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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger



Registered: 03/12/02
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The Democrats Want Universal National Service
#7713949 - 12/04/07 03:47 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Moderator Ray Suarez: "Recently in my house, a young person, turned 18, and he received a letter from the Selective Service who wrote that in no uncertain terms he had to make himself known to the Selective Service, in case he needs to be called up. I have another teenager, and she won't be hearing from the government. I'm wondering if this is giving the wrong message to our young people."
Senator Dodd: "Yes. Great question...I'm a strong person advocating that each young person gives 1,000 hours...I'm a big advocate of universal national service for our young people. I'm the only candidate who has advocated for a national service program." Suarez asked all the candidates if they would support a national youth service program if it included non-military service.
All of the candidates agreed, but Dennis Kucinich said, "Americans should be going away from militarism."
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



Registered: 03/06/03
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: fireworks_god]
#7714510 - 12/04/07 09:39 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Rumor-Mongering Extraordinaire.
How about we change that title to "Crazy Long-Shot Democrat Makes Absurd National Service Claim"
"Crazy" Chris Dodd has even less of a chance of winning the Democratic nomination as Ron Paul does the Republican one. His -2% polling numbers are scandalously low.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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xFrockx



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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Madtowntripper]
#7714516 - 12/04/07 09:43 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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It doesn't matter if they instituted mandatory military service, because if that happens I'll gladly join military service... against our government.
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



Registered: 03/06/03
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: xFrockx]
#7714531 - 12/04/07 09:47 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Nobody is doing this.
Calm down.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger



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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Madtowntripper]
#7714571 - 12/04/07 09:58 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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All of them are saying that they agree with that, even Kucinich.
Its the attitude within that which causes concern, not simply the thought of them being capable or not of enacting it anytime soon. The ideaology is fucked up.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



Registered: 03/06/03
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: fireworks_god]
#7714586 - 12/04/07 10:02 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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What Democrats Actually Say
Quote:
JOE BIDEN
Backs the creation of a U.S. Public Service Academy that would offer a subsidized college education in exchange for five years of public service. The Delaware Senator says people in public-interest careers, like teaching, should get help repaying student loans.
HILLARY CLINTON
The New York Senator also supports a U.S. Public Service Academy, modeled on the military academies, and introduced legislation to fund it. Cites her involvement with AmeriCorps, founded under Bill Clinton in 1994.
CHRIS DODD
A former Peace Corps volunteer, Dodd has made national service his signature issue. In an extensive plan, the Connecticut Senator proposes incentive grants for senior volunteers and would require public high school students to do 100 hours of service.
JOHN EDWARDS
Favors a mandatory community service requirement for high school graduation. The former North Carolina Senator has organized One Corps for local volunteers and wants to create a GreenCorps to focus on global warming.
BARACK OBAMA
The Illinois Senator proposes a national-service program that would engage disadvantaged youth in energy-efficiency and environmental work in their communities so that they could gain practical skills.
BILL RICHARDSON
Supports expanding loan forgiveness for workers in a wide variety of public-service fields, including child care, law enforcement and public health — similar to the system he started as Governor of New Mexico.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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ThePeruvianTorch
Cactidude

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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Madtowntripper]
#7714603 - 12/04/07 10:07 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I personally think its a good idea. the government doesnt allways have to be viewed as evil, I Was in the Marine corp. and it helped me tremendously, changed my life around and made me a better person, and I still enjoy all the things I've enjoyed before. free will. fun. sex. ya know, only now Im not a useless junky, I contribute to society. perhaps in the scheme of things some people are gonna get fucked up. but we need something to pull our country together as a whole. and what a better way than indoctering our youth. and im serious. its not as bad as all you hippies make it sound. Its not like we'd be the first country. go ahead and start flaming me.
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs




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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: fireworks_god]
#7714846 - 12/04/07 11:06 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Mandatory public service doesn't necessarily have to be military service. It can be volunteering for a good cause as well. I have no problem with forcing the little degenerates of today's youth to have to get off their Xbox 360's and help someone out.
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Redstorm]
#7714883 - 12/04/07 11:14 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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You know, the way the Constitution was set up, the idea behind the 2nd Amendment was that rather than have a standing army, each state would have its own militia, which would conscript and train its citizens to defend the home front, and could be called to duty in the event of an invasion or something like that. Now, that may not be ideal as far as freedom goes, but I think it's preferable to our current militarism.
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



Registered: 03/06/03
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Silversoul]
#7714916 - 12/04/07 11:22 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I don't think the Constitution calls specifically for each state to have its own militia.
The second amendment says "A Well-Regulated Militia Being Necessary For the Security of a Free State..."
By state they mean nation, in my opinion.
And that is not a direct quote, just from memory. I'm sure its not verbatim.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Madtowntripper]
#7714957 - 12/04/07 11:33 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Madtowntripper said: By state they mean nation, in my opinion.
I don't really think so. Remember that the Constitution was meant to establish a federalist system of government, with sovereign states united under a federal government. The state militia was meant to defend the state not just from foreign invaders, but from encroachment by the federal government as well. I know it's kind of hard to fathom, considering how far we've fallen from this model.
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



Registered: 03/06/03
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Silversoul]
#7714968 - 12/04/07 11:35 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yeah, I can see how your interpretation could be considered the right one.
The fact is that the entire Constitution is open to interpretation and the meaning has been considered different in history.
Its an open topic.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Madtowntripper]
#7715026 - 12/04/07 11:50 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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> The fact is that the entire Constitution is open to interpretation and the meaning has been considered different in history.
Correct, but from history we know the motivation behind these changes in interpretation. There was a lot of resistance towards the idea of a federal government to oversee the states. A lot of effort was made to ensure that states remained fairly autonomous and independent. With this in mind, it is pretty easy to see what the original interpretation of the amendment.
Quote:
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution for a decent history of the second amendment.
Quote:
The Federalists [those in favor of ratifying the US Constitution] on the other hand held that a Bill of Rights was unnecessary, particularly since the Federal Government could never raise a standard army powerful enough to overcome the militia.
Oh, how times have changed...
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



Registered: 03/06/03
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Seuss]
#7715043 - 12/04/07 11:53 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Well, in my recollection the State Militias quickly proved spectacularly inept at securing the free state, necessitating the establishment of a standing army.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
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Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Madtowntripper]
#7715118 - 12/04/07 12:09 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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> Well, in my recollection the State Militias quickly proved spectacularly inept at securing the free state, necessitating the establishment of a standing army.
I can't remember that far back... though I suspect you are correct. An American history scholar I am not. I'm more of a "I'll take z-transforms for $200" type of person.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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YidakiMan
Stranger


Registered: 09/28/02
Posts: 2,023
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Madtowntripper]
#7715127 - 12/04/07 12:10 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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You know who else has mandatory national service? j/k fark cliche
But any national mandatory service will just be gutted by the next republican president in office.
Remember the Freedomcorp, aka Americorp CCC. Bush pushed this program for kids not interested in military service after 9/11.
In 2006 he gutted their health insurance. Bonus: AmericorpCCC members are not allowed to hold outside jobs and make $900/mo. Oh yea, also mandated drug testing.
Americorp, turning potheads into alcoholics since 2006!
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Redstorm]
#7716934 - 12/04/07 07:06 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Redstorm said: Mandatory public service doesn't necessarily have to be military service. It can be volunteering for a good cause as well. I have no problem with forcing the little degenerates of today's youth to have to get off their Xbox 360's and help someone out.
Perhaps we should make it retroactive to reach back to your slacker generation. I'm quite sure you were being facetious, grandpa. At any rate, this was part of Kerry's platform in 2004. Nothing new from the fascist laft.
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downforpot
Stranger

Registered: 06/25/01
Posts: 5,715
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: zappaisgod]
#7717265 - 12/04/07 08:23 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Good idea... Should be a choice between military and other services such as working at hospitals, shelters, parks, etc. I'd prolly go military or work in some hospital.
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http://www.myspace.com/4th25 "And I don't care if he was handcuffed Then shot in his head All I know is dead bodies Can't fuck with me again"
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs




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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: zappaisgod]
#7717277 - 12/04/07 08:25 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
zappaisgod said:
Quote:
Redstorm said: Mandatory public service doesn't necessarily have to be military service. It can be volunteering for a good cause as well. I have no problem with forcing the little degenerates of today's youth to have to get off their Xbox 360's and help someone out.
Perhaps we should make it retroactive to reach back to your slacker generation. I'm quite sure you were being facetious, grandpa. At any rate, this was part of Kerry's platform in 2004. Nothing new from the fascist laft.
Hey, it wouldn't bother me. I've done probably over 100 hours of community service every year since I've been 13.
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gettinjiggywithit
jiggy


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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: fireworks_god]
#7717444 - 12/04/07 09:02 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Speaking of democrats, here are some pictures that are a riot.
That's Bill next to Hillary.

Smokers Need Health care too Poster Boy
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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DreamSignals
Morphogenetic Truth


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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
#7718054 - 12/04/07 11:56 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Can someone please post the articles in question?
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Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law. (93) Love is the law, love under will. (93 93/93)
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger



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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: DreamSignals]
#7718060 - 12/04/07 11:59 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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It is from a CNN Democratic presidental debate. I don't have a link for the transcript ready. Search for some of those contents and I'm sure you'll find it.
Government-mandated service? No thanks.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: fireworks_god]
#7718396 - 12/05/07 03:20 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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> Government-mandated service? No thanks.
Well somebody has to pay for all those socialist programs that both parties are selling... why not enslave, er force, er give a job to the mostly non-voting segment of the population and force, er allow them to work for the government for ten years or so when they get out of high school to save them the stress of having to worry about college education or finding a job. Hey, and if in the extremely super unlikely rare chance that an armed conflict were to break out, we already have a large portion of the population working for the government and can easily replace their mop or broom with a gun and send them off to fight for oil. Finally, this leaves us an out for all the well-to-do children that should avoid any kind of draft or war action since they will already be hard at work doing important government functions such as sorting IRS tax forms for the auditors.
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



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Re: The Democrats Want Universal National Service [Re: Seuss]
#7719053 - 12/05/07 10:26 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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You are a terrible cynic.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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