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 hongomon
old hand
Registered: 04/14/02
Posts: 910
Loc: comin' at ya
Last seen: 21 years, 24 days
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 Re: Bush gets his way.  [Re: Rono]
#771225 - 07/23/02 05:02 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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The U.S. is far more vulnerable economically than militarily. Unfortunately, since
a) we have evolved into the high-consumption country we are (of fossil fuels, coffee, fossil fuels, minerals, sugar, fossil fuels, and beef, to name a few randomly);
b) for all the United States' resources, it can't possibly provide for so excessive a consumption rate without those imports;
and c) U.S. international business interests represent billions of dollars in investments, a major aspect of our economy, to be sure;
any significant freeze of these resources would constitute a "threat" to our "security" (food security, economic security, physical security, and so on, all somewhat interconnected). That would warrant military intervention, per a convoluted offspring of the Monroe Doctrine.
I'm not saying that it will go this way for sure, but I can imagine how, with a few causes here and a few effects there, that the U.S. could find itself safeguarding more and more of its foreign interests, to the degree that it becomes plain that it will justify itself in holding everyone else hostage in order to maintain its own "security".
And then who knows? We might find out who really is tougher--the U.S. (maybe throw a bitch or two in--Israel for one), or the rest of the world. It would be the end-all of Pyrrhic victories, where even the winners lose.
Edited by hongomon (07/23/02 06:01 PM)
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Rono
DSYSB since '01
 
Registered: 01/25/01
Posts: 16,259
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: hongomon]
#772258 - 07/24/02 03:57 AM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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excellent post.
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"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"
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 GabbaDj
BTH
Registered: 04/08/01
Posts: 19,697
Loc: By The Lake
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: Rono]
#773363 - 07/24/02 12:20 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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If these things were restricted durring a war which most Americans only know half about and understand only half of that it would be devistateing to community support for the war.
If someones favorite resturant closed or some politicians wife had to learn to bake a loaf of bread herself all while everyones bills raise by 200% and Americans are asked to conserve more We The People would shut down the war and demand that things go back to the way they were.
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GabbaDj
FAMM.ORG
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Rono
DSYSB since '01
Registered: 01/25/01
Posts: 16,259
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: GabbaDj]
#773371 - 07/24/02 12:23 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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We The People would shut down the war and demand that things go back to the way they were.
By then it would be too late...
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"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"
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hongomon
old hand
Registered: 04/14/02
Posts: 910
Loc: comin' at ya
Last seen: 21 years, 24 days
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: GabbaDj]
#774712 - 07/24/02 10:11 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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Definitely another possible scenario. I agree with Rono though that it would probably be too late once those inconveniences reached the "more privileged". Any major radical reform will be impossible without a concerted We the People. What do you think would be an appropriate definition of "the way things were"?
I wonder if an economy is more vulnerable the more centralized it is. Any guesses? And what about nations?
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Jammer
Computers areMORE Addictive!
Registered: 11/04/00
Posts: 3,998
Loc: (God's Country) - USA
Last seen: 19 years, 7 months
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RE: ..."US is still not a fully developed country"...
uh... ok.
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>>Jammer>>
Edited by Jammer (07/24/02 10:25 PM)
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GabbaDj
BTH
Registered: 04/08/01
Posts: 19,697
Loc: By The Lake
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: hongomon]
#775545 - 07/25/02 08:55 AM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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>>>>"What do you think would be an appropriate definition of "the way things were"?"<<<<
Ignorant Bliss...
Best way I can describe it. Americans cant even point to a map to where the war is happening much less understand why its happening.. As long as they can still fill their SUVs for $50 and get a Big Mack Super Sized Meal for under $6 then really Americans will support whatevers going on..
Just wait untill things start getting hard on the every day person, youll see things get ugly and our truely selfish side come out.
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GabbaDj
FAMM.ORG
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Rono
DSYSB since '01
Registered: 01/25/01
Posts: 16,259
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: GabbaDj]
#775563 - 07/25/02 09:03 AM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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youll see things get ugly and our truely selfish side come out
..as opposed to the kind and generous nation you are now? 
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"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"
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Jammer
Computers areMORE Addictive!
Registered: 11/04/00
Posts: 3,998
Loc: (God's Country) - USA
Last seen: 19 years, 7 months
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 Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: GabbaDj]
#776822 - 07/25/02 06:02 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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RE: "As long as they can still fill their SUVs for $50 and get a Big Mack Super Sized Meal for under $6 then really Americans will support whatevers going on.."
This is very true... but at least the fast food industry is still mostly using American beef for there hamburgers... however they often pay minium wage for some of there jobs!! Thats a DISGRACE!!!
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>>Jammer>>
Edited by Jammer (07/25/02 09:14 PM)
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Anonymous
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: Jammer]
#777626 - 07/26/02 04:23 AM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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...however they often pay minium wage for some of there jobs!! Thats a DISGRACE!!!
What do you propose that they pay a sixteen year old with no job history and an unproven work ethic? These are entry level jobs. If you want to pass a law that makes the wage higher, perhaps McDonalds and others will find it cost effective to increase automation, thereby eliminating multiple entry level jobs. Or, they could raise their prices enough and then their customers will find it too expensive to eat there - whoops they gotta lay off those formerly low paid workers, not enough business.
Just some thoughts on the concept of unintended consequences...
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Jammer
Computers areMORE Addictive!
Registered: 11/04/00
Posts: 3,998
Loc: (God's Country) - USA
Last seen: 19 years, 7 months
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: ]
#778950 - 07/26/02 05:57 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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I think that a person's salary should reflect more upon how hard they work and not much more.
The lowest paying jobs are often the ones the hardest... Sucks my highest paying job that I have ever had was also by far... the easiest job that I ever had.... The hardest work that I have done has always been for about minimum wage. (with no sitting in a chair nor air conditioning).
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>>Jammer>>
Edited by Jammer (07/30/02 08:13 PM)
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Anonymous
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: Jammer]
#779120 - 07/26/02 07:19 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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I know it sucks, but generally the most physically demanding jobs require the least skill (professional athletes being one notable exception). Humans are after all, creatures of reason - our minds are our greatest assets and the market will reflect that to a great extent. I get paid a hell of a lot more programming than I ever did mopping floors or roofing, the work is much less physically demanding but more mentally precise requiring a lot more thought and the consequences of me fucking something up are economically much greater for those that pay me.
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Jammer
Computers areMORE Addictive!
Registered: 11/04/00
Posts: 3,998
Loc: (God's Country) - USA
Last seen: 19 years, 7 months
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: ]
#779374 - 07/26/02 10:01 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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You make a good point.
Another one of my pet-peeves is that I feel that the economy overly discounts how much common workers really do have to think. Even the lowest paid workers have to use there brains, and when they make a mistake they could cost there company many weeks worth of that employees salary (ex: production work).
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>>Jammer>>
Edited by Jammer (07/26/02 10:04 PM)
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GabbaDj
BTH
Registered: 04/08/01
Posts: 19,697
Loc: By The Lake
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: Jammer]
#785905 - 07/30/02 08:09 AM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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If Im not thinking straight at work I will end up missing a few fingers...
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GabbaDj
FAMM.ORG
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,248
Loc: Lost In Space
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: GabbaDj]
#786006 - 07/30/02 09:13 AM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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To go along with your missing marbles? 
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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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Jammer
Computers areMORE Addictive!
Registered: 11/04/00
Posts: 3,998
Loc: (God's Country) - USA
Last seen: 19 years, 7 months
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Well to play devil's advocate here...
If a production worker was to actualy cutt off his/her's own fingers off on the job most likely they will be drug tested before any surgery takes place. (no trust man.. )
I have seen serious injuries on the job. - it aint pretty!
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>>Jammer>>
Edited by Jammer (07/30/02 08:08 PM)
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GabbaDj
BTH
Registered: 04/08/01
Posts: 19,697
Loc: By The Lake
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: Jammer]
#787241 - 07/30/02 08:40 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thats why I cant smoke weed... If I get hurt on the job and I need to go to the doctor, the verry first thing they will do is test me, if I fail then I lose everything, my job, my benefits, Ill have to foot the bill for medical costs and its just not worth it for weed..
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GabbaDj
FAMM.ORG
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Jammer
Computers areMORE Addictive!
Registered: 11/04/00
Posts: 3,998
Loc: (God's Country) - USA
Last seen: 19 years, 7 months
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: GabbaDj]
#788806 - 07/31/02 03:56 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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Please dont misunderstand me. I have never worked a job while high. I find that to be way too risky. I also dont smoke weed that often any more. When I do choose to smoke it's always on my own private time- usally for a jamm session.
My problem is with urine/hair drug testing which can show pot use from many days/weeks ago. I understand that if a worker has an acident that blood samples (not urine) are used (I could be wrong) which only shows imparment at that time... not drug use from weeks ago).. In fact when someone comes into the ER bleeding it stands to reason that the blood is best used for drug testing.
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>>Jammer>>
Edited by Jammer (07/31/02 08:38 PM)
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politikill
journeyman
Registered: 05/23/02
Posts: 72
Loc: THC, Canada
Last seen: 22 years, 7 months
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: Jammer]
#791857 - 08/02/02 03:46 AM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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Noam Chomsky
If the Nuremberg laws were applied, then every post-war American president would have been hanged
This statement is probably very close to the truth.
Luvdemshrooms if your reasoning was as strong as your name calling you might be worth agruing with....
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Censorship: ahh, McCarthyism with a smiley face
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GabbaDj
BTH
Registered: 04/08/01
Posts: 19,697
Loc: By The Lake
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Re: Bush gets his way. [Re: Jammer]
#791986 - 08/02/02 05:42 AM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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Jammer...
Depends on your union and their drug testing policy.. Mine is a urine test.. Now they wont make you pee in a bottle before stitching you up but you wil have to pee right after theyre done..
As for blood test.. It is just the same time window as urine. It is however impossible to fool. Theirs no way short of a blood transfusion to beat a blood test...
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GabbaDj
FAMM.ORG
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