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elbisivni
Registered: 10/01/06
Posts: 2,839
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Might humans survive the death of Earth?
#7663278 - 11/21/07 02:29 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Our planet began its journey towards inevitable death at the moment of its formation, flourishing and sustaining life in the meantime.
The Earth's core is cooling rapidly and scientists expect our planet to one day resemble Mars. Eventually, the sun will become inadequate in sustaining life in this solar system and it will burn out. At the same time, perhaps an asteroid is aiming for Earth, or maybe humans will destroy it themselves.
At our current rate, how much time do you think humans would need to advance properly in order to colonize space, other planets and other solar systems? Do you think we can make it that long without wiping ourselves out?
It's funny to think that despite all of our pride, we are as vulnerable as any other creature, and that our fate as a species is so incredibly bleak. I have hope for us, and I like to think that we will be capable of overcoming these events that are so much bigger than us.
Maybe a relative few will make it to propagate the species, or maybe we'll have massive space colonies. Maybe if technology permits, our species will be far greater in number than today and strewn across portions of the galaxy. Or maybe we'll be the same as the dinosaurs.
Humanity has incredible capacity - it's the only justification I have behind proposing these ideas.
Do you think we'll make it, how and when? Differentiate between hope, logic and probability. Try to be realistic without being overly pessimistic or optimistic.
How far do you think Human History will extend into the future?
-------------------- From dust you are made and to dust you shall return.
Edited by elbisivni (11/21/07 03:16 PM)
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WScott
´ ɑ `▽ ᑲᓇᑕ


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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: elbisivni]
#7663364 - 11/21/07 02:50 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Humans thrive on adversity. We'll figure something out. Rather than being occupied with the inevitable end of this solar system (taking for truth that our sun will burn out), I would be more concerned with whether the theory of 'Planet X' is true; a red dwarf sun that is supposedly headed our way.
Planet X Forecast
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Edited by WScott (11/21/07 10:01 PM)
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: elbisivni]
#7663384 - 11/21/07 02:56 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Might humans survive the death of Earth?
Let's hope not but who can tell.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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machination
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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: elbisivni]
#7663412 - 11/21/07 03:02 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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sure
-------------------- "Have you not learned that your word is bond? Yes, my word is bond and bond is life, I shall give my life, before my word shall fail."
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lIllIIIllIlIIlIlIIllIllIIl
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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: elbisivni]
#7665163 - 11/21/07 11:05 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
elbisivni said: The Earth's core is cooling rapidly and scientists expect our planet to one day resemble Mars.
it isn't cooling rapidly
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elbisivni said: Eventually, the sun will become inadequate in sustaining life in this solar system and it will burn out.
our sun isn't going to burn out, at least not right away
since it's formation the sun has increased (not decreased) in brightness... the sun today shines much brighter than the sun than shone billions of years ago when life first appeared on this planet
eventually the oceans will boil... long before the sun is burnt out
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elbisivni said: At the same time, perhaps an asteroid is aiming for Earth, or maybe humans will destroy it themselves.
the earth has survived huge impacts in the past, what makes you think the earth cannot survive a huge impact in the future?
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elbisivni said: Do you think we'll make it, how and when? Differentiate between hope, logic and probability. Try to be realistic without being overly pessimistic or optimistic.
we are able to exist now and into the foreseeable future, but this window of opportunity will be finite in duration
the question is whether we can develop into a space faring species before conditions change and this becomes impossible
i certainly think it is possible, though not probable
first we must map our solar system (and later our galaxy) to discover areas where humans could live, areas with abundant sources of energy and building materials
the most efficient way to do this is through unmanned factory spacecraft, which are able to produce tools and even copies of themselves using materials found en route to or at their final destination
using this technique the exploration of our solar system (and later our galaxy) would accelerate exponentially
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Von_Neumann_probe
once a site was chosen, an unmanned factory spacecraft would be needed to construct a building capable of supporting humans and, likely, the humans themselves
how long would this take? i would guess hundreds or thousands of years within our solar system
within our galaxy it would take much longer, perhaps hundreds of thousands of years to successfully colonize another star system
however before we can do any of that we must develop the technology i decribed... how long that would take is anyone's guess
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elbisivni said: How far do you think Human History will extend into the future?
i think 2-4 million years since this is the average lifespan of species on earth according to paleontologists
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lIllIIIllIlIIlIlIIllIllIIl
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i think a more important question is should we survive the death of earth?
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Nwerd
Stranger


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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: elbisivni]
#7665353 - 11/22/07 12:45 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think that logically speaking, a few humans might survive... How many times has the Earth died and re-birthed in it's own long existence let alone our existence. All life has destructive and regenerative cycles. You and I might not make it, but I'm sure life with rebirth in strange new ways.... Now when the sun goes out... That's a different can-o-worms Just my thoughts P.S. How do you know that when we die, our spirits don't get reborn on some other life sustaining planet in some distant galaxy... Also, as long as humans are alive, history will exist.
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elbisivni
Registered: 10/01/06
Posts: 2,839
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I suppose the article in National Geographic might have been written in such a way as to make the body of evidence available seem to be sufficient enough to draw a few probable conclusions. But thanks for providing additional arguments.
I think that if humans are capable of surviving the death of earth then they should. There's no reason we should choose extinction over perseverance and preservation and there's no reason we should feel that it is our fate for the workings of the universe to determine our finite end when we are fully capable of utilizing or minds to our own benefit.
We might have some serious issues that could even bring end unto ourselves, but like I said I think we are an interesting species and I like to entertain the thought of space colonization. My logic tells me that our chances are 50-50 in the cosmic short-run. Maybe our act of space colonization would only even provide a slow and lonely closing chapter to the story of the human race.
-------------------- From dust you are made and to dust you shall return.
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demiu5
humans, lol


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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: elbisivni]
#7666223 - 11/22/07 09:03 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
elbisivni said: At our current rate, how much time do you think humans would need to advance properly in order to colonize space, other planets and other solar systems? Do you think we can make it that long without wiping ourselves out?
My honest opinion: we will not make it off this planet. Considering how long it would take to reach any of the other 'uninhabitable' planets in our own solar system, it would take far too long to be able to design, build, test, re-test, re-test, and then actually perfect the technology. Not to mention the lack of certainty of sustainability of our new home.
Quote:
I have hope for us, and I like to think that we will be capable of overcoming these events that are so much bigger than us.
overcoming what? why do you feel like this is a challenge to be taken on or something against you which you are against?
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Humanity has incredible capacity - it's the only justification I have behind proposing these ideas.
given enough time on the evolutionary scale, every animal has the capacity to be like us or greater
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How far do you think Human History will extend into the future?
obviously, depending on if/how the local and global environments change, maybe a few hundred years; more if we find a way to end 'war'
-------------------- channel your inner Larry David
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Droz
Love of Life



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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: demiu5]
#7666652 - 11/22/07 11:19 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think war will keep us occupied for many years to come. But if we would spend like half the money we spend on war for space travel and for our chance to survive when the earth is no longer livable. I think we should prepare now for the end times. Better now then it be too late to do anything.
-------------------- Evolution of Time.
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lIllIIIllIlIIlIlIIllIllIIl
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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: elbisivni]
#7666819 - 11/22/07 12:18 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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national geographic?
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: Droz]
#7667068 - 11/22/07 01:37 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Whether we survive the solar system or not our future concludes in death. I like to imagine our species colonizing space one day, but I am not overly optimistic about it.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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sunflower
We're here....


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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
#7667078 - 11/22/07 01:43 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Change your shirt and you might be a little more optimistic about it!
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redtailedhawk
Explorer of the Mystery


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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: elbisivni]
#7667098 - 11/22/07 01:52 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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No. Humans are an integral part of the Earth matrix and cannot survive without it. Earth dies = people die. The only reason we think we might survive it is that in our pathology and delusion of greatness we have come to believe we are something above nature, separate from it. And even if we did somehow survive, the Universe is programmed to self-destruct (Google that fact) so there’s no escape from ultimate human demise.
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"Who are you who live in all these many forms? You're death that captures all. You too are the source of all that's gonna be born. You're glory, mercy, peace, truth. You give calm a spirit, understanding, courage, the contented heart."
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lIllIIIllIlIIlIlIIllIllIIl
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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: redtailedhawk]
#7667211 - 11/22/07 02:48 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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i kind of feel this way too
maybe some other life form, perhaps artificially created, could colonize the universe... but humans?
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



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I don't know if humans will colonize the Universe or not, but I am wondering what makes you think that an artificially created form of life would stand more chances.
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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WScott
´ ɑ `▽ ᑲᓇᑕ



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Quit doubting your own race! We are definitely far from perfect, but look how far we've come.
First flight (Orville and Wilbur Wright) to the Moon in 50 years.
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lIllIIIllIlIIlIlIIllIllIIl
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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7667468 - 11/22/07 04:25 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
MushroomTrip said: I don't know if humans will colonize the Universe or not, but I am wondering what makes you think that an artificially created form of life would stand more chances.
you would think that a lifeform that is engineered to survive in space would have a much higher chance to colonize the universe than a human would
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



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To survive in space in which way? Are you referring to the biological adaptability or what?
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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lIllIIIllIlIIlIlIIllIllIIl
Stranger

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Re: Might humans survive the death of Earth? [Re: MushroomTrip]
#7667511 - 11/22/07 04:45 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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yes
for example, the most hospitable place in our solar system (that we know of) outside of earth is mars, where we may live long enough to suffocate, perhaps ten minutes
in most other places we die in seconds or less
now imagine a body designed to survive a wide range of temperatures, pressures and radiation damage... something that could survive in space as well as it could survive at the bottom of the ocean or on the surface of the planet mercury
such a creature would be at a huge advantage in a race to colonize just our solar system, let alone the galaxy where most stars are red dwarfs quite unlike our own
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