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Invisiblejohnm214
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Posts: 17,582
Loc: Americas
Re: Ron Paul [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7612820 - 11/08/07 08:59 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

johnm214 said:
got ya...

a neo con who believes in personal freedom... that's an interesting mix




Without a strong security presence there is no freedom. There is no more free nation on earth than the US.




I understand where your coming from, I'm just not convinced of the effectivness and morality of what we're currently doing in Iraq.

Not that I feel foreign intervention isn't prudent at some times.

For example, Paul supported the idea of invading afghanistan, as did I. I don't buy the utility of the iraq invasion.


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Offlineandrewss
precariously aggrandized


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 8,725
Loc: ohio
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Re: Ron Paul [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7613295 - 11/08/07 11:44 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Without a strong security presence there is no freedom. There is no more free nation on earth than the US.




This is true, but really its not like we are opposed to the soviet union or something with a real powerful army. I think RP's points about reducing spending (even in foreign policy) save American dollars make a lot of sense.

I think in hindsight the Iraq invasion was a bad idea, its going to suck for a lot of people there when we leave, but it sucks now as well. Might just have to let it unfold, we have been there for quite some time now... I hope we consider policies like Ron Paul's ideas of more restrained foreign policy. Sure we have interests overseas but perhaps we need to examine whats really worth starting wars over. The humanitarian thing for Iraq is kinda silly, not like we intervene in places like Darfur, Burma, etc etc.

Afghanistan made a whole lot more sense to me, destroy the actual terrorists. Iraq just didn't make much sense. A more conservative foreign policy is a great ideal, hopefully it can work.

Man the modern world is crazy. :ooo:



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Jesus loves you.


Edited by andrewss (11/08/07 11:51 PM)


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero


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Re: Ron Paul [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7613743 - 11/09/07 03:58 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

> Without a strong security presence there is no freedom.

Playing the devil's advocate... we have nukes and a couple of big oceans between us and most people... what more security do we need to protect freedom?


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Just another spore in the wind.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Ron Paul [Re: Seuss]
    #7613785 - 11/09/07 05:19 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Obviously more than we have had. And threats of retaliation are meaningless against suicidal nutlogs. Once you have to retaliate it is too late.


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Ron Paul [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7613960 - 11/09/07 07:20 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

johnm214 said:
got ya...

a neo con who believes in personal freedom... that's an interesting mix




Without a strong security presence there is no freedom. There is no more free nation on earth than the US.



Trivial fact: I had to wonder if this post was sarcasm for a bit, as both points are comically non-factual. Anyways...
Weapons and tightened laws provide false security at best, and both are actually the product of insecurity. Good relationships provide security and diminish the usefulness of weapons and tightened laws.


Edited by Disco Cat (11/09/07 11:24 AM)


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Re: Ron Paul [Re: Disco Cat]
    #7615767 - 11/09/07 03:24 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Your stated opinions on foreign policy continue to be informed by an utterly infantile belief that if you just make nice people will like you and be nice to you back. No they won't. They will steamroller over you and take what they want. They will plant you headfirst in the desert sand and abuse your rectum. Not all of them but far far too many to put down your guns.

You also spout these opinions safely ensconced behind those very guns that you deride. Must be nice, all that simultaneous having and eating.


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InvisibleDieCommie


Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: Ron Paul [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7615813 - 11/09/07 03:35 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

:lol: Good one dude    :thumbup:


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Ron Paul [Re: DieCommie]
    #7615974 - 11/09/07 04:21 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Ha, easily amused?

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Your stated opinions on foreign policy continue to be informed by an utterly infantile belief that if you just make nice people will like you and be nice to you back. No they won't.  They will steamroller over you and take what they want.  They will plant you headfirst in the desert sand and abuse your rectum.  Not all of them but far far too many to put down your guns. 

You also spout these opinions safely ensconced behind those very guns that you deride.  Must be nice, all that simultaneous having and eating.




That good relations provide a security that can't be achieved with weapons and laws is hardly an opinion. If you think otherwise you probably aren't the one to talk of foreign policy. You'd never know it judging by your response, but I never said defences were currently useless or should not be used. I clarified that they do not equate freedom, and the security they give is not the fullest one that can be achieved.
Now whether being nice on the international stage will receive niceties in return, or not, would seem to be a topic of your own creation, as it doesn't appear in my own post. But thanks for your opinions on it anyway, I guess.

Also, apparantly you think I live in the US?


Curiously, all in all, that makes for a 100% non-relevant response from you.
So ya...

Quote:

DieCommie said:
:lol: Good one dude    :thumbup:




Edited by Disco Cat (11/09/07 05:20 PM)


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Re: Ron Paul [Re: Disco Cat]
    #7616736 - 11/09/07 08:23 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Force of arms is the sine qua non of our freedom. You probably think that's ironic. I think it's obvious.


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Ron Paul [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7617875 - 11/10/07 08:33 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

That is the obvious unfortunate state of the current situation, which is neither encouraging of freedom, or the essence of security. I would also point out that it would provide a Negative Peace if it had actually proved to be a full attack deterrent, which of course it didn't due to not making nice in the middle east.


Edited by Disco Cat (11/10/07 10:31 AM)


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Ron Paul [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7619183 - 11/10/07 03:05 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
I'm really surprised you didn't find anything. Did you go back two weeks? Ythan permabanned me for bitchslapping his dumbcunt candidate. Fortunately for all you younguns, cooler heads prevailed




looked again, can't find it... what was the thread about?


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


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Re: Ron Paul [Re: johnm214]
    #7619225 - 11/10/07 03:19 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)



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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Ron Paul [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7623799 - 11/11/07 09:58 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

From the original poster (in another thread)...

Clearly we're dealing w/ a scholar here; for shame on anyone who doubted his ability to reasearch ron paul on his own:

Quote:

So last night, after drinking, I went over to my (now ex-) girlfriend's place to spend the night. I fell asleep, then was rudely awakened hours later by her yelling "Oh my god, are you pissing on my computer?" It took me a few moments to realize what was going on. I wasn't even that drunk, so I guess I just invented sleep-pissing.

Anyone got any ideas on how to raise $2000?




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OfflinePinballWizard
Naive and Gullible as usual

Registered: 03/20/04
Posts: 2,804
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Re: Ron Paul [Re: johnm214]
    #7626637 - 11/12/07 04:32 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Hey, we all do stupid things. Just because you don't share them doesn't mean you haven't done them.


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Ron Paul [Re: PinballWizard]
    #7626778 - 11/12/07 05:08 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

wait, that means those bouncing boobs are not yours.

someone lock this thread please.


--------------------
All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Ron Paul [Re: afoaf]
    #7627155 - 11/12/07 06:21 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

eh... I think I could piss on my girlfriend's computer without her dumping me... we've been together for awhile and I pretty much bought her her computer


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