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Offlineverminute
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Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics)
    #7853451 - 01/09/08 12:47 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

What I've learned, regardless of what Tek's tell you, you need to pack the substrate down a little before you PC. Other wise the mycelium will reach out and grab what it can find. It looks like spider-man's web from the movies... Here is a picture, sorry for the poor quality, it's from a camera phone...



Here is my incubation box. Yup a shoe box with a temp. meter. I use a heating blanket under it, it stays around 78 degrees.



Now here is my FC, obviously not in use yet. Perlite is under the tin foil which will be removed when I'm ready.



So my question, since the jars are not %100 and I see pinning, I assume I should still wait until I reach %100 even is the pins start to abort? Or will they just continue growth without a lot of humidity and room for growth.

As always, thanks for your time.


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InvisibleDontPlay
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: verminute]
    #7853535 - 01/09/08 01:03 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Growth
That spider mans web you describe is a great sign of growth it should look very ropey like that.Packing the substrate is not recommended because leaving little air pockets gives the mycelium room to jump through the substrate.
Early Pinning
Yeah I have the same problem currently, From what ive read you should just leave it in there and keep it in the dark. Light can trigger pinning. The pins in my jars have not growin any bigger and the cakes are now almost done colonizing.
Heating Pad- FC
Using a heating pad under the box is terribly dangerous, it's the cause of many house fires not to mention uneven distribution of heat to your jars. Also you should drill a few 1/4 inch holes on all sides of that FC unless you want to hand fan 12 times a day.


Edited by DontPlay (01/09/08 01:22 PM)


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InvisibleSlimz
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: verminute]
    #7853541 - 01/09/08 01:05 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

i would watch it closely.. intro-pinning does happen but normaly not till 100%... Birthing them at 75%-85% does not seem to be the proper answer, but if they are pinning, the want to fruit, wich means the colonization will stop.


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Offlineveda_sticks
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: verminute]
    #7853552 - 01/09/08 01:08 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Leave them until 100% colinisaton. Birthing early will give a great chance of the uncolinised portion becoming contaminated.

I have seen mushrooms grow inside jars just fine.

Take shitake for example, they are best left fruiting in the jar, the work ther way up and find outside.

I always thought that pinning before 100% colinisation was a trigger from something else other than a pinning trigger, for example contamination. But im not to sure about that.

People will come along and ask if they have been exposed to light. I dont think it is light, my jars get exposed to light frequently and have never had early pinning. I will be testing out this theory soon.

other than that, im not sure what is causing the early pinning.


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Invisiblemrwindowz
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: Slimz]
    #7853553 - 01/09/08 01:08 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Yea the heating pad is a very dangerous method. I would suggest the double tub with the aquarium heater underneath as shown in the PF tek. Very effective and doesn't cost much at all. Good luck.


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Offlineverminute
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: mrwindowz]
    #7853581 - 01/09/08 01:13 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Thank you all!

Great replies, the heating pad is at low heat, but I will work towards removing it.

As for the comment regarding healthy, or normal mycelium with the spider web effect... PHEW! Thanks, I've been reasearching and could not find that answer. Thanks.


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Offlineveda_sticks
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: DontPlay]
    #7853591 - 01/09/08 01:16 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

DontPlay said:
Growth
That spider mans web you describe is a great sign of growth it should look very ropey like that.Packing the substrate is not recommended because leaving little air pockets gives the mycelium room to jump through the substrate.
Early Pinning
Yeah I have the same problem currently, From what ive read you should just leave it in there and keep it in the dark. Cooler temp's and light can trigger pinning. The pins in my jars have not growin any bigger and the cakes are now almost done colonizing.
Heating Pad- FC
Using a heating pad under the box is terribly dangerous, it's the cause of many house fires not to mention uneven distribution of heat to your jars. Also you should drill a few 1/4 inch holes on all sides of that FC unless you want to hand fan 12 times a day.




Temp drop is not a pinning trigger.

While light is a pinning trigger, exposure to light should not trigger pinning in an partially colinised substrate (not to my knowledge)


--------------------

PF TEK - writeup by EvilMushroom666
Lets Grow Mushrooms - RogerRabbit & RoadKills website with sample videos plus the full PF TEK video series. Alot of great information - BUY THE DVD
Cakes can and will pin! - So you think cakes suck for pins. Your wrong
Franks Simple Coir/Verm Tek
Franks Proper Pasturisation Tek
Franks Spawning To Bulk - Monotub
Professor Pinheads RTV Injection Port Tek
Foo Mans No Soak WBS Prep Tek


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InvisibleDontPlay
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: veda_sticks]
    #7853614 - 01/09/08 01:19 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Hmm well there goes some more misinformation I have read in numerous posts that drop in temp is a pinning trigger. Now I have no idea if that is true or not I think I need to buy some mycology books. Id like to think that they would not be filled with non sense.


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Offlineverminute
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: DontPlay]
    #7853643 - 01/09/08 01:25 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

DontPlay said:
Hmm well there goes some more misinformation I have read in numerous posts that drop in temp is a pinning trigger. Now I have no idea if that is true or not I think I need to buy some mycology books. Id like to think that they would not be filled with non sense.




I thought the same thing, no worries, you're passing on information which has some fact. For instance I would've made the same assumption based on dunking... Since it's done at cold temps I would think it would be benifcal for all types of pinning... Veda, can you help shed some light on the matter?


Edited by verminute (01/09/08 01:25 PM)


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Invisiblemrwindowz
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: DontPlay]
    #7853661 - 01/09/08 01:30 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

A drop in temperature is a pinning trigger depending on the species. If you are trying to grow edible species, then a temperature drop is necessary. If you are growing cubensis, then a temperature drop is not necessay. So it depends on the species you are growing.

Pinning and temperature


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Offlineverminute
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: mrwindowz]
    #7853695 - 01/09/08 01:36 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Cool, thanks!


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InvisibleDontPlay
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: verminute]
    #7853745 - 01/09/08 01:45 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Yeah after Veda posted that I did a little more searching on the matter. A decrease in temp is necessary for optimal growing conditions but not for pinning. Cubes do not need to be cold shocked either, as Ive been seeing alot of post claiming that also. Maybe we should think of early pins as very impatient little buggers lol and are trying to lead the way.


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Offlineverminute
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: DontPlay]
    #7853771 - 01/09/08 01:49 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Impatient yes, but am I happy to see first pins, HELL YEAH! :smile:


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OfflineNibin
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: DontPlay]
    #7853781 - 01/09/08 01:51 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

DontPlay said:
Hmm well there goes some more misinformation I have read in numerous posts that drop in temp is a pinning trigger. Now I have no idea if that is true or not I think I need to buy some mycology books. Id like to think that they would not be filled with non sense.




Temp drop is an important pinning trigger in cold loving species but not for P. Cubensis as they are a tropical species. Do a search for posts by RR relative to cold shocking and you will get more info.

PS: Dunking, which is done in the fridge, is not done in the fridge for cold shocking but to help prevent contams.


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Offlineverminute
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: Nibin]
    #7853813 - 01/09/08 01:55 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

Nibin said:
Quote:

DontPlay said:
Hmm well there goes some more misinformation I have read in numerous posts that drop in temp is a pinning trigger. Now I have no idea if that is true or not I think I need to buy some mycology books. Id like to think that they would not be filled with non sense.




PS: Dunking, which is done in the fridge, is not done in the fridge for cold shocking but to help prevent contams.




Ah, that makes much more sense.


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InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: verminute]
    #7854108 - 01/09/08 02:49 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

I would recommend you use that jar for G2G, since it is showing easy fruiting genetics.


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Offlineverminute
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7854141 - 01/09/08 02:57 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

That is a great recommendation actually. Good call. It is the most badass of them all... Like sparta... Hahaha, it's the sparta cake!


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InvisibleCaptain Cubensis
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: verminute]
    #7854154 - 01/09/08 02:59 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Well thank you,I gave you 5 mushrooms for being so kind!


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OfflineNibin
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: Captain Cubensis]
    #7854172 - 01/09/08 03:02 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

Captain Cubensis said:
I would recommend you use that jar for G2G, since it is showing easy fruiting genetics.




CC, tranferring mycelium from one jar to another will not isolate the easy fruiting genetics. A jar inoculated with multispore will contain different portions with different genetics, be they compatible or not)

By doing a G2G from multispore spawn you will not isolate a set of genetics.

Where did you get that idea from?

PS: Early pinning inside a jar is normally caused by or contamination or an improperly prepared substrate. The mycelium thinks it has finished colonizing all it can (even if there is stuff left in the jar) and starts fruiting.


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Edited by Nibin (01/09/08 03:04 PM)


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OfflineFraggin
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Re: Pinning inside jars @ 75% colonization (w/ pics) [Re: Nibin]
    #7854248 - 01/09/08 03:18 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

Nibin said:
Quote:

Captain Cubensis said:
I would recommend you use that jar for G2G, since it is showing easy fruiting genetics.




CC, tranferring mycelium from one jar to another will not isolate the easy fruiting genetics. A jar inoculated with multispore will contain different portions with different genetics, be they compatible or not)

By doing a G2G from multispore spawn you will not isolate a set of genetics.

Where did you get that idea from?






He didn't say isolate, and though a grain to grain transfer would not isolate a set of genetics, it would minimize the sets that you are working with when compared to a multi-spore inoculation.

I have taken rhizomorphic mycelium from rhizomorphic areas of a grain jar innnoculated with ms, and grown and entire jar of what look like cotton rope. I have done this on numerous occasions. So, I have to disagree with part of your detraction from the advice given.


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