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Majawala
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Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing....
#7686451 - 11/27/07 03:24 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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and has it come true? Has their calender corresponded to anything in the past that came true?
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Sophistic Radiance
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7686827 - 11/27/07 04:46 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Their calendar predicted a wide range of astronomical events that turned out to be true.
I'm not sure of specifics, but I'm about to check it out on Wiki.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
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Middleman

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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7686846 - 11/27/07 04:49 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Most of the Mayan predictions for our time are strictly astronomical.
The have correctly predicted Eclipses and transits of Venus in texts like the Dresden Codex.
Many "scientific" sources have claimed the Dresden codex is out of sync, but John Major Jenkin's works have shown that it actually is, when calibrated correctly.
I understand why the skeptics are so cynical about Mayan prophecy though, there sure is a lot of BS out there.
Watch out for Dr. Jose Arguelles, he's full of it and just trying to sell books, like most 2012ers...
But the fact remains that the Mayans had at least 17 different synchronized calendars and their astronomy was very advanced for their time...
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Majawala
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7686998 - 11/27/07 05:09 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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So the astronomy is accurate, but was there a situation on earth in the past that they were able to predict based on their astronomy? see where i'm goin with this?
I mean based on the four physical forces known by physics, weak and strong nuclear, electro-magnetic, and gravity, the only one that could effect us from far away stars and planets is gravity and its so weak that it has almost 0 effect. I don't deny the possibility that maybe something else is going on, but its hard to buy that planets and stars can really effect our behavior and conciousness.
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OrgoneConclusion
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7687075 - 11/27/07 05:19 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Somehow they overlooked their own demise as they were much more concerned with bored, white, middle-class Americans some 400-500 years in the future.
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badreligion2good
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7687436 - 11/27/07 06:08 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Isnt this the wrong forum how is the related to philosophy or spirituality? This seems more fit for MRP.
-------------------- All I know is that I dont know. Row, row, row, you boat, gently down the stream. Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, life is but a dream.
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Rustifer
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7687802 - 11/27/07 07:36 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: Somehow they overlooked their own demise as they were much more concerned with bored, white, middle-class Americans some 400-500 years in the future.
That's a really good point you have there.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7688117 - 11/27/07 08:38 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: Somehow they overlooked their own demise as they were much more concerned with bored, white, middle-class Americans some 400-500 years in the future.
They saw their own exit coming actually, and they weren't concerned with us, just future ASTRONOMY.
Mayan Astronomy and Spirituality were closely linked, but if the OP wants it moved let me know.
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Middleman

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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7689771 - 11/28/07 10:22 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Majawala said:
So the astronomy is accurate, but was there a situation on earth in the past that they were able to predict based on their astronomy? see where i'm goin with this?
I haven't seen any direct references to modern world event prophecies by the Mayans. A direct reference to any ancient information is very hard to find these days. 
Well, there's always "John's Honey Scroll Trip on St. Patmos Island" aka The Book of Revelations...
I'm not a believer in doom theories, but a cataclysm would be an interesting way to go out.
Five possibilities exist: nuclear war, alien invasion, a meteor hits us, a sister brown dwarf star grazes us, or our galactic nuclei becomes active. The chances of any of these things happinging in the same year as the 2012 alignment seem unlikely though, imo.
Quote:
Majawala said:
I don't deny the possibility that maybe something else is going on, but its hard to buy that planets and stars can really effect our behavior and conciousness.
Way to be open to possibilities, however remote they may be. 
The fact that the police are busier on the full moon involves more than just gravitational forces, imo.
I suspect that due to the holographic nature of reality, we each project our universe from the inside, it's a paradox, I know, but there really is no objective world "out there". Mystics have been saying this for ages, and science is beginning to agree...
So what's happening "up there" is a fractal mirror of what's happening "in here" or "in you" - same thing ultimately, imo.
That's why the ancients "worshiped" (read: closely followed and personified) the stars and planets, because they recognized them as aspects of their own psyches. They understood that the celestial cycles mirrored cycles within themselves - personally and collectively.
Here are some quotes that I feel hint at the true nature of Astronomology...
"...perhaps there is a pattern set up in the heavens for one who desires to see it, and having seen it, to find one in himself" - Plato
"The very first thing which we would like to clarify is that both the Tarot and the Zodiac are not external phenomena. They are not "out there" and should be considered living essences or archetypes within each individual. You are a living, breathing zodiac." - M. Tsarion
"Know that the philosopher has power over the stars, and not the stars over him." - Paracelsus
"As long as you still experience the stars as something above the head you lack the eye of knowledge." - Fredrick Nietzsche
"...when the planets of the Solar System are named or symbolized...it must not be supposed that the planetary bodies themselves are referred to, except as types on a purely physical plane of the septenary nature of the psychic and spiritual worlds." - Madame Helena Petrovna Blavatsky
"It is an erroneous interpretation of astrology to opine that special forces emanate from the planets and the stars." - R.A. Schwaller de Lubicz (Sacred Science)
"As we all know science began with the stars, and mankind discovered in them the dominants of the unconscious, the "gods," as well as the curious psychological qualities of the Zodiac: a complete projected theory of human character." β Carl Gustav Jung
For we are the stars. For we sing. For we sing with our light. For we are birds made of fire. For we spread our wings over the sky. Our light is a voice. We cut a road for the soul for it's journey through death. This is the song of the stars. For we sing, we sing with our light
Song of the Stars - Passamaquoddy Indians
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gbeatle
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7691066 - 11/28/07 03:29 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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wow, amazing i love it
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Majawala
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: gbeatle]
#7692050 - 11/28/07 06:47 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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"The fact that the police are busier on the full moon involves more than just gravitational forces, imo."
I think its cause theres more light out so people are more likely to get up to no good. that and werewolves.
unfortunately i can't debate with you on the relevance of astrology cause I don't know any details.
do you have any sources for saying that the mayans knew of their own demise?
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OrgoneConclusion
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7692101 - 11/28/07 06:58 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
"The fact that the police are busier on the full moon involves more than just gravitational forces, imo."
Source? There is no increase in crime nor is there greater gravity during a full moon.
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Silversoul
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7692126 - 11/28/07 07:02 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: There is no increase in crime nor is there greater gravity during a full moon.
Source?
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igwna
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Silversoul]
#7693545 - 11/29/07 02:13 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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did they even predict the 2012 thing? i have limited backround knowledge but i was under the impression that that was just when their calender ended and we assumed it meant the end of 'time'
i could be wrong.
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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Sophistic Radiance
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#7693550 - 11/29/07 02:16 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Some studies show increased crime under the full moon, others do not.
The moon obviously has a gravitational pull on the earth. What do you think causes the rising and the falling of the tides?
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
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EllisDSox
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#7694308 - 11/29/07 10:26 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
did they even predict the 2012 thing? i have limited backround knowledge but i was under the impression that that was just when their calender ended and we assumed it meant the end of 'time'
As far as I'm aware, that's exactly what happened. I may well be wrong here, but I think there's absolutely no reference to eschatology to be found in any Mayan source- the calendar just ends.
Maybe the poor guy who had to draw out the calendars just got bored one day, or maybe they genuinely believed (correctly or not) that the world would end. Either way, they knew the date of the Winter Solstice of 2012. Impressive.
-------------------- Disclaimer: If you have any kind of heart condition, my posts are not for you. You could literally die from reading the first couple of words in any one of them. Scroll down the page, live your life and prosper, but don't read my posts because your heart will probably explode. I am not joking.
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igwna
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: EllisDSox]
#7696446 - 11/29/07 07:09 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
EllisDSox said:
Quote:
did they even predict the 2012 thing? i have limited backround knowledge but i was under the impression that that was just when their calender ended and we assumed it meant the end of 'time'
As far as I'm aware, that's exactly what happened. I may well be wrong here, but I think there's absolutely no reference to eschatology to be found in any Mayan source- the calendar just ends.
Maybe the poor guy who had to draw out the calendars just got bored one day, or maybe they genuinely believed (correctly or not) that the world would end. Either way, they knew the date of the Winter Solstice of 2012. Impressive.
Oh that is interesting. I can't imagine why they'd expect the world to end so specifically. Maybe they just wanted to scare everyone in the future
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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OrgoneConclusion
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#7696463 - 11/29/07 07:13 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Are you saying the ancient Mayans were in bed with the modern book publishers?
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bait_
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#7696500 - 11/29/07 07:21 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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If i remember corectly they believed that life on earth lived in phases. When each phase ended the earth would be destroyed or rocked by a cataclysmic event and a new phase of life began. The end of the 5th phase is supposed to be Dec 25. 2012.
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igwna
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: bait_]
#7696844 - 11/29/07 09:16 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
bait_ said: If i remember corectly they believed that life on earth lived in phases. When each phase ended the earth would be destroyed or rocked by a cataclysmic event and a new phase of life began. The end of the 5th phase is supposed to be Dec 25. 2012.
now THATS cool.
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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Middleman

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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: bait_]
#7696912 - 11/29/07 09:35 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
bait_ said: If i remember corectly they believed that life on earth lived in phases. When each phase ended the earth would be destroyed or rocked by a cataclysmic event and a new phase of life began. The end of the 5th phase is supposed to be Dec 25. 2012.
it's Sunrise (PST) 12.21.2012.
There are many stone monument calendars that end in 2012 AD so it's not like one guy just got bored and decided to end it.
There is one in particular that says some thing's going to happen, but the heiroglyph stating exactly what is eroded.
From J.M. Jenkins' site:
And from David Stuart's recent decipherment of Tortuguero Monument 6 for the UT Mesoamerican Google group:
As promised here's a quick translation of the final passage* of Tortuguero Monument 6, recording the 2012 Bak'tun ending:
Tzuhtz-(a)j-oom u(y)-uxlajuun pik (ta) Chan Ajaw ux(-te') Uniiw. Uht-oom ? Y-em(al)?? Bolon Yookte' K'uh ta ?.
"The Thirteenth 'Bak'tun" will be finished (on) Four Ajaw, the Third of Uniiw (K'ank'in). (2012) ? will occur. (indecipherable) (It will be) the descent(??) of the Nine Support? God(s) to the ?."
This is it. The term following uht-oom is the main puzzle, and largely effaced. The "descent" reference is highly tentative, too. The enigmatic deity Bolon Yookte' K'uh has been known for some time from many sources, and I suspect that he (or they) has some tangential relationship to the Principal Bird Deity, as well as war associations. Interestingly, he is a protagonist in the deep time mythology of Palenque, as recorded on Palenque's Temple XIV tablet. A long-lasting character who's still around somewhere waiting, I suppose.

One thing about Bolon Yokte's presence in the 2012 text should be emphasized. Apart from symbolizing war, conflict, and the underworld, Bolon Yokte is a god that is often present during Creation events, often referring to the Creation event of 13.0.0.0.0 in 3114 BC, and most notably on the Vase of the Seven Lords. So, what does it mean that a Creation Lord is present on the next 13.0.0.0.0, the one that falls in 2012 AD? Although some scholars have commented that the incomplete text on Tortuguero Monument 6 doesn't tell us much, they have overlooked the obvious: Bolon Yokte's mere presence suggests that 2012 was thought of as a Creation, a worldrenewal that, after all, makes perfect sense in the context of a World Age doctrine that sequences forward in intervals of 13 baktuns. This may seem to go without saying, but in fact my work has been criticized for characterizing 2012 as a "cosmogenesis." Here the scholars are one step closer to understanding 2012 for what the Maya knew it to a be: a rebirth and the beginning of a new World Age.
So, specific prophecy with content for future events are rare in hieroglyphic texts. This may explain why there is a dearth of hieroglyphic texts on 2012βone of the main complaints about my theory. For whatever reason, our expectation that there should be such texts is thus pegged as an erroneous assumption; such a dearth is the norm. This may reveal a Mayan conceptualization of past and future as non-local realities that collapse always in the present moment. We see this in the shifting tense usages when Maya folktales are told. It was, it will be, it isβthese temporal locations are interchangeable in mythic time, the space of "everything manifests in the now."
An Apparent Maya Prophecy for Our Day
Those who have read βProphecy among the Mayaβ in a previous FARMS publication[1] are aware that native Mesoamericans at the time of the Spanish Conquest had prophets.
Documents written by descendants of the Maya during the century after the conquest have furnished us with sketchy details of how and what they prophesied.
Prophecy was a feature also of inscriptions on certain Maya monuments of the Classic era (approximately AD 300β800), although almost all of the inscriptions exclusively refer to impersonal events that are safely predictable, such as future completions of a given calendrical period.[2] Recently, however, a prophecy of a more specific event has been identified on a Maya monument that was erected around A.D. 670. It points to a definite future event. At the site now called Tortuguero, about 35 miles west-northwest of Palenque in southernmost Mexico, Monument 6 bears an enigmatic inscription.[3] An event is mentioned that was expected to take place on the Maya date 13.0.0.0.0 4 Ahaw 3 Kβankiβin; following the generally accepted correlation of their calendar with ours, that would fall on Friday, 21 December 2012. (Some modern interpreters have spoken of this date as βthe end of the world,β although there is no explicit basis for that idea in Maya lore.)[4] At that time the god Bolon Yokte Kβu was prophesied to βdescend,β presumably from a heavenly realm to earth (erosion damage of a key glyph makes the reading of the verb somewhat uncertain).
This monument allows us to be confident that the practice of prophesying future happenings was going on within a few centuries after the end of the Book of Mormon period, and since the custom of recording prophecies continued for at least a thousand years into Spanish colonial times, probably Monument 6 is not the earliest manifestation of the pattern that will be found. Such prophesying thus could have been going on from before Mormonβs day.
The Mayan date for 12.21.2012 is 13 PIK 4 AHAW, 3 K'ANK'IN
Words form modern day Mayans about 2012:
"4 Ahaw k'atun is the eleventh k'atun according to the count. Chichen Itza is the seating of the k'atun. The settlement of the Itzas comes. The quetzal comes, the green bird comes. He of the yellow tree comes. Blood-vomit comes. K'uk'ulkan shall come...." Book of Chilam Balam of Chumayel.
The passage explicitly references the 4 Ahaw k'atun (7,200 day period) in the mid-1700s but most likely refers to the arrival of the historical K'uk'ulkan in 987. However, according to maya cyclical time, the 4 Ahaw k'atun ending on the 2012 winter solstice would likely share similar qualities.
"Rix bβix kan chiqe ojer kumal qatit, qamam. Jewa: 'Kiwil china riβ kβisbβal kβux kβisbβal wasaq. Ri kβisbβal uβwa kβux. Kiwil china ri kaqa saqil. Ka kβex taj kβu ri uβ ra ri u wach ulew'.
Pa jun ch'ab'al k'o pa ri loq'laj wujil Pop Wuj. Pa ri ch'ab'al k'o jun q'et tzij jewa kub'ij. 'Me qayexik rumal ri qatb'al tzij'. Rechi je ka tzijon wa xax ki si qo ojer chi ka k'uji jun qatab'al tzij maj chi taj ri ku b'an k'ax chi kech ri mayib winaq wa qas tzij. Wakamik q'ij konojel taq ri q'atb'al tzij ri k'o pataq. Qa amaq' "AmΓ©rica" ma ajchi taj mak'otu rech e loq'laj qa no'jib'al kojonik maya. Wawataq q'atab'al tzij tajin kub'an k'ax che ri qas qa k'aslemal mayib' ri kelawi pa ri qa chomanik wane are konojel taq ri chomanik (pensamiento ideolΓ³gico) aj ch'aqapja (occidental) su kasach u'wach sux powik kanoq. Pataq ri junab' ri jetel uloq ri 2012. 'We ka b'in na ri q'ij we k'ona ri saqir u'wach ulew osu maka sachta ri qa k'aslemal Β΄jew ri ku b'ij ri ch'ab'al' rech ri loq'laj wuj Pop Wuj". Rigoberto Itzep Chanchavac. ajq'ij k'iche' (2006) "That which our grandfathers and grandmothers left us from before: You will still see many warnings. You will still see and hear strange things. You will still see great ruin. There will be many changes on Earth. In a passage from the sacred book Pop Wuj, in one of the lines it says, 'nor are they condemned by justice.' When it speaks and says this, they are making a prophecy that there was going to be a Western judgment against the Maya; this is a reality. Today the laws of the Americas are foreign to the maya cosmovision. These laws are violating the legitimate rights of the Maya. Another interpretation enters in that the ideological power of the West in its entirety might expire forever in 2012. 'As long as the sun walks, as long as there as light, our existence will never be lost.' Thus says the passage in the sacred Pop Wuj." Rigoberto Itzep Chanchabac, K'iche' spiritual guide from Momostenango (2006)
"From the perspective of contemporary Maya, 2012 constitutes a very important point in the history of humanity since time is a variable that greatly influences the life of the planet and everything that exists on it. Human beings do not exist by coincidence or by a work of chance. They are part of a plan to carry out a mission in this part of the universe. The world is still not totally finished in its creation and perfection; this human creature has a role to play en the world and its preservation. One could say that the life of the planet depends on human beings and what they do in their existence.β Gaspar Pedro GonzΓ‘lez (2006)
2012 is the central theme in the novel TRECE BβAKβTUN that will come out in Spanish in Guatemala this year. The novelist, Gaspar Pedro GonzΓ‘lez publishes from within the maya context and his life experiences that begin in Xibalba alongside the Ajtxum who preserve authentic maya identity.
"Prophetic expressions of the indigenous peoples insist on the protagonist role that new generations must play at the close of this Oxlanh B'aktun (thirteen B'aktun) and the beginning of the new Maya millennium. The ancestors have always said that 'one day our children will speak to the world.' ... This millennial or b'aktunian movement responds to the close of a great prophetic cycle ... the great prophetic cycle of 400 years in the Maya calendar. For the Maya, this is not the close of the second millennium or 2000 years after Christ, but rather the close of the fifth millennium according to the ancient Maya calendar initiated in the mythical year that corresponds to 3114 B.C. (correction of typo in original) ... The b'aktun includes the global concept of time and the regeneration of life with new ideas and actions. In other words, the theoretical b'aktunian approach leads us to understand the effect of human ideas and actions on all that exists on the earth and their effects on the environment and cosmos." Victor Montejo (2005) in Maya Intellectual Renaissance: Identity, Representation and Leadership (Austin: U of Texas P, 2005), 120-122.
"The end of the world is going to arrive in the year 2000 and bit more, but no one know how much a bit is. It might be 30 years or a century, nobody knows when it will be.... The legend used to say that in Chan Santa Cruz there would arrive a time in which four white ropes would cross; these ropes are the highways to Merida, Vallodolid, Cancun and Vigia Chico. These ropes are a sign that time is going to change; or perhaps that time already changed. When times change, a new war is also near.... The war to come will begin far away and will end here, but before it begins there will be several signs." Son of an elder prayermaker in Xcacal Guardia (1994) in JesΓΊs J. Lizama Quijano, "Las seΓ±ales del fin del mundo: Una aproximaciΓ³n a la tradiciΓ³n profΓ©tica de los cruzo'ob" http://www.uady.mx/sitios/mayas/articulos/tradicion.html
βOur Lord Hachakyum will make everything die because of the cold. The grass wishes to die. The seed, the animals all wish to die. And the True People [the Lacandon Maya] also β we all die. In thirty years Hachakyum will destroy the world." Chan K'in Viejo of Naja (1978) in Victor Perera and Robert D. Bruce, The Last Lords of Palenque: The Lacandon Mayas of the Mexican Rain Forest (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1982), 49.
"I guess I'll tell you the story of beautiful holy Lord for you to hear, because I have read the testament of beautiful holy Lord, where he says (that in) 2000 and a few more years it will end on earth. But if they have been very good Christians on earth, he will not end it.... He begins to diminish, beautiful holy Lord, His merciful grace (corn), the end of the road.... It is left, they are just looking one another in the face, no one is going to win the fight, hunger is going to win, truly. It ends, then, the fight like that. Hunger is going to finish it. Amidst that, whoever remembers there is a beautiful holy Lord, he makes a prayer in the cornfield, a harvest ceremony. Thus he makes it for beautiful holy Lord, He throws out blessings, beautiful holy Lord, there is corn in the fields." Lorenzo Kinil of Chemax (1930) in Paul Sullivan, Contemporary Yucatec Maya Apocalyptic Prophecy: the Ethnographic and Historical Context, diss., John Hopkins U., 1984, 291-95.
βIt is an event that has already begun, there are already signs. If humans donβt correct our course in the face of these events we will be off-balance in the moment the event appears, a very strong event in comparison with what we have experienced. Humans more than ever should pay close attention to all the events that disturb balance. They are teachings that we living beings should extract from the stages through which we pass. Itβs not that we are arriving at a zero hour in 2012, itβs already beginning. That is, just as in a day we begin at dawn, and as we approach noon the sun beats down harder; just as in the afternoon the forces of the sun start to calm down until experiencing night. In the passing of a day we experience degrees and effects of heat and at the same time we experience the energies that influence our lives. This date is the same way and I dare say that 12 years previous to 2012 we have been experiencing different stages of a sacred effect that can turn harmful if we lose human wisdom and there will be 12 years after in which the effects also will arrive. 2012 is just the high point of the story.β JosΓ© MarΓa Tol Chan, K'iche' daykeeper from Chichicastenango (2006)
"The time of the year Thirteen B'aqtun on our solar calendar of 365 days, a time of great social, political, economic and spiritual changes in our region, America and the entire world ... From the day One Aj, of the yearbearer Eleven Kame ... the 29th of April of 1991 enters the influence of Thirteen B'aqtun of which we are in the first cycle of thirteen, within two cycles when they mark the year 2020 plus 2 all the prophecies of Thirteen B'aqtun will be fulfilled on the yearbearer Eleven Kame. For conscious beings, the children of honey, the sixth sun, they will be marvelous changes of light, but for the heartless unconscious who treated the Heart of Sky and Heart of Earth Nature poorly, it will be a life of justice and cruelty. Right now we are awaiting the time of One B'atz and One Chowen, day of inspiration of the Dawning." Chuchqajaw Kaqchikel Achi Ijatz, Apolinario Chile PixtΓΊn (2005) Coordinador Titular of the Gran ConfederaciΓ³n de Consejos Principales Ajq'ijab' Mayab' de Guatemala.
"One day the English will give us arms and the people will go to war to throw out the Yucatecans. The sign will be when the money disappears from the hands, Mexican money; that will be the end of the year and a little, the end of the world. Who knows if it will be this year or in a thousand years? It will be just past the end of the year." Raimundo Canul (1959) in Nelson A. Reed, The Caste War of Yucatan (Stanford, Stanford UP, 2001), 343-44.
"The monumental cycle called Saqarik* (dawn) or thirteen b'ak'tun, began on this date: 4 Ahaw 8 Kumk'u and it will end on the day 4 Ahaw, the winter solstice of December 21, 2012 (day on which the new Saqarik or new oxlajuj b'ak'tun will begin.)" JosΓ© MucΓa Batz (1996), βNikβ: FilosofΓa de los nΓΊmeros mayas (Chimaltenango, Guatemala: Editorial Rutzijol, 1996), 12. *Special usage of the traditional K'iche' morning greeting created by MucΓa Batz.
"12/21/2012, if we analyze the counting up of the numerals of this date, gives us a Cabalistic number that is 11. Within metaphysics, this number represents the world of the ascended masters. If we look at the Popul Wuh, we can realize that three eras existed: the era of the gods, the era of the heroes and the era of humans where the decline began. But what's going on? What is happening is that within maya prophecies, it makes visible the return to power. The curious thing is that within the awaited time, one also sees the awakending of the maya world in its complexity. One can see that we face the appearance of ascended Maya spirits who will come to raise up the people. The famous passage "May no one be left behind" and also the phrase "We always return from where we came." It means that we face great changes, great powers that never have been seen on the face of the earth." Kaqchikel daykeeper Baldomero Kawoq Cuma (2005)
βTe meβel mamaletik kuβuntik ta Chyapae ay lom bayel yaβyejik, ya snopik sok ya sules ta sjolik te binti ya spas te balamilale jich ya smel yoβtanik yuβun te lumlumtike sok te ba nakalik te jmeβtik tatike. Bayel ta chajp aβteletik te maβyuk tsakalik sok mukβul jtunele ay stsobo sbaik, xchapel skβopik, ta spukbel skβoplal te bitβil ayix wokolajel yuβun te jaβ ta Chyapae. Ay staoik ta ilel ta yaβwilal 2025, cheb oxajtβ te balamilal ya xlijk lajuk te yaβalike. Lom bayelix te machβatik ya staikix ta nopel te jaβnix xchβunejik te binti la yalik te jmam jmeβchuntike, te jaβnix lom tulan skβoplal bitβil lek ya xkuxinotik sok te jmeβtik jkaxeltike. Te jkβulejetik te jaβ lom chopol te bitik ya spasike sok te jaβ ya skuy ta yuβunik sok te jaβ ya spastaik jay tuluk ta kβulejal yuβun te bitik ay ta balamilale, jaβ smulik te binti lom chopol ya xtal ta balamilale. Jaβinto te bitik ya kalbetik skβoplale tsakaltal ta skβop yaβyejik te jmam jmeβchuntike, te jaβnix aytal ta stojol maba jaβnax te mejikoe ta spβejel te balamilale. Jich te skβop yaβyejik te jmam jmeβtike, yakalotikix yilel, yantoxan a te binti ya xkβot ta pasel ta yaβwilal 2012. ΒΏBinti ya spas te balamilal teme mala kichβtik ta mukβe? Ya kil yilel te ayuk binti ya stakβ pasel te yuβun jich ya xjel snopojibal sok te yakuk xjul chβulelik te jmeβtik tatik te ba nakalotike, ta spβejel mejiko soknix ta spβejel balamilal, ayuk bitβil lek ya xkuxinotik, kichβtik lek ta mukβ te jmeβtik jkaxeltike soknix te jkuxineltikeβ. La stsβibu Tsiak Tsaβpat Tsβit (2006)
"Our elders in Chiapas have set-up many discussions analyzing and reflecting upon what is happening in the world and it is worrisome for the people and communities. Different NGOs have had meetings, forums, and information campaigns about the water problems in Chiapas. They have determined that by the 2025, two-thirds of the world population will face problems with water. Many of these analysts base themselves on maya philosophical concepts, mainly that of living harmoniously with the powers of nature. Savage capitalism attacks this concept, privledging power and the wealth of natural resources for the egotistical benefit of a few plunderers and bringing devastating consecuences for the rest of humanity. These considerations are found contained in the ancient maya profecies and are not directed just to Mexico but to the whole world. Thus, we are already living these prophecies, apart from what will occur in 2012. What will happen to humanity if we do not become more aware? From what one sees, something must be done to transfor the mind and consciousness of local, national and worldwide society with the goal of attaining a more just and harmonious way of preserving our planet and our life." Tzeltal writer Diego Mendez Guzman (2006)
βAs the elders said, everything is going to change. The world will be changed by that memorable date. Our children will have a different world view. The time will have passed and other beings will inhabit the universe.β Mam teacher Benito Ramirez Mendoza (2006)
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Sophistic Radiance
Free sVs!



Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 43,135
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#7696924 - 11/29/07 09:38 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Taking all bets on nuclear holocaust.
Thanks for all that info, Middleman, I have a hard time grokking the Mayan calendar...
I'd be surprised if the end of the world happens in 2012... but then, I'd be surprised if nothing happened.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
Edited by Tchan909 (11/29/07 09:40 PM)
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igwna
The Cap'n


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
#7697023 - 11/29/07 10:13 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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so wait.. is it predicted the end of time, the world, or humanity?
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#7697188 - 11/29/07 11:24 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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I hate to spoil the surprise for y'all, but the date merely signals the end of the Simpsons TV series. They made a good run of it, though.
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Majawala
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7697338 - 11/30/07 12:22 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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what happened at the end of the previous 4 phases? do they correlate with cataclysmic events?
edit: around 3114 BC which is when the 4th phase began is around when the first egyptian dynasty started. kinda cool, but no mayhem or destruction. i think people like this 2012 stuff cause of all the metaphor it has. but its like saying you need a god figure to enjoy spirituality.
Edited by Majawala (11/30/07 12:33 AM)
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Silversoul
Rhizome


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7697343 - 11/30/07 12:25 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: I hate to spoil the surprise for y'all, but the date merely signals the end of the Simpsons TV series. They made a good run of it, though.
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igwna
The Cap'n


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7697530 - 11/30/07 02:30 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: I hate to spoil the surprise for y'all, but the date merely signals the end of the Simpsons TV series. They made a good run of it, though.
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
#7697533 - 11/30/07 02:35 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tchan909 said:
Thanks for all that info, Middleman, I have a hard time grokking the Mayan calendar...
I'd be surprised if the end of the world happens in 2012... but then, I'd be surprised if nothing happened.
Word. I always have lots to share but usually don't bother because it seems to just fall on deaf and dumb ears.
Nothing never happens. Big changes are presently happening one small event at a time...
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7697563 - 11/30/07 03:12 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
I always have lots to share but usually don't bother because it seems to just fall on deaf and dumb ears.
Probably because not a single future thing you have ever shared here has come to pass and most of the nonsense you spew has no foundation or evidence except for some wacky book or website with no foundation or evidence except for another wacky website or book with no foundation or evidence...
A mountain of bullshit is still bullshit. Volume and quantity and number of believers tells us nothing of the subject discussed; it only points speaks to the gullibility of mankind
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Majawala
Stranger
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7697574 - 11/30/07 03:31 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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I know that big changes are going on. but I don't think its necessary to bring the mayans into it. i think all the arguments and hypothesis would be much more digestible if it was backed up by real events. the mayan stuff is just an extra unnecessary layer.
Edited by Majawala (11/30/07 03:32 AM)
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7697585 - 11/30/07 03:39 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Was there ever a time when big changes were not going on?
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Majawala
Stranger
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7697600 - 11/30/07 03:54 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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very true
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kidaihuan
First Growery Ban



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7697661 - 11/30/07 05:30 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Was there ever a time where humanity had the means to literally kill every living being and destroy the earth?
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7697680 - 11/30/07 06:05 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
"The fact that the police are busier on the full moon involves more than just gravitational forces, imo."
Source? There is no increase in crime nor is there greater gravity during a full moon.
Woah, incorrect, at least on the gravity bit. When the moon is either full or new, the gravitational forces of the moon and sun are combined resulting in "spring tides". Granted, the moon's gravity doesn't change, but your claim was on gravity in general, not the gravity of just the moon.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tide:
Quote:
The semidiurnal tidal range (the difference in height between high and low tides over about a half day) varies in a two-week or fortnightly cycle. Around new and full moon when the Sun, Moon and Earth form a line (a condition known as syzygy), the tidal forces due to the Sun reinforce those of the Moon. The tide's range is then maximum: this is called the spring tide, or just springs and is derived not from the season of spring but rather from the verb meaning "to jump" or "to leap up". When the Moon is at first quarter or third quarter, the Sun and Moon are separated by 90Β° when viewed from the earth, and the forces due to the Sun partially cancel those of the Moon. At these points in the lunar cycle, the tide's range is minimum: this is called the neap tide, or neaps. Spring tides result in high waters that are higher than average, low waters that are lower than average, slack water time that is shorter than average and stronger tidal currents than average. Neaps result in less extreme tidal conditions. There is about a seven day interval between springs and neaps.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7697690 - 11/30/07 06:11 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
I always have lots to share but usually don't bother because it seems to just fall on deaf and dumb ears.
Probably because not a single future thing you have ever shared here has come to pass and most of the nonsense you spew has no foundation or evidence except for some wacky book or website with no foundation or evidence except for another wacky website or book with no foundation or evidence...
A mountain of bullshit is still bullshit. Volume and quantity and number of believers tells us nothing of the subject discussed; it only points speaks to the gullibility of mankind
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gbeatle
Stranger


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7697971 - 11/30/07 08:42 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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well guys we've only got 5 years left... PARTY!!!!!!!!!!!!!11 like theres no tommorow
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gbeatle
Stranger


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7697984 - 11/30/07 08:48 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
I always have lots to share but usually don't bother because it seems to just fall on deaf and dumb ears.
Probably because not a single future thing you have ever shared here has come to pass and most of the nonsense you spew has no foundation or evidence except for some wacky book or website with no foundation or evidence except for another wacky website or book with no foundation or evidence...
A mountain of bullshit is still bullshit. Volume and quantity and number of believers tells us nothing of the subject discussed; it only points speaks to the gullibility of mankind
uhhh no.
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: gbeatle]
#7698112 - 11/30/07 09:33 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
gbeatle said: uhhh no.
Elaborate perhaps?
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7699138 - 11/30/07 01:51 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Sorry MT, but that was the sum total of his thought.
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7699389 - 11/30/07 02:44 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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You're taking away all the fun!
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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daytripper23
?


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Loc:
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7699404 - 11/30/07 02:48 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Someday, Im going to look into this 2012 stuff. Someday Before 2012.
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: daytripper23]
#7699445 - 11/30/07 03:02 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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--------------------
   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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machination
Stranger
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7699630 - 11/30/07 03:50 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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in the year 2037 reptiles fry under blazen gold sky
-------------------- "Have you not learned that your word is bond? Yes, my word is bond and bond is life, I shall give my life, before my word shall fail."
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: machination]
#7699648 - 11/30/07 03:54 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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What happens in the year 2525, if man is still alive, if woman can survive?
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machination
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7699682 - 11/30/07 04:03 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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time will be taste
-------------------- "Have you not learned that your word is bond? Yes, my word is bond and bond is life, I shall give my life, before my word shall fail."
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: machination]
#7699839 - 11/30/07 04:41 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Time will be... huh?
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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gbeatle
Stranger


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7700734 - 11/30/07 08:32 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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and0rr
sync



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: gbeatle]
#7701542 - 12/01/07 12:40 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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nobody mention timewave zero yet? Or the concept of time travel being created on 2012?
-------------------- "Our society is run by insane people for insane objectives. I think we're being run by maniacs for maniacal ends and I think I'm liable to be put away as insane for expressing that. That's what's insane about it." -John Lennon
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gbeatle
Stranger


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: and0rr]
#7702750 - 12/01/07 12:59 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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white men came over to america and killed all the people and inforced there veiws and bullshit and inslaved black people and are still in control of america to this day brainwashing everyone through media and things. lol i find it quite funny
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Silversoul
Rhizome


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7702795 - 12/01/07 01:15 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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I wonder if 2012 will bring an increase in maxed out credit cards.
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urtrippin
joker, smoker,midnight toker


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#7702900 - 12/01/07 01:54 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think perhaps I will invest in a titanium hat, with closed cell foam padding, rather than a tin foil hat at around 2012.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Silversoul]
#7704869 - 12/02/07 12:17 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Silversoul said: I wonder if 2012 will bring an increase in maxed out credit cards.
I think you're on to something.
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machination
Stranger
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7706195 - 12/02/07 11:27 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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we're all time travellers, the divinity personified, timeless, eternal shadow devouring, born from Elohim, alien hybrid mutants, splicing in our gnu code into god code, we have done this forever, a salaam malakim
-------------------- "Have you not learned that your word is bond? Yes, my word is bond and bond is life, I shall give my life, before my word shall fail."
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: machination]
#7706244 - 12/02/07 11:41 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Don't forget Bush and Burger King.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Ego Death
Justadropofwaterinanendlesssea


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Icelander]
#7706594 - 12/02/07 01:11 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Theres a video on www.quicksilverscreen.com
Its about 2012 and what evidence there is.
It appears to me that the evidence was mostly just over-active thinking and imagination.
All thats really certain was that the Mayan calender ends but it is a big circle so maybe they just ran out of room on the stone?
Apparently it is some astrological alignment so its possible that it could be the cause of these pole shifts. We know they exist but don't seem to know what causes them.
I'm betting nothing happens though - it just seems to be explaining astronomy, so if the Mayans were still here they'd probably be making their next calendar now.
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a_guy_named_ai
Stranger

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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7707458 - 12/02/07 05:17 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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How come people keeps talking about this 2012 thing, but I read somewhere on wikipedia that the people in South America who are really involved in the religion say people who assert 2012 "apocalypse" that people who say things don't understand their religion or culture.
One interesting thing I saw though was that nasa also predicted that the sun would reverse it's poles in 2012. What happens if that happens?
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HELLA_TIGHT
Madge the Smoking Vag



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Loc: Afghanistan
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7707537 - 12/02/07 05:38 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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2012 isn't a Mayan prediction of the end of the world. That's just what retarded new agers think.
2012 is just the ending of the 12th baktun, and it restarts at the beginning of the 13th.
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
#7707539 - 12/02/07 05:39 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
How come people keeps talking about this 2012 thing, but I read somewhere on wikipedia that the people in South America who are really involved in the religion say people who assert 2012 "apocalypse" that people who say things don't understand their religion or culture.
And what exactly is your question? Very hard to distinguish from your... phrase.  Also to which of the religions from South America are we talking about? From what I know there's a diversity of religions.
but "somewhere on wikipedia" doesn't count as a source.
Quote:
One interesting thing I saw though was that nasa also predicted that the sun would reverse it's poles in 2012. What happens if that happens?
Source
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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Jack Albertson
bismillah rahmani rahim



Registered: 04/14/06
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7707569 - 12/02/07 05:44 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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it's just a big shift that's it. I dont see it as a big deal, im just glad i should be around to ascend into the bed, the bath, and the BEYOND.
-------------------- Man is timid and apologetic; he is no longer upright; he dares not say "I think," "I am," but quotes some saint or sage. He is ashamed before the blade of grass or the blowing rose.Man postpones or remembers; he does not live in the present, but with reverted eye laments the past, or, heedless of the riches that surround him, stands on tiptoe to foresee the future. He cannot be happy and strong until he too lives with nature in the present, above time TRANSCEND
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Ego Death
Justadropofwaterinanendlesssea


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
#7707576 - 12/02/07 05:46 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
jonathan_206 said: How come people keeps talking about this 2012 thing
A prediction like that spreads like wildfire!
If someone actually had the answer as to the end of the world (and told others) most the world would know in a matter of hours! Its just something everyone would like to know.
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a_guy_named_ai
Stranger

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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7708037 - 12/02/07 07:14 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Also to which of the religions from South America are we talking about? From what I know there's a diversity of religions.
but "somewhere on wikipedia" doesn't count as a source.
It didn't say specifically form what I remember. I know it doesn't count as a source, I tried to find it before I posted but I couldn't find it and I thought someone would know what I'm talking about. It seems the 2012 page has been messed with, it said there's been vandalism also.
One thing I read though that I saw interesting :
Quote:
According to the Maya there will be a baktun ending in 2012, a significant event being the end of the 13th 400 year period, but not the end of the world.[9]
[edit] Inscriptions beyond 2012
Maya stela occasionally show dates beyond 2012. Most of these are in the form of "distance dates", where a Long Count date is given with a distance date to be added. For example, on Tablet of Inscriptions from Palenque were found the following Long Count date: 9.8.9.13.0 8 Ahau 13 Pop (24 March 603 Gregorian) with a distance date of 10.11.10.5.8. The resulting date is given as 1.0.0.0.0.8 5 Lamat 1 Mol,[10] or 21 October 4772 β almost 3,000 years into the future. The king Pacal of Palenque predicted that on this date the eightieth Calendar Round anniversary of his accession will be celebrated, suggesting he did not believe the world would end in 2012.[11]
[edit] Summary
Despite the publicity generated by the 2012 date, Susan Milbraath, curator of Latin American Art and Archaeology at the Florida Museum of Natural History, stated that "We [the archaeological community] have no record or knowledge that [the Maya] would think the world would come to an end" in 2012.[12]
"For the ancient Maya, it was a huge celebration to make it to the end of a whole cycle," says Sandra Noble, executive director of the Foundation for the Advancement of Mesoamerican Studies in Crystal River, Fla. To render Dec. 21, 2012, as a doomsday or moment of cosmic shifting, she says, is "a complete fabrication and a chance for a lot of people to cash in."[13]
What do proponents have to say about this?
Edited by jonathan_206 (12/02/07 07:17 PM)
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machination
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
#7708050 - 12/02/07 07:16 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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clean out your lungs = hahaha , cant find a reason to laugh? inhale as deep as you can and HA, ha, ha ha ha ha ha
-------------------- "Have you not learned that your word is bond? Yes, my word is bond and bond is life, I shall give my life, before my word shall fail."
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: machination]
#7708058 - 12/02/07 07:17 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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What does that have anything to do with the subject?
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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a_guy_named_ai
Stranger

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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7708077 - 12/02/07 07:21 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've been noticing it seems some people are posting it seems to just increase their post count.
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machination
Stranger
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7708080 - 12/02/07 07:22 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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[it has everything to do with the subject. your lungs our our lungs har har har
-------------------- "Have you not learned that your word is bond? Yes, my word is bond and bond is life, I shall give my life, before my word shall fail."
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: machination]
#7709668 - 12/03/07 05:14 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Seriously dude, please cut the BS.
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
#7714064 - 12/04/07 06:02 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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> To render Dec. 21, 2012, as a doomsday or moment of cosmic shifting, she says, is "a complete fabrication and a chance for a lot of people to cash in."
That pretty much sums up my feelings on the subject. If the people that make up this stuff really believed what they were spouting, then they would be out making the most of their last four years, living a life of void of repercussions.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Seuss]
#7714159 - 12/04/07 07:21 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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The Mayans predicted that Ron Paul would be elected president in 2008. Four years later, when he wins again, and then, at the start of 2012, world peace ensues and everyone lives happily ever after.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: fireworks_god]
#7714222 - 12/04/07 07:54 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7714301 - 12/04/07 08:24 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Your shirt is stylish.
--------------------
If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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machination
Stranger
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7714371 - 12/04/07 08:52 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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awwwww mannng WHY? you cut out the sh it
-------------------- "Have you not learned that your word is bond? Yes, my word is bond and bond is life, I shall give my life, before my word shall fail."
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: machination]
#7714396 - 12/04/07 09:00 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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>> Moderator: Seriously dude, please cut the BS > awwwww mannng WHY? you cut out the sh it
14-day forum ban.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: machination]
#7714404 - 12/04/07 09:03 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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[double post]
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Seuss]
#7714436 - 12/04/07 09:15 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Thanks Seuss.
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Diploid
Cuban



Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Ego Death]
#7715220 - 12/04/07 12:33 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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maybe they just ran out of room on the stone?
Have you ever been reading a book but needed to stop, then rather than than just close it in the middle of a paragraph, you keep reading until a handy stopping point like the end of a chapter?
The Mayans stopped calculating their calender in 2012 because that's the equivalent in astronomical calculations to the handy stopping point in the book analogy. It's where the celestial mechanics number crunching all converges more or less and it's a perfect stopping point to put a bookmark. They did, after all, by this time have several hundred years worth of dates stockpiled.
Why do people have such a hard time accepting this? It's like the human psyche finds convoluted and implausible explanations somehow more satisfying than mundane ones.
What ever happened to Occam's Razor?
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Diploid
Cuban



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
#7715237 - 12/04/07 12:36 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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nasa also predicted that the sun would reverse it's poles in 2012
I highly doubt NASA said any such thing.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Silversoul
Rhizome


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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Diploid]
#7715353 - 12/04/07 01:09 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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It's not just a stopping point, a full revolution. It marks the beginning of another cycle. So I guess the Mayan calendar would start all over again after that point.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Diploid]
#7715373 - 12/04/07 01:14 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Diploid said: nasa also predicted that the sun would reverse it's poles in 2012
I highly doubt NASA said any such thing.
Actually they did, but the sun does that every 11 years. 2012 happens to be the next Solar Maximum.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Silversoul]
#7715376 - 12/04/07 01:15 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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So on Decemeber 12, 2012, the world will end and then instantly restart and no one will notice.
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



Registered: 12/02/05
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7715400 - 12/04/07 01:19 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Just like they never noticed before.
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7715550 - 12/04/07 01:55 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yes, but this is a brand new non-noticement.
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Diploid
Cuban



Registered: 01/09/03
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7715801 - 12/04/07 02:45 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Actually they did, but the sun does that every 11 years. 2012 happens to be the next Solar Maximum.
You're confusing the 11-year solar cycle with a magnetic pole shift. Two different animals. The sun does not reverse it's magnetic field every 11 years.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Diploid]
#7715818 - 12/04/07 02:51 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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February 15, 2001 -- You can't tell by looking, but scientists say the Sun has just undergone an important change. Our star's magnetic field has flipped.
The Sun's magnetic north pole, which was in the northern hemisphere just a few months ago, now points south. It's a topsy-turvy situation, but not an unexpected one.
"This always happens around the time of solar maximum," says David Hathaway, a solar physicist at the Marshall Space Flight Center. "The magnetic poles exchange places at the peak of the sunspot cycle. In fact, it's a good indication that Solar Max is really here."
The Sun's magnetic poles will remain as they are now, with the north magnetic pole pointing through the Sun's southern hemisphere, until the year 2012 when they will reverse again. This transition happens, as far as we know, at the peak of every 11-year sunspot cycle -- like clockwork.
http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2001/ast15feb_1.htm?list63905
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Yoschie99
nomad



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Ego Death]
#7715830 - 12/04/07 02:53 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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sorry if i repeat any information... i made it through the first 3 pages before deciding to reply.
The mayans predicted many events w/in their own cultural time.. including the arrival of the spanish and the end of their own culture.
The problem with finding out what other predictions they made, is that almost all of their written works were destroyed by the church as Christianity made it's way through their land... only 4 written documents survived. Who knows what sort of predictions and astronomical information was destroyed.
The 12.21.2012 date seems to be significant, imo, because it's also the day that the earth will pass through the universal hemisphere. Scientists don't really know what this means... but it is possible that the earth's poles will shift on that day... basically throwing the earth into climactic chaos. Would that be the end of all life on earth? probably not. But, what could happen? People and animals will survive, but civilizations as we know them will be so undone as to have to undergo a drastic rebuilding. Land masses will change due to flooding and, possibly, volcanic activity. Most modern communication will probably be knocked out... which is probably one of the single most devastating things to the world as we know it.
As someone said, the mayans never say the world is going to end.. just this phase of civilization and society.. and a new one will begin.
I personally believe that crossing the universal hemisphere is going to have a huge effect on the earth, the sun and the moon... and that the above mentioned changes are going to happen...
of course, we'll never know until the date arrives... i just plan on being somewhere temperate and away from the ocean or any large glaciers. 
yos-
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Diploid]
#7715842 - 12/04/07 02:55 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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If I remember correctly, unlike the earth which has one magnetic pole, the sun has zillions of non-aligned constantly changing magnetic poles.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7715846 - 12/04/07 02:56 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Actually, the earth has more than two poles, I guess I need to dig up a reference for this too.
The sun has many minor poles but two major ones just like the earth...
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7715864 - 12/04/07 03:00 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Correction: One major magnetic field with two poles. There are probably many very minor ones due to clumping of iron ores and such.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7715880 - 12/04/07 03:04 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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The earth's magnetic fields have little to do with it's iron content and more to do with the solar wind...
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Diploid
Cuban



Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7715912 - 12/04/07 03:10 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yep, I stand corrected. For some reason I though you were talking about the Earth's magnetic field.
Nevermind.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7715922 - 12/04/07 03:12 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Bzzzt! Try again.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Diploid]
#7715923 - 12/04/07 03:12 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Diploid said:
The sun does not reverse it's magnetic field every 11 years.
I was right and you were wrong, nah nah nahnah nah.
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger


Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7715935 - 12/04/07 03:15 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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The Mayans predicted that by 2012 somebody would have updated their damn calendar.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7716024 - 12/04/07 03:32 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
I was right and you were wrong, nah nah nahnah nah.
1 out of 713 ain't too bad...
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PhanTomCat
Teh Cat....



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7716648 - 12/04/07 05:58 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Middleman said: The earth's magnetic fields have little to do with it's iron content and more to do with the solar wind...
It is the rotation of the liquid iron core that causes Earth's magnetic fields.... The solar wind is deflected (except at the poles) by the magnetics, but they can snap the magnetic field bands if there is a strong enough solar storm....
That is why Mars is fucked, it doesn't have strong enough magnetic fields to deflect the solar winds, thus losing it's atmosphere....
>^;;^<
-------------------- I'll be your midnight French Fry.... "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#7716693 - 12/04/07 06:07 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Actually, the earth has more than two Poles...
In Poland?
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



Registered: 04/27/01
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7716815 - 12/04/07 06:38 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
The Sun's magnetic poles will remain as they are now, with the north magnetic pole pointing through the Sun's southern hemisphere, until the year 2012 when they will reverse again. This transition happens, as far as we know, at the peak of every 11-year sunspot cycle -- like clockwork.
So it has been happening every 11 years (or so) since the birth of the solar system, yet this time (drum roll) it is different?
Quote:
I was right and you were wrong, nah nah nahnah nah.
Rub it in...
... though I can't remember the last time I saw a "non-skeptic" admit to being wrong about something.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Seuss]
#7716840 - 12/04/07 06:44 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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And that won't change in 2013, either.
"Like Dude, there WAS a major shift on 12/12/2012 you just weren't tuned in!"
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7716850 - 12/04/07 06:46 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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That's why they sell tuners for this shit
--------------------
   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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earen
Divine essenceof puritybl

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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7872447 - 01/13/08 06:34 AM (16 years, 19 days ago) |
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do not fear for the events of 2012 is not the end of the world but it is a major warning for mankind as we know it... and i know from a source that a something revolutionary will happen in the spiritual context
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: earen]
#7872452 - 01/13/08 06:39 AM (16 years, 19 days ago) |
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Yet another convincing argument.
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



Registered: 12/02/05
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: earen]
#7872483 - 01/13/08 07:04 AM (16 years, 19 days ago) |
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Quote:
earen said: do not fear for the events of 2012 is not the end of the world but it is a major warning for mankind as we know it... and i know from a source that a something revolutionary will happen in the spiritual context
And I know from a source that nothing revolutionary will happen. And someone else has their source which informed them that it will be the end of the world. I wonder which of these sources to trust.  Of course, there is thinking straight and considering only the reliable evidence, but who's crazy enough to do that?
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7872506 - 01/13/08 07:18 AM (16 years, 19 days ago) |
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Quote:
Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing....
They didn't really come up with what 2012 has grown into. It is just internet prophecy.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." β Carlos Castaneda
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Diploid
Cuban



Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7873286 - 01/13/08 12:57 PM (16 years, 19 days ago) |
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I know from a source
My source is better than your source. Neener neener!
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Diploid]
#7875063 - 01/13/08 07:24 PM (16 years, 19 days ago) |
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But MINE is more enlightened
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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Gomp
Β‘(Bound toΒ·(O))be free!



Registered: 09/11/04
Posts: 10,888
Loc: I reΒ·side [primarily] in...
Last seen: 10 months, 23 days
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#7875640 - 01/13/08 08:46 PM (16 years, 19 days ago) |
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Their calender is all that predicts..
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Diploid]
#7877663 - 01/14/08 10:18 AM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
Diploid said: I know from a source
My sores is better than your sores. Neener neener!
(are better)
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Jack Albertson
bismillah rahmani rahim



Registered: 04/14/06
Posts: 10,065
Loc: SOLARIS
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Icelander]
#7877751 - 01/14/08 10:54 AM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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i think it's funny how people totally discredit 2012 b/c of the internet following. The internet has made it possible for the movement to grow as much as it has and has opened new planes of communication from one part of the world to another. So the fact that it's all over the internet is probably the best thing that could have happened in this situation. So it's not that it's the prophecy imo, but the internet being around at this moment is part of a prophecy being fulfilled.
-------------------- Man is timid and apologetic; he is no longer upright; he dares not say "I think," "I am," but quotes some saint or sage. He is ashamed before the blade of grass or the blowing rose.Man postpones or remembers; he does not live in the present, but with reverted eye laments the past, or, heedless of the riches that surround him, stands on tiptoe to foresee the future. He cannot be happy and strong until he too lives with nature in the present, above time TRANSCEND
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Jack Albertson]
#7877852 - 01/14/08 11:29 AM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
i think it's funny how people totally discredit 2012 b/c of the internet following
It is not discredited because of internet following, but because of total lack of substance.
--------------------
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EternalCowabunga
Being of Great Significance



Registered: 04/04/05
Posts: 7,152
Loc: Time and Space
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#7877881 - 01/14/08 11:35 AM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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There are no prophecies, only possibilities. A self-fulfilling prophecy is a prediction that directly or indirectly causes itself to become true, in most cases through the direct will of humans making it "true".
Is this what 2012 is? It's possible
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Jack Albertson]
#7877967 - 01/14/08 11:58 AM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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but the internet being around at this moment is part of a prophecy being fulfilled.
Not to mention the war, starvation, economy, pollution, and the Ipod and the third season of Lost.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Jack Albertson
bismillah rahmani rahim



Registered: 04/14/06
Posts: 10,065
Loc: SOLARIS
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Icelander]
#7878011 - 01/14/08 12:08 PM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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is that your way of saying everything is part of a prophecy?
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
i think it's funny how people totally discredit 2012 b/c of the internet following
It is not discredited because of internet following, but because of total lack of substance.
Lack of substance? what do you mean by that? what more do you need than the existence of the calendar? As far as other people's theories not having substance that is true, but going by the evidence that we already have along with historical and astrological evidence i would say that something is going to happen.
-------------------- Man is timid and apologetic; he is no longer upright; he dares not say "I think," "I am," but quotes some saint or sage. He is ashamed before the blade of grass or the blowing rose.Man postpones or remembers; he does not live in the present, but with reverted eye laments the past, or, heedless of the riches that surround him, stands on tiptoe to foresee the future. He cannot be happy and strong until he too lives with nature in the present, above time TRANSCEND
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger



Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 12 days
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Jack Albertson]
#7878212 - 01/14/08 12:51 PM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
America is said to be the arena on which the battle of freedom is to be fought; but surely it cannot be freedom in a merely political sense that is meant. Even if we grant that the American has freed himself from a political tyrant, he is still the slave of an economical and moral tyrant.
Thus is the nature of an empire. See:
An Empire For America
Quote:
The theme of the essay was that, as Great Britain was proceeding to expand its empire around the world, it was not only enslaving the peoples brought under British imperial control, it was also enslaving the British people in the process.
Spencer asked his readers to picture a man literally enslaved with his hands tied and with a collar round his neck to which was attached a rope held at the other end by his slave-master. Most people, seeing this, would say that clearly one was the captor and the other the captive.
But Spencer suggested that, in fact, the slave-master is as much enslaved as his prisoner. Unless he holds on to the rope and watches his prisoner, the slave will run away and reclaim his freedom. In this sense, the captor is as much tied to the captive as the captive is to his master.
With an empire, especially one that was still expanding, the British government was not only extending its enslavement over more subject peoples in other parts of the world but also increasing its enslavement of the British people, who would be required to supply and hold the ropes that would keep the conquered nations under British control.
America's empire is coming to an end as the tethers begin to tear as a result from our own over-extension and lack of resources to maintain it.
--------------------
If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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igwna
The Cap'n


Registered: 06/19/07
Posts: 8,016
Loc: New England, USA
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: fireworks_god]
#7878247 - 01/14/08 12:57 PM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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yeah, lets high tail it outa here.
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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Jack Albertson
bismillah rahmani rahim



Registered: 04/14/06
Posts: 10,065
Loc: SOLARIS
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: fireworks_god]
#7878549 - 01/14/08 02:15 PM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
fireworks_god said:
Quote:
America is said to be the arena on which the battle of freedom is to be fought; but surely it cannot be freedom in a merely political sense that is meant. Even if we grant that the American has freed himself from a political tyrant, he is still the slave of an economical and moral tyrant.
Thus is the nature of an empire. See:
An Empire For America
Quote:
The theme of the essay was that, as Great Britain was proceeding to expand its empire around the world, it was not only enslaving the peoples brought under British imperial control, it was also enslaving the British people in the process.
Spencer asked his readers to picture a man literally enslaved with his hands tied and with a collar round his neck to which was attached a rope held at the other end by his slave-master. Most people, seeing this, would say that clearly one was the captor and the other the captive.
But Spencer suggested that, in fact, the slave-master is as much enslaved as his prisoner. Unless he holds on to the rope and watches his prisoner, the slave will run away and reclaim his freedom. In this sense, the captor is as much tied to the captive as the captive is to his master.
With an empire, especially one that was still expanding, the British government was not only extending its enslavement over more subject peoples in other parts of the world but also increasing its enslavement of the British people, who would be required to supply and hold the ropes that would keep the conquered nations under British control.
America's empire is coming to an end as the tethers begin to tear as a result from our own over-extension and lack of resources to maintain it.
oy
-------------------- Man is timid and apologetic; he is no longer upright; he dares not say "I think," "I am," but quotes some saint or sage. He is ashamed before the blade of grass or the blowing rose.Man postpones or remembers; he does not live in the present, but with reverted eye laments the past, or, heedless of the riches that surround him, stands on tiptoe to foresee the future. He cannot be happy and strong until he too lives with nature in the present, above time TRANSCEND
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: fireworks_god]
#7878563 - 01/14/08 02:19 PM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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America's empire is coming to an end as the tethers begin to tear as a result from our own over-extension and lack of resources to maintain it. 
So your plan is to abandon the sinking ship, just when we (and WalMart) need you most.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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backfromthedead
Activated


Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 3,592
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Icelander]
#7878764 - 01/14/08 03:21 PM (16 years, 18 days ago) |
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WOW. I forgot how schizo these boards really are. If you are a direct reflection of what you take in... Yikes.   Kindly point me towards reality. Been lost more than once.
What I find interesting is the whole Freemasonry connection. They are supposed to be the direct inheritors of the 'mystery' religions. I was stuck on this for a while... It becomes common knowledge that freemasonry holds the secrets to REAL spiritual Ascension using entheogens then the world is forced into a confrontation with the ineffable itself. Supper?? 'Take eat' With all the Divinci code shit and science proving the existence of a universal mystical state produced by psilocybin... *See definition of mysticism* I feel that the big event of 2012 could be the acceptance of the mushroom religious experience. Or entheogen induced religious ecstasy. Christ!! Then, the world correctly reorders itself with the capstone in place. The mushroom and each unique experience it provides for the individual and their relationship to GOD, whatever it might be. Not without a fight as ages of believers see this as sorcery and witchcraft. 2012 time to flip the script. No??
Bullshit?? I KNOW.
--------------------
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backfromthedead
Activated


Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 3,592
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: backfromthedead]
#7882458 - 01/15/08 10:08 AM (16 years, 17 days ago) |
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--------------------
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lucas_southoz
Adelaidian



Registered: 06/09/10
Posts: 1,196
Loc:
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: backfromthedead]
#12827288 - 06/30/10 03:54 AM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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hmm with all these natural disasters and the bp oil spill, this could be true. just think about it... if 60,000 barrels of oil is spewing out of the oil EVERY day going straight into our oceans... what does that affect? marine life! and what eats marine life? birds... and we eat birds... also birds drop seeds which allows plants to grow in different areas. then what eats the plants? and so on... and also, BP ARE FUCKING IDIOTS!!! one of the substances they are using to try n clean there fuck up with causes red blood cells to pop and causes marine life to bleed... cheers bp for fucking up my fishing and swimming!
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Atlantis
Stranger


Registered: 10/02/09
Posts: 97
Last seen: 8 months, 4 days
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: lucas_southoz]
#12827466 - 06/30/10 06:33 AM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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hope it turns out well in 2012...
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igwna
The Cap'n


Registered: 06/19/07
Posts: 8,016
Loc: New England, USA
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: lucas_southoz]
#12828351 - 06/30/10 11:47 AM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
lucas_southoz said: hmm with all these natural disasters and the bp oil spill, this could be true. just think about it... if 60,000 barrels of oil is spewing out of the oil EVERY day going straight into our oceans... what does that affect? marine life! and what eats marine life? birds... and we eat birds... also birds drop seeds which allows plants to grow in different areas. then what eats the plants? and so on... and also, BP ARE FUCKING IDIOTS!!! one of the substances they are using to try n clean there fuck up with causes red blood cells to pop and causes marine life to bleed... cheers bp for fucking up my fishing and swimming!
what kind of birds are you eating that eat marine life?
i figure i mostly eat chickens and turkeys.. in the way of birds. and cows, which eat grass and grains. and pigs sometimes, which will just about any fuckin thing.
and i think birds eat bugs. unless we're talkinga bout pelicans because i think they eat fish. and birds of prey too, but i think they eat other birds as well.
i don't foresee the end of the world because of the oil spill
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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the bizzle
the joke that no one spoke


Registered: 04/14/09
Posts: 11,870
Loc: :seriousbusiness:
Last seen: 10 years, 11 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Middleman]
#12828382 - 06/30/10 11:56 AM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mr. Middle said: Most of the Mayan predictions for our time are strictly astronomical.
The have correctly predicted Eclipses and transits of Venus in texts like the Dresden Codex.
Many "scientific" sources have claimed the Dresden codex is out of sync, but John Major Jenkin's works have shown that it actually is, when calibrated correctly.
I understand why the skeptics are so cynical about Mayan prophecy though, there sure is a lot of BS out there.
Watch out for Dr. Jose Arguelles, he's full of it and just trying to sell books, like most 2012ers...
But the fact remains that the Mayans had at least 17 different synchronized calendars and their astronomy was very advanced for their time...
i think this sums it up rather nicely
-------------------- MY HAIR IS A BIRD YOUR ARGUMENT IS INVALID
  
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igwna
The Cap'n


Registered: 06/19/07
Posts: 8,016
Loc: New England, USA
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: the bizzle]
#12828390 - 06/30/10 11:59 AM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
the bizzle said:
Quote:
Mr. Middle said: Most of the Mayan predictions for our time are strictly astronomical.
The have correctly predicted Eclipses and transits of Venus in texts like the Dresden Codex.
Many "scientific" sources have claimed the Dresden codex is out of sync, but John Major Jenkin's works have shown that it actually is, when calibrated correctly.
I understand why the skeptics are so cynical about Mayan prophecy though, there sure is a lot of BS out there.
Watch out for Dr. Jose Arguelles, he's full of it and just trying to sell books, like most 2012ers...
But the fact remains that the Mayans had at least 17 different synchronized calendars and their astronomy was very advanced for their time...
i think this sums it up rather nicely 
you would
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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the bizzle
the joke that no one spoke


Registered: 04/14/09
Posts: 11,870
Loc: :seriousbusiness:
Last seen: 10 years, 11 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#12828397 - 06/30/10 12:00 PM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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well for one I don't think there is any prophecy involved, just calendars
i hope you didn't think otherwise
-------------------- MY HAIR IS A BIRD YOUR ARGUMENT IS INVALID
  
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igwna
The Cap'n


Registered: 06/19/07
Posts: 8,016
Loc: New England, USA
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: the bizzle]
#12828412 - 06/30/10 12:04 PM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
the bizzle said: well for one I don't think there is any prophecy involved, just calendars
i hope you didn't think otherwise
i was just bustin balls.
i don't believe in any prophecy.
or planet x is coming an the akkadians or whatever are gonna come down and take us as slaves and use us to mine gold.
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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the bizzle
the joke that no one spoke


Registered: 04/14/09
Posts: 11,870
Loc: :seriousbusiness:
Last seen: 10 years, 11 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#12828422 - 06/30/10 12:06 PM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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that's what I'm saying...i think that was all BS perpetrated by the media for $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$, and perhaps a little bit of fear and 
but that doesn't change the fact that the mayans were very good with astronomy
-------------------- MY HAIR IS A BIRD YOUR ARGUMENT IS INVALID
  
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igwna
The Cap'n


Registered: 06/19/07
Posts: 8,016
Loc: New England, USA
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: the bizzle]
#12828428 - 06/30/10 12:08 PM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
the bizzle said: that's what I'm saying...i think that was all BS perpetrated by the media for $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$, and perhaps a little bit of fear and 
but that doesn't change the fact that the mayans were very good with astronomy
agreed. my friend has a theory that the only thing catastrophic thats going to happen is every one getting so worked up about the end of the world they start rioting and looting.
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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the bizzle
the joke that no one spoke


Registered: 04/14/09
Posts: 11,870
Loc: :seriousbusiness:
Last seen: 10 years, 11 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#12828446 - 06/30/10 12:11 PM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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yeah, i'm definitely gonna stay home when that time comes. There is no involved in predicting that there might be real dangers like that; better safe than sorry
-------------------- MY HAIR IS A BIRD YOUR ARGUMENT IS INVALID
  
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igwna
The Cap'n


Registered: 06/19/07
Posts: 8,016
Loc: New England, USA
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: the bizzle]
#12828468 - 06/30/10 12:14 PM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
the bizzle said: yeah, i'm definitely gonna stay home when that time comes. There is no involved in predicting that there might be real dangers like that; better safe than sorry
yeah people are fucking crazy these days.
-------------------- I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.
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lucas_southoz
Adelaidian



Registered: 06/09/10
Posts: 1,196
Loc:
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: igwna]
#12838967 - 07/02/10 09:05 AM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
theMERRYiguana said:
Quote:
lucas_southoz said: hmm with all these natural disasters and the bp oil spill, this could be true. just think about it... if 60,000 barrels of oil is spewing out of the oil EVERY day going straight into our oceans... what does that affect? marine life! and what eats marine life? birds... and we eat birds... also birds drop seeds which allows plants to grow in different areas. then what eats the plants? and so on... and also, BP ARE FUCKING IDIOTS!!! one of the substances they are using to try n clean there fuck up with causes red blood cells to pop and causes marine life to bleed... cheers bp for fucking up my fishing and swimming!
a shitload of birds do, if the ocean becomes stagnant were fucked... if theres a nice coating of oil were fucked... the "ocean" evaporates... what if oil could somehow evaporate into the clouds.... there just too may possibilities to explain
what kind of birds are you eating that eat marine life?
i figure i mostly eat chickens and turkeys.. in the way of birds. and cows, which eat grass and grains. and pigs sometimes, which will just about any fuckin thing.
and i think birds eat bugs. unless we're talkinga bout pelicans because i think they eat fish. and birds of prey too, but i think they eat other birds as well.
i don't foresee the end of the world because of the oil spill
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Freedom
Pigment of your imagination



Registered: 05/26/05
Posts: 5,852
Last seen: 4 hours, 19 minutes
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Majawala]
#12839272 - 07/02/10 10:26 AM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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Why does everyone ignore the Aztecs? They had a cool looking calendar too:
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Freedom]
#12839284 - 07/02/10 10:31 AM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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When 2012 doesn't pan out we will switch over.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Freedom
Pigment of your imagination



Registered: 05/26/05
Posts: 5,852
Last seen: 4 hours, 19 minutes
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Icelander]
#12839307 - 07/02/10 10:38 AM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: When 2012 doesn't pan out we will switch over.
*starts writing furiously*
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teknix
πβπ
’ππ
π°π‘ πΌπ⨻


Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 11,953
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Re: Have the Mayans predicted anything besides the 2012 thing.... [Re: Freedom]
#12839563 - 07/02/10 11:41 AM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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The question is:
Who else predicted the same events.
How many religions base off a great flood, etc.
It's but a forewarning of natural phenomena.
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