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Shop: North Spore Cultivation Supplies   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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InvisibleIcelander
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There but for the grace of G_d go I
    #7865022 - 01/11/08 01:22 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

Nihilism is the situation obtained when one comes to the realization that beyond the linguistic world, there lies nothing but chaos and disorder. The world as it is, seperate from humans, exists in a state of continual conflict and flux (says the nihilist), and any order imposed upon this situation is necessarily artificial. There is only one "meaningful" option open to humans, however, and this option is to impose order upon the world. Language is the means by which humans impose order upon the actions that appear to occur in the world. The bringing together of art and action is a dangerous balancing act which severely contrasts "man, the creator" with "man, the impotent being." It is this contrast between empowerment and dissolution which characterizes the heroic figure and which lies at the heart of tragedy.

Now in this arena of "truth" I'm just another speculator. But I was thinking about the above in relation to life experience. Lets say for instance that you had a lovely lady and a nice house and swimming pool and a good job (for some part at least) and you also had a philosophy about meaning that you considered proof that there was a positive, loving, interested (in you) creative force controlling the Universe. Now lets say you were born in Africa to a women with Aids and you had no food an there was warfare all around you. Do you think you might see things in a different light?

Sometimes I think most of our philosophy is a product of our circumstance rather than any "truth" we may intuit.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: There but for the grace of G_d go I [Re: Icelander]
    #7865067 - 01/11/08 01:34 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Do you think you might see things in a different light?





Same Sun... different continent.

Quote:


Sometimes I think most of our philosophy is a product of our circumstance rather than any "truth" we may intuit.




Of course. And that is why it is called, "Philosophy"... not, "Science".

Nihilism is a great way to teach a human to let go. Very much like Taoism... indeed. Both paths eventually help one turn Spirituality into an awesome compromise... rather than a Magical/Mystical experience.


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Fiddlesticks.



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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: There but for the grace of G_d go I [Re: Rose]
    #7865086 - 01/11/08 01:37 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

I agree indeed.:thumbup:(for now:lol:)


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (01/11/08 01:38 PM)


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InvisibleEternalCowabunga
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Re: There but for the grace of G_d go I [Re: Icelander]
    #7865268 - 01/11/08 02:19 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

Your post inspired me to dig out my copy of Sartre's "existentialism and humanism". Heidegger's philosophy is not so different than Nietzsche's:

Heidegger knows, as did Kierkegaard, the intensity of man's anxiety to feel and know that he exists, and that this is the root of all his anxieties. If - as phenomenology demonstrates - we do not know objects, nor do we know ourselves the subjects, if we know only phenomena which are the transitory and contingent products of the inter-action of these two "unknowns" - then, to be born into this life is to find oneself pitched into the drift of phenomena, "abandoned," - "responsible" for our existence and yet ever more clearly realising to our "anguish" that the whole is meaningless.

In the remedy proposed by Heidegger, there is a somewhat Neitzschean flavour. The only hope for man lies in his full realisation and acceptance of the truth 'that these things are not otherwise but thus.' And although his personal fate is simply to perish, he can triumph over it by inventing "purposes," "projects," which will themselves confer meaning both upon himself and upon the world of objects - all meaningless otherwise and in themselves.

There is indeed no reason why a man should do this, and he gets nothing by it except the authentic knowledge that he exists; but that precisely is his great, his transcendent need and desire. Not many are capable thus of authenticating their existence: the great majority reassure themselves by thinking as little as possible of their approaching deaths and by worshipping idols such as humanity, science, or some objective divinity


I like existentialism, even though I think it should only be used as a stepping stone to more "creative" philosophies and it would be foolish to close one's account of reality based on these ideas. It is in fact a philosophy which may allow us to destroy our current frame in order to create a better one.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: There but for the grace of G_d go I [Re: EternalCowabunga]
    #7865300 - 01/11/08 02:27 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

Yes. Good post:thumbup:

I just posted this on another thread and I think it applies.


Things fall apart. This is natures way. This is hard for us to take. It speaks of death and loss. We are dreamers for the most part I believe. Our dreams are made up of our hopes and fears and we project them out onto the tapestry of our lives and the world we see. Really we want to succeed and find a happy ending and keep on doing pleasurable things forever. And if things aren't pleasurable right now we think that given time they will be.

This just isn't natures way in the material world. Death and decay are the natural consequences of life and energy. It's all yin and yang, creation and destruction. I think one thing that really scares many of us is the thought that that is all there is to the game and no one is looking down on us and out for us and we will soon meet the common fate and be gone forever and all those hopes and dreams will come to naught.

To survive this Carlos Castaneda (and others although IMO not so poignantly) created the idea of the warriors way. It's the only way to look into all this and survive the sight according to him and I agree. One has to create a new paradigm (shields) to survive outside of the programming of culture. If humanity is ever to really change emotionally, then IMO we will have to deal effectively and positively with death.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: There but for the grace of G_d go I [Re: Icelander]
    #7865551 - 01/11/08 03:28 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

Do you think you might see things in a different light?





Of course! Why are most purchasers of "Create your own reality" type (and other) New Age books bought by bored middle-class westerners instead of the poor third-worlders that could really use them if they contained anything of value?

Perhaps instead of irrigation and water purification equipment and food, we should distribute copies of "The Secret" to the downtrodden...


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: There but for the grace of G_d go I [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7865660 - 01/11/08 04:01 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

I think you're right.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: There but for the grace of G_d go I [Re: Icelander]
    #7865673 - 01/11/08 04:05 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

What else is new? :yawn:


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