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satyr
אתה בעצמך יודע

Registered: 11/13/07
Posts: 3,396
Loc: Alpha Canis Majoris
Last seen: 11 years, 4 months
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smokable mimosa hostilis??
#7816787 - 12/31/07 11:54 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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after boiling down mimosa hostilis root bark for ayahuasca,the liquid left a thin, plastic-like residue on the bottom of the container. Has anyone ever tried smoking this? Im sure there is some DMT in residue, but would it be safe to smoke?
-------------------- Looking for Astrophytum asterias specimens; have cacti for trade
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Overclock22
Here, There andBack Again



Registered: 09/19/07
Posts: 208
Loc: NY
Last seen: 13 years, 1 month
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: satyr]
#7816800 - 12/31/07 11:59 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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well so long as you just used water to boil it down sure but its going to be one painful smoke.
-------------------- He did not laugh as his eyes stopped in awareness of the earth around him. His face was like a law of nature-a thing one could not question, alter or implore. It had high cheekbones over gaunt, hollow cheeks; gray eyes, cold and steady; a contemptuous mouth, shut tight, the mouth of an executioner or a saint. If you wake up at a different time in a different place, can you wake up a different person? Cf. A.C. Doyle "I'll rise above this, you can't keep me down, for I am Divine, and I know it all too well."
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muistrue
Inspired by the mystery


Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 12,899
Loc: Behind the Redwoods
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: satyr]
#7816911 - 12/31/07 12:30 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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The DMT is still a salt. You have to basify it to convert to smokable freebase. There are teks all over the web that tell you how to get smokable DMT from mimosa hostilis.
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Robo
R Series 66Y
Registered: 05/08/07
Posts: 14,861
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: muistrue]
#7817139 - 12/31/07 01:44 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yeah don't smoke unless you do an extraction, there are many methods out there (although similar) like its been said and its very easy to do.
I don't think he's looking at DMT salt, as I'm pretty sure DMT exists in Mimosa Hostilis as it's freebase form. For it to be a salt now he would have had to extract and add freebase to an acidic solution and converted to HCl yada yada. Doing that gets you a goo, so maybe that's you're reasoning for believing the residue he is looking at is its 'salt'.
And as for smoking an alakaloid in it's salt form, it can be done but the tempurature must be significantly higher to vaporize it and it's a dumb choice anyway. (Which is why people smoke freebase over salt, lower vaporization temp. It's like smoking crack vs. cocaine)
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xFrockx



Registered: 09/17/06
Posts: 10,455
Loc: Northeast
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: Robo]
#7817181 - 12/31/07 01:54 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've tried smoking it before, nothing happened for me.
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muistrue
Inspired by the mystery


Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 12,899
Loc: Behind the Redwoods
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: Robo]
#7817213 - 12/31/07 02:03 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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DMT is in salt form in the bark. That's why you basify in all the extraction teks. You're right about DMT salt's higher melting point. If you smoke the salt the heat will destroy the DMT before you get a hit. That is why we smoke the freebase.
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Robo
R Series 66Y
Registered: 05/08/07
Posts: 14,861
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: muistrue]
#7817234 - 12/31/07 02:07 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Is it? I wasn't sure.
All I know is that if you try and convert freebase to HCl salts you get a sludge or goo-like substance. There's no such thing as an actual DMT HCl powder I don't think
Edited by Ombient (12/31/07 03:00 PM)
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Robo
R Series 66Y
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Posts: 14,861
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: Robo]
#7817257 - 12/31/07 02:14 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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And I was pretty sure the point of adding sodium hydroxide was to raise the ph, increasing the alkaloid's solubility.
Edited by Ombient (12/31/07 02:15 PM)
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muistrue
Inspired by the mystery


Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 12,899
Loc: Behind the Redwoods
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: Robo]
#7817282 - 12/31/07 02:24 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Omni said: There's no such thing as an actual DMT HCl powder.
Why would you think that? From Tihkal "The resulting crystals were recrystalized from benzene/methanol to give N,N-dimethyltryptamine hydrochloride with a mp of 165-167C. The yield from 14g of the amide was 13.3 g of the salt."
Strassman used hcl in his studies as well.
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muistrue
Inspired by the mystery


Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 12,899
Loc: Behind the Redwoods
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: Robo]
#7817295 - 12/31/07 02:28 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Omni said: And I was pretty sure the point of adding sodium hydroxide was to raise the ph, increasing the alkaloid's solubility.
True, it does do that. But you add the base (sodium hydroxide) to convert the salt to freebase form.
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Robo
R Series 66Y
Registered: 05/08/07
Posts: 14,861
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: muistrue]
#7817298 - 12/31/07 02:28 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I could have sworn that I read about the HCl being a goo (Shulgin) 
I'll go back and check tihkal
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muistrue
Inspired by the mystery


Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 12,899
Loc: Behind the Redwoods
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: Robo]
#7817315 - 12/31/07 02:33 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Go to page 415. He says that recipe is the only claim af a valid hcl salt of DMT. The original Manske synthesis ended with a yellow resin.
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Robo
R Series 66Y
Registered: 05/08/07
Posts: 14,861
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: muistrue]
#7817414 - 12/31/07 02:56 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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First part.

Second part.

So the only way to get hcl salts is from indole or from using benzene/methanol? I'm not understanding.
So it is possible, just not done often. Shulgin himself says he has had no personal success in getting the hcl salt. He doesn't even give a reference or source as to who successfully got it, just mentions "the literature" 
The yellow resin is the form i was aware of.
h/o if you don't know, I know a nigga who might
Edited by Ombient (12/31/07 03:09 PM)
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muistrue
Inspired by the mystery


Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 12,899
Loc: Behind the Redwoods
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: Robo]
#7817499 - 12/31/07 03:19 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I'm not a chemist so I don't know. Just like you I'm just going by what I've read. I knew it did exist so I was letting you know. It's also interesting that Strassman had Dave Nichols synthesize DMT hcl for his studies back in 1990. He doesn't say how it looked just that it was "nearly 100 percent pure." Right when Strassman received the DMT he had it diluted in to saltwater which is how it was administered IV to his subjects.
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Robo
R Series 66Y
Registered: 05/08/07
Posts: 14,861
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: muistrue]
#7817513 - 12/31/07 03:22 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
FractalDust said: I'm not a chemist so I don't know.
acyl where is you bitch
Edited by Ombient (12/31/07 03:49 PM)
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satyr
אתה בעצמך יודע

Registered: 11/13/07
Posts: 3,396
Loc: Alpha Canis Majoris
Last seen: 11 years, 4 months
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: Robo]
#7817600 - 12/31/07 03:51 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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great, thanks for the info. i have plenty of mimosa, and have been planning on doing an extraction with that, i was just wondering if i could salvage the residue instead of trashing it.
-------------------- Looking for Astrophytum asterias specimens; have cacti for trade
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Robo
R Series 66Y
Registered: 05/08/07
Posts: 14,861
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Re: smokable mimosa hostilis?? [Re: satyr]
#7817602 - 12/31/07 03:52 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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trash it
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