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Offlinefreddurgan
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Registered: 01/11/04
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I finally understand what meditation is
    #7853811 - 01/09/08 01:55 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

I took me four years and I think I've now meditated twice in that time span. Last night, and the night before. All the other times were me becoming frustrated sitting in weird postures and fighting my brain. I always asked myself why I kept reading about meditation over and over. "It's something you DO, not read about", I would tell myself. But then one day I read something that made everything clear. All those rummaging rambling thoughts just coalesced into one beautiful whole and I understood how to meditate. And it makes so much sense now that I see it. It's almost cosmic in it's significance. All I had to do was read something that framed meditation as the cure for what MY suffering is. Everyone suffers differently. If you're curious, here is what did it for me.

"What exactly is meditation ? Facing boredom is meditation. What does
a meditator go on doing? Sitting silently looking at his own navel or
watching the breathing, do you think he is being entertained by these
things? He is utterly bored ! That's why the Zen master moves with a
stick in his hand-- because those bored people are bound to fall
asleep. There is no other escape, so only one escape is left: al least
they can fall asleep. They cannot escape. They have themselves, of
their own accord, become part of the Zen training, and the
discipline--they cannot escape. But one escape is always available: you
can fall sleep, then you forget all about it. That's why in meditation
one feels sleepy.

The whole effort in meditation is this: be bored but don't escape
from it; and keep alert, because if you fall asleep you have escaped.
Keep alert ! watch it, witness it. If it is there, then it is there. It
has to be looked in to, to the very core of it.

If you go on looking into boredom without escaping the explosion
comes. One day, suddenly, looking deep into boredom you penetrate your
own nothingness. Boredom is just the cover, the container in which is
contained your inner nothingness. If you escape from boredom, you are
escaping from your own nothingness.

Buddha left the world out of boredom; utterly bored, he ran away from
the world. And what was he doing for six years sitting in those forests
? He was getting more and more bored. What can you do, sitting in a
forest ?--Watching your breath, looking at your navel, day in day out,
year in, year out. He created boredom to its ultimate peak, and one
night it disappeared. It disappears of it's own accord.

If you reach the peak...the turn comes. It comes ! And with that turn
of the tide, light enters into your being-- you disappear, only light
remains. And with light comes delight. You are full of joy--you are
not, but full of joy for no reasons at all. Joy simply bubbles up in
your being.


:heart::heart::heart::heart::heart::heart:


--------------------
Ishmael
http://www.ishmael.org

Ron Paul 2008!
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/


Edited by freddurgan (01/09/08 03:05 PM)


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OfflineLion
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: freddurgan]
    #7853990 - 01/09/08 02:28 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

That's an awesome article!

However, don't get attached to that description of the meaning and purpose of meditation.  There are many kinds of meditation, and conceptualizing any of them could potentially detract from the experience of being in a state of meditation.

I've had astounding experiences lately with meditation because of having good teachers, but a challenge that arises is not to become attached to the experience or to interpretations of the experience.

:heart:


--------------------
“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”


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InvisibleScratcher
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: freddurgan]
    #7854157 - 01/09/08 03:00 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

thanks for posting that, i know it's gonna help me.


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InvisibleEternalCowabunga
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: Scratcher]
    #7854317 - 01/09/08 03:33 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

meditation is incredibly valuable, especially in our modern fast-paced society.


--------------------


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OfflineQuoiyaien
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: EternalCowabunga]
    #7854509 - 01/09/08 03:59 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Here is a teisho delivered by my teacher during one of our all night sittings.  I thought I'd share it with you as I feel it relevant to the topic of tiredness. 

"Welcome to our annual Yaza: Sitting throughout the night.

We sit throughout the night because, on a hot and humid night like this, who could sleep anyway?

When Eihei Dogen Zenji studied with his master Rujing at Tiantong-shan in China, the schedule for the day would begin around two-thirty or three, and zazen would extend well past eleven at night. Some records show that during Rujing's abbacy, the time for washing one's face in the morning after rising from sleep had been moved to one o'clock in the morning.

It was during one of these late night rounds of zazen that Rujing struck a student sitting near to Dogen, saying "Zazen is dropping body and mind." Hearing Rujing speak of dropping through the bodymind – shinjin datsuraku – Dogen fell away, fell right through, and all around as all directions and all beings.

At Hakukaze-ji, it was very common for zazen to continue throughout the night during sesshin. Rohatsu, the most intense sesshin of the year, usually began with nearly 18 hours of zazen on the first day, 20 hours of zazen on the second day, 22 on the third day, and 24 on the third [sic]... but also the fourth, fifth, sixth and seventh day. So, you do the math... [laughs]

We practise Yaza to commemorate the efforts of those who have come before us; but also... because it's a lot of fun.

Just as familiar faces and places and objects appear one way in the daylight and yet can look entirely different seen at night, the coming and going of moments, the coming and going of the breath, the coming and going of moments of wandering into discursiveness or sinking into dullness – or, opening up and opening around – take on a very interesting character when experienced doing zazen when we would usually be asleep.

Now there is a good reason for our usually being asleep at night. The systems of the bodymind, its circadian rhythms, are such that during the night the body rests and renews itself; and as we sit throughout the night, the rhythms of bodymind will be different than they are throughout the day. It's interesting to experience this.

There will be times when attention will wander into discursiveness or sanran, and there will be times when you will experience dullness or sinking mind, konchin.

However... it's not going to be as difficult as you think.

All that you have to do is stay awake for one moment: this moment. This breath. This sound.

Opening to and attending mindfully to this moment, you find that there is an infinite infinity of sensations, of sounds, variations in temperature. Even the colours of the wall, although white, are many different shades of white.

Rather than struggling and trying to survive... just let yourself die away. Let that thought die away. Let the past moment die away. Let the moment drop through itself. Do this, and you will know shinjin datsuraku, dropping through the bodymind.

You just have to be willing to enjoy this moment as it actually is.

If there is sinking, feel that, feel what it's actually like, without attempting to push it away or steel yourself. And without snuggling into it, without collapsing, without becoming someone experiencing the sinking.

All around the sensations of sinking, everything is quite bright.

The lights are on. And we'll keep them on, all night...!

Notice how attention can flatten, how the sounds can flatten and seem distant. Or, can be vivid and dimensional and rich, and, are not merely heard, but felt bodily.

If the eyes blink and itch and a tendency to close them continues to arise, raise your eye gaze, open your peripheral vision, notice the depth that's present in the visual field, even facing the wall.

If attention sinks, if it flattens, notice what this actually feels like, what the effect of that movement of attention has on all of the senses. In doing so you will be able to recognise not only coarse states of sinking such as sleepiness, but subtler forms of inversion that are part of self-image's recoil from the richness of reality.

Sinking mind, konchin, and wandering mind, sanran, are not all that different. In order to become lost in thought, your attention must already invert and narrow. This inversion and narrowing is of course much stronger with sinking mind. But even within sinking mind there is wandering. There are bits and pieces of discursiveness, there is imagery, and of course a flux of feeling tones.

Whether there is wandering or there is sinking, practise with it in the same way, by balancing attention, with whole-bodily feeling, with the breath: with this whole moment.

So on this hot and humid night, please, enjoy yourselves."


:hippie:


Edited by Quoiyaien (01/09/08 06:35 PM)


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Offlineigwna
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Registered: 06/19/07
Posts: 8,016
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: Quoiyaien]
    #7857526 - 01/10/08 01:35 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

yeah that definitally helps. i always wanted to "learn" how to meditate when it didn't 'seem' to be working.

this definitally helps.

awesome post.


--------------------
I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.



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OfflineGomp
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: freddurgan]
    #7857578 - 01/10/08 01:57 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Being awake in a dream, knowing and feeling myself asleep.. Can feel strikingly alike the feeling of being awake when meditating feeling the body sitting there, being fully aware of it and maybe even others.. One need not really sleep to "dream".. :wink:


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OfflineRoseM
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Registered: 09/24/03
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: Gomp]
    #7857587 - 01/10/08 02:04 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Meditation is letting your nervous system think for you.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: freddurgan]
    #7857680 - 01/10/08 03:22 AM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Your nice quote is from Rajneesh. Where is the part about paranoia and guns and sex and Rolls Royces?


--------------------


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7857724 - 01/10/08 04:41 AM (16 years, 22 days ago)

hand in hand
together we stand (sit)
on the threashold
of a dream


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: redgreenvines]
    #7858272 - 01/10/08 09:09 AM (16 years, 22 days ago)

I think therefor I am... I think.

Of course you are my bright little star, you're miles and miles of files, pretty files of your forefathers fruit; and now to suit our great computer, you're magnetic ink.

I'm more than that, I know I am... at least, I think I must be.


There ya go man, stay as cool as you can; face piles of trials with smiles, it riles them to believe that you perceive the web they weave, and keep on thinking free. -Moody Blues

And blah blah blah.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinefreddurgan
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: freddurgan]
    #7858976 - 01/10/08 11:48 AM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Wow I like this Osho chap. Too bad he's already got me stirred up. I don't see myself being free enough to do his Dynamic Meditation unless I was totally alone in my house =/


--------------------
Ishmael
http://www.ishmael.org

Ron Paul 2008!
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: freddurgan]
    #7859213 - 01/10/08 12:29 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

I think his dynamic meditation was his great contribution to psychology.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Registered: 04/01/07
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: freddurgan]
    #7859279 - 01/10/08 12:45 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Did you get to the chapter on AK-47s yet?


--------------------


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Offlinefreddurgan
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Registered: 01/11/04
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Re: I finally understand what meditation is [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7859308 - 01/10/08 12:53 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

I don't know where to find a consolidated writing? Link?


--------------------
Ishmael
http://www.ishmael.org

Ron Paul 2008!
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/


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