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tsane
Stranger
Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 1
Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
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psilocybe death?
#7743476 - 12/11/07 12:22 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I just had a conversation related to me: one participant who we will call Fred was largely misinformed about drugs. However, Fred related a story about someone he knew that had died from psilocybe mushrooms.
The supposed facts: this fellow ingested some (cultivated) psilocybe mushrooms with a few friends. The friends were fine, but this fellow ended up in hospital and his 'body just shut down'. Fred later stated that the doctor told him that this fellow 'had a seizure' and died. The doctor told him that they see someone 'every month' die from psychedelic mushrooms; 'their bodies just shut down'. Fred suggested a genetic vulnerability to this.
Fred believes this story. the doctor may have made those statements.
A quick search turned up a couple cases where someone had died and the only factor was psilocybe ingestion. One was seizure and I forget the other but possibly organ failure. As far as I can tell it is extremely rare and thus may not even be causatively linked to psilocybe (don't people occasionally just die for no reason, after all?)
I feel that Fred's story is unlikely but unfortunately I don't know the victim's name or have access to a coroner's report.
So the question is, wtf really happened?
P.S. Could this be related to the concept of 'voodoo death'? http://www.psychosomaticmedicine.org/cgi/reprint/19/3/182.pdf
An inexperienced user who fears losing control and actually believes that the drug is 'extremely dangerous' might die as a result of that belief?
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SunshineDaydream
Journeyman



Registered: 06/03/06
Posts: 1,381
Loc: OK
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: tsane]
#7743484 - 12/11/07 12:24 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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i have never heard of anyone dying from psilocybin... could be an allergy? if it even happened... from what i've read, it is an extremely non-toxic substance...
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Hotsauce72
ShapeShifter


Registered: 07/29/06
Posts: 58
Last seen: 15 years, 10 months
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I know a girl personally that went to the hospital because of a bad trip. She was freaking out and couldn't calm herself...or so she thought. The doctor said she was having a allergic reaction to the mush...restrictive breathing, sudden red rash. People should show respect for the power of the mushroom...all because some dummy reads that aspirin is more deadly then psilocybin doesn't mean that the mush can't screw up your head or worse end your unpromised life.
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PoisonedV
Fuming Shrooming




Registered: 09/13/07
Posts: 398
Loc: Hell
Last seen: 9 years, 1 month
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: Hotsauce72]
#7743568 - 12/11/07 12:53 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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WOW! thats so weird, reminds me of how my friend told me that her doctor told her, that a guy, he, he, he, he did LSD and he thought he was a glass of orange juice! Drugs must be horrible!
-------------------- Lazy...
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adrian7812
Stranger



Registered: 09/26/07
Posts: 262
Loc: Sydney, Australia
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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Scary stuff.
-------------------- Nothing I say is true. It is entirely fictional. In fact, my life is entirely fictional. I do not exist.
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evolprim
human



Registered: 05/07/06
Posts: 1,226
Last seen: 8 years, 2 months
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: PoisonedV]
#7743616 - 12/11/07 01:13 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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The toxicity of psilocybin is relatively low; in rats, the oral LD50 is 280mg/kg — almost one and a half times that of caffeine. When administered intravenously in rabbits, Psilocybin's LD50 is approximately 12.5mg/kg. [9] Death from psilocybin intake alone is unknown at recreational or medicinal levels.
The psilocybin content of psychoactive mushrooms is quite varied and depends on species, growth and drying conditions, and mushroom size.
some cases of psilocybin toxicity have been studied and refuted. most of the people who die are those who jump out of windows.
happy trails
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impeachme2
AmateurMycologist



Registered: 05/10/07
Posts: 646
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: evolprim]
#7743634 - 12/11/07 01:21 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Personally I have experienced a bad trip which caused extremely rapid mental activity, which could probably have easily caused a siezure in some people. I might have experienced a siezure and didn't even know it. The next day, my head hurt the entire day. There was so much mental activity from the bad trip, I could FEEL how rapidly my brain was handling information. I nearly lost the will to live, because I thought it would not end. I now understand that its good to establish a positive mood during the beginning of a trip. This will dramatically effect the way you attempt to interpret things. This is probably best done with enjoyable music.
-------------------- tradelist
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F1234K
Wizard Of Tryptamines



Registered: 10/14/06
Posts: 1,241
Last seen: 11 years, 11 months
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: impeachme2]
#7744524 - 12/11/07 11:06 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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My dad was telling me of a friend of his who just stopped breathing when he dosed once. He ended up fine in the end but was very close to death. It was not so much the mushrooms but the panic effect they had on the guy.
-------------------- Im Not Living, Im Just Killing Time
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skroomadoom
master of theskroomaverse


Registered: 07/16/07
Posts: 428
Loc: GA
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: F1234K]
#7744678 - 12/11/07 11:55 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I'm going to go ahead and say that no, you cannot die from any amount of psilocybin that you would reasonably ingest. How can I be so sure? Well, for one, I've read a lot of stuff about mushrooms and I've never heard of anyone dying from an overdose. Everything I've ever read puts the LD50 for psilocybin at an amount that would require one to eat POUNDS of mushrooms, which I think everyone realizes is physically impossible.
As for your friend's story, think about this. If someone died EVERY MONTH at that ONE SPECIFIC HOSPITAL, then hundreds of people should be dying EVERY MONTH from psilocybe mushrooms. Don't you think we would know about something like that? With all the energy the government puts into demonizing drugs, don't you think that if mushrooms actually did kill people, they would do everything in their power to get that information out there? Not to mention, surely if THAT many people were dying from shrooms, several people on the shroomery would be dead by now, or at least personally know someone who died, and I do not believe that is the case.
The only time I've ever heard about someone having REAL medical problems (i.e. not just a bad trip, panic attack, etc) was this dude that ate 30g dried and had muscle spasms or something and had to go to the hospital. Apparently the muscle spasms were caused by a chemical in the mushrooms that is inactive at normal doses but apparently can cause problems at that big a dose. That being said, that is ONE instance I have heard of in all my years of using, talking, and reading about drugs. I personally know two people who have eaten an ounce and one person who ate 3/4oz and none of them suffered any medical problems (at least not physical problems, to be completely honest none of them are that stable mentally -- whether that's from the shrooms or not I can't say for sure).
I'm sure you could have a panic attack that ends up resulting in a heart attack or something, but I would think you'd already need to have some sort of heart problem for this to happen. To be honest I'd think the most likely physical problem that might result from high doses would be if you somehow hurt yourself while you were tripping and didn't realize what you were doing (like jumping out a window or some shit). A lot of people here try to say that this won't happen because you will be "floored" i.e. not able to move when you are tripping hard enough to be stupid but I'm not sure this is the case. My first time tripping I took 3.5g and I knocked over a bookcase and almost flooded my friends bathroom. Who's to say I couldn't have pulled the bookcase over on myself and died? Another time on 5.5g I almost flushed an entire sheet of acid because I thought tripping was making me crazy. That's pretty fucking stupid, and I could have just as easily thought something like oh well I'm insane now might as well jump out the window or some shit.
So in the end, no, you can't die from medical complications directly, but you can probably fuck yourself up pretty good just from being completely out of it.
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Sillicybin
Registered: 02/14/05
Posts: 2,134
Loc:
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A good friend of mine went to the hospital because she started seizing after a 3G dose.... eyes rolling into the back of her head and all that "fun" stuff. Completely freaking out, panicking, and then she'd lose consciousness and start convulsing while I was sitting there talking to her.
The nurses and doctors pretty much told her that if she continued to seize, she would just have to ride it out. It wasn't anything life threatening as long as she was supervised.
What's strange is that it all happened after she had peaked... she'd been tripping for almost 2.5-3 hours before she started seizing. She'd never had any prior history of seizures before and had been on anti-depressants (Effexor) before....
She quit taking anti-depressants about two months prior to this episode, so that may have been a contributing factor. She tripped once prior to this (just after quitting Effexor) and had a somewhat mild trip with no adverse side effects.
Sure made me think twice about ever giving anyone mushrooms again... as a matter of fact, I never will. I grew them, I knew where they came from, I'd tripped off the same batch 40 times before this and have continued to do so many times after it. Just depends on the person and their condition, I guess... With her being just off the anti-depressants, she might have been desensitized to the effects of the drug, while two months later, come to find out she's super-sensitive to it.
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g00ru
lit pants tit licker



Registered: 08/09/07
Posts: 21,088
Loc: georgia, us
Last seen: 5 years, 1 month
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: Sillicybin]
#7745227 - 12/11/07 02:04 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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You can't die from shrooms. Sometimes people feel like they are forgetting to breath, its happened to me, but your body will take care of you. The worst thing that can happen is you pass out, but that almost certainly wont happen either.
IDK what causes it but mushrooms seizures are not unheard of, imo they are probably caused by sheer sensor overload. Often they can accompany ego death. Either way, there is no way that mushrooms can cause organ failure as described by the OP.
-------------------- check out my music! drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss
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primal21
Stranger
Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 63
Last seen: 15 years, 10 months
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: g00ru]
#7745331 - 12/11/07 02:25 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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The shrooms cant kill
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newlife
Raging Anamorphist



Registered: 02/08/07
Posts: 656
Loc: South of the Arctic
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: primal21]
#7745600 - 12/11/07 03:51 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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There is only one reported case from death relating to mushroom toxicity. (Sorry cant remember the source.) This was however, in combination with large amounts of mushrooms and eighteen some odd beers. So mushrooms alone cant kill you.
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primal21
Stranger
Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 63
Last seen: 15 years, 10 months
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: newlife]
#7745622 - 12/11/07 03:55 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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You would need to eat a few pounds to die probably, and at that does your asking for it anyways
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Ness1
Spreading myinvisible wings


Registered: 10/01/07
Posts: 621
Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: newlife]
#7745625 - 12/11/07 03:55 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Some people will exploit their position as an "expert" to indoctrinate their own views onto others. That is what the doctor did. He abused his position of authority and lied to you in order to scare you away from drugs.
-------------------- I know what they'll find, it's in their mind, it's what they want to see. Spare me from the light, here comes the night and here I'll stay, waiting for darkness.
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c0_hush
Stranger



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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: newlife]
#7745641 - 12/11/07 03:57 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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What if one's allergic to psilocybin? Granted, not many ppl are but I've known ppl that are allergic to weird shit that put them in emergency rooms like sunflower seeds or bee stings so I'd say it IS possible for someone to get really sick or even die from ANY chemical they are allergic to, including psilocybin... *shrug*
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Ness1
Spreading myinvisible wings


Registered: 10/01/07
Posts: 621
Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: c0_hush]
#7745657 - 12/11/07 04:00 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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When talking about a substance's toxicity I don't think that the argument that someone could be allergic to it is a valid argument unless an allergy to that substance is common. Anything can kill you the first time you consume it (ANYTHING!) so it really doesn't make for a good argument.
-------------------- I know what they'll find, it's in their mind, it's what they want to see. Spare me from the light, here comes the night and here I'll stay, waiting for darkness.
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dshroom
balshem

Registered: 08/30/06
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: Ness1]
#7745684 - 12/11/07 04:06 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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a good way to die.
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c0_hush
Stranger



Registered: 07/16/06
Posts: 417
Last seen: 12 years, 4 months
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Re: psilocybe death? [Re: Ness1]
#7745719 - 12/11/07 04:14 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Ness1 said:When talking about a substance's toxicity
I wasn't talking about toxicity. If the story is true, we don't know why the person died. I think it's safe to assume the doctor didn't know diddly squat about psilocybin because it's Schedule 1 and further research is prohibited, etc. I think it's more probable that it would be from an allergic reaction than toxicity cuz obviously the others who ate from the same batch were fine? I don't know man, the whole story sounds fishy and this, coming from a person with 1 post; I've been seeing more and more of these weird low post count ppl popping up and injecting weird comments or false stories for whatever reason or agenda they have, I'd be highly suspicious of their credibility.
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