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Droz
Love of Life



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Panthiest
#7834705 - 01/05/08 08:12 AM (16 years, 27 days ago) |
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Google Defintion -
*One who identifies God with nature and vice versa. If we have to regard Deity as an infinite and omnipresent Principle, this can hardly be ...
*From the Greek words "pan" (all) and "theos" (God). God is all. The belief that every existing entity (humans, animals, etc.) together, is a part of God. The entire universe is divine. ...
*Pantheism (Greek: πάν ( 'pan' ) = all and θεός ( 'theos' ) = God) literally means "God is All" and "All is God". It is the view that everything is of an all-encompassing immanent God; or that the universe, or nature, and God are equivalent. ...
-------------------- Evolution of Time.
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machination
Stranger

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Re: Panthiest [Re: Droz]
#7834738 - 01/05/08 08:46 AM (16 years, 27 days ago) |
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awe 'll el take us there, the threads you weave i weave aswell
-------------------- "Have you not learned that your word is bond? Yes, my word is bond and bond is life, I shall give my life, before my word shall fail."
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



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Re: Panthiest [Re: Droz]
#7834739 - 01/05/08 08:46 AM (16 years, 27 days ago) |
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That's my religion.
-------------------- ...or something
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Panthiest [Re: Droz]
#7835404 - 01/05/08 12:41 PM (16 years, 27 days ago) |
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Quote:
Droz said: Google Defintion -
*One who identifies God with nature and vice versa. If we have to regard Deity as an infinite and omnipresent Principle, this can hardly be ...
*From the Greek words "pan" (all) and "theos" (God). God is all. The belief that every existing entity (humans, animals, etc.) together, is a part of God. The entire universe is divine. ...
*Pantheism (Greek: πάν ( 'pan' ) = all and θεός ( 'theos' ) = God) literally means "God is All" and "All is God". It is the view that everything is of an all-encompassing immanent God; or that the universe, or nature, and God are equivalent. ...
I wonder if pantheism was easier to practice in personal and private and so not so much in need of priests and authority figures and so not so easy a tool of population control. Anyone got any thoughts on this?
Maybe it had something to do with folk not living in tight little villages and cities.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
Edited by Icelander (01/05/08 12:42 PM)
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Droz
Love of Life



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The church collects people, minds and all. Then based on current events and situations like war they manipulate those minds to believe whatever the preacher is preaching that day.
It's mind control at it's best.
I'm sure the priests feel as if they are seeking power over others since he can justify things with words about the bible.
-------------------- Evolution of Time.
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MarkostheGnostic
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Re: Panthiest [Re: Droz]
#7835768 - 01/05/08 02:08 PM (16 years, 27 days ago) |
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Pan, son of Hermes and Penelope (wife of Odysseus, in some versions) or a daughter of King Dryops.
PAN- Half man, half goat, with horns on his brow and lust in his eyes. Son of Hermes and a daughter of the Dryops, he was the God of pastoral regions and wilderness. Special friend of shepherds, he guided and protected them from afar. Protector of all wild things and places. His pipes had an aphrodisiac effect on those who heard them and induced mating. Pan was a lecherand a drunk who constantly pursued nymphs who would flee in terror. Caves rang with their cries when he caught them. He was famous for his rages, where he attacked anyone who got in his way. His irrational behavior led people to flee him in "panic." He was dangerous when he took possession of a being. The possessed, or panoleptic, took on his bearing and would wander in the wild, laugh madly, or throw themselves on others for sex without respect to gender, or have epileptic fits.
Clearly not a high or transcendent deity, Pan is the classical representation of nature taken in its entirety. In the animal domain, unbridled polymorphous sexuality and unconscious (drunken) stupor are typified by the mythic character. Not being transcendent, the figure is representative of the unconscious end of nature's continuum, not the superconsciousness that human mammals (Centuric or Satyric humans) turned human beings can attain to, a balance between the animal and the angelic domains in humanoid form.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Droz
Love of Life



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MarkosTheGnostic - It seems you are a firm believer in Mythos.
You call yourself Gnostic because you have read and remember all the stories of Mythological creatures from here and afar.
But what it is about you, you behind that knowledge, what do you have? Just another thought wanderer?
I bet you are just like everyone else, with the supposed knowledge.
Peace, Droz
-------------------- Evolution of Time.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Clearly not a high or transcendent deity
In other words all to human. And to "transend" that is the goal of those Who fear their humanity. Pan is also the Green Man I believe. All that is natural, growing, wild and free.
Pantheism isn't really about Pan is it? Doesn't Pantheism mean "all inclusive"?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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xFrockx



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Everything is made of God.
-Me tripping
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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Re: Panthiest [Re: Droz]
#7838666 - 01/06/08 10:11 AM (16 years, 26 days ago) |
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I do not believe in myth, I understand its place in the human psyche, primarily from a Jungian perspective. Our home space is decorated with mythic themes in every room. The living room hosts Jewish, Christian, Greek and Egyptian items, one bathroom is primarily Egyptian, meditation room Hindu and Buddhist, etc. We have been tremendously influenced by Jean Shinoda-Bolen's books: Gods in Every Man and Goddesses in Every Woman.
This has nothing to do with a Shroomery tag that I chose when I registered. Gnosticism may contain numerous mythologies, but mythology is not gnosis. I have had glimpses of Awakening. The Awakening is Gnosis and I am dedicated to further Awakening, hence the choice of name.
You seem to be confusing your projections about me, with me, whom you do not know. I am typologically (MBTI) in a minority of Americans, so I am not exactly like everyone else in how I process life. The Awakening is not "supposed knowledge," and the type of knowledge that 'gnosis' consists in is different from conceptual 'episteme.' Gnosis is equivalent to mystical experience wherein knowledge is of a direct experiential type.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
Edited by MarkostheGnostic (01/06/08 02:26 PM)
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MarkostheGnostic
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No, Pan is not representative of humanity, mythically speaking. Unlike a demigod or hero which was fathered by the Absolute God, Zeus, Hermes and Penelope (or variant) and Hermes and Aphrodite, produced aberrant offspring which have their specific mythic meanings. Hermes and Aphrodite produced Hermaphroditus - a being with male and female psychophysical attributes. It was a union indicating wholeness.
Pan means 'All' and by 'All' nature (physis) was being suggested. The emphasis was pretty much on the alleged lustiness of goats, and as sexuality was repressed and demonized later by Christianity, Pan was the image that morphed into the Christian devil, with barbed tail and Neptune's trident added to the cloven hooves and horns. Nature itself was vilified by Christianity since the devil was god of this world, and Hell was seen as being in the bowels of the Earth in the mythic cosmology.
There a nice bronze of Pan in the living room and some Green Men and Women in the living room. Not visible is a statue of Hestia next to the stove (hearth/heart) and above the stove (and close to our hearts ) is a fresco of Eros receiving wine from Dionysius (sex and drugs!). I was only qualifying mythic domains, not passing a judgement against nature - from which my very fabric is woven. 'I' as awareness, interpenetrate my form, but awareness is not a substance (Greeks were wed to the notion of substance), and is not 'contained' in, but co-exists with, my form, hence the transcendental nature of consciousness. Spiritually, I am a Panenthiest due to this distinction.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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MarkostheGnostic
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Re: Panthiest [Re: xFrockx]
#7838809 - 01/06/08 10:49 AM (16 years, 26 days ago) |
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Quote:
xFrockx said: Everything is made of God.
True for a Kabbalist, untrue for a Buddhist. The Truth can be described variously, yet exactly how and why form emerges from Formlessness (God, Clear Light) is The Mystery.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Droz
Love of Life



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Thanks for clearing that up Markos.
I was wondering, do you believe one faith? Or are you knowledgable about many faiths and religions, not choosing one but taking bits of info from each to conclude your beliefs?
Peace, Droz
-------------------- Evolution of Time.
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MarkostheGnostic
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Re: Panthiest [Re: Droz]
#7839748 - 01/06/08 02:24 PM (16 years, 26 days ago) |
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At this point, I 'believe' only one thing: that Ultimate Reality is ONE, indivisible and eternal. I left the faith of my fathers by the time I was 13, but I do remember my own father teaching me the Hebrew Shema when I was only 3. We'd say it before I went to sleep and it was more of a profession of faith than any kind of petitionary 'Now I lay me down to sleep...' kind of prayer:
"Shema Y'Isroel, Adonai Elohanu, Adonai Echod" - Hear O Israel, the Lord thy God is One Lord.
I went on a long pilgrimage from magick to Zen to Yoga to Neoplatonism to Western Christianity to Eastern Christianity to Messianic Judaism to Kabbalism to the Present. I have integrated and synthesized all kinds of thinking, but it all comes back to ONE. I reject a Trinitarian God for a Unitarian God. What the nature of The ONE is, is pretension to say. I practice classical Yoga. I read about (but do not practice ritual) magick inasmuch as Judaism and Christianity, while forbidding thaumaturgy, both are riddled with Theurgy.
Neoplatonism is interactive with much Kabbalistic thought in their speculations about how multiplicity emanates from The ONE even though their conclusions about how to live differ. Buddhism accepts the ONE and multiplicity, but usually focuses on how human psychology divides the Nirvana from Samsara, Nirvana being the psychic awareness of the Eternal Clear Light.
Like light being understood as both particle and wave, depending on the context, I can grok that Ultimate Reality can be both personal and transpersonal - with attributes and without attributes. I can pray to the former God, but I can only dwell in the latter. Hindu thought has room for both - simultaneously. I can dwell without asking, but I can't ask without dwelling.
Once again, because I fell asleep in life for many years, like Rumplestiltskin, I see myself as a philosopher, primarily. A Jewish Christian Gnostic philosopher with Buddhist leanings. There is no doctrine that I endorse whole-heartedly although one can follow the precepts of Patanjali's Yoga and follow the precepts of the Buddhist Four Noble Truths simultaneously and without conflict. I can recognize that God is ONE, that there is The ONE in Neoplatonism, in Buddhism and in Yoga. I can further see that "Christ is the way, the truth and the life..." and understand that the word Tao also means 'way,' and that it is the SAME WAY, without confusion or contradiction because being in Christ and being in Tao are phenomenologically identical though doctrinally very different.
So, as the title of an influential book by Frithjof Schuon put it, I suppose I 'believe' in The Transcendent Unity of Religions. I do not obey the 613 commandments of Judaism, but I do adhere to Jewish ethics (of which Jesus was an exponent) and of late, I've been lighting Sabbath candles because in fact, I have always felt that Friday evening and Saturdays were for rest and relaxation, while Sunday is the first day of the week and I prepare for Monday on Sunday. We just took down our Sears 9' Christmas tree - Pagan to its non-existent roots, but a symbol of light and life and festivity nonetheless. In the inner world of the psyche, Tibetan Buddhism probably corners the market on its grasp of mind at the micro levels of awareness. Not 'belief,' but experiential and scientific in its classifications. (Can a Christian be compromised in integrity from using Arabic-Muslim algebra?).
It is not a matter of what one believes because beliefs are thoughts and thoughts about Ultimate Reality are only thoughts ABOUT Reality, not Reality itself. I'll leave you with a saying from 2005's Zen calendar that incorporates Christian and Buddhist 'thought':
"You may call God love, you may call God goodness. But the best name for God is compassion." - Meister Eckhart
I am, in the final analysis, just a person who is becoming aware of all of these things, and the mind-body assumes many of the forms of each in its awareness of them. Thanks for your interest.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Panthiest [Re: xFrockx]
#7839927 - 01/06/08 02:53 PM (16 years, 26 days ago) |
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Quote:
xFrockx said: Everything is made of God.
-Me tripping
Brilliant
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
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I 'believe' only one thing: that Ultimate Reality is ONE, indivisible and eternal.
Gee Markos, we believe the same thing. I knew you'd come around. It's just good science.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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machination
Stranger

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eat rocks
-------------------- "Have you not learned that your word is bond? Yes, my word is bond and bond is life, I shall give my life, before my word shall fail."
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Faaip_De_Oiad
as above, so below



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oh, I thought it said panty-ist. 
I've always thought that no matter what belief system you hold, if you believe in some higher power/intelligence you're talking about the same thing as everyone else, you just happen to call it a different name, and believe different things about your creator's personality, which are all just projections of your own.
I've been forced to believe that there is a higher power, it just has fun watching us suffer, or at least it just doesn't give a shit about our petty concerns. but what do I know? i'm just a chaoist with a sense of humor.
excuse me, a panty-ist.
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MeatyVitamin
The Majority



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Is God everything in pantheism? Or everything alive?
I posted this a while back on a self-concocted version of religion, I think it might be pantheism but I'm not exactly sure.
The universe is made of atoms and the like, tiny pieces of matter that go about their days according to laws of the universe that they cannot change, nor have the will to change. In this universe there is no "freedom" because there is no choice involved, there is only the interaction of matter and perhaps a measure of luck involved with each reaction.
In contrast to this is any form of life. The individual cell doesn't simply go about it days according to the laws of the universe, it takes active part in its world and changes things according to its needs and wants. The same could be said about humanity; we don't operate according to some universal principles and our free will is what separates us from the rest of the universe. We actively mess around with things and create what would never have existed, we essentially are a wrench in the cogs of the universe.
I'm seeing the universe as a system of order whereas the second you introduce life into the mix you get an aspect of chaos. But to deny this chaos is to devolve into something without purpose, because without choice how can there be purpose? If we just go to work, come home and sleep, rinse and repeat until we die, how are we any different than a star in a galaxy that revolves until it burns out, our existence would have no meaning beyond continuing to uphold the stability. But if we go imagine and create according to our free will we will have truly used our freedom.
-------------------- I like to keep my work life and my home life seperate. My job doesn't know I have a wife, and my wife doesn't know I have a job.
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machination
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every particle is sentient, all is mody according to this late harvest vidal
-------------------- "Have you not learned that your word is bond? Yes, my word is bond and bond is life, I shall give my life, before my word shall fail."
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