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Invisibledaytripper23
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Registered: 06/22/05
Posts: 3,595
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7651770 - 11/18/07 05:42 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

This statement is a gross oversimplification of lifes complexities. Actually, this notion seems to be very much reflective of the stigma surrounding hallucinogens.

When we do hallucinogens, often times problems arise. but I hope all of us here realize that these problems should in almost every instance be treated as our own personal problems, and not attributed to the drug. (schizophrenia and other similar cases not included, I know nothing about these kinds of situations. From my understanding though, these are not the usual cases)

As we all know, society makes the mistake of taking the position that drugs are the cause of these difficult situations. And why shouldnt they? statistics often support this connection between drugs and life problems. In a sense they are correct. From their perspective there is no difference whatsover between causation and correlation.

So, I think we as drug users should accept this connection as valid, that sometimes, drugs can in fact be correlated to lower grades, work performance etc. (although I realize that often it is not the case, so dont go telling me how good your grades are even though you smoke pot every day)

The truth that is not seen, and cannot be demonstrated without force ingensting the general population, is this connection is more correlation than causation. The truth is, that these problems that arise are in actuality built through a lifetime of social conditioning and self delusion. Hallucinogens can make us aware of our problems, and often force us confront them. They arent THE problem though.

My point is, that overcoming ignorance is a struggle. Its not the truth that comes to bite you in your ass when you become aware, its the delusions.


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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Registered: 12/02/05
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: daytripper23]
    #7652255 - 11/18/07 07:30 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Huh?

This discussion was NOT about psychedelics and also using this analogy has little place here, in the context you presented it.
I was merely outlining that people do tend to run away from their issues, and when facing difficult it's possible to with that they were simply unaware of them.


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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Invisibledaytripper23
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Registered: 06/22/05
Posts: 3,595
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7652477 - 11/18/07 08:12 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Sorry it was a general response. Should have directed it that way. But if it seems to offend your viewpoint... You don't see it this way? Where exactly did I lose it?


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Invisibledaytripper23
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: daytripper23]
    #7653756 - 11/19/07 07:41 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Perhaps I could be more concise

Many people here do believe that psychedelics are an awareness expanding tool. I do not see how you can deem them irrelavent to the theme of this thread, that ignorance is bliss.

To label ignorance as bliss simply on a basis of our sensational reaction, is not a far cry from labeling the expansion of awareness as painful, or something that should in the same sense be avoided because it can be painful/unpleasent.

This is what I outlined and expanded a bit on in my previous posts.


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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: daytripper23]
    #7653768 - 11/19/07 07:50 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

To label ignorance as bliss simply on a basis of our sensational reaction, is not a far cry from labeling the expansion of awareness as painful, or something that should in the same sense be avoided because it can be painful/unpleasent.




With that I agree. They usually go hand in hand.

When I couldn't understand was the point of making that reply to my latest statement, since your reply was addressed to me. :shrug:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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Invisibledaytripper23
?
Male

Registered: 06/22/05
Posts: 3,595
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7653793 - 11/19/07 08:03 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Well, I tend to have a bit of a self-absorbed outlook when I post on this board, so I hope youll excuse me from time to time. :hatsoff:

on the plus side though you may judge what I say simply as what I have said. :smile2:


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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: daytripper23]
    #7653798 - 11/19/07 08:05 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

:smile:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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Offlinesoulcircus
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. *DELETED* [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7653850 - 11/19/07 08:36 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Post deleted by soulcircus

Reason for deletion: .



Edited by soulcircus (11/19/07 08:40 AM)


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: soulcircus]
    #7654855 - 11/19/07 01:54 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

the main place i found this statement most true was when i started perceiving everything as lifeless chemical interactions or simply patterns and processes.

i got severaly depressed becasue of this.

however it goes beyond that and maybe this statement simply holds most true during the stages leading upto to realisations that take you to places which are far greater.

we are the magical beings we think we are, not just machines, i AM alive.
it IS actually amazing.


I find your statements here quite interesting as I have had to deal with these same issues.

I think that it becomes obvious that how we think determines how we feel. To a scientist the fact of chemical reactions and and patterns and processes might be endlessly fascinating and amazing. So here it might be an issue of self-importance rather than a depressing thing in and of itself. Most humans harbor a deep need to be very important and of special interest to others or to a creator God. Many of the facts of life such as chemical processes or death can make many humans feel very unspecial and insecure. But of course to someone who doesn't think in this way these "facts" might be in no way a cause for depression but even the opposite.

You have a certain definition of what makes life magical but it is only your definition most likely based on your programming. This is worth thinking about IMO.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisiblepsyka
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Registered: 06/09/03
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: soulcircus]
    #7657002 - 11/19/07 10:20 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)



Fractals are often considered beautiful. The mathematical formula's that they consist of, however, are not. Just because one understands that there is no magic ingredient involved does not make the mystery any less interesting to fathom.

Icelander gave some very sound wisdom. Depression is a defense mechanism of the ego... of the grasping mind. It lashes out to grab on to something, when you are getting the hint that there really is nothing to grab on to. True bliss occurs, when you let go of trying to control the free fall, and glide with skill.


--------------------
As the life of a candle,
my wick will burn out.
But, the fire of my mind
shall beam into infinite.



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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Registered: 05/07/04
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Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: psyka]
    #7658978 - 11/20/07 12:59 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

"Ignorance is bliss" is a sarcastic statement, imho.
But maybe I don't understand 'bliss'.


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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InvisibleEgo Death
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Registered: 04/27/03
Posts: 10,447
Loc: The War Machine
Re: Ignorance is bliss. [Re: psyka]
    #7659350 - 11/20/07 02:54 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

psyka said:
True bliss occurs, when you let go of trying to control the free fall, and glide with skill.




:thumbup:

Reminds me of one of my shroom trips where my ego was destroyed and shown to me on a plate.

When I let go of it (mainly the emotions of fear and anxiety) I was catapulted into Ecstasy.  I saw a bright white light all around me and my body and sense of self had completely been removed.


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