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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?



Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: Seuss]
#8073294 - 02/26/08 04:34 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Seuss said: > World Temperatures according to the Hadley Center for Climate Prediction. Note the steep drop over the last year.
Thank God for Al. He saved us just in time.
Imagine how far the temps would have dropped had he given up flying around telling what asses the rest of us are.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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blackegg
...has left the building.



Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 1,021
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
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Quote:
you cant use something from wiki for an argument. for all we know you wrote. you cant trust information you get off of that site.
Oh really? Well how do you respond to this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reliability_of_Wikipedia
-------------------- 'Pain is meant to wake us up. People try to hide their pain. But they're wrong. Pain is something to carry, like a radio. You feel your strength in the experience of pain. It's all in how you carry it. That's what matters. Pain is a feeling. Your feelings are a part of you. Your own reality. If you feel ashamed of them, and hide them, you're letting society destroy your reality. You should stand up for your right to feel your pain and leave the Shroomery.' ~ Jim Morrison
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?



Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: blackegg]
#8073467 - 02/26/08 05:05 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Dude (or Dudette), If you aren't smart enough to reply to the right person, perhaps TV is more for you.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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gluke bastid
Stinky Bum



Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 3,322
Loc: Charm City
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: Seuss]
#8073724 - 02/26/08 05:58 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Seuss said: > Carbon Capping is killing us all!
No, but it is a very clever way to inflate energy prices.
When and how has it been used to do that?
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Society in every form is a blessing, but government at its best is but a necessary evil - Thomas Paine
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blackegg
...has left the building.



Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 1,021
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
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Quote:
Dude (or Dudette), If you aren't smart enough to reply to the right person, perhaps TV is more for you.
um...if you're speaking to me...I was replying to the person I quoted.
And if you can't figure that out you probably don't know who I'm speaking to now and certainly shouldn't be trusted with a gun.
But I still love you.
-------------------- 'Pain is meant to wake us up. People try to hide their pain. But they're wrong. Pain is something to carry, like a radio. You feel your strength in the experience of pain. It's all in how you carry it. That's what matters. Pain is a feeling. Your feelings are a part of you. Your own reality. If you feel ashamed of them, and hide them, you're letting society destroy your reality. You should stand up for your right to feel your pain and leave the Shroomery.' ~ Jim Morrison
Edited by blackegg (02/26/08 06:10 PM)
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zorbman
blarrr


Registered: 06/04/04
Posts: 5,952
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Twelve-month long drop in world temperatures wipes out a century of warming
How do you figure that?
-------------------- “The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.” -- Rudiger Dornbusch
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boomer q
Comrade General



Registered: 05/03/07
Posts: 1,091
Loc: Dirty Jersey
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: zorbman]
#8077152 - 02/27/08 01:02 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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well, luckily for us there are actual climate scientists studying this, and not just ignorant folks who can only regurgitate material they get from internet sources. and believe it or not, most of the scientists, maybe not all, but most, believe in anthropogenic causes of global warming. im not gonna quote something that anyone can pull up on google to prove my point, but ill just say that having gone to a fairly prestigious research university for the last 4 and a half years, and having majored in physics and minored in geology almost all my professors have been primarily research scientists, i have not encountered a single science professor who does not agree with anthropogenic causes of global warming. coincidence? im willing to bet that at the closest university to you... if you drive to it and go to the meteorology department, you wont find a single person there willing to deny that humans are having an impact on the climate. its just a feeling i have. having been in the academic sphere for almost 5 years, this topic comes up alot, and every scientist ive ever spoken with agrees. so to me, you can pull up any kinds facts or bullshit statistics on a website no problem, but if you actually go to an academic community, youll find that there is consensus among most scientists, and if you think that its all some coincidence or guesswork, or a conspiracy.... well, unfortunately we dont have long to wait for the truth to reveal itself
-------------------- I got bags of funk and i sell em by the tons
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boomer q
Comrade General



Registered: 05/03/07
Posts: 1,091
Loc: Dirty Jersey
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: zappaisgod]
#8077319 - 02/27/08 01:59 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
zappaisgod said: I am in no way interested in doing anything at any expense at all based on utterly unproven and to me nonsensical notions that fossil fuel burning is a problem for warming.
im not trying to be disrespectful or anything, im just trying to figure out where the disconnect is.... you do recognize that burning fossil fuels emits carbon dioxide, dont you? that one of the products of combusting a hydrocarbon is carbon dioxide? do you not believe that carbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas? im not a huge fan of wikipedia, but i use it for quick little statistics, like the one about how we humans emit more than 27 thousand million metric tons of CO2 each year. do you disagree with this fact?
so if you agree that we indeed ARE flooding our atmosphere with levels of carbon dioxide not seen in (at least) millions of years, and you agree that carbon dioxide is in fact a greenhouse gas - that is to say that the carbon dioxide molecule is able to absorb infrared photons and heat the surrounding atmosphere, how can you reconcile these basic facts with your assertion that there are no facts supporting anthropogenic causes of global warming? i just dont get it, i guess, it seems pretty clear to me
Quote:
zappaisgod said: I am all for conservation. At a market based price. I am all for developing alternative energy. At a market based price. Except for fusion. THAT needs to be funded by giant governments.
why is fusion any different from any other alternative energy sources? because its so much more ambitious than, say, wind power? why should my tax dollars go towards the billions and billions of dollars needed to research and implement fusion power, but not towards the already well researched, well understood, and already workable wind power? north and south daktoa get enough wind to power the whole country, why not take advantage of that with our tax dollars? it would be alot cheaper than making several new stars all around the planet to power our civilization. dont get me wrong, im a big supporter of nuclear power, fusion and fission alike, i just dont understand why you would be willing to have our government spend billions of dollars on one form of alternative energy, as cool as it may be, but relegate other, more proven and reliable forms of alternative energy to the will of the free market.
i personally feel that the health of our planet and of the biosphere is too important to leave to the will of the market. someone might say, well, if most people want to curb greenhouse gasses and use alternative energy, then their will will be reflected in private enterprise and the business community. i feel that there are some issues that are too important to wait for public opinion to catch up. for instance, lets just say for a moment that some of the dire predictions of climate scientists will come true, and that between 2015 and 2020 we will reach a tipping point at which the positive feedbacks associated with global warming will be enter an unstoppable chain reaction resulting in a warming of, idk, lets say 4 degrees fahrenheit in the next century what if the public doesnt take the problem seriously until 2030? and only then is there a real desire by the public to save our planet... well shucks, that would be a little late, wouldnt it? and in that case, we, our generation, would be sentencing our descendants, our kids and grandkids and beyond, to a world less rich and full of life than the world we inherited. rising sea levels, no ice in the arctic, more powerful storms, not to mention the 15-35% of all life forms which would bite the dust because of this rapid change in their environments... all because we didnt take the problem seriously enough. idk, its just not a chance i wanna take, rarely is scientific fact reflected in the free market, because of the other forces at work in a marketplace. thats just me, i guess, i dont wanna take the chance that the majority of climate scientists are wrong
-------------------- I got bags of funk and i sell em by the tons
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Viveka
refutation bias


Registered: 10/21/02
Posts: 4,061
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: boomer q]
#8077800 - 02/27/08 04:00 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
ill just say that having gone to a fairly prestigious research university for the last 4 and a half years, and having majored in physics and minored in geology almost all my professors have been primarily research scientists, i have not encountered a single science professor who does not agree with anthropogenic causes of global warming. coincidence?
Gee, do you think any of these professional research scientists have any incentives in common?
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?



Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: zorbman]
#8077822 - 02/27/08 04:08 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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zorbman said:
Quote:
Twelve-month long drop in world temperatures wipes out a century of warming
How do you figure that?
Perhaps you would be better off directing the question to the person who wrote the article. They were his words, not mine.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?



Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: boomer q]
#8077846 - 02/27/08 04:15 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Lucky for us there are those with open minds who don't swallow every "crisis" hook, line and sinker.
Quote:
so to me, you can pull up any kinds facts
Good to know the facts don't matter to you.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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bodynotdead
TrichodermaCultivator



Registered: 05/10/07
Posts: 271
Loc: U.S.A
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: zorbman]
#8078421 - 02/27/08 06:16 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
zorbman said:
Quote:
Twelve-month long drop in world temperatures wipes out a century of warming
How do you figure that?
Temperatures were colder than average across large swathes of central Asia, the Middle East, the western US, Alaska and China. In some parts of China and central Asia, snow fell for the first time in recored history.
-------------------- "absolute power corrupts absolutely". Lord Acton,
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zorbman
blarrr


Registered: 06/04/04
Posts: 5,952
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: bodynotdead]
#8078998 - 02/27/08 08:25 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Temperatures were colder than average across large swathes of central Asia, the Middle East, the western US, Alaska and China. In some parts of China and central Asia, snow fell for the first time in recored history.
So what?
That does not answer my question.
Temperatures are ALWAYS colder or warmer than the norm in certain regions at any given time. There is ALWAYS freak weather going on somewhere on the planet. The question is what is the average global temperature over a meaningful time span?
My question was how does one year of data negate an entire century of warming?
-------------------- “The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.” -- Rudiger Dornbusch
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Phred
Fred's son


Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 12,949
Loc: Dominican Republic
Last seen: 9 years, 18 days
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: zorbman]
#8079087 - 02/27/08 08:49 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
The question is what is the average global temperature over a meaningful time span?
Depends what you classify as meaningful. The average global temperature for the last twelve months is about the same as it was a century ago.
The global warmenists gleefully trumpet a single year's data if it is up --
"2003 the warmest year in the last ten years!"
-- but if the single year's data is down (as it is this year: WAY down) then a single year's data means nothing. It's a head's I win tails you lose thing with the warmenists.
Phred
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zorbman
blarrr


Registered: 06/04/04
Posts: 5,952
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: Phred]
#8079793 - 02/27/08 11:21 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Depends what you classify as meaningful. The average global temperature for the last twelve months is about the same as it was a century ago.
The global warmenists gleefully trumpet a single year's data if it is up --
"2003 the warmest year in the last ten years!"
-- but if the single year's data is down (as it is this year: WAY down) then a single year's data means nothing. It's a head's I win tails you lose thing with the warmenists.
So-called "global warmists" who cite one year as evidence of anything are just as wrong as those who do so from the opposing minority. I must say I see more of that behavior from the latter as they tend to have no real grounding in science or statistics. The temptation to cherry-pick data by this crowd is almost irresistable.
I agree with you that one year by itself means little but the last I heard each succeeding year has typically been warmer than the last as of late. I'm just wondering what this one year looks like in comparison to those other years. Facts in isolation are unhelpful. Nothing goes straight up or down but the trend certainly seems to be towards increasing average global temperatures.
Most people, especially those with science backgrounds, agree upon that. The debate has now shifted towards whether the temperature increase is due to human activity or not.
-------------------- “The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.” -- Rudiger Dornbusch
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Phred
Fred's son


Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 12,949
Loc: Dominican Republic
Last seen: 9 years, 18 days
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: zorbman]
#8079841 - 02/27/08 11:36 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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I agree with you that one year by itself means little but the last I heard each succeeding year has typically been warmer than the last as of late.
Don't know where you heard that. Average global temperature peaked in 1998 and has been declining (as a trend -- obviously there are times when a year is warmer than the preceding year) ever since. That's a decade of decline now.
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I'm just wondering what this one year looks like in comparison to those other years. Facts in isolation are unhelpful.
Go here and look at the graphs -- http://www.dailytech.com/Temperature+Monitors+Report+Worldwide+Global+Cooling/article10866.htm
Quote:
Nothing goes straight up or down but the trend certainly seems to be towards increasing average global temperatures.
No, for the last decade the trend has been to decreasing average global temperatures.
Phred
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zorbman
blarrr


Registered: 06/04/04
Posts: 5,952
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: Phred]
#8079890 - 02/28/08 12:02 AM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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I make my living largely from analyzing charts for technical trends. In spite of the recent and notable plunge this particular chart shows a clear uptrend. Draw an imaginary line from the troughs and they point up. Both nature and markets (which after all are a part of nature) attempt to balance themselves always. Whenever there is an extreme disruption in the norm there will be an equal and opposite reaction until equilibrium is achieved.
That is a Fundamental Law.
Notice how when the chart dips bigtime there is always a fairly quick response in the opposite direction. And often the more wild the swing, the more wild the response.
(I could make a larger point here about political extremism but you get the drift).
Sure, the temps DO dip occasionaly. But notice how when they do they always stabilize along a higher low which builds a base for another rise.
Some people make a lot of money off of understanding this stuff. And I can tell you, my friend, that the recent wild drop will be offset by an equally wild rise. You cannot take facts in isolation. That is the path of cherry-picking and self-delusion. One should follow the facts where they lead you rather than warping reality to fit one's pre-ordained conclusions.
-------------------- “The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.” -- Rudiger Dornbusch
Edited by zorbman (02/28/08 01:58 AM)
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?



Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: zorbman]
#8080209 - 02/28/08 02:59 AM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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The peaks point down. Perhaps a job analyzing charts is not the best choice for you.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
Edited by luvdemshrooms (02/28/08 03:01 AM)
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?



Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: zorbman]
#8080218 - 02/28/08 03:04 AM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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So do the troughs.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?



Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
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Re: Lots of ice cubes now [Re: zorbman]
#8080243 - 02/28/08 03:35 AM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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I was going to do more but what's the point. I have little doubt you'd disagree with most placements of the trend lines that didn't suit your fancy.
A look by eye clearly shows a downward trend to any who are open-minded enough to be willing to admit it.
Face it. The models don't work. The trend since 1998 is against your stance.
Quote:
One should follow the facts where they lead you rather than warping reality to fit one's pre-ordained conclusions.
Good advice. Too bad you seem unable to follow what you so easily bandy about.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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