Home | Community | Message Board

Cannabis Seeds UK
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

Jump to first unread post Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3  [ show all ]
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #7653281 - 11/19/07 01:09 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
Spirituality -vs- self improvement. How can one oppose the other. They are different elements of the same thing.




It's the difference between wanting to improve, and needing to improve. If we are only wanting to improve, we are acknowledging that we are perfect just the way we are, and are aware that we are spiritual. This is spirituality (IMO). Awareness of spirit. Awareness of being.

If improvement is a necessity, we are in denial of our current perfection, and mostly unaware that we are spiritual beings. It is this type of improvement that I speak of. It is like a cult, and enlightenment is the ring leader, someone to worship and secretly be jealous of.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: WScott]
    #7653374 - 11/19/07 02:03 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

>>>>rahz, i would argue that happiness can be created. a thoughtful gift at christmas, a donation to someone in need or lending a listening ear could all do the trick and all need conscious intent.

If a person receives a gift which makes them forget their troubles for a while, happiness occurs. A donation relieves a problem, happiness occurs. If a person expresses their problems, they lighten their load and happiness occurs. We can not create happiness, but we can remove the obstacles that prevent happiness. If a person had no obstacles, they would be happy before the gift.

It may seem like we are creating instances of happiness, but happiness is created each moment unless we prevent it. So we help people remove obstacles, and happiness is the state of having no obstacles.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblepsyka
Praetorian
 User Gallery

Registered: 06/09/03
Posts: 1,652
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: Rahz]
    #7653392 - 11/19/07 02:19 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

We are not perfect the way we are... EVER. Improvement can go on and on for eons, and still never achieve the state of perfection. Being mentally stable despite external circumstances brings an element of contentment and inner peace to ones sense of being. Mental collectedness, and tranquility emerge bringing confidence to our daily actions and clarity into the nature of our mind. With that type of confidence, improvement occurs naturally, without effort. This to me IS spirituality.


--------------------
As the life of a candle,
my wick will burn out.
But, the fire of my mind
shall beam into infinite.



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinesoulcircus
Stranger
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/09/06
Posts: 1,300
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement *DELETED* [Re: psyka]
    #7653733 - 11/19/07 07:31 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Post deleted by soulcircus

Reason for deletion: .



Edited by soulcircus (11/19/07 07:37 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: psyka]
    #7653835 - 11/19/07 08:30 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Spiritual growth is perfect.
The fight against entropy is perfect.
Entropy is also perfect.

Everything is as it should be. A desire to change, and having a problem with perfection are two different things.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: soulcircus]
    #7653872 - 11/19/07 08:44 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

>>>>i think spirituaity and self improvement are the same thing.

They can be.

A girl at work is looking for anger managment classes. She get's angry, and then automatically get's VERY angry because she is angry. She can accept that she get's angry, and work on it, or she can have a problem with getting angry. Her attempts to improve are useless because she refuses to accept things as they are.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFraggin
Multi-Faceted
 User Gallery


Registered: 01/05/05
Posts: 8,707
Last seen: 8 years, 3 days
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: Rahz]
    #7655710 - 11/19/07 04:30 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Rahz said:
If we are only wanting to improve, we are acknowledging that we are perfect just the way we are, and are aware that we are spiritual.




If you desire more than you currently have, it's because you're not content with what you have. This statement makes no logical sense to me.
Also, anything or any person that does not continue to improve only degrades and becomes stagnant. Neither of which are happy states to be in.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: Fraggin]
    #7655942 - 11/19/07 05:17 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

>>>>If you desire more than you currently have, it's because you're not content with what you have. This statement makes no logical sense to me.

You can choose to want progress, and still be content with who you are, unless you are basing your happiness on what you have, which is egoic happiness. You identify what you are with the world of form, and not with your spirit. There is a fear that being content with who you are will result in entropy. This is just a fear, and is not a truth. It is the opposite of a truth. It is egoic truth.

>>>>Also, anything or any person that does not continue to improve only degrades and becomes stagnant. Neither of which are happy states to be in.

Humans improve because it is our nature. No one wants to become stagnant, yet it happens. It happens because of all the fear and worry of not being enough. It's stress over the possibility of not reaching some obscure finality that is hurtful, and can actually prevent us from reaching our potential.

People become unhappy because they don't believe they deserve to be happy. They must first "do something", or "figure something out" in order to deserve happiness. This is not true. We can be happy and do things. We can be happy and figure things out. Why must our happiness hinge on it?


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFraggin
Multi-Faceted
 User Gallery


Registered: 01/05/05
Posts: 8,707
Last seen: 8 years, 3 days
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: Rahz]
    #7656683 - 11/19/07 08:30 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Rahz said:
>>>>If you desire more than you currently have, it's because you're not content with what you have. This statement makes no logical sense to me.

You can choose to want progress, and still be content with who you are, unless you are basing your happiness on what you have, which is egoic happiness. You identify what you are with the world of form, and not with your spirit. There is a fear that being content with who you are will result in entropy. This is just a fear, and is not a truth. It is the opposite of a truth. It is egoic truth.

>>>>Also, anything or any person that does not continue to improve only degrades and becomes stagnant. Neither of which are happy states to be in.

Humans improve because it is our nature. No one wants to become stagnant, yet it happens. It happens because of all the fear and worry of not being enough. It's stress over the possibility of not reaching some obscure finality that is hurtful, and can actually prevent us from reaching our potential.

People become unhappy because they don't believe they deserve to be happy. They must first "do something", or "figure something out" in order to deserve happiness. This is not true. We can be happy and do things. We can be happy and figure things out. Why must our happiness hinge on it?




Happiness is nothing more than a consequense of novelty. And the historical action of novelty suggests that as time progresses, states of novelty and non-novelty fluctuate. If you have no basis to compare a state of novelty to, then you are simply in a state of undefineable entropy. But because non-novelty exists dichotomously with novelty, happiness is given a frame of reference on the foundation of happiness and unhappiness. It would seem possible that a constant state happiness is rather impossible. Perhaps the occurrence of happiness and unhappiness is cyclic, and that in itself can nullify the fear of entropy, if discpline is applied to the idea that nothing will remain constant. Even a state of non-novelty or unhappiness.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: Fraggin]
    #7658998 - 11/20/07 01:06 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

No reason is needed for happiness. It can be experienced, just because. It is anger and sadness that are efforts.

I am not saying we should all enter unending states of bliss immediately, or that it is possible, but people hold onto their anger. Everyone has their reasons, but now is the only time to let go if that is what is desired. A person cannot be angry for more than a minute or so, unless they try. The happiness I speak of IS acceptance of what is, and of change. This may not seem to be "happiness", but it is. It is not always an exuberant feeling, busting out with excessive positivity. It's an appreciation of whatever is being felt. I enjoy being sad, I enjoy being angry. As a result, sadness and anger become short lived. They are lessons instead of problems. It does not seem to be a logical thing. In fact is is -very- bothersome to the ego, but the only other choice I have is to have a problem with sadness and anger, and that is self perpetuating.

It takes work, but it is not the work of a lifetime. It is not the big insurmountable task many people come to believe it is. If a person can be OK right now with right Now, it is the same skill they will have 50 years from now.

This can be a disappointment, or a revelation. On the level of spirit, there is no future.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinesubconsciousness
Stranger


Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 38
Loc: inside the mothership
Last seen: 15 years, 8 months
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: Rahz]
    #7660989 - 11/20/07 10:48 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I don't believe in spirituality as a means to an end. I don't believe in morality as a means to an end. That is because spiritual fulfillment is not in the future, it is NOW. To me, spiritual perfection is dropping any expectation that you will "become" perfect. Spirituality means being accepting of your own faults and limitations, but at the same time also striving to realize your full potential as a human being. However, your potential may not be as great as Gandhi's, or the Dalai Lama's. Spiritual progress comes when you stop caring so much about "progress" however you try to define it.

Am I making sense?


--------------------
"It's not a war on drugs, it's a war on personal freedom. Keep that in mind at all times."
--Bill Hicks

"Anyway, no drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power."
--P.J. O'Rourke


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: Spirituality -vs- self improvement [Re: subconsciousness]
    #7661141 - 11/20/07 11:30 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

That makes perfect sense.:yesnod:

Spirituality is crap!

no, no...

Self improvement is crap!

:lol:


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3  [ show all ]

Shop: Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Nothing Important Here.. Just a little something spiritual Ped 903 14 06/04/05 02:26 PM
by HedgeWych
* Sports & Spirituality
( 1 2 all )
Swami 4,484 32 08/21/03 01:44 PM
by Malachi
* Spiritually sick...how to heal?
( 1 2 3 all )
MOTH 3,275 41 03/20/05 12:05 AM
by Huehuecoyotl
* New Spirituality Message Boards
( 1 2 all )
Anonymous 5,170 36 03/16/02 02:37 AM
by Anonymous
* Lynn V. Andrews (female Castaneda)
( 1 2 all )
Swami 3,793 31 07/13/04 07:46 PM
by Huehuecoyotl
* The Definition of Spirituality
( 1 2 all )
Sclorch 1,706 21 09/03/03 10:56 PM
by bedetached
* spiritual truths
( 1 2 all )
Moonshoe 2,457 37 06/29/04 10:32 PM
by Panoramix
* 10 Ways to Improve Your Life and/or Destroy It Scarfmeister 1,407 10 05/07/04 09:12 AM
by Frog

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, DividedQuantum
3,204 topic views. 1 members, 15 guests and 7 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.027 seconds spending 0.007 seconds on 14 queries.