|
Ginseng1
Elegant Universe



Registered: 09/02/04
Posts: 3,310
Last seen: 9 years, 4 months
|
Whats wrong with the P+S heads?
#7748761 - 12/12/07 11:07 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
seriously.
-------------------- Flowing through beginningless time since time without beginning...
|
skydog
Coffee & Blunts



Registered: 08/03/05
Posts: 2,486
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: Ginseng1]
#7748807 - 12/12/07 11:15 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Ginseng1 said: seriously.
Either Nothing or Infinitely nothing. I'm not quite sure. 
WRAP UR HEAD AROUND THAT ONE, LOL
--------------------

|
Jack Albertson
bismillah rahmani rahim



Registered: 04/14/06
Posts: 10,065
Loc: SOLARIS
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: skydog]
#7748828 - 12/12/07 11:20 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I dont really understand them either. It seems like they get off on trying to debunk everything that anyone says.
-------------------- Man is timid and apologetic; he is no longer upright; he dares not say "I think," "I am," but quotes some saint or sage. He is ashamed before the blade of grass or the blowing rose.Man postpones or remembers; he does not live in the present, but with reverted eye laments the past, or, heedless of the riches that surround him, stands on tiptoe to foresee the future. He cannot be happy and strong until he too lives with nature in the present, above time TRANSCEND
|
Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: Ginseng1]
#7748858 - 12/12/07 11:25 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
What's with divisive people who try to draw lines between themselves and others? Where's the love?
--------------------
|
EternalCowabunga
Being of Great Significance



Registered: 04/04/05
Posts: 7,152
Loc: Time and Space
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: Silversoul]
#7749705 - 12/12/07 02:42 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
the P&S forum has different goals than M&P - nothing wrong with that.
--------------------
|
MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: Ginseng1]
#7749746 - 12/12/07 02:54 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
We are the children of Satan and drink virgin's blood 
Other than that we're pretty cool
--------------------
   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
|
Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
|
|
Quote:
ts727 said: I dont really understand them either. It seems like they get off on trying to debunk everything that anyone says.
I've actually been on both sides of the fence here, and now I stand between them. Here's my thoughts on skeptics and debunkers:
First of all, they are not one in the same, though most debunkers like to think of themselves as skeptics. A skeptic responds to the claim by saying, "Do you have any evidence for this?" If not, they do not dismiss the claim as rubbish, but suspend judgment until such evidence can be produced. Debunkers have decided a priori that the claim is bogus, and want to prove to everyone that they're right and the person making the claim is bogus. It's kind of like a dominant, alpha-male mindset(which is not to say that such people are necessarily male).
From my experience, not everyone is all of one and none of the other. I've found even the most egotistical of debunkers to have moments of open-mindedness. I should also note that "believers" can be just as close-minded(in the debunker's view, it is only the believers who are close-minded). I think the real enemy here is certainty. When someone "knows" that their view is right and another's view is wrong, then there is not much room for genuine discussion. Just a shouting match. If, however, you accept that accept that your perceptions are gambles, and that you might learn something from someone else's point of view, then the tendency towards hostility will be greatly diminished.
These days, I try hard not to make absolute claims of truth, but to make it clear that my beliefs are only my best guesses based on my experiences. If I have paranormal experiences, I make it clear that I'm not sure about them, but that there seemed to be something unusual about them. If I was completely confident in some paranormal ability, then I would take the JREF challenge, but I would do it because I wanted to, not because some arrogant debunker rolls their eyes and waves it in my face. That is one thing that annoys me about these people. They act like we have a duty to take that challenge, and I've been accused of being selfish for not wanting to do it. If they could understand and accept that I'm not interested in proving everything I talk about, and that not everything I want to discuss is meant as an assertion, we could all save ourselves a bunch of hassle.
At the same time, the "mystic heads," as they are derogatorily called, need to understand that if you are asserting something to be true, and it conflicts with someone else's worldview, they will naturally want evidence of such a claim. They don't have to be rude about it, but you have to understand that people's egos are invested in their reality tunnels, just as you are invested in yours, so naturally tempers can flare and misunderstandings can happen. The best thing we can do is all take a chill pill and try to appreciate where the other person is coming from.
--------------------
|
Ego Death
Justadropofwaterinanendlesssea


Registered: 04/27/03
Posts: 10,447
Loc: The War Machine
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: Ginseng1]
#7750021 - 12/12/07 04:14 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Competition and psychosis.
Although they may well say the same about us.
|
MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: Ego Death]
#7750043 - 12/12/07 04:20 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Only half of what you said is true. You're right about the latter
--------------------
   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
|
Lion
Decadent Flower Magnate



Registered: 09/20/05
Posts: 8,775
Last seen: 3 days, 19 hours
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: Ginseng1]
#7750065 - 12/12/07 04:27 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
In Zen, the master tries to surprise, frighten, befuddle, anger, and pose difficult or unanswerable questions to her or his students in order to awaken them. Students likewise can test the master in a similar manner. The way I see it, much of what P&S is about is a bunch of students who are pushing each other to question their assumptions by whatever means they have. It is unwise to ever believe that one has come to a satisfactory understanding of the experience of being alive, and the goal of most P&Sers is to keep one another on our toes, to push one another to live on "the razor's edge of the present", as Eckhart Tolle described Zen practice. That's how I approach P&S, anyway.
-------------------- “Strengthened by contemplation and study, I will not fear my passions like a coward. My body I will give to pleasures, to diversions that I’ve dreamed of, to the most daring erotic desires, to the lustful impulses of my blood, without any fear at all, for whenever I will— and I will have the will, strengthened as I’ll be with contemplation and study— at the crucial moments I’ll recover my spirit as was before: ascetic.”
|
MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: Lion]
#7750087 - 12/12/07 04:32 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
bug said: In Zen, the master tries to surprise, frighten, befuddle, anger, and pose difficult or unanswerable questions to her or his students in order to awaken them. Students likewise can test the master in a similar manner. The way I see it, much of what P&S is about is a bunch of students who are pushing each other to question their assumptions by whatever means they have. It is unwise to ever believe that one has come to a satisfactory understanding of the experience of being alive, and the goal of most P&Sers is to keep one another on our toes, to push one another to live on "the razor's edge of the present", as Eckhart Tolle described Zen practice. That's how I approach P&S, anyway.
--------------------
   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
|
PhanTomCat
Teh Cat....



Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 5,908
Loc: My Youniverse....
Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
|
|
Quote:
ts727 said: It seems like they get off on trying to debunk everything that anyone says.
Debunk wha~...!? Everything....? Everyone....? They do not, got any proof to back that statement up....?

>^;;^<
-------------------- I'll be your midnight French Fry.... "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
|
sleepy
zZzZzZzZz


Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 3,888
Loc:
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: PhanTomCat]
#7751357 - 12/12/07 09:05 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
they think too much
Edited by sleepy (12/12/07 09:06 PM)
|
mushbaby
woodswalker




Registered: 09/30/06
Posts: 2,645
Loc: in my own lil world
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: sleepy]
#7751572 - 12/12/07 09:53 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I don't think anything is wrong with them. I just think alot of them are different from me.
I sometimes feel sorry for the ones who just can't admit that maybe there are things that are unexplainable. And I think there has to be an emptiness when there is no ability to just believe something might be possible regardless of how improbable.
I am sure that some of them feel sorry for us, thinking we are deluded and nuts. THat's ok. We can't all be the same. Think how boring a place it would be.
Bug, you always say some great things. I've said it before, I love to read your posts.
|
SoY
I am the LizardKing



Registered: 06/01/06
Posts: 774
Loc: Everywhere
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: sleepy]
#7751587 - 12/12/07 09:56 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
bug said: In Zen, the master tries to surprise, frighten, befuddle, anger, and pose difficult or unanswerable questions to her or his students in order to awaken them. Students likewise can test the master in a similar manner. The way I see it, much of what P&S is about is a bunch of students who are pushing each other to question their assumptions by whatever means they have. It is unwise to ever believe that one has come to a satisfactory understanding of the experience of being alive, and the goal of most P&Sers is to keep one another on our toes, to push one another to live on "the razor's edge of the present", as Eckhart Tolle described Zen practice. That's how I approach P&S, anyway.
--------------------
   "The choiceless truth of who you are is revealed to be permanently here permeating everything. Not a thing and not separate from anything."--Gaganji "Yesterday is but today's memory and tomorrow is today's dream." "My karma ran over my dogma!"
|
Ginseng1
Elegant Universe



Registered: 09/02/04
Posts: 3,310
Last seen: 9 years, 4 months
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: SoY]
#7751625 - 12/12/07 10:05 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SoY said:
Quote:
bug said: In Zen, the master tries to surprise, frighten, befuddle, anger, and pose difficult or unanswerable questions to her or his students in order to awaken them. Students likewise can test the master in a similar manner. The way I see it, much of what P&S is about is a bunch of students who are pushing each other to question their assumptions by whatever means they have. It is unwise to ever believe that one has come to a satisfactory understanding of the experience of being alive, and the goal of most P&Sers is to keep one another on our toes, to push one another to live on "the razor's edge of the present", as Eckhart Tolle described Zen practice. That's how I approach P&S, anyway.
Cool. I dig that.
I just can't see the line they are trying to push. They are all trying to push questions and answers from all directions and don't get anywhere.
-------------------- Flowing through beginningless time since time without beginning...
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: mushbaby]
#7752552 - 12/13/07 04:21 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
*generic response - not directed at any specific poster*
I have been through this a thousand times, but the wall of ignorance is just too thick in the closed mind of a believer. Facts have no bearing. Lack of real world evidence has no bearing. Common sense, logic and rationality have no bearing.
Maybe my associate that died in the Heaven's Gate suicide cult really did go to the alien mother ship behind the comet, but if you people truly believe that then psychiatric help is advised.
Maybe God really did tell Bush to kill innocent civilians and destabilize a region, but I am betting it was to make Halliburton stock go up a hundred-fold...
Every single claim made by a believer THAT CAN BE TESTED has fallen flat.
What happened to the spells put on me? What happened in my remote viewing test that no one got even close to?
Ask Shroomism why he stiffed me out of $20,000 when Planet X failed to appear. I had the cash and would have honored it, but I was the bad guy - right?
Do we really need yet another recap? Apparently so.
Famous (1938?) Loch Ness photo - plywood as admitted by the photographer.
Famous 1914 Fairie photo - darkroom magic as admitted by the photographer on her death bed.
Famous Big Foot 8 mm film (1978?) - hoax as admitted by the photographer
Face (and city) on Mars - trick of light
Talking to the dead as per Van Praagh, Edward and others - cold reading
Harmonic Convergence - nothing
Nostradamus 1999 end of world scenario - nothing
Gulf Breeze UFO sitings - hoax
Phoenix Lights - military flares
Telekinesis/telepathy - never been publicly demonstrated
Chi - basic bio-mechanics
Pyramid Power - nothing
Crystal power - nothing
Over-unity devices - nothing
Plants (and water crystals) responding to emotions - nope
Being able to tell when being stared at or seeing auras - nope. Fails every time when tested.
Knowing who is calling? Fails when tested.
Levitation? Nope.
Predictions? No accurate ones on record.
The Power of Prayer - no affect.
Homeopathy - no affect.
On and on the bullshit flows with a fresh new crop of believers every year - all hopeful-eyed and looking for magic.
How many thousands of times must I be right when it comes to esoterica? My batting record is 100%. Is that arrogance and close-mindedness?
How many issues brought up by believers in esoterica have come to pass? Umm....... ZERO! That's right. Never. Nunca.
And don't forget to bash rationalism as we communicate via a device based on logic and science.
--------------------
|
Mastamike1118



Registered: 03/29/07
Posts: 2,010
|
|
and thats a problem.....
whos testing and what are they testing??????????????
could it be possible some things cant be tested???????????? cmon now
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: Whats wrong with the P+S heads? [Re: Mastamike1118]
#7752603 - 12/13/07 05:26 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Anything that a human does that has an affect on this world can be tested. Simple.
--------------------
|
Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
|
|
> Anything that a human does that has an affect on this world can be tested.
However, through science, we know that observation has a direct effect on the testing. With this in mind, one could claim that the act of testing is invalidating the results. (Not that I buy the excuse, but... is it not valid?)
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
|
|