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InvisibleEgo Death
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Re: Question for those who believe in a god [Re: Drewwyann]
    #7784621 - 12/21/07 06:11 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

A man with a white beard that hates muslims.

Really though,
My definition of God has to be a label for a fabricated mechansim that humans use for not being able to understand how and why they are here.


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InvisibleGGreatOne234
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Re: Question for those who believe in a god [Re: Irishdrunk]
    #7784665 - 12/21/07 06:56 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Irishdrunk said:
Quote:

accountant said:
God is responsible for every positive quality that nature(most importantly humans) intentionally expresses between itself.




WITCH!!! BURN EM!:imspecial:




Alright, I do not usually reply to this type of topic, but, I think that I might start off with my views on "religion".. It honestly amazes me how so many people "follow" a religion that was developed by a person other than theirselves. Every single religion that has ever and will-ever be developed on this planet, also including other planets across our "universe" and beyond which contain forms of intelligent life, will always contain varying degrees of "distortion"..

Let me give you an example: ...Spend a second to first clear your mind and then read on.. Try to "imagine" that the universe has an end, a barrier in which it is all contained, maybe in the shape of an enormous spherical bubble.. so there is an outside layer or shell to this bubble.. now, try to visualize a white, thin, line, starting at the center of your brain, and then allow this line to "race" as fast as you can, towards the closest edge of that universe-bubble.. do not just imagine it as a full line, try to visualize it "racing" towards the bubble.... ok.. now how far did you make it? Chances are, if you were attempting it the way that I described, you never even made it to the Moon.. it is practically impossible for the human mind to visualize that far of a distance (unless of course you are amist some type of God-like state of mind, of course).. you probably never even made it to the Earths ozone layer.. even that is just too far.. My guess is that some of the people reading this, could spend all day trying to draw one of these imaginary lines from their computer desk to their fucking mailbox, and still not succeed.. (hehehe).. so right now, i've just instilled some type of "idea" in your head that their might be an actual distinct edge of the our universe (which there probably isn't).. another exercise is this (one that I didn't just really make up): Whatever you do, Do Not, think about a purple elephant wearing a shiny black top-hat and snorting a kilo sized line of cocaine with it's snout. See, you just pictured everything I just described right in your mind, with no control over it. Again, whatever you do, do not, think of a plastic McDonald's straw.. and ya fuckin did again didn't you? I will you why.. It is because we are fucking stupid. :sighs: Human beings are indeed one of the most brilliant and intelligent life-forms on our planet, but we are also, at the same time, probably the stupidest.. one of the most intelligent life-forms on the planet that I can think of, are actually mushrooms.. they are fucking brilliant creatures.. mushrooms have a more important niche on this planet that humans ever-could.. another one here that pops into my mind are misquitos and insects, ants, wild foliage as simple as grass or trees..

Next I want share with you, that I believe in "Heaven" and "Hell".. now, I understand completely, that heaven and hell do not excist At All.. but, somewhere along the way while I was growing up, I somehow was obviously told that heaven and hell excisted by someone or something.. I had no control over this. Even though, today, I know, that those two things do-not-excist, I just cannot seem to shake those ideas out of my head yet, and I am not sure if I ever will be able to do that....

Now, I believe also that probably every single organism on our planet and thoughout the universe and beyond have, a spirit, or a soul.. and each one of these spirits are unique.. they all have the same basic shape and form, but they are compareable to snow-flakes, you know how each one is not similar if you look at them under a microscope? Another example is how these spirits in us are kind of like finger-prints, none are exact duplicates.. thinking of that, this is why I find it strange that a person would actually "follow" a "religion" that was thought up by another person..

Another theory I have, is a sort of Catch22.. I believe, that the minute my dads sperm entered my moms egg, that was when I had the greatest understanding of what my truest "religion" is.. because I had not yet had anything pressed into my conciousness to distort my beliefs.. that was when I should have wrote a "bible" or a "koran" (hehehe). But, it is not possible to write a story at that age.. so, the older you get in your life, the more garbage will collect in your mind, distorting and contorting your "truest" understanding of what your personal spiritual finger-print really looks like..

I won't say anymore about God that I already did.. because I have zero understanding of what God really even is..

I think I am done.. :smile:

Keep shroomin,
GGreatOne234


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OfflineNewbieS
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Re: Question for those who believe in a god [Re: GGreatOne234]
    #7784797 - 12/21/07 08:24 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I like how you think.  :rockon:


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InvisibleIrishdrunk
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Re: Question for those who believe in a god [Re: Newbie]
    #7784802 - 12/21/07 08:27 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Yah, religion is the old way of thinking and discounted by science, surprised anyone believes it anymore.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: Question for those who believe in a god [Re: GGreatOne234]
    #7784900 - 12/21/07 09:18 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

God? How can anybody possibly believe in God?





Perhaps you have a definition of God that makes it impossible to seriously believe in him/her/it.

If you believe that God = the Universe in its entirety, it would be exceedingly hard to not believe in it.

Part of the Universe are sentient beings, so sentience permeates it. Two beings could be a billion lightyears apart, but both invent the wheel. So in a perfectly rationally understandable way, both draw from  the same source. In a way, it is all interconnected. If you both have a similar understanding of the universe, you may think the same thoughts, invent the same things.

The universe isn't just void, gas, dust, planets and stars. Through us, living beings, it has consciousness. It has dreams. Logic is just as much a property of the Universe as gravity is. The Universe is making love and jokes in bad taste as much as it is gas giants and quasars. We see ourselves and the things we do as somehow separate from the Universe, but this is folly. We ourselves and all the things we do are parts of the Universe, for if they were impossible within it, we and our things wouldn't occur.

According to some scientists, our material universe will eventually completely fall apart. This will take a googol years, give or take, that's a one with 100 zeros, years. A truly staggering number, but it is infinitely small compared to Eternity. Some scientists estimate that in a staggering expanse of time, a one with 1056 zeros, years, there just might be a big bang giving rise to another material universe. And in that frightening number of years from that, another, and another, and this on and on into infinity.

Now picture this: a material universe created by a big bang has a limited size. Therefore the number of guises it can come in, is a staggering but finite number too.

If time truly is Eternal, you'll see it coming, every possible configuration of every possible universe will be created and destroyed over and over again, an infinite number of times.

You and me and every grain of sand, and every situation thats possible, shall be re-created over and over, in every possible way, with every possible outcome.

It is also possible that space is infinitely large, which would mean that if you were to travel in a straight line, you'd travel through an infinite number of big-bang universes, and meet yourself and everything in all possible guises over and over.

Now is that a BIG place or what :yesnod:
We're not just a measly 30-something lightyears across, thats just a drop in an endless sea.

You are Eternal. You shall reincarnate in all your guises forevermore, and live every possible life. Once you die, time itself stops for you, so you shall travel to your next life at infinite speed, through annihilation and re-creation. There appears to be an order of cause and effect to the universe. One thing leads to the next. Taking that assumption, there might be a pattern to the lives lived in succession also, something about this life and the ones before it will set you up for the next.

Since you reincarnate infinitely in a limited number of guises, there might just be a cycle of lives you go through. Since science insists there's no such thing as a soul, that cycle may be the same for all of us. We might all be incarnations of the same, of the One. The Sentience of the Universe. God.

You can see that in a universe of cause and effect, nothing can really go "wrong" as it's all an expression of the natural order. To the Universe, there simply is no "wrong".

And - we can't mess it up either. We humans can only make a finite mess of things, but do no harm to the fabric of the Universe. If we pollute and stripmine our planet.. Turn our solar system into a raging inferno. No biggie. All that goes extinct shall return forevermore. It's just the Universe doing its thing.

AQnd the good part of all of this is: you're part of it all, as proven by your existance. It doesn't matter if it's software or hardware that makes you, you: You're part of the grand old cycle. Enjoy the ride!


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OfflineNewbieS
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Re: Question for those who believe in a god [Re: Asante]
    #7784911 - 12/21/07 09:21 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

You sound like an observer of quantum physics/string theory, I like how you think as well. There's just so much more structure (as chaotic as it may be at the quantum level) than a true "religion".


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: Question for those who believe in a god [Re: Newbie]
    #7785002 - 12/21/07 10:08 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

The further I examined Belief and Science, the closer they came, and they have fused into one. we're all trying to make sense of it all, the mystics and the scientists, but our methods differ.

Once you come to the realization that "God" is everything that exists in all of its guises, and that the natural order is absolute, every single "religion" I ever came across will feel a bit like a spiritual straightjacket.

Most of them force you to take sides, for one. If you divide the One, which is Perfection itself, into two parts and call one part God and the other part Satan, you are introducing a major conflict in my perception of the One. Divide and Conquer, anyone? Instead of trying to find peace with the anything and all, they force you to choose sides (which is entirely arbitrary) and unleash a war between flocks of angels and hordes of demons in my precious mind. Tey pit me against my fellow man, my mind against my body, my spirituality against my sexuality, and much more. I'll try to return to the Garden of Eden on my own, how do you like them apples :crankey:

Then there are religions that say you reincarnate, but they insist that reincarnation is a pool of sheer misery and that your only hope is to transcend death and rebirth, and never be born again. I'm trying to make peace with the Journey, thank you very much :crankey: don't try to make me hate Life and then offer me an escape route. I was doing just fine, go advocate infinite suicide someplace else please.

But science can be quite a bit of a straightjacket too. Many scientists get so caught up in logic that they lose touch with the emotional and spiritual sides of the human experience. Rationality is just part of the human experience, not the be-all end-all of it. A lot of scientific minds are nihilists who, trapped in logic, try to strip away all magic and wonder of existence and substitute it with logic that only makes sense in it's own limited area. Science can make you a prisoner of your own mind just as much as any religion. Suuure.. there is no God, no Self, Love is just a bunch of chemicals and everything is void of any purpose and meaning. Go be emo some place else, I suggest taking some of that Prozac you invented to fight the utter meaninglessness you created :crankey:


:wink: ya.. The bottom line is that you shouldn't rely on one thing solely, be it religion or science, but I think that the road to a fulfilling life can be found in being a bit of everything. Try to find logic in your beliefs, and let yourself be overcome by spiritual awe when the particle accellerator spews out a completely different list of data than you imagined it would.

A bonsai looks best if it's craftily pruned from all sides, and your mind is no different :grin:


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Omnicyclion.org
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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Question for those who believe in a god [Re: Asante]
    #7785029 - 12/21/07 10:18 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Wiccan_Seeker said:
Go be emo some place else




I prefer being emo right here.  :razz:


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InvisibleGGreatOne234
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Re: Question for those who believe in a god [Re: Asante]
    #7785084 - 12/21/07 10:41 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Wiccan_Seeker,

I really, really do appreciate your replies, and I find that your outlook on this topic, is, well thought out... thank you.

I must make two final notes, after reading, your mention of "Satan" (The Devil)... I do not believe that the Devil excists, anymore, even though, I had an experience that I met "him" face-to-face..

Lastly.. I believe that "Love", is the most powerful force, in every-thing.

GG


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: Question for those who believe in a god [Re: GGreatOne234]
    #7785127 - 12/21/07 10:56 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

My pleasure, I hope you read it to be as benign-intentioned as I intended it.

Quote:

your mention of "Satan" (The Devil)... I do not believe that the Devil excists, anymore, even though, I had an experience that I met "him" face-to-face..




The Devil does exist, definitely. But is he an opposing deity, or an archetype of the mind? Archetypes of the mind are VERY real, but they lack the omnipotence that comes being a true Deity.

The Devil is well known for his deceptiveness, perhaps he's a psychological archetype that tricked Christians into believing he has any real power on a God level.


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