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OfflinexFrockx
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Registered: 09/17/06
Posts: 10,455
Loc: Northeast
Last seen: 11 days, 16 hours
Re: If the world really does end in 2012, will you be dissapointed? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7669580 - 11/23/07 09:34 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

"If you don't have any incomes you don't have to pay any taxes"

Tell that to the $150 or so dollars of local taxes I pay every year, regardless of income. How old are you?

"No, I don't "get" it because there isn't any difference.
Let me explain what you just said: it's ok to use the internet because it's a brand."

No. The internet is not a brand. Coca Cola is a Brand. Master Card is a Brand.

"nd that there ARE internet companies and you must ask for their services in order to have access to internet."

Internet service providers are one way to access the internet, but not the only way (it is possible to set up your own ISP, how do you think the companies do it). The internet is one contiguous tool. You are making my head hurt.

"Yeah, I already answered you that. As long as you don't have any incomes you don't pay any taxes."

What fantasy world are you living in? I pay my local school taxes regardless. The only thing I can get exempt from is the federal income tax.


"I am sorry, there's no way I can have this discussion any further because you refuse to bring reason in your arguments so it's like talking to a wall."

1. the state of being free or at liberty rather than in confinement or under physical restraint: He won his freedom after a retrial.
2. exemption from external control, interference, regulation, etc.
3. the power to determine action without restraint.
4. political or national independence.
5. personal liberty, as opposed to bondage or slavery: a slave who bought his freedom.
6. exemption from the presence of anything specified (usually fol. by from): freedom from fear.
7. the absence of or release from ties, obligations, etc.
8. ease or facility of movement or action: to enjoy the freedom of living in the country.
9. frankness of manner or speech.
10. general exemption or immunity: freedom from taxation.
11. the absence of ceremony or reserve.
12. a liberty taken.
13. a particular immunity or privilege enjoyed, as by a city or corporation: freedom to levy taxes.
14. civil liberty, as opposed to subjection to an arbitrary or despotic government.
15. the right to enjoy all the privileges or special rights of citizenship, membership, etc., in a community or the like.
16. the right to frequent, enjoy, or use at will: to have the freedom of a friend's library.
17. Philosophy. the power to exercise choice and make decisions without constraint from within or without; autonomy; self-determination. Compare

Hows that for reason. Freedom is not subjective. Read. Think. Understand. Know.


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OfflineMushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs
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Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
Re: If the world really does end in 2012, will you be dissapointed? [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #7669582 - 11/23/07 09:34 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

That's easy.
Somebody else wakes you up and tells you: dude you're dead! :what:
:lol:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
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Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
Re: If the world really does end in 2012, will you be dissapointed? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7669617 - 11/23/07 09:48 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:


Poster: MushroomTrip
Subject: Re: If the world really does end in 2012, will you be dissapointed?

That's easy.
Somebody else wakes you up and tells you: dude you're dead!







Could always be worse. Someone wakes you up and tells you in an excited voice: Dude! You're getting a Dell!


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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OfflineKristian
Stranger

Registered: 11/15/07
Posts: 31
Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
Re: If the world really does end in 2012, will you be dissapointed? [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #7669659 - 11/23/07 10:04 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I await quietly in the corner. If it happens, it happens. I can't seem to act as God and prevent a possible apocalypse so I will just be the best human I can.


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OfflineMushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs
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Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
Re: If the world really does end in 2012, will you be dissapointed? [Re: xFrockx]
    #7669701 - 11/23/07 10:21 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Tell that to the $150 or so dollars of local taxes I pay every year, regardless of income. How old are you?





I'll let you tell them, you're a big boy, you can take care of your own stuff. :smirk:
Also my age has nothing to do with with the subject that's being discussed.
I haven't checked your country's laws to see about the regulations of your tax payments, but look what I found with :google:
How to Save Taxes Without Going to Jail

A small passage from the text you'll find there:

Quote:

Expatriation

One way to avoid income taxes, estate taxes and even the social security tax is to give up your U.S. citizenship (expatriate) and move to a tax haven. The reason you have to give up your citizenship is because the U.S. imposes taxes on the world-wide income of a citizen, regardless of where they live.  After you expatriate, all future income from non U.S. sources will not be subject to U.S. taxes.

But ... to avoid having to pay even higher taxes in another country, you would need to locate a country with no income or estate taxes on its residents. Such countries are often referred to as "tax havens".

And ... because you need to have a passport to travel and you must be a citizen of some country in order to have a passport, you might want to become a citizen of another major country (like Canada) before you give up your U.S. citizenship.

The USA is the only major country in the world that asserts the authority to tax the income of its citizens no matter where they live. In other high tax countries, if you move to another country you are no longer subject to the taxes imposed by the former country. IN most English countries, you don't have to give up your citizenship and passport in order to do that. Thus, you could move to Canada or Australia long enough to become a citizen and you could then move to a low tax country like the Bahamas or Bermuda. But if you are a U.S. citizen or permanent resident, you must formally give up your citizenship or resident status.

However, this is not a simple procedure and you could be subject to U.S. taxes on any tax deferred income for up to ten years after you expatriate. For those with modest assets (under $600,000), the process is not as difficult and it may be possible to avoid any U.S. tax immediately after giving up your U.S. citizenship. Further details about the tax rules for expatriation are included in the Offshore Tax Manual.




See? There ARE always solutions and different choices for those who are willing to invest time and making use of their brain, in changing their lives.

Quote:

Internet service providers are one way to access the internet, but not the only way (it is possible to set up your own ISP, how do you think the companies do it). The internet is one contiguous tool. You are making my head hurt.




I am sorry but  am not responsible for your technical errors. :smirk:

Quote:

What fantasy world are you living in? I pay my local school taxes regardless. The only thing I can get exempt from is the federal income tax.




You're paying school taxes because you agree to live in this society. Agreeing on that is agreeing on paying taxes.
However, nobody's forcing you to adhere to those standards, nobody's demanding you to go to school.

Quote:

1. the state of being free or at liberty rather than in confinement or under physical restraint: He won his freedom after a retrial.
2. exemption from external control, interference, regulation, etc.
3. the power to determine action without restraint.
4. political or national independence.
5. personal liberty, as opposed to bondage or slavery: a slave who bought his freedom.
6. exemption from the presence of anything specified (usually fol. by from): freedom from fear.
7. the absence of or release from ties, obligations, etc.
8. ease or facility of movement or action: to enjoy the freedom of living in the country.
9. frankness of manner or speech.
10. general exemption or immunity: freedom from taxation.
11. the absence of ceremony or reserve.
12. a liberty taken.
13. a particular immunity or privilege enjoyed, as by a city or corporation: freedom to levy taxes.
14. civil liberty, as opposed to subjection to an arbitrary or despotic government.
15. the right to enjoy all the privileges or special rights of citizenship, membership, etc., in a community or the like.
16. the right to frequent, enjoy, or use at will: to have the freedom of a friend's library.
17. Philosophy. the power to exercise choice and make decisions without constraint from within or without; autonomy; self-determination. Compare

Hows that for reason. Freedom is not subjective. Read. Think. Understand. Know.




You sounds like an anti drug campaign from the 70's :lol: :smirk:
It ironic that someone like you, who pleads for "freedom" like Mother Teresa pleading for wold peace, are so bonded by a set of definitions, which, might I add, are all socially and culturally regalement.
Doesn't coca cola have the freedom to exist and be sold, in the same measure as you have the freedom to revolt against it?
Freedom is indeed subjective, and those who let themselves tied down by a set of rules will never be happy or live a healthy life. It's those people who do nothing else but bitch and complain about this world's problems instead of fixing their lives in the best way possible and actually start feeling good about it.
Doesn't the gravity take you the liberty to float? What of one finds himself not free do do what he wants, because of this tragic event? Should he revolt against the Earth? Isn't it only a psychological conditioning?
I'll stick to my initial statement: freedom is subjective.


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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OfflinexFrockx
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/17/06
Posts: 10,455
Loc: Northeast
Last seen: 11 days, 16 hours
Re: If the world really does end in 2012, will you be dissapointed? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7669902 - 11/23/07 11:02 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

"You're paying school taxes because you agree to live in this society. Agreeing on that is agreeing on paying taxes.
However, nobody's forcing you to adhere to those standards, nobody's demanding you to go to school."

In Pennsylvania one has to pay school taxes regardless of whether they use the school system or not. I'm sure you're argument would be "Well, then move out!" Surely a valid counterargument, but it has nothing to do with what I am disgusted with about our society. Sure, there may be a couple places here and there where people don't have to pay taxes, and I would love to live somewhere like that, but I shouldn't have to flee my country in order to be free. I am disgusted with my society because that solution seems to be the only way out.

"You sounds like an anti drug campaign from the 70's
It ironic that someone like you, who pleads for "freedom" like Mother Teresa pleading for wold peace, are so bonded by a set of definitions, which, might I add, are all socially and culturally regalement."

You are completely missing the point of those definitions. One person may find joy in becoming rich, one may find joy in living in the wilderness, and another may find joy killing themselves, but this has nothing to do with the definition of freedom. Freedom is one's right to live as they decide, without impediment. It doesn't matter whether you're a future billionaire or a mountain man, if you have the freedom to be either, you are free.

However, in our society this is not the case. The billionaire is free to make money as he pleases, but the mountain man must pay for the land he lives on, abide by local laws regarding the consumption of illegal or endangered recourses, and he too must pay his taxes, whether he has the want or ability to do either. The mountain man must conform to his society, because otherwise, he'll be climbing trees in the prison courtyard.

"Doesn't coca cola have the freedom to exist and be sold, in the same measure as you have the freedom to revolt against it?"

Yeah, it does. I admit I was a bit obtuse in my original observations about universally eliminating commercialism. While one does have the ability to be free from coca cola, there are other aspects of our society which do not afford this freedom, and these things force us to conform in order to live outside of prison.

"Freedom is indeed subjective, and those who let themselves tied down by a set of rules will never be happy or live a healthy life. It's those people who do nothing else but bitch and complain about this world's problems instead of fixing their lives in the best way possible and actually start feeling good about it."

How do you expect someone to change something without first forming a complaint? That sounds pretty impossible to me. You've also demonstrated another strawman here. I am complaining at present, but I am not perpetually complaining. If you want to call me a whiner, you must call me a whiner at the present time. You cannot assume that I do nothing but complain.


"Doesn't the gravity take you the liberty to float?"

No, because gravity is a law of nature, not a law of man. I never will have the ability to float, barring some sort of metaphysical discovery in the future.

"What of one finds himself not free do do what he wants, because of this tragic event? Should he revolt against the Earth? Isn't it only a psychological conditioning?"

It depends on the kind of event you are talking about. If it is a natural disaster, then one doesn't have any option to change. In a way, nature does limit freedom, but it cannot be equated to the way man limits freedom. (You've used another philosophical fallacy: false analogy) Man limits freedom through social norms, laws, and hegemony. These things are not permanent like the limits of the earth itself.

"I'll stick to my initial statement: freedom is subjective."

Each person may view freedom differently, however, it is not freedom that changes, it is their life. Freedom is being allowed to live (or not live) as one pleases.


Edited by xFrockx (11/23/07 11:05 AM)


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InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: If the world really does end in 2012, will you be dissapointed? [Re: xFrockx]
    #7669993 - 11/23/07 11:15 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

How, exactly, are Pennsylvania "school taxes" assessed? Perhaps by the value of your property? Do you choose to own property, knowing that you will be assessed taxes upon the value of said property?

Freedom does not mean that you get to have whatever you want, whenever you want, without consequences. It means that you can make choices, and that you will be responsible for the consequences of those choices. If you choose to be part of society, you will be responsible for the consequences of that choice. If you choose to "drop out" of society (i.e. be homeless, unemployed, etc...), you will be responsible for the consequences of that choice.

BTW, it is not illegal to commit suicide in the U.S. A handful of states still have laws against it, but they are not applied. Usually a failed suicide results in a stint in a psych ward, not criminal prosecution. Assisted suicide is still illegal, but not for the person who wants to die.


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