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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: SoY]
    #7847381 - 01/08/08 10:57 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

I base my opinions on the available information.

At the moment, it looks like Iran was completely in the wrong. But journalists have a way of digging up the truth.

If the facts change, I'll change my mind.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleSoY
I am the LizardKing
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Registered: 06/01/06
Posts: 774
Loc: Everywhere
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: Diploid]
    #7847385 - 01/08/08 11:00 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Fair enough.


--------------------

"The choiceless truth of who you are is revealed to be permanently here permeating everything. Not a thing and not separate from anything."--Gaganji
"Yesterday is but today's memory and tomorrow is today's dream."
"My karma ran over my dogma!"


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: jasonpwnd]
    #7847399 - 01/08/08 11:04 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

What would we have done?

We would have watched carefully to make sure they didn't stray into our territorial waters or fired on our interests.

We sure as fuck would not have dropped boxes in the water and called on the radio to warn of an impending explosion. WTF was that supposed to accomplish?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleSoY
I am the LizardKing
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Registered: 06/01/06
Posts: 774
Loc: Everywhere
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: SoY]
    #7847402 - 01/08/08 11:05 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

It just seems counterintuitive though. In a conflict between the two countries, the U.S. would benefit and Iran would suffer. It is unlikely that they would attempt to bring that upon themselves.

It's like at the schoolyard. When the principal asks what happened, the bully says he beat up the wimp in self-defense.....


--------------------

"The choiceless truth of who you are is revealed to be permanently here permeating everything. Not a thing and not separate from anything."--Gaganji
"Yesterday is but today's memory and tomorrow is today's dream."
"My karma ran over my dogma!"


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OfflineBrAiN
Art Fag
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Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 6,875
Loc: Chocolate City
Last seen: 2 years, 5 months
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: Diploid]
    #7847407 - 01/08/08 11:06 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
What would we have done?

We would have watched carefully to make sure they didn't stray into our territorial waters or fired on our interests.

We sure as fuck would not have dropped boxes in the water and called on the radio to warn of an impending explosion. WTF was that supposed to accomplish?




Especially if Russia was involved in an ongoing high-profile operation in Virgina


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Offlinejasonpwnd
Learnin'
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Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 499
Loc: the flip side
Last seen: 13 years, 30 days
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: Diploid]
    #7847411 - 01/08/08 11:07 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

OK my bad, here's the down low on international waters in case you were wondering.

Just so you know neither Iran, nor the U.S. has ratified the UN's Law of the Sea, which entails all laws regarding the waters near and abroad. So according to both countries those waters were not international.

AND: Iran knows we have talked of at least quartering our troops in their country, with or without their permission.

You're telling me that if I threw this situation at you, you wouldn't investigate at all? (Keeping in mind these ships are capable of dealing serious damage, neither of you approves of the international waters rule, the other country has talked of quartering unwanted troops in your land (because these 'peace-keepers' have fucked up so much shit across the middle-east already), keeping in mind this is all happening very close to your biggest oil reserves (which are all your country is good for)...

Also, get your facts straight, nobody attacked anybody.

I'm not trying to insult you but your ethics are seriously fucked up, did you read this article or just take the quotes that were given to you and decide to blindly defend them to the death instead of opening your mind to what other people point out with facts?

Edit: I'm not saying that Iran was right to make that scene, but there probably wasn't a good reason for U.S. warships to be traveling through a free-trade route near oil reserves. Iran was right to investigate the U.S. ships.


--------------------

Disclaimer: Everything I say is a lie intended to make my e-reputation more prestigious.


Edited by jasonpwnd (01/08/08 11:13 AM)


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: SoY]
    #7847430 - 01/08/08 11:14 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

It just seems counterintuitive though. In a conflict between the two countries, the U.S. would benefit and Iran would suffer. It is unlikely that they would attempt to bring that upon themselves.

You don't understand Muslims or Islam.

Dying, suffering, torture, decapitation, dead children, [fill in the blank with your favorite horror] are all perfectly acceptable if it furthers their moronic religious goals.

Dying in a war with the US only guarantees more virgins in heaven.

You have to stop thinking with logic and common sense if you want to understand how these people behave and think.

The logic that works in a schoolyard doesn't work with Muslims. Kids in a schoolyard are motivated to live. Muslims are motivated to get their heavenly virgins at ANY COST.

WW3 is a non-issue to these people. If the generations of ongoing, non-stop war in that part of the world doesn't demonstrate this to you, I dunno what will.

Also, get your facts straight, nobody attacked anybody.

Calling on the radio to tell someone their death is imminent followed by dropping something in the water in the path of the ship is an attack.

but there probably wasn't a good reason for U.S. warships to be traveling through a free-trade route near oil reserves

You don't need a good reason to be in FUCKING INTERNATIONAL WATERS near other US interests.

You sound like the cop that stops some poor slop minding his business at 3am because the cop decided that nobody should be out on the sidewalk at 3am.

It's a fucking sidewalk. You can be there any fucking time you want with or without a reason. Just like international waters.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Offlinejasonpwnd
Learnin'
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Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 499
Loc: the flip side
Last seen: 13 years, 30 days
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: Diploid]
    #7847441 - 01/08/08 11:18 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

exactly, so why go there and look for trouble in the first place?


--------------------

Disclaimer: Everything I say is a lie intended to make my e-reputation more prestigious.


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: jasonpwnd]
    #7847453 - 01/08/08 11:19 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Not to look for trouble. To protect our (and our allies') many interests in that part of the world.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleYidakiMan
Stranger
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/28/02
Posts: 2,023
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: Diploid]
    #7847487 - 01/08/08 11:29 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Thank god Bush will be gone in a year. After 8 years in office, I'm sick to fucking death of this "America is always wrong" bullshit coming from America's young adults. It is a shame, the leaders of these misled youths are just like the Ori in Stargate. They gain power from your belief.


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InvisibleYidakiMan
Stranger
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/28/02
Posts: 2,023
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: YidakiMan]
    #7847505 - 01/08/08 11:35 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Its fucking amazing really.
Headlines:
America invades Iraq
Blame Bush!
America's Navy just averted a war.
Blame Bush!
Blame America!



Seriously this shit is boring.


Edited by YidakiMan (01/08/08 12:46 PM)


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Invisiblezorbman
blarrr
Male


Registered: 06/04/04
Posts: 5,952
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: YidakiMan]
    #7847558 - 01/08/08 11:57 AM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Personally, I am proud that this generation has the balls to question authority.

But I don't think this type of skepticism is generational so much as observational. Most of us came of age after Vietnam and Watergate. More recently we witnessed the cherry-picking and distortion of intelligence used to justify the Iraq war. We don't swallow just anything before examining it first.

Once bit, twice shy.

We don't get fooled again.

Quote:

Seriously this shit is boring, grow the fuck up.




Take your own advice.


--------------------
“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch


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Offlinejasonpwnd
Learnin'
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Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 499
Loc: the flip side
Last seen: 13 years, 30 days
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: zorbman]
    #7847579 - 01/08/08 12:02 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

i would rather blindly distrust until facts are shown from which i can make my own decisions, than to blindly throw my allegiance to the place i was coincidentally born in.


--------------------

Disclaimer: Everything I say is a lie intended to make my e-reputation more prestigious.


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
liberal pussy
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Registered: 05/21/02
Posts: 5,646
Loc: innsmouth..MA
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: zorbman]
    #7847615 - 01/08/08 12:10 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

zorbman said:
Or perhaps the Bush admin is trying to create an incident.

They certainly don't have a history of clean hands when it comes to rationales for war.




this latest incident w/ the boats positively reeks of a false-flag operation if you ask me...and faced with the genuine possibility of losing the 2008 election..the repubnicans have more incentive than ever to start a war...


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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InvisibleYidakiMan
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Registered: 09/28/02
Posts: 2,023
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: zorbman]
    #7847620 - 01/08/08 12:12 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

zorbman said:
Personally, I am proud that this generation has the balls to question authority.

But I don't think this type of skepticism is generational so much as observational. Most of us came of age after Vietnam and Watergate. More recently we witnessed the cherry-picking and distortion of intelligence used to justify the Iraq war. We don't swallow just anything before examining it first.

Once bit, twice shy.

We don't get fooled again.





That's not rational or logical, that is guilt by association and it is holding up progress and it is holding up change. You are the problem that stands in the way of change.

Bush = Bad. I understand that you think that. I think everyone else understands this is how you think. That is why your side, our side, has self destructed.


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Invisiblezorbman
blarrr
Male


Registered: 06/04/04
Posts: 5,952
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: YidakiMan]
    #7847649 - 01/08/08 12:20 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

That's not rational or logical, that is guilt by association and it is holding up progress and it is holding up change. You are the problem that stands in the way of change.




:rofl2:



--------------------
“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch


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InvisibleYidakiMan
Stranger
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Registered: 09/28/02
Posts: 2,023
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: zorbman]
    #7847666 - 01/08/08 12:26 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

More irrational argument, ridicule. You can discredit someone by showing their claims are ridiculous. But you can't show someone is ridiculous by laughing at their point of view.


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InvisibleSoY
I am the LizardKing
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Registered: 06/01/06
Posts: 774
Loc: Everywhere
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: zorbman]
    #7847667 - 01/08/08 12:26 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:

You don't understand Muslims or Islam.

Dying, suffering, torture, decapitation, dead children, [fill in the blank with your favorite horror] are all perfectly acceptable if it furthers their moronic religious goals.

Dying in a war with the US only guarantees more virgins in heaven.

You have to stop thinking with logic and common sense if you want to understand how these people behave and think.

The logic that works in a schoolyard doesn't work with Muslims. Kids in a schoolyard are motivated to live. Muslims are motivated to get their heavenly virgins at ANY COST.

WW3 is a non-issue to these people. If the generations of ongoing, non-stop war in that part of the world doesn't demonstrate this to you, I dunno what will.





I believe it is you that does not understand Islam. Suicide is against Islamic Law. One who commits suicide is denied paradise and cast into the fire. However, radical cults and sects have manipulated this to classify suicide terrorism as "martyrdom" against their oppressors. Our occupation of their sacred land allows their *holy* leaders to motivate young, ignorant Muslim men to commit suicide terrorism in the fight against the Imperial Satan (AKA U.S.). You fail to see that in their eyes, they are fighting for the freedom of their country, their religion, and their lifestyle.

Your gross generalizations of Muslims demonstrates your lack of knowledge of true Islam and the real reasons why some want to kill us.


--------------------

"The choiceless truth of who you are is revealed to be permanently here permeating everything. Not a thing and not separate from anything."--Gaganji
"Yesterday is but today's memory and tomorrow is today's dream."
"My karma ran over my dogma!"


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Invisiblezorbman
blarrr
Male


Registered: 06/04/04
Posts: 5,952
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: YidakiMan]
    #7847692 - 01/08/08 12:32 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

YidakiMan said:
More irrational argument, ridicule.  You can discredit someone by showing their claims are ridiculous.  But you can't show someone is ridiculous by laughing at their point of view.




I felt derisive laughter was all the response your post deserved. :shrug:


--------------------
“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch


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InvisibleSoY
I am the LizardKing
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Registered: 06/01/06
Posts: 774
Loc: Everywhere
Re: Iranian Navy threatens U.S. ships [Re: SoY]
    #7847706 - 01/08/08 12:36 PM (16 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

YidakiMan said:
That's not rational or logical, that is guilt by association and it is holding up progress and it is holding up change.




It is not rational or logical to deny the possibility of us being purposefully mislead after there have been multiple instances where this has occurred. It is not rational or logical to accept on faith alone that we're not being lied to. It is not rational or logical to suppress skepticism in the name of patriotism.


--------------------

"The choiceless truth of who you are is revealed to be permanently here permeating everything. Not a thing and not separate from anything."--Gaganji
"Yesterday is but today's memory and tomorrow is today's dream."
"My karma ran over my dogma!"


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
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