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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: Syle]
    #7774479 - 12/18/07 04:31 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

so i am guessing that Franklin Delano Roosevelt should actually be at the top of your list using this logic? i mean, WW2 killed many many more American and other civilian lives around the world than the Iraq or Afganistan war.




Breaking news!!

We were attacked in WWII.

Iraq was a choice. And a dumb one at that.


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“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch


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OfflineSyle
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: zorbman]
    #7774506 - 12/18/07 04:39 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zorbman said:
Quote:

so i am guessing that Franklin Delano Roosevelt should actually be at the top of your list using this logic? i mean, WW2 killed many many more American and other civilian lives around the world than the Iraq or Afganistan war.




Breaking news!!

We were attacked in WWII.

Iraq was a choice. And a dumb one at that.




does it matter? millions of lives were still drastically effected or brutally lost?


--------------------
https://kenaisigh.bandcamp.com/ <- Just completed the 2021 RPM challenge for February - An EP in one month (5 songs or 20 minutes). Check it out!


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: Syle]
    #7774518 - 12/18/07 04:42 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

does it matter? millions of lives were still drastically effected or brutally lost?




Of course it matters. The war was not an option.


--------------------
“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch


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OfflineSyle
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: zorbman]
    #7774539 - 12/18/07 04:47 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zorbman said:
Quote:

does it matter? millions of lives were still drastically effected or brutally lost?




Of course it matters. The war was not an option.




sure it was, there is always a choice.


--------------------
https://kenaisigh.bandcamp.com/ <- Just completed the 2021 RPM challenge for February - An EP in one month (5 songs or 20 minutes). Check it out!


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: Syle]
    #7774568 - 12/18/07 04:54 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Syle said:
Quote:

zorbman said:
Quote:

does it matter? millions of lives were still drastically effected or brutally lost?




Of course it matters. The war was not an option.




sure it was, there is always a choice.




Not in reality.

Which is where we live incidently.


--------------------
“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: zorbman]
    #7774570 - 12/18/07 04:55 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

War with Japan was not an option. War with Germany, however, was completely optional.

That takes us further astray from the thread topic, though.




Phred


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: Phred]
    #7774584 - 12/18/07 05:00 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

War with Germany, however, was completely optional.




As a practical matter, no. Germany declared war on the U.S. four days after Pearl Harbor. War with Germany was inevitable at that point.

So Syle, are you going to offer your own response to the topic in question or just take pot shots at the answers of others who participated?


--------------------
“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch


Edited by zorbman (12/19/07 10:38 AM)


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OfflineSyle
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: zorbman]
    #7774992 - 12/18/07 06:52 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

just gonna take pot shots. i don't see a rule against that.


--------------------
https://kenaisigh.bandcamp.com/ <- Just completed the 2021 RPM challenge for February - An EP in one month (5 songs or 20 minutes). Check it out!


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: zorbman]
    #7776544 - 12/19/07 06:03 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

zorbman writes:

Quote:

As a practical matter, no. Germany declared war on the U.S. four days after Pearl Harbor.




So what? There was no need to respond to what was in reality a laughably hollow declaration of war -- Germany hadn't the foggiest hope of landing on American soil anything other than maybe a small raiding party or two from a couple of U-boats. Nazi Germany in late 1941 was less of a threat to America than was Osama bin Laden in 1998, when he declared war on America.

There were many, MANY people in the United States who at the time argued in favor of ignoring the European theater entirely and instead throwing all resources against the Japanese. Perhaps these people were right -- there is no doubt whatsoever that fighting the war on two fronts led to increased duration of the war on Japan. If all of America's military might had been thrown against the Japanese, and Hitler left to the USSR, both would have been defeated with far fewer American casualties.

Quote:

War with Germany was inevitable at that point.




Far from it. See above.

However, this has little to do with the thread topic, unless one is arguing Roosevelt was America's most retarded president for going to war against Germany. I'm not arguing that. Are you?



Phred


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: Phred]
    #7776620 - 12/19/07 07:20 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Phred said:
Germany hadn't the foggiest hope of landing on American soil anything other than maybe a small raiding party or two from a couple of U-boats.





They also sent over submarines and were sinking ships around new york with non-military civilians on them. WTF we're just supposed to let that persist?

Quote:

Nazi Germany in late 1941 was less of a threat to America than was Osama bin Laden in 1998, when he declared war on America.





What about 1945 if we HADN'T gotten involved and beaten Russia.

You would call the killing over over 2000 U.S. troop in pearl harbor troops LAUGHABLE? After Japan took over everything else in the pacific they would have taken over Hawaii.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: BrAiN]
    #7776715 - 12/19/07 08:22 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

This is totally off topic to the thread, BrAiN.

This business of the wisdom of America's going after Hitler in Europe has been discussed in great detail over the years in various threads. I say wisdom rather than necessity because clearly there was no necessity (at least from a self defense point of view) for the US to do anything but -- at most -- beef up its coastal anti-submarine defenses.

If you really have an interest in continuing this tangent, why not review one of the older threads and add your thoughts to it? Here's one you might want to start with --

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/1401391/page/0/fpart/5/vc/1

or maybe this one --

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/2058586/page/0/fpart/4/vc/1




Phred


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: Phred]
    #7776755 - 12/19/07 08:40 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Phred said:
This is totally off topic to the thread, BrAiN.




You have a real habit of feeding the flames off topic-tangents on the boards, Phred.

You tell everyone else they're OFF TOPIC and to stop their disucssion, only AFTER you've thrown your opinion in, to get the last word on something.

I see THREE posts from you here and not a single one having anything to do with the topic at hand.

.. the pot calling the kettle black >:P

But to get back ON topic... I wouldn't call Roosevelt a bad politician even IF the war with Germany were unneccessary. I mean hell.. they delcared war on US.


Edited by BrAiN (12/19/07 08:52 AM)


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: BrAiN]
    #7776778 - 12/19/07 08:50 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

We all go off topic from time to time, myself included. At least this time, I realized that my continuing to participate in this whole World War II side chain is off topic, and would take it even further off topic if continued, so I took it upon myself to offer a way to continue this tangent without derailing the thread further.

If you really are interested in pursuing the WW II angle further, what does it matter if it is in this thread or in another?

I'm used to people disagreeing with me -- there's maybe half a dozen regular posters here who agree with me, and even they don't agree with me about everything. So no, I'm not shutting down debate with someone who disagrees with me, I'm doing everything in my power to give those who disagree with me the proper place to continue the discussion (use one of the links I provided, or start a new thread if you prefer -- doesn't matter to me) while showing some respect to the originator of THIS thread.

If you see that as some sort of nefarious form of manipulation... well... nothing I can do about what goes on inside your head, I guess.



Phred


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: Phred]
    #7776792 - 12/19/07 08:53 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Phred said:
We all go off topic from time to time, myself included. At least this time, I realized that my continuing to participate in this whole World War II side chain is off topic, and would take it even further off topic if continued, so I took it upon myself to offer a way to continue this tangent without derailing the thread further.

If you really are interested in pursuing the WW II angle further, what does it matter if it is in this thread or in another?

I'm used to people disagreeing with me -- there's maybe half a dozen regular posters here who agree with me, and even they don't agree with me about everything. So no, I'm not shutting down debate with someone who disagrees with me, I'm doing everything in my power to give those who disagree with me the proper place to continue the discussion (use one of the links I provided, or start a new thread if you prefer -- doesn't matter to me) while showing some respect to the originator of THIS thread.

If you see that as some sort of nefarious form of manipulation... well... nothing I can do about what goes on inside your head, I guess.



Phred




I appreciate your tact.

What's funny... the last two times you complained about me being off topic (this one included) were threads that *I* started.

Hah!

I think 80% of the threads here pretty much get derailed so I don't even try to fight it.

Everything ends up somehow turning into one of two topics:

1) YAY RON PAUL

2) BOOOO GEORGE BUSH. AMERICA SUCKS. CAPITALISM SUCKS. OK LET ME GO OUT AND BUY SOME SHOES NOW.

At least this one was kept interesting and didn't fall into either two


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: BrAiN]
    #7776894 - 12/19/07 09:27 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

We all go off topic from time to time, myself included. At least this time, I realized that my continuing to participate in this whole World War II side chain is off topic, and would take it even further off topic if continued, so I took it upon myself to offer a way to continue this tangent without derailing the thread further.

If you really are interested in pursuing the WW II angle further, why does it matter if it is in this thread or in another?

I'm used to people disagreeing wit


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: BrAiN]
    #7777060 - 12/19/07 10:19 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

You have a real habit of feeding the flames off topic-tangents on the boards, Phred.




:yesnod:

I had already tried to steer us back on-topic but we were diverted yet again. :shrug:


--------------------
“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch


Edited by zorbman (12/19/07 10:36 AM)


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: zorbman]
    #7778711 - 12/19/07 06:13 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Well, to get back on-topic, the most retarded US politician ever, IMO, is Dan Quayle.

"I stand by all the misstatements that I've made." -- Dan Quayle, to Sam Donaldson, 8/17/89

Can you spell 'potatoe'?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: Diploid]
    #7780063 - 12/20/07 12:17 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I knew someone would mention Dan Q Public


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: Diploid]
    #7780566 - 12/20/07 06:48 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Can you spell 'potatoe'?

I never understood why there was such a furor over that incident. The word was spelled both ways until fairly recently. I have seen both versions and have never been greatly surprised to see either used. Also the plural of 'potato' is 'potatoes'.

Quayle did have a tendency to say stupid things though and I think the spuds incident was a media-friendly story that reached critical mass and the talk shows had a field day with jokes about it.

Personally, I dislike Quayle more for his politics and family values BS (which he helped popularize) than his verbal gaffes.


--------------------
“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch


Edited by zorbman (12/20/07 06:55 AM)


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: Your vote for America's most retarded politician ever [Re: zorbman]
    #7780576 - 12/20/07 06:53 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I never understood why there was such a furor over that incident.

Because he had cue cards in his hand with the correct spelling for all the words and he still mis-corrected the student's spelling.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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