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Diploid
Cuban



Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again
#7859814 - 01/10/08 02:22 PM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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Catholic governor of Washington state Christine Gregoire has come out against the state's Assisted Suicide Initiative. Why must these people ALWAYS push their morality on the rest of us? They just can't grasp the concept of minding their own business.
In essence, she says below that she loves her ill friend, but she'd rather see him continue to suffer Parkinson's than to let him move on. And since God is involved, there is absolutely no reasoning with her.
I don't even understand why we have to go out of our way to make assisted suicide legal. It should be legal by default.
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Several groups, representing medical physicians to people with disabilities, are voicing strong opposition against an initiative filed Wednesday by a former Washington governor that would make the state the second in the nation to legalize assisted suicide.
Under the "Washington Death with Dignity Initiative," launched by former Gov. Booth Gardner, Washington residents who have less than six months to live would be able to request from a doctor a prescription of legal drugs to end their life.
Backers of the measure have until July to collect about 225,000 from state residents to put the issue on the November 2008 ballot.
Gardner, 71, who has Parkinson's disease, modeled the initiative after Oregon's assisted suicide law. He said he still supports the measure even though it would not apply to his non-fatal condition.
"This is something we should do. We should have done it a long time ago," Gardner said last week, according to the Seattle Times. "It's the right thing to do - it's the Christian thing to do."
But opposition against the measure has been mounting, beginning with Gov. Chris Gregoire, who is a friend to Gardner.
"I love my friend Booth Gardner, and my heart goes out to his condition and what he's had to face," Gregoire, who choked up briefly before speaking, told reporters Tuesday.
"I pray every day that we'll find a cure. But I find it on a personal level very, very difficult to support assisted suicide."
A counter campaign to the initiative, Coalition Against Assisted Suicide, has also formed. Backed by Democratic state Sen. Margarita Prentice, a former nurse, the coalition consists of people with disabilities, doctors, nurses, hospice workers, minority persons and religious groups.
Duane French, the spokesman for the group, is concerned that the assisted suicide law would pressure sick and disabled people who see their condition as too great a hardship or economic burden for relatives.
“The judgment of people with a terminal illness is often clouded by depression," added French, who is a quadriplegic. "Assisting people at their most vulnerable point to end their lives is not compassion, it’s negligence.”
Joelle Brouner of the disability-rights group Not Dead Yet, a coalition member, also chimed in on the debate, reported the Associated Press.
"I think it's a mistake for the people of Washington to accept death as a progressive health care policy."
The effort led by Gardner is not the first time the issue of assisted suicide was presented before the state. In 1991, Washington voters rejected a similar initiative.
One major change in the recent measure is that the patient requesting the lethal prescription must self-administer the drugs. Other "safeguards" in the new proposal require witnesses to the patient's both oral and written requests and a two-day waiting period following the final written request before the prescription could be dispensed.
Opponents also said the measure is a slippery slope to euthanasia and would actually remove, not grant, ethical safeguards for patients, pointing to the case in the Netherlands.
"Published medical studies reveal that Dutch doctors administer lethal injections to roughly a thousand patients a year who never consent to their deaths. That's autonomy for doctors – not for patients," commented Dr. David Stevens, CEO of Christian Medical Association.
"The answer to patients suffering at the end of life is not to kill them, but to provide aggressive and appropriate relief from pain, compassionate counsel and unconditional love," he added.
The American Medical Association also opposes assisted suicide, according to AP.
Last year, pro-life advocates were successful in stopping assisted suicide in California, Hawaii, and Vermont.
"The leading champion of assisted suicide, Dr. Jack Kevorkian, taught us that keeping assisted suicide illegal is the only true 'safeguard' against abuse," said French.
christianpost.com
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Diploid]
#7859853 - 01/10/08 02:28 PM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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I believe my state has the only functioning assisted suicide law.
I can only recommend taking things into your own hands whenever possible.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Philanthropist
Savior ofMankind

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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Icelander]
#7859896 - 01/10/08 02:35 PM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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I concur.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Icelander]
#7860001 - 01/10/08 02:55 PM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
I can only recommend taking things into your own hands whenever possible.
I thought we were talking about suicide?
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Veritas


Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7860009 - 01/10/08 02:57 PM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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Go out with a bang?
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Diploid
Cuban



Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Veritas]
#7860067 - 01/10/08 03:09 PM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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Cum on you two. This was supposed to be a serious thread!
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Cracka_X
Spiritual Dirt Worshipper




Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 8,808
Loc: Swamp
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Diploid]
#7862113 - 01/10/08 09:55 PM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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Dr Kevorkian is giving a talk on my campus Monday. Kinda excited to see him.
-------------------- The best way to live is to be like water For water benefits all things and goes against none of them It provides for all people and even cleanses those places a man is loath to go In this way it is just like Tao ~Daodejing
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Diploid]
#7863667 - 01/11/08 05:30 AM (16 years, 21 days ago) |
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> I don't even understand why we have to go out of our way to make assisted suicide legal.
I understand the need for regulation. There is too much potential for abuse otherwise. However, "assisted suicide" should not be illegal.
> Why must these people ALWAYS push their morality on the rest of us?
Because it justifies their faith.
*sigh*
I don't own myself; instead, the government owns me. I'm not allowed to consume whatever I want. I'm not allowed to die whenever I want. I'm not allowed to look at whatever I want. In many places, I'm not even allowed to think whatever I want.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Seuss]
#7863720 - 01/11/08 06:10 AM (16 years, 21 days ago) |
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If only you caught a boat over to the "Land of the Free"...
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Icelander]
#7863768 - 01/11/08 06:34 AM (16 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
I believe my state has the only functioning assisted suicide law.
What if you want your neighbor or irritating relative to commit suicide....is it alright to "assist" them? If so then this could be a useful law...
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
#7863790 - 01/11/08 06:43 AM (16 years, 21 days ago) |
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> What if you want your neighbor or irritating relative to commit suicide
I assume you are speaking towards murder rather than suicide...
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Seuss]
#7863838 - 01/11/08 07:05 AM (16 years, 21 days ago) |
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Murder...suicide....it is better to not worry to deeply about the meaning of words.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
#7864141 - 01/11/08 09:44 AM (16 years, 21 days ago) |
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Spoken from the heart of Kentucky.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Icelander]
#7864152 - 01/11/08 09:48 AM (16 years, 21 days ago) |
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Your the one who told me that following dictionary definitions was surrendering to your social programming.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
#7864169 - 01/11/08 09:52 AM (16 years, 21 days ago) |
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No I didn't say that. I did however acknowledge that just because a word is defined in the dictionary does not mean that definition is correct.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Icelander]
#7864215 - 01/11/08 10:06 AM (16 years, 21 days ago) |
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I don't know how else we define words. Are you Humpty Dumpty with the ability to pay words to mean what you want?
Quote:
'When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said, in a rather scornful tone,' it means just what I choose it to mean, neither more nor less.'
'The question is,' said Alice, 'whether you can make words mean so many different things.'
'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master - that's all.'
Alice was too much puzzled to say anything; so after a minute Humpty Dumpty began again. 'They've a temper, some of them - particularly verbs: they're the proudest - adjectives you can do anything with, but not verbs - however, I can manage the whole lot of them! Impenetrability! That's what I say!'
'Would you tell me, please,' said Alice, 'what that means?'
'Now you talk like a reasonable child,' said Humpty Dumpty, looking very much pleased. 'I meant by "impenetrability" that we've had enough of that subject, and it would be just as well if you'd mention what you mean to do next, as I suppose you don't mean to stop here all the rest of your life.'
'That's a great deal to make one word mean,' Alice said in a thoughtful tone.
'When I make a word do a lot of work like that,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'I always pay it extra.'
'Oh!' said Alice. She was too much puzzled to make any other remark.
'Ah, you should see 'em come round me of a Saturday night,' Humpty Dumpty went on, wagging his head gravely from side to side, 'for to get their wages, you know.' -- Lewis Carroll
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Religious People Pushing Their Shit On Us... Again [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
#7864253 - 01/11/08 10:15 AM (16 years, 21 days ago) |
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For example in another thread there was a dictionary definition of enlightenment that stated it was freedom from desire.
This is blatantly impossible IMO. They should have said "freedom from attachment".
They were just ignorant is all.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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