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OfflineDroz
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Imagination
    #7843724 - 01/07/08 02:09 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

How much of this information we speak about is real and how much is your imagination?

God
Reincarnation
Karma
Ying-Yang
Heaven
Hell

Etc.

Peace,
Droz


--------------------
Evolution of Time.


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OfflineLion
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Re: Imagination [Re: Droz]
    #7843746 - 01/07/08 02:17 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Whether those concepts are real is secondary to whether they are applicable. All of the above concepts are limited tools through which we seek out new experiences, or seek to transmit our experiences to others. If any of these phenomena is "real", that reality is not contained in our concepts about them.


--------------------
“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”


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OfflineDroz
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Re: Imagination [Re: Lion]
    #7843758 - 01/07/08 02:21 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

What do you mean by applied? As you would accept these thoughts are real or false, is all in your imagination.. nothing more nothing less...


--------------------
Evolution of Time.


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OfflineLion
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Re: Imagination [Re: Droz]
    #7843778 - 01/07/08 02:27 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

Droz said:
What do you mean by applied? As you would accept these thoughts are real or false, is all in your imagination.. nothing more nothing less...


I changed my post to use the word I meant to write: "applicable".  I mean that no concept in and of itself is "real" or "unreal", but if one can apply the concept of "karma", for example, to one's experience, it has some limited validity in conveying insight.  If that makes any sense. :shrug:

Nice post count. :hehehe:


--------------------
“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”


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OfflineDroz
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Re: Imagination [Re: Lion]
    #7843834 - 01/07/08 02:39 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Well these are all weak concepts, i bet in the future we will learn to use our language better.

Or even invent more words and terminology to suit our needs.

Peace,
Droz


--------------------
Evolution of Time.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Imagination [Re: Droz]
    #7843892 - 01/07/08 02:51 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

Droz said:
How much of this information we speak about is real and how much is your imagination?

God
Reincarnation
Karma
Ying-Yang
Heaven
Hell

Etc.

Peace,
Droz




Come on  dude. How are you supposed to answer a question like this?:crazy2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineDroz
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Re: Imagination [Re: Icelander]
    #7844131 - 01/07/08 03:36 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

So what exactly do we do? We make up stories and then talk about it as if it were something special.

Words are weak. Actions hold strong. Actions from beliefs, saying God is in control is like making up stuff, using ur imagination to hold onto.

It's all crap.

Concept after concept, it changes our minds and our actions.

So on another note, are we more vocul about our imagination as if it were real? Does it change anything?

Peace,
Droz


--------------------
Evolution of Time.


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OfflineRoseM
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Could you repeat the question? [Re: Icelander]
    #7844367 - 01/07/08 04:20 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Quote:

Droz said:
How much of this information we speak about is real and how much is your imagination?





Come on  dude. How are you supposed to answer a question like this?:crazy2:




I agree Ice... I have no idea what Droz is asking.

I IMAGINE Droz could've phrased his question better.

I don't know, "How much of this information we speak about is real" I didn't even know WE were speaking about information.

And I can honestly say I don't know what Droz meant when he said, "How much is your imagination?"

Is Droz asking, "How much is MY imagination"?

If he is, I would have to say my imagination is THIS MUCH: :doublefu:


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



Edited by Rose (01/07/08 04:27 PM)


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Imagination [Re: Droz]
    #7844387 - 01/07/08 04:26 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

"Anything real, has been realized, anything imagined, can be!"


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: Gomp]
    #7844399 - 01/07/08 04:29 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

That is a nice statement... but it is not true.

Many imaginary things have been realized (like flying to the moon)... but many imaginary things will never become real (like Nessie).


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7844455 - 01/07/08 04:41 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

That's because I imagined then NOT to become real  :voila:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7844473 - 01/07/08 04:47 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

"can be" ...


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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Imagination [Re: Gomp]
    #7844790 - 01/07/08 05:51 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

*could


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: Gomp]
    #7844795 - 01/07/08 05:52 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Look, your statement was a nice one... but you are using it out of context.

This is what you said: "Anything real, has been realized, anything imagined, can be!"

No, it CAN'T.

Your statement is not a universal truth. It is an ARTISTIC truth.

Anything imagined CAN be created... ARTISTICALLY. But you can't just imagine ANYTHING into existence.

If you imagine Nessie, you can write about Nessie, or draw a picture of what you IMAGINE Nessie looks like... Hell, you can even make a movie about Nessie... but you CAN'T imagine Nessie into ACTUAL existence. It doesn't work that way.

Sorry.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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Offlinetrent
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7844841 - 01/07/08 06:06 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

i'm here to report to you that most of all those things are all too real with imagination thrown in to boot.


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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Imagination [Re: trent]
    #7844913 - 01/07/08 06:20 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Thanks for the update.  :goodmorning:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: trent]
    #7845451 - 01/07/08 08:17 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

trent said:
i'm here to report to you that most of all those things are all too real with imagination thrown in to boot.




Wow... I am not sure what you are talking about... not at all.

This IS the thread for confusing posts... I guess.

Here, let me say something confusing too:

Imaginary images are found in all over the world and not forever.

:smile:


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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OfflineGomp
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7845734 - 01/07/08 09:07 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

Cervantes said:
Look, your statement was a nice one... but you are using it out of context.

This is what you said: "Anything real, has been realized, anything imagined, can be!"

No, it CAN'T.

Your statement is not a universal truth. It is an ARTISTIC truth.

Anything imagined CAN be created... ARTISTICALLY. But you can't just imagine ANYTHING into existence.

If you imagine Nessie, you can write about Nessie, or draw a picture of what you IMAGINE Nessie looks like... Hell, you can even make a movie about Nessie... but you CAN'T imagine Nessie into ACTUAL existence. It doesn't work that way.

Sorry.




See? You try to blame me for your interpretation...

As you say, I said: "Anything real, has been realized, anything imagined, can be!"
... you can read this as you like, but there is no reason you should leave out the fact that what I am saying, also could be interpreted as; Anything that is imagined can be realized, even if only as pure imagination! ...

However, I usually do not explain like this, cause it might limit what I said, as other find other interpretations.. But, it is almost sad to see you be hung up in only one as if that is what I intended to say..

Reason I use one-liners like that, is cause it would take a small book to explain every aspect of it..

:monkeydance:

(Edit: spelling.)


Edited by Gomp (01/08/08 06:47 PM)


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: Gomp]
    #7845971 - 01/07/08 09:43 PM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

Gomp said:
See? You try to blame me for you interpretation...





"For YOU interpretation"?!?

For the love of God, can we get some grammar police in here?!? STAT!

Gomp, if you don't want me to interpret, "YOU" posts, represent, "YOUself" more clearly next time.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



Edited by Rose (01/07/08 09:52 PM)


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Invisibledaytripper23
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7846683 - 01/08/08 01:29 AM (16 years, 25 days ago)

Read or see A Midsummer Night's Dream, and then try to sell yourself on the notion that it is "just" art.


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Invisiblemayfly
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Re: Imagination [Re: daytripper23]
    #7846692 - 01/08/08 01:42 AM (16 years, 25 days ago)

It doesn't real matter if these things are real or not, it only matters what people think and do about them. Concepts like god or karma can't be real in a concrete sense, so they're only important in our minds, and then only if we decide they're real.

Personally, I'm a bit skeptical about the idea of heaven and hell--they just don't correspond with my beliefs about life and afterlife. So for me, heaven and hell are not real. But if you believe in them, then they're totally concrete and real. Maybe you'll change your mind after you die. Maybe I will. Or maybe we'll be past thinking. Who knows.


--------------------
"The important thing to remember: if we ship all our fat-bottomed girls off to foreign countries, the terrorists win."


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Invisibletruekimbo2
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Re: Imagination [Re: mayfly]
    #7846939 - 01/08/08 06:18 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

i agree with you droz.


--------------------
You can check the last post in my journal for contact info.


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InvisibleApollyphelion
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Re: Imagination [Re: daytripper23]
    #7847045 - 01/08/08 08:14 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Anything that affects your brain-chemistry/neurology should be considered real. Does it matter what the stimulus is as long as it affects you? I find my D&D campaign to be as real as The Shroomery.

Isn't real context? Isn't everything context, relativity?

Is that a real stupid question for me to ask?

Are we talking about matter itself? Are thoughts themselves matter? Where are they stored? What happens to your thoughts when you die?

I really suck at P&S forum, so excuse my crappy points, if they may be that.

Many giants in here, and I feel like a worm here. Haha.


--------------------

"I'm looking at you looking at it"

SUBSCRIBE TO MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL PLEASE! www.youtube.com/apollyphelion



Creator of the World's Worst Comic Book


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Imagination [Re: Droz]
    #7847406 - 01/08/08 11:06 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

saying God is in control is like making up stuff, using ur imagination to hold onto.

It's all crap.


Just because what you say here is true and I do agree with it, that does not mean there is no God. We don't know.:tongue:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineDroz
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Re: Imagination [Re: Icelander]
    #7847475 - 01/08/08 11:25 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

It's like logically there is no way to prove or disprove of the idea of a GOD.

"Not enough information, maybe yes and maybe no."


--------------------
Evolution of Time.


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: Imagination [Re: Droz]
    #7847611 - 01/08/08 12:10 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

Droz said:
It's like logically there is no way to prove or disprove of the idea of a GOD.

"Not enough information, maybe yes and maybe no."



Until know I bet it stands exactly 50/50..
That is what freaks me out..


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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OfflineDroz
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Re: Imagination [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #7847721 - 01/08/08 12:40 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

You could say GOD gave us the mind, he never said you had to believe in him for him to exist.

You can also say there is no evidence of a GOD, therefore he doesn't exist.

You can only imagine! Get it? <<


--------------------
Evolution of Time.


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: Imagination [Re: Droz]
    #7847858 - 01/08/08 01:08 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Sure, but imaginatory things don't have to be originated in fiction just because they were not proven real yet... {gulp} :smile:


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: daytripper23]
    #7847872 - 01/08/08 01:10 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

daytripper23 said:
Read or see A Midsummer Night's Dream, and then try to sell yourself on the notion that it is "just" art.




You do know theatre is an ARTFORM don't you?

Fairies aren't REALLY real.

BTW, I have read, AND seen that play...

... and I have ALSO acted in THREE different productions of MSND... I have played Nick Bottom the Weaver... TWICE!

... AND I STILL don't believe in fairies.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7847888 - 01/08/08 01:15 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

AND I STILL don't believe in fairies.

Never been to NY?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: Icelander]
    #7847895 - 01/08/08 01:16 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

... and I lived in the Village for 4 years!

I don't believe in fairies... only fairy queens. :wink:


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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OfflineGomp
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7849669 - 01/08/08 06:44 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

Cervantes said:
Quote:

Gomp said:
See? You try to blame me for you interpretation...





"For YOU interpretation"?!?

For the love of God, can we get some grammar police in here?!? STAT!

Gomp, if you don't want me to interpret, "YOU" posts, represent, "YOUself" more clearly next time. 




There we go, it was only a matter of time, before you showed your maturity level for all too see! I am happy for you.. And I hope the best for you! :smile:

And "for the love of God", if you cannot make more than one kind of sense of something, just do not read my post's.. I will not baby sit for you. :wink:


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: Gomp]
    #7849698 - 01/08/08 06:49 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Wow... you played the immaturity card.

According to you, I am immature because YOU couldn't spell.

You may wish to review the rules of this forum before you play that card again. Just because I know how to spell, does not make me immature.

I called you on what you LITERALLY said... and you (gently) attacked me personally. Your attack was unfounded.

Don't worry, I am a big boy, I can take it... but watch who you insinuate is immature. And please, check YOU ( :smile: ) spelling if you have a point to make.

My point stands... if you want me to understand YOU ( :smile: ) point... please, make YOU ( :smile: ) point more clearly next time.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



Edited by Rose (01/08/08 07:02 PM)


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7849968 - 01/08/08 07:45 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

Cervantes said:
Wow... you played the immaturity card.

According to you, I am immature because YOU couldn't spell.

You may wish to review the rules of this forum before you play that card again. Just because I know how to spell, does not make me immature.

I called you on what you LITERALLY said... and you (gently) attacked me personally. Your attack was unfounded.

Don't worry, I am a big boy, I can take it... but watch who you insinuate is immature. And please, check YOU ( :smile: ) spelling if you have a point to make.

My point stands... if you want me to understand YOU ( :smile: ) point... please, make YOU ( :smile: ) point more clearly next time.





Poor baby.. I help you one last time:


I call you immature, cause you try to hang up in one missing letter, rather than reading what is told you...

This is what immature people like you do. When they cannot argue what is said, they pick on the little things like a missing 'r' in you'r' .. Again, I will not baby sit for you, you should let that anger out on someone who care to aid you.. :smile:

This is exactly what you sought for, though, and I know it, so now I shall stop feeding this troll! I hope you grow up some day.. And maybe we could speak then.

:laugh:

I hope you understand that I will not reply to you no more, as said, I do not care for baby sitting. :smile:


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: Gomp]
    #7849986 - 01/08/08 07:47 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

Gomp said:

Poor baby

I call you immature.

This is what immature people like you do.

I do not care for baby sitting.




You(r) words... not mine.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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Offlinewyldeman007
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Re: Imagination [Re: Droz]
    #7850114 - 01/08/08 08:09 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Immortality for atheists?

As most of you know, your brain produces electromagnetic spikes at the cellular level. These brainwave patterns contain a minute amount of energy which in turn are absorbed and re-radiated. These waves (incredibly tiny) eventually escape your body and travel into the atmosphere. Emanating out of the solar system and gradually pass into the outer cosmos. So in a sense a part of you does live on forever (indisputably).

So fellow atheist you do have something to look forward to after all..
er,
uh.. yeah.


Edited by wyldeman007 (01/08/08 10:28 PM)


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: wyldeman007]
    #7850722 - 01/08/08 09:43 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Who said I was an Atheist?

I never did.

Are you talking to somebody else?

I have the capacity for spiritual thought... and sometimes I entertain such thoughts... but I do my best to never claim something is real unless it has been proven.

SPIRITUALity and IMAG(E)ination, by their very definitions, both live in the mind... and not in the tangible world.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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Offlinewyldeman007
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7851002 - 01/08/08 10:29 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

I'm talking to atheists and anyone who would find it interesting..


--------------------

"We are going to die, and that makes us the lucky ones. Most people are never going to die because they are never going to be born. The potential people who could have been here in my place but who will in fact never see the light of day outnumber the sand grains of Arabia. Certainly those unborn ghosts include greater poets than Keats, scientists greater than Newton. We know this because the set of possible people allowed by our DNA so massively exceeds the set of actual people. In the teeth of these stupefying odds it is you and I, in our ordinariness, that are here." - Richard Dawkins


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OfflineKickleM
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7851066 - 01/08/08 10:40 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Just an FYI, I don't think English is Gomp's first language, and it is disheartening to hear the reactions to his perfectly understandable posts.


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: Kickle]
    #7851455 - 01/08/08 11:48 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Good point Kickle. :blush:

This thread had so many confusing posts... starting with the first... even my GF was pulling her hair out trying to read it.

I was already carried away playing grammar police before Gomp posted his first reply. I TOTALLY forgot Gomp is from the great Scandinavian north. I would have razzed him differently had I remembered... because he can certainly run circles around me in Norwegian.

My apologies to Gomp and anyone else who was offended.

Gomp did make a very good point. I dismissed it entirely.

That said, I don't like being called a baby. Perhaps this public apology will show Gomp that I do have a few mature bones in my body.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



Edited by Rose (01/09/08 12:02 AM)


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Imagination [Re: Rose]
    #7852793 - 01/09/08 09:35 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

Cervantes said:
Who said I was an Atheist?

I never did.

Are you talking to somebody else?

I have the capacity for spiritual thought... and sometimes I entertain such thoughts... but I do my best to never claim something is real unless it has been proven.

SPIRITUALity and IMAG(E)ination, by their very definitions, both live in the mind... and not in the tangible world. 




:thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Imagination [Re: Gomp]
    #7853574 - 01/09/08 01:12 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

Gomp said:

See? You try to blame me for your interpretation...

As you say, I said: "Anything real, has been realized, anything imagined, can be!"
... you can read this as you like, but there is no reason you should leave out the fact that what I am saying, also could be interpreted as; Anything that is imagined can be realized, even if only as pure imagination! ...

However, I usually do not explain like this, cause it might limit what I said, as other find other interpretations.. But, it is almost sad to see you be hung up in only one as if that is what I intended to say..

Reason I use one-liners like that, is cause it would take a small book to explain every aspect of it..

:monkeydance:






Yeah... I see what you are saying... sorry I dissed your post without acknowledging your point.

I owe you a response.

I think we both interpreted your quote in quite the same way... but I too was skipping some points because this IS a difficult topic to discuss clearly.

Anything CAN exist in the imagination. I agree completely. And in THAT sense... even GOD undeniably exists.

But...

Your quote *can be* :smirk: misleading.

Far too many people today think the phrase, "Create your own reality" means, "If you believe in something hard enough, it will become true and real."

eg: "The Secret"





p.s. Don't tell me I'm the only one here, who has mistakenly imagined some American 20-something, who can't spell or write in his OWN language, to be the average Shroomerite.

Again Gomp, my sincerest apologies.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



Edited by Rose (01/09/08 01:23 PM)


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