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OfflineKanker
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Registered: 07/16/07
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Apollyphelion]
    #7788152 - 12/22/07 07:06 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

atheism is not the absence of spirituality.


--------------------
I'm ahead, I'm advanced
I am the first mammal to make plans, yeah
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher
2010, watch it go to fire.
It's evolution baby.
-Pearl Jam


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OfflineBoots
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Apollyphelion]
    #7788433 - 12/22/07 10:10 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I'm not religious, atheist, or particularly spiritual. I think that whether there is a 'god' or not, I just don't care. Having said that, I take 'shrooms as a way to explore myself, my surroundings, quality art, and the concept of 'thought' in general. Whether or not it's the result of a chemical imbalance doesn't change the incredible beauty and depth of a 'shroom trip.


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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Registered: 11/02/03
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: g00ru]
    #7789048 - 12/22/07 01:23 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

guruu said:
The argument that atheism requires faith is, no disrespect intended, complete crap. Atheism does not require faith by definition. I don't want to accept god on a (completely) blind leap of faith. Therefore my only rational option is not to believe in him unless he can be logically explained to me to exist. No faith involved. It's not a belief, its a lack of a belief. Many of you might say: "God is inexpressible, we could never explain him by definition." To that I would reply: "Exactly why I do not believe he exists."




Hold on though, you have to have faith the material world even exists, and also faith in that your own perception is correct enough to make that judgement call. These are leaps that I think we ALL make, but the idea that there is a completely indisputible position is faulty. You make the leap of faith that if you don't understand it or don't appear to see it it must not exist. For that you would have to be omnicient. Fifty years ago a person could have neither seen nor understood dark matter, but it does exist.

Now, I don't really subscribe to the semetic idea of God either, but atheism like any belief system requires faith.

I don't BELIEVE in God, but I also know that it is real. Something that is inexpressible is cannot be known by people who dwell in belief because conceptual thinking is not direct experience. As long as you are only thinking and BELIEVING in thought as the only mode of experience you will never know what is true.

Describing the ineffable in thought and langauge is like representing colors with smells. Just because you can't do it very well doesn't mean the thing you intend to describe does not exist.


--------------------
1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."


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InvisibleKrishnaDreamer
I bleed nicotine...
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Registered: 09/23/07
Posts: 4,132
Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #7789293 - 12/22/07 02:44 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I'm god.


--------------------
Everybody's a ninja...


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Offlineashfiken
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: KrishnaDreamer]
    #7790016 - 12/22/07 05:49 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

fuck atheism and fuck religion. ill have to agree that these labels dont interest me. i dont have a reason to believe in god so i dont. i dont need that crutch... some do... and i dont call myself an atheist because i dont care enough about the subject to do so. but i love mushrooms and they allow me to see my inner being and connect with myself and others in ways i couldnt do otherwise. no spirituality involved


--------------------
hmm...

"I'm naked and fearless... And my fear is naked."

"life isn't worth living without the threat of death"

"I got my plans in a ziploc bag, let's see how unproductive we can be"

"nobody lives their lives fully except for bull fighters"

My Trade List


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InvisibleAtheist
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Registered: 01/24/06
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: ashfiken]
    #7790150 - 12/22/07 06:29 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

you know that by saying god is fake you are an ATHEIST


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Offlineashfiken
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Atheist]
    #7791562 - 12/23/07 04:51 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

no people choose to call themselves atheists. you can consider myself this but i refuse to put a label on my beliefs because they cant contain my thoughts or beliefs in the long run. most people do call me atheist but i just dont see the point in calling myself anything because like i said above it just seems binding and boring to do so.


--------------------
hmm...

"I'm naked and fearless... And my fear is naked."

"life isn't worth living without the threat of death"

"I got my plans in a ziploc bag, let's see how unproductive we can be"

"nobody lives their lives fully except for bull fighters"

My Trade List


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InvisibleAtheist
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: ashfiken]
    #7791922 - 12/23/07 10:01 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

dumbest shit i have ever read

if you say that god IS NOT REAL then you are an atheist (whether you like it or not)

its like saying you arent human because its a label (EVEN THOUGH WE ARE ALL HUMAN)

just because you are atheist doesnt mean other shit is included (whatever you believe)
it just means that you think god is fake


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InvisibleAtheist
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Atheist]
    #7791923 - 12/23/07 10:01 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

for example, many buddhists are atheist because they dont believe in god(s)


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OfflineProskier
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Atheist]
    #7791972 - 12/23/07 10:13 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Atheist said:
for example, many buddhists are atheist because they dont believe in god(s)




and if you talked to a buddhist they wouldnt want to be called an atheist. they would want to be called buddhist. This guy just sounds like he doesnt like the idea of being called an atheist for whatever reason. probly for the stereo types he's heard/knows that follow the title.

im a gentile because im not jewish but i prefer to be called/"labeled" a christian.


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InvisibleAtheist
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Proskier]
    #7791978 - 12/23/07 10:15 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

they are still atheists


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Offlineashfiken
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Atheist]
    #7792564 - 12/23/07 01:28 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

i dont care enough for it to matter im sorry the dumbest shit youve ever read is how i feel. like i also said everyone considers me an atheist but i just prefer not to label myself. do you really have that big of a problem with that? im not gonna put myself into any type of barrier that says what i do or do not believe period.


--------------------
hmm...

"I'm naked and fearless... And my fear is naked."

"life isn't worth living without the threat of death"

"I got my plans in a ziploc bag, let's see how unproductive we can be"

"nobody lives their lives fully except for bull fighters"

My Trade List


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Offlineashfiken
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Registered: 09/06/06
Posts: 3,072
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: ashfiken]
    #7792583 - 12/23/07 01:32 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

and in what way is it like saying im not human (not even a label). its not remotely similar. it is scientific fact that we are human. there is nothing to state that i HAVE to fit into the category because of me inevitably not giving a fuck about the subject of god is real or god isnt because to me it has been irrelevant for the majority of my life. with all this said even though i dont consider myself one for whatever reasons i find i get along best with atheists because of their like minded beliefs. i dont have a problem with that stereotype like the other dude said the whole point im trying to make is that it doesnt really matter to me


--------------------
hmm...

"I'm naked and fearless... And my fear is naked."

"life isn't worth living without the threat of death"

"I got my plans in a ziploc bag, let's see how unproductive we can be"

"nobody lives their lives fully except for bull fighters"

My Trade List


Edited by ashfiken (12/23/07 01:35 PM)


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OfflineVeter
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #7793080 - 12/23/07 04:21 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Divided_Sky said:
Hold on though, you have to have faith the material world even exists, and also faith in that your own perception is correct enough to make that judgement call. These are leaps that I think we ALL make, but the idea that there is a completely indisputible position is faulty. You make the leap of faith that if you don't understand it or don't appear to see it it must not exist. For that you would have to be omnicient. Fifty years ago a person could have neither seen nor understood dark matter, but it does exist.

Now, I don't really subscribe to the semetic idea of God either, but atheism like any belief system requires faith.

I don't BELIEVE in God, but I also know that it is real. Something that is inexpressible is cannot be known by people who dwell in belief because conceptual thinking is not direct experience. As long as you are only thinking and BELIEVING in thought as the only mode of experience you will never know what is true.

Describing the ineffable in thought and langauge is like representing colors with smells. Just because you can't do it very well doesn't mean the thing you intend to describe does not exist.




I think you're misunderstanding Atheism. Atheism is not a "belief" in anything. It requires no more faith to not believe in god than it does to not believe in the tooth fairy or a pink unicorn in the corner of my room.
Atheism is simply the reliance on science as the definer of reality. If science were to verify the existence of god, atheists would "believe" in god. Science is the best method we have found to obtain 'proof' in reality. Consistency is the closest thing you will ever get to proof, and ignoring that because it isn't perfect only leads to pointless over-thought philosophies.
To say that we are making leaps of faith is like saying it takes a leap of faith to believe that you will die if you stop drinking or eating (or any other mundane assumption you make every day).

A system of finding consistencies and 'proofs' in our world is required to base any meaningful definition of reality.


--------------------
Let the Demons have their place, if so, it's angels you'll create.


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OfflineDivided_Sky
Ten ThousandThings

Registered: 11/02/03
Posts: 3,171
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Veter]
    #7793130 - 12/23/07 04:36 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I agree with you. What you are describing is a pragmatic/correspondance theory of reality. I just think guruu's reasoning was kind of faulty. The atheism he described was unbelief in anything you have not experienced or do not understand which also makes some big presumptions. I don't think it is very open minded nor wise to discount possibilities so easily based on such a limited perspective.


--------------------
1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."


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Offlinelifeson2112
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Apollyphelion]
    #7793482 - 12/23/07 06:48 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I consider myself an atheist in that I don't believe anyone knows god outside themselves. I think that being alive makes you a god. I like taking shrooms because it helps me remember this and makes me want to live up to what I am. It also makes me appreciate other people for being alive and choosing to be that way, you know? (organized) Religion kinda spits in the face of all that. Although it may be said that my belief is my religion.. Call it what you will, I just don't consider myself to be a theist.


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: EllisDSox]
    #7793583 - 12/23/07 07:35 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

EllisDSox said:
He?




Gotta call him something. :lol:


--------------------
check out my music!
drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss


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Offlinesandman3698
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Atheist]
    #10858603 - 08/14/09 11:17 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Atheist said:
dumbest shit i have ever read

if you say that god IS NOT REAL then you are an atheist (whether you like it or not)

its like saying you arent human because its a label (EVEN THOUGH WE ARE ALL HUMAN)

just because you are atheist doesnt mean other shit is included (whatever you believe)
it just means that you think god is fake




No it sounds more like agnosticism


--------------------
Insanity in individuals is something rare -- but in groups, parties, nations, and epochs it is the rule. -Nietzche

What luck for the rulers that men do not think. -Adolf Hitler


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InvisibleBiG_StroOnZ
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: Apollyphelion]
    #10858628 - 08/14/09 11:23 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

People have just manufactured this dogmatic idea that believing in a god, or an anthropomorphic deity or practicing religion makes you "spiritual." All "god" is, is a word created by man for something they could not readily understand at that point in time.

We are our own gods. That's what mushrooms, other psychedelics/entheogens, and logical thought helped me realize.


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OfflineTheLizardKing23
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Re: Atheism and Shroom-taking [Re: BiG_StroOnZ]
    #10917284 - 08/23/09 01:21 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I did not believe in god or religion before taking mushrooms or LSD and I do not believe in god or religion after taking them. I feel very connected to the world when I trip. Even when I am not tripping, I now feel more connected after having experiences on the drugs.

I don't see the need for god or religion. The world is amazing, I don't know how it got here and I never will. It does not concern me since I will never know.


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