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DontPlay
Yeah Science!



Registered: 12/13/07
Posts: 750
Loc: On Land most of the time....
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Okay so are you trying to say that anyone who uses it is wrong ? Casing is a good idea to hold in moisture, you might not need it but it's better than nothing. Coir holds moisture what ? No wayyy
-------------------- My Trade List I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me. Hunter S. Thompson
I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery. ~Thomas Jefferson
Edited by DontPlay (01/09/08 04:10 PM)
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Tomandjerry58
Stranger
Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 5,212
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Re: help with casing [Re: DontPlay]
#7854566 - 01/09/08 04:08 PM (16 years, 23 days ago) |
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http://www.shroomery.org/55/60-40-Vermiculite-and-Coco-Coir-Casing-Tek
used this one for years always worked great... as far as the misting goes.... i wouldn't concern myself with too much.... if the sides look dry mist them... if it don't.then don't mist. couple sprays two feet over the casing once a day....but if it looks too wet then don't you have to gain an eye for these things...it is really hard for someone to actually tell you. just like the how wet should my casing be before i use? the only way i have ever been able to tell this is by squeezing the water should drizzle out of ur hands not pour
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Tomandjerry58
Stranger
Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 5,212
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just want to add with the tek listed above don't worry urself with ph adjust.. done it like 5o times and never adjusted the ph
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Nibin
Getting there



Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 4,480
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
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Quote:
Captain Cubensis said: Yes, you are right, you can get good casing information if you sift through the BS. I meant a link to ONE POST that contained a good casing tek.
Coir works in casing because you don't even have to case to get fruits.
Coir is second to hpoo in mushy nutrients, and since nutritious materials are not recommended for a casing layer, well, you can follow the logic.
Coir works as casing because it has kick ass water retention capabilities and texture. It has the con though that it is nutritional, which is why peat is better as it holds lots of water like coir and has a great texture also but isn't nutritional.
It isn't just because cubes can grow uncased. Coir works as a casing layer but others are far superior, that's it. Nothing more, nothing less.
-------------------- Newcomers guide-----> For all things shroomy
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Captain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
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Re: help with casing [Re: Nibin]
#7855199 - 01/09/08 06:16 PM (16 years, 23 days ago) |
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I'm also a believer in peat/verm casings. I tried coir when everybody else was raving about it, but coir works far better in the substrate than in casings. RR 04/05/05
This is my first and last try using coir. I don't like the way it colonizes like a substrate and overlays in the fruiting chamber. I lightly scratched and patched the coir side, but it is already starting to overlay again. I do have pins now, but the set isn't great. It looks like it will overlay by the next flush, so I just might let it do that and fruit it like a big substrate block. I will not use coir again for casing cubes. -Blue Helix 04/03/04
I've always recommended peat/verm for casing. It's just that so many people are 'set' on using coir, that I grew tired of always saying it sucks as a casing, rather than a substrate. If it's mixed 60/40 or 70/30 verm-coir it will work, although not as well as a non-nutritious casing such as peat will. For those of you who were around then, I was the first person to say coir is a substrate material and not well suited for casing unless massively diluted with vermiculite. Until then, everybody seemed to repeat the lie that coir has no 'nutes'. In fact, saying that coir is better suited as a substrate than a casing material led to me getting banned from one of the other mushroom boards for being on a 'jihad' against coir and popcorn spawn. RR 11/03/06
I'm a peat based man through and through. -Hyphae 04/01/05
50/peat - 40/verm - 10/coir (Ph adjusted peat - of course) -Agar 04/16/05
You are 100% backwards. Coco coir is for substrates. Peat moss is for casing. -Monstermitch 09/16/06
Peat + verm- IMO this is the best mix. You get the fluffiness of the peat with the water retention of the verm. Only downside, and it's not a big one, is the semi need for calcium carbonate to balance the PH of the peat since it's acidic. However if you're only in it for a flush or two you can ignore that (i do, and i get great harvests from a 5lb casing). Verm- Verm will do in a pinch if for some reason peat isn't available. It provides great water retention and no other additives to balance out the PH. The only problem is that it tends to compact which is counterproductive in cultivation. When working with straight verm i suggest going on the sparser side and create a thin layer. Coir- IMO coir makes a better substrate then a casing layer. -Coda 08/16/07
You don't want nutes in the casing layer. -Hyphae 07/04/07
The only draw back to the Verm/Coco Coir casing is...that you need to fruit it before the mycelium breaks the surface of the casing layer. If you wait too long to fruit...the mycelium will grow through the casing layer too quickly and you will have to patch the casing layer...and if you don't patch it, you might get a bad pinset. -Roadkill 04/14/05
Edited by Captain Cubensis (01/09/08 06:27 PM)
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Nibin
Getting there



Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 4,480
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
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Yes, so as I said, it works, but there are much better materials for your casing.
I wasn't saying that people should use coir, just rebbuting your statement that coir has no use whatsoever as a casing layer.
It has been used in the past, it works, albeit not as well as other materials, and it has been established that it will cause problems.
-------------------- Newcomers guide-----> For all things shroomy
Edited by Nibin (01/09/08 06:37 PM)
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DontPlay
Yeah Science!



Registered: 12/13/07
Posts: 750
Loc: On Land most of the time....
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Re: help with casing [Re: Nibin]
#7855281 - 01/09/08 06:35 PM (16 years, 23 days ago) |
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Sigh, your missing the point plain and simple. It can and is used for casing. NO ONE IS CLAIMING IT IS THE BEST. Is that so hard to understand can you grasp that ? Also you have wayyy to much time on your hands.
-------------------- My Trade List I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me. Hunter S. Thompson
I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery. ~Thomas Jefferson
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Captain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
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Re: help with casing [Re: Nibin]
#7855639 - 01/09/08 07:35 PM (16 years, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
Nibin said: Yes, so as I said, it works, but there are much better materials for your casing.
I wasn't saying that people should use coir, just rebutting your statement that coir has no use whatsoever as a casing layer.
It has been used in the past, it works, albeit not as well as other materials, and it has been established that it will cause problems.
I never said that at all, you put words in my mouth then argued with those words, not mine.
I said coir works, of course it works, but it sucks as a casing material, everybody knows that.
Plus, it's expensive, and that is a waste of coir IMHO, put it in your sub, not your casing.
I never said anything like "just rebutting your statement that coir has no use whatsoever as a casing layer", not even close, please quote me if you are going to make statement about things I claimed.
-------------------- www.groworganic.com Get 350lbs shipped to your door for only $100! www.mycosupply.com Online Organic Rye Berries www.hydroponics.net/i/200002 The Cyclestat 4P, a great repeat cycle timer made in the USA.
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poot
bottom feeder



Registered: 11/24/07
Posts: 212
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keep posting, eventually you all will forget wtf ur talking about!
-------------------- possibly the last post of mine.
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Nibin
Getting there



Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 4,480
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
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Quote:
Coir works in casing because you don't even have to case to get fruits.
This, at least to me equals you saying coir is as good as not casing which equals you saying coir is useless as a casing layer.
Which Is why I rebutted this statement.
-------------------- Newcomers guide-----> For all things shroomy
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Captain Cubensis
Bleeding HeartLiberal


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 648
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Re: help with casing [Re: Nibin]
#7855726 - 01/09/08 07:45 PM (16 years, 23 days ago) |
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What that means is, by adding a layer of coir on top of your substrate, you are in effect, adding another layer of substrate, and therefore not adding a casing layer at all, which is only the non-nutritious layer on top of the cased substrate.
By casing with coir, you are not casing at all, not even Roger will dispute that!
-------------------- www.groworganic.com Get 350lbs shipped to your door for only $100! www.mycosupply.com Online Organic Rye Berries www.hydroponics.net/i/200002 The Cyclestat 4P, a great repeat cycle timer made in the USA.
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poot
bottom feeder



Registered: 11/24/07
Posts: 212
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captain im giving you 5 shrooms of insanity :-)
-------------------- possibly the last post of mine.
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Supplier
Mad Hatter



Registered: 01/05/08
Posts: 705
Loc: The Sky
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
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Re: help with casing [Re: poot]
#7857979 - 01/10/08 07:34 AM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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ok i have two more noob questions first one is when doing a 50/50 casing do u really need the oyster or can u do with out it... next second question someone describe patching please? is it just taking dry verm and covering up the myc that comes threw?
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Nibin
Getting there



Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 4,480
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
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Re: help with casing [Re: Supplier]
#7858027 - 01/10/08 07:53 AM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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-------------------- Newcomers guide-----> For all things shroomy
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doc34
Fungitarian



Registered: 02/14/04
Posts: 2,667
Loc: Myceliaville !!!
Last seen: 7 months, 29 days
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Quote:
Captain Cubensis said:
Quote:
endepth said:
Quote:
Captain Cubensis said:
Quote:
endepth said: Plenty of peoples opinions and casing techniques have been posted here. Quit being lazy.
Leaving this thread now.
Really, find me 3 links to good casing teks then Endepth.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/3290155/an/0/page/0 http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/1308057/an/0/page/0 http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/565456/an/0/page/0
wow... that was hard y0.
The last two are not good casing teks because they advocate the use of coir in the casing layer, something widely accepted as foolish.
Hyphae's is the only good one I could find as well.
HOLD IT RIGHT HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Quote:
The last two are not good casing teks because they advocate the use of coir in the casing layer, something widely accepted as foolish.
I use 100% Coco-Coir in all of my casings and I would not use anything else! With results like these who would want to?
LOOK!!!!!! VVVVVVVVVV







I have even better pictures that are amazing including a 700 gram first flush using only 100% Coco-Coir! From a 10"X12"X4" deep pan!
NOW IS THAT FOOLISH RESULTS?
I think its foolish to say that a PROVEN casing method is foolish!
I wouldn't use your peat, verm or whatever, why? Because I have used it in the past 15 years of cultivation and I have found that COIR is overall the handsdown winner when it comes to weight=casing layer!
Doc is foolish huh? I know you didn't say that I was foolish but you did say that my casing tek is foolish-Why would you do that when it is proven to be a great casing material?
Yeah, I went through the same tortures of being a newbie on this site but when everyone realized I know my shit they quit acting like they knew everything-There is alot of good cultivators here and there are alot that thinks they are,lol. There are assholes and pests too, but we won't mention any names cause they know who they are.
JESUS CHRIST what has happened to this site since I was here only a year ago?
Hell, I've said enough!
My two cents and COCO-COIR ROCKS ASS!!!!!!!!!!!
Doc
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doc34
Fungitarian



Registered: 02/14/04
Posts: 2,667
Loc: Myceliaville !!!
Last seen: 7 months, 29 days
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Quote:
Captain Cubensis said: What that means is, by adding a layer of coir on top of your substrate, you are in effect, adding another layer of substrate, and therefore not adding a casing layer at all, which is only the non-nutritious layer on top of the cased substrate.
By casing with coir, you are not casing at all, not even Roger will dispute that!
I'LL dispute that!!!!!!!!!!!
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fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: help with casing [Re: doc34]
#7858166 - 01/10/08 08:39 AM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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Doc, are you using coir as the substrate also?
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DontPlay
Yeah Science!



Registered: 12/13/07
Posts: 750
Loc: On Land most of the time....
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Re: help with casing [Re: fastfred]
#7858179 - 01/10/08 08:42 AM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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Doc everytime you show your pics its an inspiration makes me almost wanna shit my pants 700 gram first flush my god *drools*
-------------------- My Trade List I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me. Hunter S. Thompson
I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery. ~Thomas Jefferson
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Supplier
Mad Hatter



Registered: 01/05/08
Posts: 705
Loc: The Sky
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
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Re: help with casing [Re: DontPlay]
#7858194 - 01/10/08 08:45 AM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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jesus 700 grams on one flush thats insane that makes me wana make my 50 gallon aquarium into one big casing hahaha :] hmm...
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doc34
Fungitarian



Registered: 02/14/04
Posts: 2,667
Loc: Myceliaville !!!
Last seen: 7 months, 29 days
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Re: help with casing [Re: fastfred]
#7858265 - 01/10/08 09:07 AM (16 years, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
fastfred said: Doc, are you using coir as the substrate also?
No, I'm not. I use it as a "casing layer" only.
Now, others are saying that coir is a "substrate" and not a "casing" layer-I beg to differ. It's both! I have tried every casing material on the market and had different results with each, except one-coir! Now in order for a casing layer to be a true casing layer, it is suppose to be "non-nutrative"(sp?) meaning that it contains none or minute amounts of nutrients. If an organic substance is used it contains nutrients and coir(being organic) does indeed contain some nutrients, but, when used as a casing layer it produces extreme flushes just like or even better than the top grade materials-I don't care what it does or why it is called what it is-all I know is that it is the easiest to prepare(sterilizing or pasteurizing) as you don't add anything and you get results that are amazing-Why not use it as a "casing" layer-it works better than most of your true non-nutrient casing materials.
I'm not gonna argue this anymore cause its plain and simple=coir is the easiest thing for a newbie to use when first getting into casing and even if your a seasoned pro, to achieve dramatic results.
You call it a substrate and I call it a casing layer = who-gives-a-rats-ass?
It works as both!
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