm not aware of any way to get mescaline citrate without using a citric acid solution to extract from the nonpolar solvent.
Quote:
TreeMoss said: Serously, make it easy and don't freeze your layer of water to pour of the xylene.........get a sep funnel for about 65 bucks (a nice 2000ml one) so you can make sure that you get all xylol away from the water....

That's fucking retarded. Seriously.
Xylene is very slightly miscible with water. No matter how you seperate the phases, there will be enough xylene in the water to give it a funky smell.
Once again, learn what you're talking about before mouthing off like you know what's up.
Quote:
If you add a concentrated acid to your solvent, you will see crystals form as that drop goes in.....these crystals will form on the sides of your glass and drop to the bottom......there shouldn't be much water if it's a very concentrated solution.......filter and dry then enjoy!
And this has what to do with citrate salts?
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04281969
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527194 - 01/01/09 12:07 PM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Good luck with that. I'll look for your TEK on mescaline freebase separation.
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TreeMoss
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: 04281969]
#9527212 - 01/01/09 12:17 PM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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No you don't need to gas to form cocaine salts, just have solvent B be acidic.
I know that mescaline base is an oil, I typed that if you would of read; ya know actually read.....let me repeat that; actually read.
I was referring to getting the water away from the solvent to keep the solvent..........
make cactus tea Make cactus tea basic in a jug with xylol or chloroform or ether separate solvent that is now your basic carrier for the alkaloids Salt the freaking solvent and WATCH YOUR CRYSTALS DROP OUT!
and how is something "very slightly", you just mean slightly.
I'm not disagreeing with you that you can't separate a layer of water from the solvent and the alkaloids to be salted in there. This whole your an idiot, I'm an idiot; we are all idiots started from the person asking a question.....about A: how to get the solvent away from the water.......B: how to freeze precipitate the crystals out of the water without evaporating.
All I know is that every tek, refers to precipitating out of a non-polar solvent........although some people do enjoy having a less pure product by evaporating the polar solvent.....and yes some of the citric acid extractions have evaporated some damn fine crystals.
Evaporating just isn't the cleanest way to form a crystal, but some have pulled it off nicely.
And ya you fucking jack ass, how wouldn't I know that mescaline isn't cocaine........that is just a stupid insult.....apparently to your own judgment of what a good insult can be, you must be surrounded by nit wits if that kind of thought is even applicable to your life.
-------------------- Drug chemicals are going to be more abundant and survive longer than any anti-drug agendas. Some of us are just ahead of the game, we already know what the future will understand. Drugs weren't bad but how some people used them were and some people just were bad because they had to be.
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04281969
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527218 - 01/01/09 12:18 PM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
TreeMoss said: Man, you are dumb as fuck
NON_POLAR SOLVENTS will not dissolve salts.......only polar solvents
God man, you are a fucking retard........Jesus fucking Christ,
Non-polar solvents dissolve bases, that is why SALTS SNOW/PRECIPITATE OUT
Polar solvents dissolve salts, THAT IS WHY BASES SNOW/PRECIPITATE OUT
YOU ARE FUCKING RETARDED AND ARE GIVING THE WORST INFORMATION, HOW HAVE YOU EVER MADE SOMETHING ACTUALLY PRECIPITATE??????????????????????????
I shouldn't bother.
But when you have an aqueous layer with crystals under a basic or neutral xylene layer in a separatory funnel, then drain out the water from the bottom, you will be left with mescaline citrate crystals in the valve and sitting in basic or neutral xylene. Even if you can pass the xylene through the crystals without dissolving them into the xylene again, they will be covered with stinky xylene. And you STILL need to get them out of the sep. funnel. Now what? Warm distilled water? Good idea. This is not the way you want to do this procedure.
You've said that all of your information is theoretical. You can not question my experience without discounting your own.
Edited by 04281969 (01/31/09 01:21 PM)
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TreeMoss
I live in a Fox Hole

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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: 04281969]
#9527247 - 01/01/09 12:27 PM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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With your experience your being a little rash about things. Your forgetting that people need to establish a theory before having it "simply work out".
I know a salt can dissolve in xylene if it's basic....which means it's not a salt anymore.........and your not going to have crystals in room temp water......cold cold water but not warm water......people aren't gong to know that stuff with your experience not being detailed enough...they need to know the theory before the practice.
It must be crappy xylol, it should evaporate........you could do what I said about freeze precipitating then filtering then redissolving in warm water and keep doing that........you will lose that xylol smell, plus filtering through some activated carbon when you filter your solution of warm mescaline water should help speed things up when cleaning/purifying.
If you can get chloroform or ether (chloroform sinks under water), those would be better than a industrial xylol....that is where a lot of the crap is coming from with smells......and ya I know that some is just the chemical itself.
-------------------- Drug chemicals are going to be more abundant and survive longer than any anti-drug agendas. Some of us are just ahead of the game, we already know what the future will understand. Drugs weren't bad but how some people used them were and some people just were bad because they had to be.
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Entropymancer

Registered: 07/16/05
Posts: 10,207
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Re: Easy Three Step Mescaline Citrate [Re: TreeMoss]
#9527259 - 01/01/09 12:30 PM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
TreeMoss said: how is something "very slightly", you just mean slightly.
No, I meant very slightly. That refers to a degree of miscibility that is noticeably less than slightly 
Quote:
All I know is that every tek, refers to precipitating out of a non-polar solvent
You mean every tek for cocaine extractions. Once again (and this may come as a shock), cocaine isn't mescaline.
It's not necessarily common that an alkaloid can be salted out of a nonpolar solvent with a concentrated acid. Typically, the equilibria are such that the salt is soluble in the small amount of water that entered the system with the acid. That's why the most common method of salting from a nonpolar solvent (in the lab) is to gas it with HCl, so you don't introduce any water to the system.
It might be possible to get mescaline citrate to precipitate from xylene with a saturated solution of citric acid. I think you'd probably have more luck trying to drip in a saturated solution of citric acid in acetone though, so you're not introducing water. But I know this has been tried unsuccessfully with fumaric acid... xylene may just be a poor crystallization environment for mescaline citrate.
But until you've tried it and can confirm that either of these methods work, how can you recommend that as the preferred route?
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