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OfflineMuppet
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Jew: religion or race?
    #7686263 - 11/27/07 02:35 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

cause rumor has it that if you were born a jew - you ARE a jew (regardless if you practice or not)

and that if you're married into it - you're *sorta* a jew...but not really

and that you can practice judism without actually being a jew

and that you can be a jew without practicing it

and that one of your parents isa jew / and the other isn't - then yera half breed

and if neither are / but both practice - then yera wanna-be

and if you've ever fantasized about a jewish woman - then yer just a dumb twat







nah...but seriously though:

blood line seems to be a real big thing for these people...and they tend to get all 'weird' over who their children marry, and whether or not they're keeping their heritage pure (or some crap)

and I don't understand any of it  :confused:


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:craven:  Ravings of a Madman  :craven:


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InvisibleRustifer
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7686275 - 11/27/07 02:41 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

It's both, even if your a non-practicing Jew you still deserve to die in the same ways a practicing one does.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7686281 - 11/27/07 02:43 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

"Race" isn't the right word. "Ethnicity" is more like it.


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InvisibleWolfgang
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7686303 - 11/27/07 02:48 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

My cousin and I got into a huge debate about this I was saying it was both, he was saying it was strictly a religion but I can usually tell just by looking at someone if they're Jewish so I say it's both.


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InvisibleRobo
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7686355 - 11/27/07 02:59 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
"Race" isn't the right word. "Ethnicity" is more like it.



Race and Ethnicity are the same thing, pretty much. It's more like a culture. You can be of a Jewish cultural background and not necessarily practice Judaism.


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InvisibleUnholyChild666
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7686421 - 11/27/07 03:18 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

People just say it's both to try and get people to be more sensitive about antisemitism, but the truth is being a jew is a CHOICE, race is not simple as that.


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"I am the Highest Power the leader of the pack"

Actiavte My Dream Sequence Machine

GOD of the hologram earth


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Robo]
    #7686445 - 11/27/07 03:23 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Adagio said:
Quote:

Silversoul said:
"Race" isn't the right word. "Ethnicity" is more like it.



Race and Ethnicity are the same thing, pretty much.




Quote:

Wikipedia said:
An ethnic group or ethnicity is a population of human beings whose members identify with each other, usually on the basis of a presumed common genealogy or ancestry. Ethnicity is also defined from the recognition by others as a distinct group and by common cultural, linguistic, religious, behavioural or biological traits.




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InvisibleUnholyChild666
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7686475 - 11/27/07 03:29 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Well reason bloodline between Jews is so strong and why people link the two is probably the same when it comes to black people, the many years of oppression I'm sure has a lot to do with it. This is not meant for people to start posting stupid racist shit either, but I'm sure it will come.


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"I am the Highest Power the leader of the pack"

Actiavte My Dream Sequence Machine

GOD of the hologram earth


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InvisibleRobo
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: UnholyChild666]
    #7686489 - 11/27/07 03:33 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

If it were OTD maybe


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OfflineTurntableJunky
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7686491 - 11/27/07 03:33 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I think its both.


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OfflineMustelid
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: UnholyChild666]
    #7686502 - 11/27/07 03:37 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Judaism is by far the largest tribal religion in the world. Being a tribal religion, it's mainly practiced by members of the ethnicity.

It's confusing because Jew can refer to a member of the race or a practicer of Judaism. I do know of several people born racially Jewish who have refused to have a Bar Mitzvah or practice Judaism despite VERY strong pressure from the family.

My favorite thing about Judaism is that they have zero interest in converting you if you aren't racially Jewish!


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InvisibleUnholyChild666
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Mustelid]
    #7686521 - 11/27/07 03:42 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Mustelid said:
Judaism is by far the largest tribal religion in the world. Being a tribal religion, it's mainly practiced by members of the ethnicity.

It's confusing because Jew can refer to a member of the race or a practicer of Judaism. I do know of several people born racially Jewish who have refused to have a Bar Mitzvah or practice Judaism despite VERY strong pressure from the family.

My favorite thing about Judaism is that they have zero interest in converting you if you aren't racially Jewish!




thats because they have a GREAT respect for each other and their religion, it's not like Christianity were you turn on your TV and it's commercialism at it's best with some televangelist screaming and shaking about the devil, while people throw money at them.


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"I am the Highest Power the leader of the pack"

Actiavte My Dream Sequence Machine

GOD of the hologram earth


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Invisibledownforpot
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: UnholyChild666]
    #7686599 - 11/27/07 04:00 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Both. I'm half jewish and half slavic. One side of the family has a completely different complection, darker hair, men have more hair, more features from the middle east. One side Christians and others Jews in terms of religion.

But I ain't religious... at all. But if I do convert in the future it will be Judaism.


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http://www.myspace.com/4th25


"And I don't care if he was handcuffed
Then shot in his head
All I know is dead bodies
Can't fuck with me again"


Edited by downforpot (11/27/07 04:00 PM)


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Invisiblemecreateme
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Robo]
    #7686603 - 11/27/07 04:01 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Race is not real. There are no "white people" and "black people." There are various ethnicities, which refer to where a person or their culture comes from, not the color of their skin.


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No ONE wants to know the ultimate TRUTH, as soon as YOU find IT out, YOU want to forget IT.

You are everything's way of feeling itself.

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OfflineTurntableJunky
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: mecreateme]
    #7686618 - 11/27/07 04:06 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah there are white people and black people.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: mecreateme]
    #7686619 - 11/27/07 04:06 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

mecreateme said:
Race is not real. There are no "white people" and "black people."



That's what I was taught in school, but since then I've learned that the latest discoveries in biology suggest that there are three biological races(Causasian, African, and East Asian), with variations within each one, and mixing between these races.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7686768 - 11/27/07 04:35 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah, I call bullshit on that one too. The various physical differences between the races are noticeable enough to warrant calling each individual race a different "breed" much like dogs are all of the same species but have different breeds.


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Invisiblemecreateme
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7687135 - 11/27/07 05:29 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

That is actually in debate among people, because there are so many of them with so many different ideas. Ultimately it is a matter of opinion.

There are many viewpoints, especially from geneticists today, that the term 'race' has no real meaning.

Now there are many people out there that would say,"tell that to the racist's." That is exactly the point I am trying to make. That racism is a seriously wrong belief and the idea of race is considered real by looking at things too simply.

There is skin color and ethnicity, and they are two different things. Race seems to try to boil down those ideas into one.


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No ONE wants to know the ultimate TRUTH, as soon as YOU find IT out, YOU want to forget IT.

You are everything's way of feeling itself.

Happy Schwag, everygodly!


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Invisiblejewunit
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Wolfgang]
    #7687171 - 11/27/07 05:35 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Wolfgang said:
My cousin and I got into a huge debate about this I was saying it was both, he was saying it was strictly a religion but I can usually tell just by looking at someone if they're Jewish so I say it's both.




I bet if you went to the Middle East you couldn't tell Jews from Muslims.

It's a religion.
End of story.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: mecreateme]
    #7687187 - 11/27/07 05:36 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

mecreateme said:
That racism is a seriously wrong belief and the idea of race is considered real by looking at things too simply.

There is skin color and ethnicity, and they are two different things. Race seems to try to boil down those ideas into one.




Political Correctness has made it such that recognizing differences between the races is not socially acceptable. There is no scientific validity to this muzzling of free speech. It is a society-wide ideological shift.

It is possible that there are racial differences not only in outward physical appearances but in brain makeup as well. For example, Asians often score higher on standardized tests than whites do. As a white male I'm willing to admit that it is possible that Asians are on average more intelligent than white people. I don't scream "RACISM!" and stomp my feet at such an assertion (as you know black people would if such an assertion was made).


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OfflineAaronEvil
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: UnholyChild666]
    #7687391 - 11/27/07 06:00 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

UnholyChild666 said:
the truth is being a jew is a CHOICE, race is not simple as that.




I agree 100%

If I remember correctly the Ethnicity is Hebrew not Jewish. I think Jew is just slapped on there because people are idiots and dont know what a Hebrew is.


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Offlinelearningtofly
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #7687574 - 11/27/07 06:36 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I think Jew is more of an Ethno-religion than anything else.


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InvisibleWolfgang
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: jewunit]
    #7687686 - 11/27/07 07:09 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

jewunit said:
Quote:

Wolfgang said:
My cousin and I got into a huge debate about this I was saying it was both, he was saying it was strictly a religion but I can usually tell just by looking at someone if they're Jewish so I say it's both.




I bet if you went to the Middle East you couldn't tell Jews from Muslims.

It's a religion.
End of story.




I've seen plenty of Jews that have very similar physical features.

Does this mean Jews share a common ancestry or they're usually Hebrew or what?


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OfflineHotsauce72
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #7687705 - 11/27/07 07:14 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Real jews don't exist anymore. Just a bunch of watered down sunbeam and cracker fakes. Your a jew if your mom is a jew.


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InvisibleCracka_X
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7687795 - 11/27/07 07:35 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

apparently Jews are singled out with the possibility of having Tay-Sachs disease. So by this, you could say it's a Race/Ethnicity.

I think this applies to middle eastern jews though. there's could be a lot of speculation on it too so eh, but yeah


--------------------
The best way to live
is to be like water
For water benefits all things
and goes against none of them
It provides for all people
and even cleanses those places
a man is loath to go
In this way it is just like Tao        ~Daodejing


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Invisiblepong
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Cracka_X]
    #7687963 - 11/27/07 08:02 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

well most of the jews i know are not practicing jews other than having their ceremony. and observing Hanukkah. i dont consider these people at practicing the religion as much as they are just associating themselves with it. can you consider a large group of people who associate with a certain religion for whatever reason a race?, an ethnicity, a tribe? it certainly imo is more than just a religion.


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Offlinewildchild68
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7688459 - 11/27/07 10:04 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Flippity Floppity Floo, I smell a jew.


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Offlinevade
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: wildchild68]
    #7688523 - 11/27/07 10:23 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

RACE.


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I've got this feeling that there's something that I missed...



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InvisibleUnholyChild666
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: vade]
    #7688529 - 11/27/07 10:25 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

vade said:
RACE.




I guess you must be a Jew? or "Jew", sorry.


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"I am the Highest Power the leader of the pack"

Actiavte My Dream Sequence Machine

GOD of the hologram earth


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: UnholyChild666]
    #7688543 - 11/27/07 10:28 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)



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Offlinevade
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: UnholyChild666]
    #7688546 - 11/27/07 10:28 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

not jewish. don't worship Satan either.


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I've got this feeling that there's something that I missed...



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InvisibleUnholyChild666
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: vade]
    #7688553 - 11/27/07 10:31 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

vade said:
not jewish. don't worship Satan either.




just a dumb ass? I don't know where you got the satan worship bullshit either


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"I am the Highest Power the leader of the pack"

Actiavte My Dream Sequence Machine

GOD of the hologram earth


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Offlinevade
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: UnholyChild666]
    #7688567 - 11/27/07 10:34 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

*sigh*


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I've got this feeling that there's something that I missed...



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InvisibleUnholyChild666
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: vade]
    #7688580 - 11/27/07 10:36 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

vade said:
*sigh*





just remember you started it, i just wanted to put the last few nails in your coffin that you built.


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"I am the Highest Power the leader of the pack"

Actiavte My Dream Sequence Machine

GOD of the hologram earth


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Invisiblealphabeatu
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7688592 - 11/27/07 10:39 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:





:lol:


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i need names and addresses of narc members

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Offlinevade
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: UnholyChild666]
    #7688610 - 11/27/07 10:42 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

tonight... you


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I've got this feeling that there's something that I missed...



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OfflineYthanA
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7688653 - 11/27/07 10:55 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Jews are people who are Jewey. You know us when you see us so who cares about the official definition. You can convert to Judaism but if you don't have a big nose and body hair and you don't kvetch about stuff and send back your order 12 times at a restaurant, you aren't a real Jew. Kyle's family in South Park is a good example of real Jews. Except they're actually not real. But you know what I mean.


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Invisiblejewunit
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Ythan]
    #7689042 - 11/28/07 01:27 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Go eat some gefilte fish, you schmuck!


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Offlinerazmablues
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Cracka_X]
    #7689044 - 11/28/07 01:27 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Cracka_X said:
apparently Jews are singled out with the possibility of having Tay-Sachs disease.  So by this, you could say it's a Race/Ethnicity.

I think this applies to middle eastern jews though.  there's could be a lot of speculation on it too so eh, but yeah




it's actually eastern european jews, and it's identified with the religion because it was only socially accepted to marry with other jews at the time, so the disease spread through families of the religion.

it isn't some magic taysachs loves jews thing

:snowman:


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OfflineVisionsToReality
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: razmablues]
    #7689302 - 11/28/07 06:40 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

what kind of person would really think that being jewish is a race? if they do, they don't even know the meaning of race to begin with. wtf!


--------------------
Life is one big road with lots of signs,
So when you're ridin' through the ruts,
Don't you complicate your mind.

Flee from hate, mischief and jealousy
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InvisibleUnholyChild666
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: VisionsToReality]
    #7689312 - 11/28/07 06:45 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

It would be different to say that most Jews are a certain race but to say that being a Jew is race......... :cruelworld:


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"I am the Highest Power the leader of the pack"

Actiavte My Dream Sequence Machine

GOD of the hologram earth


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InvisibleConservationist
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7689377 - 11/28/07 07:22 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Muppet said:
cause rumor has it that if you were born a jew - you ARE a jew (regardless if you practice or not)




Jewishness is racial/ethnic, religious, cultural and linguistic.

When you think about it, religions are just philosophies and every ethnic group has their own.

So the rules are the same for every group. Jews are just the most racist and up-front about it, to their credit.


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OfflineMosby
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #7802082 - 12/26/07 09:14 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I follow Kaballist mysticism and find praying in Hebrew much more uplifting but find Zionism and the state of Israel abhorrent I was sexually mutilated at 6 days of age have olive skin and curly hair my mother claims to be methodist and my father deist so what the fuck am I


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OfflineDrewwyann
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Muppet]
    #7802101 - 12/26/07 09:24 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I don't understand the people that say they are half jewish, and half christian, because of their parents. :confused:


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OfflineBoneMan
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #7802420 - 12/26/07 11:07 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
It is possible that there are racial differences not only in outward physical appearances but in brain makeup as well.




It's not only possible, it's true. How could our genes possibly determine the structure of our entire body except for the brain? It's ridiculous to think that our physical form is shaped by genes, but mentally we are exempt. All men are not created equal (except in the eyes of the law I guess). I have German heritage and I'm genetically predisposed towards drinking beer and to hate complaining about anything (Germans are not whiners). Just like people of Hebrew heritage might be genetically predisposed towards sending their order back when they are out to eat at a restaurant. I work at a restaurant, and that joke may be offensive to some Jewish people but really its hilarious. Fortunately, Jewish people are also predisposed towards comedy and they often have a healthy sense of humor about their heritage.


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OfflineDrewwyann
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: BoneMan]
    #7802421 - 12/26/07 11:08 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

All men are not created equal (except in the eyes of the law I guess).




guess again...


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: BoneMan]
    #7802425 - 12/26/07 11:10 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I've sometimes attributed my tolerance for cold weather to my Swedish ancestry, but I'm Swedish on my mom's side, and she gets cold easier than anyone in my family. Sorry, but I don't think genes determine that much about who you are.


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OfflineDrewwyann
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7802432 - 12/26/07 11:14 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

well genetics are tricky in that. its possible that she was just a carrier of the gene that makes you warm.

The gene for warmer blood would be carried in the X chromosome, and since you are a male (you are male correct?) it would make sense that your mother expressed the cold gene (it would be dominant). She would be X(cold)X(warm). combined with X(Whatever)Y.

that would make you X(warm)Y. Making you express the recessive warm-blooded trait.

Since your mother passed on the recessive warm-blooded trait, and your dad gave you the Y chromosome without any blood temperature gene, you have warm blood!

yay genetics!

not to mention that there have been many, many trials done with twins separated at birth with very very similar idiosyncrasies, like how they hold their mugs, how they talk, and many other similarities.

I'm pretty sure a lot of the findings had to do with the brain as well.


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7802448 - 12/26/07 11:21 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
I've sometimes attributed my tolerance for cold weather to my Swedish ancestry, but I'm Swedish on my mom's side, and she gets cold easier than anyone in my family. Sorry, but I don't think genes determine that much about who you are.




I've noticed that women get cold really easily. I can wear a t-shirt out in the winter and it barely bothers me.


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OfflineDrewwyann
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #7802451 - 12/26/07 11:22 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

hmmm... there goes my cold-blood gene theory...

women go get cold easily. My girlfriend can barely be outside in the winter for 5 minutes without getting hypothermia.


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OfflineBoneMan
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Drewwyann]
    #7802458 - 12/26/07 11:23 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Thats what I'm talking about. Modern genetic research shows that genes are responsible for a LOT more than we had ever imagined. Of course, we are products of our environments, but regarding the old question of nature vs. nurture things are leaning pretty damn far to the nature side.


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: BoneMan]
    #7802463 - 12/26/07 11:24 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

BoneMan said:
Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
It is possible that there are racial differences not only in outward physical appearances but in brain makeup as well. 




It's not only possible, it's true.  How could our genes possibly determine the structure of our entire body except for the brain?




I would love to see a study that examined the brain makeups of the different races.  But, something like that is super non-politically correct and would never happen. 

I'm not afraid to admit that Oriental people score higher on tests often that people of my race (caucasion).  Maybe the average Oriental person has a higher IQ than the average white person and maybe genetics has played a part in this.  :shrug:


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: BoneMan]
    #7802472 - 12/26/07 11:26 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

You ever see that study on identical twins who were seperated at birth and raised in completely different environments? Yet, they often ended up getting in the same careers, dressing the same, have similar hobbies, and marrying similar spouses. Weird.


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #7802477 - 12/26/07 11:28 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

not to continue any racial stereootypes or anything, but I believe pretty well that different races have different genetic make-up, not only in the skin tone/appearance, but in the brain.

It just doesn't make sense to me that genetics would limit itself to physical appearance. The brain is so complex, there is no way that genes can simply wing it. As they can't with the physical appearance.

Genes can be responsibly for artistic talent, for brains, and for physical appearance. Whether different races have better genes for different things is still debated, though a test would never be allowed.

If a test were to show that all japanese people had a gene that gave them an edge at math, the world would flip. There simply isn't anyone ballsy enough to go through with it, that still wants to be an accepted member of society.


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Edited by Drewwyann (12/26/07 11:33 PM)


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Offlinelearningtofly
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #7802478 - 12/26/07 11:28 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Jew is an ethno-religion. end of conversation.


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Drewwyann]
    #7802489 - 12/26/07 11:31 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Drewwyann said:
There simply isn't anyone ballsy enough to go through with it, that still wants to be an accepted member of society.




Exactly. University academia has become so infested with Leftism and political correctness that these topics and any research associated with them would be taboo and vilified.


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #7802496 - 12/26/07 11:33 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
You ever see that study on identical twins who were seperated at birth and raised in completely different environments? Yet, they often ended up getting in the same careers, dressing the same, have similar hobbies, and marrying similar spouses. Weird.



I have two uncles who are identical twins. One of them married a Japanese woman, gets up at 4am to work out, and runs a construction business. The other married a blonde-haired white woman, went to prison for a year for meth, and got fat after getting clean, though he also works in construction.


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7802507 - 12/26/07 11:36 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

That could be attributed to nurture as well. Lots of people tend to want to be different then their sibling. They want identity.

Maybe the construction was just part of their genes. :shrug: We really don't know.


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: BoneMan]
    #7802513 - 12/26/07 11:37 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

BoneMan said:
Thats what I'm talking about. Modern genetic research shows that genes are responsible for a LOT more than we had ever imagined. Of course, we are products of our environments, but regarding the old question of nature vs. nurture things are leaning pretty damn far to the nature side.



I don't really think the jury's quite in on how much nature affects us versus nurture. Biologists tend to have a bias of genetic determinism because genes are what they study, and when you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail. The ones studying the nurture side are psychologists and sociologists. But since these fields are social sciences rather than "hard" sciences, people have a bias against them.


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7802516 - 12/26/07 11:39 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
The ones studying the nurture side are psychologists and sociologists. 




Wait...there are people out there who have sociology degrees and who are employed?  :smirk:


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #7802520 - 12/26/07 11:40 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

:flipthebird:


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OfflineBoneMan
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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7802578 - 12/27/07 12:08 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:

I don't really think the jury's quite in on how much nature affects us versus nurture. Biologists tend to have a bias of genetic determinism because genes are what they study, and when you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail. The ones studying the nurture side are psychologists and sociologists. But since these fields are social sciences rather than "hard" sciences, people have a bias against them.




Thats true. There has not been enough research done yet so really be sure about any of this. I do think its significant that some scientist are searching for a set of genes responsible for homosexuality and there have actually been some consistent results.

One study by a professor from the University of Illinois at Chicago found that "genetic scans showed a clustering of the same genetic pattern among the gay men on three chromosomes -- chromosomes 7, 8, and 10. These common genetic patterns were shared by 60% of the gay men in the study. This is slightly more than the 50% expected by chance alone."
http://www.webmd.com/sex-relationships/news/20050128/is-there-gay-gene

I realize the evidence isn't extensive enough to call it proof, but these people seem pretty certain that sexual orientation is heavily influenced by genetic factors.


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: BoneMan]
    #7802599 - 12/27/07 12:26 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

60% seems kind of low for something that's supposed to be cause solely by genetics. This seems to confirm my suspicion that sexuality is too complex to reduce it to either nature or nurture. I suspect the same is true of many human behavioral patterns.


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Re: Jew: religion or race? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7802603 - 12/27/07 12:29 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I highly doubt that all certain traits are determined by genes, and all others are nurture. There has to be a big mixture. What determines them, may take a long while to figure out.

Sexuality, there could be a gene, but I highly doubt that. We just don't know, and thats the bottom line. Maybe theres certain genes that make them more feminine, and that leads to them being gay (not trying to be an asshole here, just saying, most of the gays I know are feminine.) but not a gene that just makes them outright gay.

There may be a genetic thing that can raise your chances of being gay I suppose, but a single gene that makes you gay just doesn't make sense to me.


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