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InvisibleAsante
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What if...
    #7791801 - 12/23/07 09:04 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

What if death was nothing more than the transition from your former life to your next life? What if you leave your world, your body and mind behind, only to reincarnate in another world, another body, and a mind is given to you anew?

What if this reincarnation is endless? What if you have already lived an infinite number of lives, and will live an infinite number of lives more?

So that, in essence, you are eternal. So that, each death ends with a fresh start in a new life, no matter what happens to you.

Just imagine..

Suppose that the situation I just described was the actual truth..
What's your opinion?

discuss!

.
How would you feel about it, if this was the truth?
You may choose only one


Votes accepted from (12/23/07 09:04 AM) to (No end specified)
You must vote before you can view the results of this poll



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InvisibleAsante
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7791803 - 12/23/07 09:06 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

and..

.
Do you think it's like this?
You may choose only one


Votes accepted from (12/23/07 09:06 AM) to (No end specified)
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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7791810 - 12/23/07 09:10 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

If you don't remember your previous lives, it's really no different than dying and rotting in the ground. Unless the reincarnation is working towards something, it's just kind of a recycling of one's "soul" without retaining their previous consciousness.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: What if... [Re: Redstorm]
    #7791819 - 12/23/07 09:17 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

If you don't remember your previous lives, it's really no different than dying and rotting in the ground.





There's a huge difference! In the rotting in the ground scenario, it is over. You will no longer live, love, experience, suffer, triumph, struggle, hug a kitty. With eternal reincarnation however there is no end to the number of new adventures.. you just don't remember you had one before.

If there is eternal reincarnation I hope it's mostly with the amnesia of death (or rather a fresh install on a new machine :smile:) because if you remember, you won't just retain the highs of the former lives, but the lows as well. The pristineness of being a baby, a toddler, a child simply won't be the same. You'll have a lot of luggage from former lives, good and bad.

I love this life, but I rather start anew than being born old :grin:


--------------------
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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: What if... [Re: Redstorm]
    #7791821 - 12/23/07 09:18 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

If you don't remember your previous lives, it's really no different than dying and rotting in the ground.

Why? Do you remember everything from this life? :wink:

Wouldn't you assume that your memory of lifes past would be very poor?


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.


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Offlinedanlennon3
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Re: What if... [Re: Redstorm]
    #7791823 - 12/23/07 09:19 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

maybe we are the first conscious souls and thats why it is so difficult to see past lives :sun:


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"Psychedelics should be used not to escape reality, but to embrace it"



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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: What if... [Re: danlennon3]
    #7791836 - 12/23/07 09:24 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

maybe there's no soul to carry into another life and man just needs the hope to make it through this one


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: What if... [Re: trendal]
    #7791847 - 12/23/07 09:30 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

In addition to that, it's less scientifically plausible.

From a science POV it is relatively easy to assume that time is eternal, the number of possibilities is finite, and big bang explosions are a statistical occurrence. In that case, anything that can exist will exist, and everything that exists will be re-created over and over in every possible way.

Science also assumes that your mind resides in your brain and that memories etc reside in your brain.

Given these assumptions, it seems logical that most of the times you get an new computer, you won't find your old vacation snapshots on the pristine harddrive. Statistically it could happen, but probably it would be a very rare occurrence.


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InvisibleMOTH
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7791881 - 12/23/07 09:48 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

What's your opinion?




I accept it.

Energy constantly recycles itself, even if the form changes.


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InvisibleEgo Death
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Re: What if... [Re: MOTH]
    #7791985 - 12/23/07 10:17 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Thats what I tried explaining to the guys in P&S, but they went mad and wouldn't accept that as a rational for humans :confused:


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InvisibleMistaUNGA
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792034 - 12/23/07 10:33 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Death is only the beginning...


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:gc:
Madtowntripper said:Or just give her a cloroform soaked rag and tell her it's ether!


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InvisibleCherryBomM
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792064 - 12/23/07 10:41 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I almost completely accept your theory. Except it seems to me that a soul would need a rest after all the highs and lows of living a lifetime. A break, if you will. Life is hard work!

So maybe a hundred or a thousand years on the 'other side'...which is really only the blink of an eye to a soul.


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InvisibleBaeosistine
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792107 - 12/23/07 10:55 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:

If you don't remember your previous lives, it's really no different than dying and rotting in the ground.




There's a huge difference! In the rotting in the ground scenario, it is over. You will no longer live, love, experience, suffer, triumph, struggle, hug a kitty. With eternal reincarnation however there is no end to the number of new adventures.. you just don't remember you had one before.




But if you have no memory of the past, then it is irrelevant to you. There would be absoultely no difference between having had 300 past lives and having had zero.


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: What if... [Re: Baeosistine]
    #7792123 - 12/23/07 11:01 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Baeosistine said:
Quote:

Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:

If you don't remember your previous lives, it's really no different than dying and rotting in the ground.




There's a huge difference! In the rotting in the ground scenario, it is over. You will no longer live, love, experience, suffer, triumph, struggle, hug a kitty. With eternal reincarnation however there is no end to the number of new adventures.. you just don't remember you had one before.




But if you have no memory of the past, then it is irrelevant to you. There would be absoultely no difference between having had 300 past lives and having had zero.




Exactly. That's what I was trying to put into words.


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InvisibleMOTH
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Re: What if... [Re: Redstorm]
    #7792124 - 12/23/07 11:01 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I think that's because it's all happening at once.


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InvisibleBaeosistine
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Re: What if... [Re: MOTH]
    #7792132 - 12/23/07 11:03 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Anyway, assuming you did have some memory, i would get pretty fucking weary of it after a while and yearn for some transendence etc.. so I voted 'God that would suck!'


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InvisibleBaeosistine
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Re: What if... [Re: MOTH]
    #7792138 - 12/23/07 11:04 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MOTH said:
I think that's because it's all happening at once.




Yeah, I often think if I don't get to do something in this life, someone else has probably done it and that's good enough.


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InvisibleCherryBomM
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Re: What if... [Re: Baeosistine]
    #7792151 - 12/23/07 11:09 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

What if you can remember it all, every lifetime, while you are not currently inside a human body? Like in between lives, you remember all your experiences and emotions....but while you living your human life, you can only remember what is currently relevant?

Sometimes people have 'flashbacks' from previous lives are relevant to current circumstances in thier lives. They are commonly passed of as just dreams, or thoughts...or whatever.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: What if... [Re: Baeosistine]
    #7792215 - 12/23/07 11:40 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:


But if you have no memory of the past, then it is irrelevant to you. There would be absoultely no difference between having had 300 past lives and having had zero.





If there is zero recall of past lives (despite that many people feel they do have past life memories in the real world) then the merit of each life resides within that life itself.

If you in this life can't remember having had a past life, what would be better, living it or not having lived at all? It's all about this one life you have, and that time and time again.

You're arguing that it is irrelevant whether you have one life or a neverending supply of them. I consider it to be a very relevant difference. It's a huge difference between living a hundred years surrounded by an infinity of death, or living eternally with occasional lapses of amnesia.

I'd rather receive the gift of life over and over in a neverending cycle, than being given it as a onetime deal.

The Universe is filled with things which will inevitably be formed if its requirements are met. Perhaps this goes for all things.

If a proton meets an electron and they're not too excited, hydrogen forms. If you got a big bunch of hydrogen you'll get stars. Stars burn hydrogen into atoms. Atoms form molecules. Molecules form planets. Planets form life. Life forms you. Its a chain of events that might very well be inevitable to occur over and over, if time is eternal.


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OfflineBrugman
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792264 - 12/23/07 12:01 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

At first I thought, how can there be reincarnation if the population just keeps getting bigger? Soon there'd be too many souls that could feasibly exist on earth! But then I thought, the universe is supposedly constantly expanding, and with it, maybe new energy.. which maybe souls are made of.

It'd be nice to believe in this kind of fairy tale stuff.


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InvisibleBaeosistine
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792276 - 12/23/07 12:05 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:


But if you have no memory of the past, then it is irrelevant to you. There would be absoultely no difference between having had 300 past lives and having had zero.




You're arguing that it is irrelevant whether you have one life or a neverending supply of them. I consider it to be a very relevant difference. It's a huge difference between living a hundred years surrounded by an infinity of death, or living eternally with occasional lapses of amnesia.

I'd rather receive the gift of life over and over in a neverending cycle, than being given it as a onetime deal.





But if you have no memory of the different lives, then all that matters according to your argument, is the fact that the lives are experienced, whether that is by you, or by the entire human race.


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Offlinewrestler_az
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792299 - 12/23/07 12:15 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

living one life is tough ennough


--------------------
how's your WOW?





  Edited by yageman (04/20/06 4:20 PM) 


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792308 - 12/23/07 12:18 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I don't know if I'd want to reincarnate forever. I'd prefer some sort of Moksha/Nirvana clause in there.


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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: What if... [Re: Redstorm]
    #7792324 - 12/23/07 12:24 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Redstorm said:
If you don't remember your previous lives, it's really no different than dying and rotting in the ground. Unless the reincarnation is working towards something, it's just kind of a recycling of one's "soul" without retaining their previous consciousness.




im with red on this one wiccan. i think the idea of reincarnation is cool. but i find it pointless if we cannot remember our previous lives so that we can build upon and better this life. it just seems like one gigantic useless cycle if you cant remember any of it.

it really makes me wonder just how many lives ive fucked up before i got here. cause this life hasnt been the best... haha.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: What if... [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #7792401 - 12/23/07 12:52 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

But if you have no memory of the different lives, then all that matters according to your argument, is the fact that the lives are experienced, whether that is by you, or by the entire human race.




Quote:

i think the idea of reincarnation is cool. but i find it pointless if we cannot remember our previous lives so that we can build upon and better this life. it just seems like one gigantic useless cycle if you cant remember any of it.





I believe that all things primarily exist to be, and to run through all their interactions with the environment. Experiencing life and living it like it is may very well be the meaning of life.


Quote:

it really makes me wonder just how many lives ive fucked up before i got here. cause this life hasnt been the best... haha.





Perhaps you've had a series of rosy sweet lives and so now a harder one was due. Law of averages and such.

If my ideas about eternal reincarnation are true, you lived every possible life an infinite number of times, and will live them an infinite number of times more. Nothing is lost forever, it will always return to you. If you had a chance to something wonderful and it wasn't to be, it will come true another time. Forever and ever, the best is yet to come :smile:


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: What if... [Re: Silversoul]
    #7792417 - 12/23/07 12:55 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:


I don't know if I'd want to reincarnate forever. I'd prefer some sort of Moksha/Nirvana clause in there.





Perhaps there is, but only for a limited time. Perhaps we'll go to heaven, but then leave it after a long time to go experience life again. My model doesn't exclude it, but does require that any state is temporary.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792451 - 12/23/07 01:04 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Wiccan_Seeker said:
My model doesn't exclude it, but does require that any state is temporary.



Actually, that does exclude the idea of Moksha or Nirvana. These things are by definition eternal.


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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792457 - 12/23/07 01:07 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

you think youre so smart wiccan. have an answer for everything. :grin:

well that all sounds dandy, but this isnt the life i want to remember, how about the one where i hit the mega powerball lottery, so i can start investing my money wisely, and eventually buy out every corrupt corporation in the country, then build myself a private army and destroy every evil person and group in the country, with the intentions of making life for everyone better. except the churchies, they get nothing. no i take that back, they can start getting taxed like the rest of us.  :awesome:

wheres the damn reboot button......


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Offlinekosmic_charlie
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792472 - 12/23/07 01:11 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I can accept that as a possibility. If there is an afterlife reincarnation seems to make the most sense rather than the idea of spending the rest of eternity in some spiritual plane.

Some people have explained to me their belief in an afterlife just based on the fact that they exist at this very moment. The more I think about it, the more sense it makes to me. None of us are here by coincidence or by a stroke of luck. I think that perhaps we were always and will always be "here". People assume too much just because they have no recollection of existing before birth.

It is a little unsettling though, if reincarnation is a true phenomenon, that my memories will not transfer on to my next existence. Do I really want to rise and fall again and again for eternity? And with so much pain and poverty in the world I realize how lucky I am to be living such a comfortable life but who's to say my next reincarnation won't take me to some third world country where I'm plagued with the constant fear of starvation/disease/murder/rape, etc. Hopefully there is a method to it all and if you live a good life spreading as much love as possible, you are rewarded for it in the next.


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Goin' where the water tastes like wine.


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Re: What if... [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #7792479 - 12/23/07 01:12 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I was watchin a video of some dude gettin his head hacked off by a shi'ite

friend says
"when you die your brain is still working minutes after your death"
"?"
"your blood transports the oxygen, but your brain still has electricity"
"i dont wanna go to hell in my own head"
"...flashbacks"


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InvisibleGGreatOne234
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792888 - 12/23/07 03:14 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

dude.. i am not going to participate in your poll.. it seems like you focus a lot of your attention on something that can never be figured out, alive or dead

you should spend more time just enjoying life to the fullest in the moment of every second and not worry about what happens when you will die


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: What if... [Re: GGreatOne234]
    #7792909 - 12/23/07 03:24 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

you should spend more time just enjoying life to the fullest in the moment of every second




I do that, don't worry :smile:


Quote:

not worry about what happens when you will die




I've had a heart attack and it could happen again at any moment without any warning. I've had to learn to live with that reality.

Trying to figure out the answers to Life's big questions has nothing to do with fear of death, it's more of a hobby :grin:


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InvisibleGGreatOne234
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792913 - 12/23/07 03:26 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

lol - i send you my best wishes for you to have great and happy holidays, wiccan seeker


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InvisibleLayYouIn
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7792929 - 12/23/07 03:33 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

What if...

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/7143412#7143412

that's what i title my thread also.

the way i see it, is, it seems pointless for a god to make this reality just to watch. it seems like it would be much better to live in it without knowledge on what the real truth is.

evolution clearly makes sense, but doesn't discard an existence of a god. sometimes it seems like there would have to be a god of some sort for existence to take place.


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Offlinecagerplaya247
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Re: What if... [Re: Brugman]
    #7860255 - 01/10/08 03:47 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

But what if this lifestyle is not permanent. Imagine this, you visit different universes and learn a life lesson and moral every time. But you learn the eternal message, you finally find the hidden dimension and this is what we would to refer to as heaven. Seems possible we will never know in our conscious life.


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: What if... [Re: cagerplaya247]
    #7860462 - 01/10/08 04:35 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

I would love for this to be true but it just isn't plausible.

For instance, it is proven that life, at least on earth, hasn't existed for all of eternity. Further, humans have certainly not existed for all of eternity. So for this to be true, at one point or another we would have to be reincarnated as animals. That wouldn't be so bad if there was a guarantee we would one day be humans, but 99.9% of all species aren't even self aware.

And also, for this to go on for eternity in both directions, it would need to occur on other planets to make up for the fact that life hasn't been on earth forever. And the scientific side of my mind just can't reconcile that.

This doesn't seem like a self-sufficient mechanism to me, it seems like it would need some sort of god. And I feel as though I have already disproved god to myself in my own head, so I'm gonna not conflict with my own beliefs and not believe this theory as well, appealing as it may sound to mine ears.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: What if... [Re: g00ru]
    #7860773 - 01/10/08 05:47 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

For instance, it is proven that life, at least on earth, hasn't existed for all of eternity.




There's no such proof. Here on earth probably you're right but that can't cover the entire universe. People reincarnate. Species reincarnate. Planets reincarnate. Galaxies reincarnate. Whole big bang universes get created and destroyed forever and ever.

There could be an infinite number of predecessors to earth.

Quote:

it would need to occur on other planets to make up for the fact that life hasn't been on earth forever. And the scientific side of my mind just can't reconcile that.





That you might not believe in other inhabitable planets is a matter of belief. Science says it is very likely they exist in some form or other.

Quote:

This doesn't seem like a self-sufficient mechanism to me, it seems like it would need some sort of god.




It doesn't, it is one big symbiosis of energy that always was and always will be.


Quote:

I'm gonna not conflict with my own beliefs and not believe this theory as well




You reject the theory before having sufficiently thought about it. That however is your decision. Mebbe I'll convince you the next time around :smile:


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: What if... [Re: Asante]
    #7860779 - 01/10/08 05:49 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

^ I think about this shit all the time. believe me, I'm quite open to the possibility, but remain unconvinced as of now.

I guess you could say I'm a reincarnation agnostic.


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OfflineCannabischarlie
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Re: What if... [Re: Brugman]
    #7860797 - 01/10/08 05:56 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

If a proton meets an electron and they're not too excited, hydrogen forms. If you got a big bunch of hydrogen you'll get stars. Stars burn hydrogen into atoms. Atoms form molecules. Molecules form planets. Planets form life. Life forms you. Its a chain of events that might very well be inevitable to occur over and over, if time is eternal.





This is my rationale as to why there is life on other planets, whether or not we ever find out as a species. there has to be.
besides that, life doesn't have to like on earth. maybe somewhere the beings breath nitrogen. it is not impossible.


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: What if... [Re: Cannabischarlie]
    #7860806 - 01/10/08 05:58 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

Cannabischarlie said:
Quote:

If a proton meets an electron and they're not too excited, hydrogen forms. If you got a big bunch of hydrogen you'll get stars. Stars burn hydrogen into atoms. Atoms form molecules. Molecules form planets. Planets form life. Life forms you. Its a chain of events that might very well be inevitable to occur over and over, if time is eternal.





This is my rationale as to why there is life on other planets, whether or not we ever find out as a species. there has to be.
besides that, life doesn't have to like on earth. maybe somewhere the beings breath nitrogen. it is not impossible.




I have no doubt that there is life on other planets. I just can't think of how this theory would be plausible scientifically.

Yeah just to clarify, I was just looking at it from a highly theoretical scientific view, since I think if there is any apparently supernatural shit like that then it would theoretically be able to be explained scientifically.


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