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MrAbstraction
Twing!


Registered: 07/17/00
Posts: 75
Last seen: 15 years, 1 month
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The internet is a series of tubes... is a mycelium network?
#7807675 - 12/28/07 03:12 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Hey Shroomery;
I'm curious about the behaviour and "awareness" of a mycelium network within a substrate.
Specifically, I'm wondering if each part of the network "knows" about the nutritional and moisture content of the entire volume of the substrate, or if a given region's "knowledge" is localized to an area immediately around it.
For example, does the top of a cake know that there is more water at the bottom of the cake, and therefore not fruit?
What information do we have on how these decisions are made?
The internet is a series of tubes...
Thanks! /ma
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 11 months, 3 days
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Re: The internet is a series of tubes... is a mycelium network? [Re: MrAbstraction]
#7807702 - 12/28/07 03:21 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I know if a cake is dry, you can re-hydrate it by placing in a saucer of water or you can put verm on top and soak it that way. Some folks use a straw or syringe. Whatever method, the moisture content seems to even out, and the water goes to where it's needed. Assuming the substrate is fully colonized, the only real way for water to move around is to get pumped by the mycelium. Since mycelium is composed of long cells that are joined end to end, the individual cells must act as a team to send the water where it's needed.
Whether the mycelium 'knows' or 'feels', etc., is currently restricted to philosophy rather than mycology, awaiting proof that may or may not ever come. Personally, I believe that mycelium is sentient, but that's based on psychic observations rather than scientific ones, thus can't be proved. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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MrAbstraction
Twing!


Registered: 07/17/00
Posts: 75
Last seen: 15 years, 1 month
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Re: The internet is a series of tubes... is a mycelium network? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#7807751 - 12/28/07 03:34 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I see.
The long cells comment spawned a thought that perhaps in an example where you have a two cell mycelium network, the cell on the "left" being "drier" then the cell on the "right", that the cell on the left would pump to the right inorder to even out the content. A chain of this type would even the moisture content over time. I guess I was wondering if a cell at the top of the substrate could "call out" for moisture - but all things being equal, I guess the simplest answer is usually the correct one... 
As far as them being sentient... I think everything is sentient from a certain point of view, so my feelings on that would be biased... 
Thanks RR; /ma
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Cheesekiller
Mad Scientist



Registered: 11/08/04
Posts: 485
Loc: Central NY
Last seen: 1 month, 1 day
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Re: The internet is a series of tubes... is a mycelium network? [Re: MrAbstraction]
#7807783 - 12/28/07 03:44 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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All I know is that just before a first fruit, my casing seems to drive water right to the surface. It as if it is trying to bring the water to the surface for fruiting purposes. Its always an indication that those babies want to pop. So I feel my (even though I use polyspore) substrate is all one organism, and drives the water to where it needs it.
-CK
-------------------- Bulk grower with "some" success. Cloning Machine Nice Lids A few pics of my DT setup
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 11 months, 3 days
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Re: The internet is a series of tubes... is a mycelium network? [Re: Cheesekiller]
#7807804 - 12/28/07 03:54 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I think what actually happens in reality with osmosis is there is a pressure differential across the common cell wall, which allows the water to pass. I have a video taken through the microscope showing the intra and inter-cellular activity going on. It's pretty fascinating to see all the movement, and it's fast movement, like a bunch of fish swimming in a bucket. Here's a still shot of about five or six cells. It's interesting that some of them have three nuclei, instead of the usual 2 seen in dikaryotic mycelium. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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MrAbstraction
Twing!


Registered: 07/17/00
Posts: 75
Last seen: 15 years, 1 month
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Re: The internet is a series of tubes... is a mycelium network? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#7807892 - 12/28/07 04:23 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Awesome! I'd like to see that video... just for kicks.
Following that logic - the mycelium wouldn't actually be "pumping", but rather "pulling". So, CK's observation that the top of the substrate becomes more saturated during fruiting could be explained by the cells at the fruiting layer using thier water more quickly to create/inflate the fruit body cells (err, is "create" the right term there?) hence pulling moisture from the cells the layer below that and those pulling from the cell layer below that, etc, etc.
Makes me want to try flipping my substrate over after pinning with the light source below it...
/ma
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Nibin
Getting there



Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 4,480
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
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Re: The internet is a series of tubes... is a mycelium network? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#7807895 - 12/28/07 04:23 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Capillarity and water cohesion will also play a part. Water tends to climb up thin tubes (capillarity) and water molecules evaporating off the surfaces of the cake will try and pull other molecules off with them, due to the weak interactions between water molecules, creating suction.
-------------------- Newcomers guide-----> For all things shroomy
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