Home | Community | Message Board


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore Bulk Substrate   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | Next >  [ show all ]
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting.
    #7859017 - 01/10/08 11:56 AM (16 years, 22 days ago)

I did a search and it seems most people ask, "perlite, or ultra-sonic", without much discussion on using both.

The most common issue with perlite that people report is not enough humidity.

Most perlite FCs require misting, which means you have to remove the lid of your FC and drop the Rh by 20 points or more, all in the name of restoring moisture to the casing layer.

My foaf suggests tubing an ultra on a timer into your FC, to mist without removing the lid, and to restore moisture content to the casing layer and the perlite, which will absorb any excess moisture, provided it is damp and well drained to begin with.

Ideally, the ultra would be ran though a humidistat that turns it on at 92% Rh, and then off again at 99%, such units exist, but are a little expensive.


--------------------
www.groworganic.com
Get 350lbs shipped to your door for only $100!
www.mycosupply.com
Online Organic Rye Berries
www.hydroponics.net/i/200002
The Cyclestat 4P, a great repeat cycle timer made in the USA.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblezyxwvutsr
rstuvwxyz


Registered: 12/30/07
Posts: 141
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7859051 - 01/10/08 12:01 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

so what is your question? Like, what are you wanting to know, can you use them both? or are you asking for suggestions on getting this to work?

if the latter, try your perlite with small holes toward the bottom stuffed with polyfill for air exchange. not too big or you will lose RH.

Not enough humidity with just perlite? answer: more surface area


--------------------
Cube Growth Parameters


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblesimplemachine
Manfly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/14/03
Posts: 1,981
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7859081 - 01/10/08 12:06 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

I think if you're going to put that much work into your setup, you might as well go for a greenhouse/martha.

I say this because...

1. There is no need to run tubing, therefore, construction is simpler, faster, and less prone to malfunction. An impeller humidifier inside the GH will take care of FAE and humidity.

2. I hate perlite. It covers everything in its sticky, wet, whiteness, and I won't have it in my house.

3. You can fit a good deal more substrate into the GH with less time and effort on construction and more focus on the mycology.


Thats just my 2 cents.


--------------------
     


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: simplemachine]
    #7859111 - 01/10/08 12:12 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

All true, but Marthas are larger, FCs are small and portable, so yes, I agree, ideally there is a greenhouse with a Cool Mist and an Ultra, but when there is not, and a 176 quart FC Shotgun FC is.

Windchaser builds an ultra that is so easy to tube it's not even funny.

Isn't a Cool Mist preferred in a Martha/greenhouse?

All I am saying is that an Ultra tubed into a Shotgun Fc with perlite, can balance the Rh and provide that little extra boost most perlite users are after.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRoadkillM
Retired Shroomery Mod
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/11/01
Posts: 22,674
Loc: Montana
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7859119 - 01/10/08 12:14 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

for what?

casings or cakes?


~


--------------------
Laterz, Road

Who the hell you callin crazy?
You wouldn't know what crazy was if Charles Manson was eating froot loops on your front porch!


Brainiac said:
PM the names with on there names, that means they have mushrooms for sale.



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblesimplemachine
Manfly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/14/03
Posts: 1,981
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7859142 - 01/10/08 12:18 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

All I am saying is that an Ultra tubed into a Shotgun Fc with perlite, can balance the Rh and provide that little extra boost most perlite users are after.




Probably true, but I can't say I've tried.

Quote:

Isn't a Cool Mist preferred in a Martha/greenhouse?




A "cool mist impeller" is all I use, no ultrasonic. I've never seen one labeled "cool mist ultrasonic," but I've never looked for one, either.


--------------------
     


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Roadkill]
    #7859225 - 01/10/08 12:31 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

Roadkill said:
for what?

casings or cakes?


~




For use with trays of cased substrate.

And you seem to agree, that to call it a casing is easier than to call it a cased substrate.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineRogerRabbitM
Bans for Pleasure
Male User Gallery


Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 11 months, 3 days
Trusted Cultivator
OG Cultivator
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7859372 - 01/10/08 01:07 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Raising the humidity to 99% with an ultrasonic would not add moisture to the cake, casing layer, or perlite. Besides, perlite alone would give 95% to 99%. Don't confuse humidity in the air with added liquid moisture to the cake or perlite. Even at 100% humidity, you wouldn't be adding moisture to your project, you would only be slowing down the rate of evaporation.
RR


--------------------
Download Let's Grow Mushrooms



semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #7859481 - 01/10/08 01:25 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Okay, but you do advocate misting right?

Is it better to use a spray bottle to mist, or an ultra sonic to mist, assuming you used the same amount of water.

How does misting a casing layer with an ultra not add moisture to the casing layer?

If you misted perlite with an ultra, you are saying it won't pick-up any of that mist huh?

So you are saying that you cannot add moisture to a FC with an ultra, that the water vapor is not good in a FC, and it will not soak into any surface that is dry.

"Raising the humidity to 99% with an ultrasonic would not add moisture to the cake, casing layer, or perlite"
RR

So how do you add moisture? A spray bottle?

INDIRECT misting is good. BUMP UP your FAE.
-Agar 02/22/06

Once you have your pins set misting does not hurt them just like nature friend I always use a very fine mist from a pump-up misting bottle ($6) If ya don't have one of those and you really should then like DrewBaccA said mist above the cakes so only the fine mist soaks them,I've never had a problem (with misting) myself unless over watered but different strokes for different folks! Not misting the casings IMHO is very bad, your casings aren't going to wick the moisture needed to keep the substrate from drying let alone the massive amounts of water mushrooms require to mature.
-Hyphae 08/05/04

Misting will not abort pins. Leaving the pins wet in stale air after misting will cause them to abort. Set your mister for a very fine mist, then spray up into the air so the mist falls gently on the pins/substrate. Mist only if they're drying out, otherwise just let them grow. Be sure to fan well or otherwise up the air exchange until the moisture either soaks into the pins or evaporates off.
-RR 05/12/06

An ultrasonic is never necessary, just better to use than a spray bottle for misting, that's all.
-Monstermitch 10/29/06

"Magash--do you need a cool mist AND an ultrasonic for FAE? Can you get away with just using the ultrasonic and fanning?"
For best results I'd use both.
-Magash 09/21/05

I have my casings in a greenhouse with a cool mist and I still mist at least once a day sometimes more,I never let them get to dry and it works for me,Pull them out mist,fan and put them back,easy as pie as long as you don't mist to the point where there is water pooling you are fine
-Blutjager 10/23/06


A light, gentle misting won't harm the pins. Light and gentle! My friend has tried tap water, spring water, distilled water and all of the above with H2O2 with no noticeable difference. He's settled on a 10% mix by volume of tap water and 3% H2O2 with good results.
-Diploid 04/01/03



Edited by Captain Cubensis (01/10/08 01:50 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineNibin
Getting there
Male User Gallery


Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 4,480
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7859587 - 01/10/08 01:45 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

Captain Cubensis said:
Okay, but you do advocate misting right?

Is it better to use a spray bottle to mist, or an ultra sonic to mist, assuming you used the same amount of water.

How does misting a casing layer with an ultra not add moisture to the casing layer?

If you misted perlite with an ultra, you are saying it won't pick-up any of that mist huh?

So you are saying that you cannot add moisture to a FC with an ultra, that the water vapor is not good in a FC, and it will not soak into any surface that is dry.

"Raising the humidity to 99% with an ultrasonic would not add moisture to the cake, casing layer, or perlite"
RR

So how do you add moisture? A spray bottle?




If the water in the air doesn't condensate, it won't be absorbed.

To add water to a casing layer or substrate you should physically wet it by misting it with, ideally a pump spray bottle as they make finer drops.


--------------------
Newcomers guide-----> For all things shroomy


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Nibin]
    #7859631 - 01/10/08 01:51 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

Nibin said:

So how do you add moisture? A spray bottle?




If the water in the air doesn't condensate, it won't be absorbed.

To add water to a casing layer or substrate you should physically wet it by misting it with, ideally a pump spray bottle as they make finer drops.




Are you saying a pump spray bottle produces finer droplets then an ultra sonic?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineNibin
Getting there
Male User Gallery


Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 4,480
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7859664 - 01/10/08 01:56 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

Captain Cubensis said:
Quote:

Nibin said:

So how do you add moisture? A spray bottle?




If the water in the air doesn't condensate, it won't be absorbed.

To add water to a casing layer or substrate you should physically wet it by misting it with, ideally a pump spray bottle as they make finer drops.




Are you saying a pump spray bottle produces finer droplets then an ultra sonic?




No, I'm saying that an ultrasonic produces droplets so fine they are too fine. Ever walk through mist or fog? Did you get sopping wet? No.
Maybe a little bit damp but nothing much.

Noy spray yourself with the pump spray bottle. Notice the difference? You are wet.

You need to wet the substrate and casing layer.


--------------------
Newcomers guide-----> For all things shroomy


Edited by Nibin (01/10/08 01:57 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Nibin]
    #7859713 - 01/10/08 02:05 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Run an ultra in a FC for 10 minutes and every surface will be lightly wet to the touch, or misted one might say.

In 20-30 minutes you are condensing droplets all over.

You are saying that the water droplets from an ultra are too fine huh?

Too fine for what? Condensing? Then surely you have never had an ultra.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineNibin
Getting there
Male User Gallery


Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 4,480
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7859757 - 01/10/08 02:11 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Too fine to directly wet the cake. I already mentioned condensation above.

You really enjoy arguing for arguments sake don't you CC.

I officially declare I will answer no more posts of yours. I've had too much.


--------------------
Newcomers guide-----> For all things shroomy


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Nibin]
    #7859863 - 01/10/08 02:29 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Once again, this argument was all you trying to bicker about terms.

Ultra sonic humidifiers add water vapor to the air, which is often referred to as moisture. If you run the ultra long enough, all the surfaces get covered with a thin blanket of the most readily accessible H2O possible.

For Roger to claim, "Raising the humidity to 99% with an ultrasonic would not add moisture to the cake, casing layer, or perlite", is flat out wrong, as he is fond of saying.

If an ultra cannot add moisture to a cake, casing layer, or perlite, as you claim Roger, then where does that gallon of water go to? It starts in the ultra, then get pumped into the FC.

Quite a magic trick to make a gallon of water disappear into a 176 quart tub without making anything in the tub moist.

In fact this assertion is so ridiculous that most people would be laughed at for saying what Roger said.

Trust me Roger, if you run an ultra long enough you add moisture, big time, like as much as you want.

All the moisture that condenses on the walls of the FC run down to the perlite, moistening the perlite, since it is water.

Mist falls gentle on your casing layer, adding moisture.

If you have cakes in the FC, misting with an ultra will wet the surface of the cake to saturation if you run it long enough.

Hell, you could add humidity by putting a saturated sponge in a tub, try it, it works if the sponge is large enough compared to the bin.

That's what we use in guitar cases, wet sponges, they keep my cases at 50% when ambient is less then 20%.

Roger is so hell bent on making me look wrong at all costs that he is beginning to get ridiculous, and starting to contradict himself.

He said, above, in writing, in order to make me look wrong, that by misting perlite, a cake, a casing, an FC, you are not adding moisture.

A misted cake will dry out just as fast as a non misted one then I presume? How ridiculous!

"Raising the humidity to 99% with an ultrasonic would not add moisture to the cake, casing layer, or perlite. Even at 100% humidity, you wouldn't be adding moisture to your project, you would only be slowing down the rate of evaporation.."
RogerRabbit

Maybe the lamest post he has ever made, intentionally wrong to be mean, or ignorant of what water vapor can do in an enclosed space.


Edited by Captain Cubensis (01/10/08 03:21 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCrasher
αἱρετίζω
Male User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/13/01
Posts: 6,220
Loc: Tardy to the Party
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7859880 - 01/10/08 02:33 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

and here I was under the impression that high humidity was merely preventing the rapid evaporation of water from your cake or cased substrate.

holy crap cc, I said cased substrate and not casing.


--------------------
Give me silence, water, hope;
Give me struggle, iron, volcanoes...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Crasher]
    #7860127 - 01/10/08 03:19 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Even at 100% humidity, you wouldn't be adding moisture to your project, you would only be slowing down the rate of evaporation.
-RR

Weird man, are you feeling okay Roger?

You are saying that at 100% Rh with an ultra sonic humidifier pumping mist into an FC, that you are still not adding moisture.

Slowing evaporation and adding moisture are 2 parts of the same process, one cannot occur without the other.

So I get it, you place your cased substrates, not casings, in a FC, and mist to slow evaporation, not to add moisture.

So for every gallon of water run through the ultra, the casing is evaporating 1 gallon of water minus the water that evaporated out of the FC.

So Roger's point is this, you cannot add moisture to a casing layer, perlite, or a cake, you can only slow evaporation.

So that the amount of moisture in the perlite, casing layer, or cake is fixed at birth, and can never be added to by water vapor saturating the chamber completely covering every little nook and cranny in fine mist.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFraggin
Multi-Faceted
 User Gallery


Registered: 01/05/05
Posts: 8,707
Last seen: 8 years, 3 days
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7860150 - 01/10/08 03:25 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Captain,
RR has been in mycology for a spell, and has more exp than I do, and we do things differently on some levels. Generally, he does things correctly with a scientific approach and I kind of half ass it as I do everything else in life. The point being, He not only provides a great amount of time to the forums, but he also debunks unproven methods and determines better ways to cultivate. He has even paid for a laboratory to analyze some of his fungi to disprove the theory that mushrooms grown in aluminum pans contain trace elements of aluminum.
That in itself has gained my respect.

The fact is, what roger does here on the forums is out of good will and the spread of knowledge and I'm sure there are lots of other things he could do with his time than correct stubborn noobs everyday.

If you don't agree, there's no reason to attack his credibility and pick his posts apart.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Fraggin]
    #7860164 - 01/10/08 03:28 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

If you don't agree, there's no reason to attack his credibility and pick his posts apart.
Fraggin

Yet, you seem to think that is Roger's job as a moderator, cause that's exactly what he does, for 3 hours per day, he attacks peoples credibility and picks apart their posts.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFraggin
Multi-Faceted
 User Gallery


Registered: 01/05/05
Posts: 8,707
Last seen: 8 years, 3 days
Re: Perlite FC with an Ultra Sonic for misting. [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7860193 - 01/10/08 03:34 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore Bulk Substrate   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Perlite Vs. Ultra-Sonic Humidification FattyMcFatFat 2,304 3 12/07/01 03:11 AM
by TeRzMaStA
* Perlite or Ultra sonic humidifier? broiler 995 3 09/07/01 10:49 PM
by jonnyshaggs420
* Ultra Sonic verus Perlite!!! VIgnisFatuusI 689 2 07/09/03 02:07 AM
by Magash
* Ultra sonic Vs. Cool Mist. Under_net 2,238 9 01/11/02 03:01 PM
by TeRzMaStA
* ultra sonic..samsung.. djred 724 9 01/02/05 01:22 AM
by scatmanrav
* cool mist or ultra sonic? for smaller fruiting chambers? both? djred 992 10 11/19/04 11:07 AM
by derx
* Cool Mist vs Ultra sonic oddiseus 4,773 18 02/22/05 06:59 AM
by Citric
* cool mist or ultra sonic shroomme 1,225 7 11/12/01 09:43 PM
by Anonymous

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Shroomism, george castanza, RogerRabbit, veggie, mushboy, fahtster, LogicaL Chaos, 13shrooms, Stipe-n Cap, Pastywhyte, bodhisatta, Tormato, Land Trout, A.k.a
6,281 topic views. 16 members, 194 guests and 42 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.025 seconds spending 0.008 seconds on 14 queries.