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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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New Species of Psilocybe in Maine?
#7599187 - 11/05/07 04:34 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Lots of blue on the caps and stems,gills attached.dark brown-purple print, stem is hollow, most are small, largest cap is about 2 inches. Found in Maine in november. Growing under a holly in mulch on the edge of the grass line The spot is slightly elevated above a wet wooded area. These were all found in a two foot area. There is no ring present. half the gills stretch only half way to the stem. I sampled two small caps last night, flavour was good. The effects were surprisingly potent. Thanks for your help on this one Workman. Anyone got any ideas? Thanks!
-------------------- Some things can grow without the light.--RJD
Edited by HerbBaker (02/24/08 02:08 PM)
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GGreatOne234
Stranger
Registered: 12/23/99
Posts: 8,946
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7599200 - 11/05/07 04:38 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Wow......
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CureCat
Strangest


Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 14,058
Loc: clawing your furniture
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7599201 - 11/05/07 04:39 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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you mean species, not strain.
But strange finds!! Nice!
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thetonebone72
Hunter -Gatherer



Registered: 03/11/06
Posts: 1,125
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker] 1
#7599209 - 11/05/07 04:41 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Stropharia aeruginosa maybe? I'm not aware of any active psilocybes in Maine. I'd like to see some more close-up pics!
-------------------- Hunt On, Good Fellow
 
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notapillow
I want to be a fisherman



Registered: 09/29/03
Posts: 31,129
Loc: A rare and different tune
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
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so confirmed active wow
very cool
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jet li
The One


Registered: 07/09/07
Posts: 4,279
Loc: penis double yew
Last seen: 2 months, 11 days
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7599232 - 11/05/07 04:46 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Psilocybe baeocystis. In Maine? That's awesome! EDITED BY GG. They might, afterall, be a new species. I didn't even see that they were found in Maine. So this is obviously an edited post.
Edited by GGreatOne234 (11/05/07 05:08 PM)
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: jet li]
#7599252 - 11/05/07 04:53 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Total weight was 1 ounce dry.I sampled 1/4 of a gram and i could still feel some effects the next day. these things are potent!
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CureCat
Strangest


Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 14,058
Loc: clawing your furniture
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They do not look like S. aeruginosa to me.
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: CureCat]
#7599282 - 11/05/07 05:02 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Not S. aeruginosa. Maybe a new strain of Psilocybe caerulipes, they also share features with P. baeocystis.
Edited by HerbBaker (11/05/07 05:04 PM)
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Subbedhunter420
Solitary Hunter



Registered: 12/30/06
Posts: 1,501
Loc: LA/Ventura County
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: CureCat]
#7599290 - 11/05/07 05:03 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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no the guy said they were DEFINITELY ACTIVE.
I'm blown away. the last 18 months have been out of control in the new species categories. also finding broader habitat ranges. we're finding em everywhere now.
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Phish_Dude
steppin' into yesterday




Registered: 10/16/06
Posts: 5,745
Loc: secret tweeker pad
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: jet li]
#7599295 - 11/05/07 05:05 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
jet li said: Psilocybe baeocystis. In Maine? That's awesome! EDITED BY GG. They might, afterall, be a new species. I didn't even see that they were found in Maine. So this is obviously an edited post.
that is sweet, EDITED BY GG.
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Edited by GGreatOne234 (11/05/07 05:48 PM)
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CureCat
Strangest


Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 14,058
Loc: clawing your furniture
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Quote:
Subbedhunter420 said: no the guy said they were DEFINITELY ACTIVE.
And I hardly consider anecdotal evidence. You've been here long enough to know people sometimes say they tripped on clearly inactive mushrooms.
Though, in this circumstance, they are active. I can see that from the photo. I don't need bioassay reports to recognize the activity.
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: Phish_Dude]
#7599338 - 11/05/07 05:16 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yeah, Workmans gonna help me figure this one out. I'm gonna try a full gram this weekend. It should be very interesting..
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Phish_Dude
steppin' into yesterday




Registered: 10/16/06
Posts: 5,745
Loc: secret tweeker pad
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7599350 - 11/05/07 05:20 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
warriorsoul said: Total weight was 1 ounce dry.I sampled 1/4 of a gram and i could still feel some effects the next day. these things are potent!
damn, those are some fuckin good shrooms! nice man
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: Phish_Dude]
#7599478 - 11/05/07 05:56 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Thanks! I'm friggin stoked about this! I feel like i was meant to find these little buggers.
I've been shroom hunting for a long time. This makes it all worth it, and then some.
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cactu
culture and magic


Registered: 03/06/06
Posts: 3,913
Loc: mexicoelcentrodelconocimi...
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7599532 - 11/05/07 06:09 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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whoa , great , great , find  just because they have´t found it does not mean it not exist, ha ha
2007 is a great year, congratulations, those really seem some superior mushrooms .........has´t finished yet i mean 2007........
thank you for posting this great find but will too much to ask for million pictures fron diferent angles closeup of the cap stem gill, sustrate the where growing ,oh i forgot habitad picture , pleasee¡
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  cuando una rafaga del pensamiento nos pasa al lado se puede sentir que valio la pena haber vivido, y cuando ese pensamiento se convierte en sueño no paramos de soñar hasta realizarlo
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Wiseguy
Newfoundlander.


Registered: 09/30/07
Posts: 194
Last seen: 13 years, 8 months
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: cactu]
#7600262 - 11/05/07 08:45 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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very cool.
you found all those in a two-foot area? good god, man. could you see any earth? were they growing in layers?
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Subbedhunter420
Solitary Hunter



Registered: 12/30/06
Posts: 1,501
Loc: LA/Ventura County
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: CureCat]
#7602333 - 11/06/07 11:54 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
CureCat said:
Quote:
Subbedhunter420 said: no the guy said they were DEFINITELY ACTIVE.
And I hardly consider anecdotal evidence. You've been here long enough to know people sometimes say they tripped on clearly inactive mushrooms.
Though, in this circumstance, they are active. I can see that from the photo. I don't need bioassay reports to recognize the activity.
Correct. please excuse me, ive always been a bit on the gogogo side but the bluing says it all. I just get a little too excited when i see this kinda stuff. its called mycoporn for a reason eh?eh? ahha
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: cactu]
#7609954 - 11/08/07 05:11 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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They were packed in there pretty good lots of large clumps and a few singles.
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hoopershroomer
Bonafide Oneironaut



Registered: 03/30/06
Posts: 1,704
Loc: WA
Last seen: 8 years, 2 months
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7610002 - 11/08/07 06:01 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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WOW!!! MAINE ACTIVES!??? thats crazy i couldnt imagine active mushrooms growing in maine!
does newone have ne idea what this species name is? im quite fascinated by this find, good shit warriorsoul.
one thing tho...dont rip up the mushrooms like that!!!!!:(
to me it looks like you picked alot of them, and nearly all of them have mycelia attached to the bottom of the stems.....which means that mycelia is not in the ground anymore......which means you have very well likely destroyed essential mycelian networking under the ground that is vital for mushroom growth.....which means the mushrooms now have less source to grow from......which means ultimately, this patch of yours is pretty much raped 
dont' be too surprised if you find that this patch doesnt produce anymore of these mushrooms( this all depends on how big this patch is)
learn from this mistake man, USE SCISSORS next time!
-------------------- "Life lived in the absence of the psychedelic experience that primordial shamanism is based on is life trivialized, life denied, life enslaved to the ego." "You teach the world how to treat you, by showing the world how you treat yourself." A well developed sense of humor is far superior to any religion" "Everything you could want and could be, you already have and are."
&
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Theres plenty of mycelium left in the mulch and i made sure not to pull it all up..dont worry the myc i did pull up is being put to good use, Psilocybe caerulipes..like disturbed ground.Peace
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Jair
Smeghead



Registered: 06/08/07
Posts: 2,593
Loc: East Coast
Last seen: 5 years, 5 months
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7610101 - 11/08/07 07:46 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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A couple of them definitely look like caerulipes to me. From my experience (which isn't that much), caerulipes are pretty rare, therefore they could easily be growing in Maine and just no one has found any yet due to their rarity. My money is on caerulipes or some strain of them.
All I can say is amazing find. That is so sexy. For some reason when I saw the thread title I was like "cool another active in Washington..." then as I read on I said "WAIT!! wtf am I talking about Washington!? THIS IS MAINE!!" Don't know why I was thinking Washington for some reason. East coast for the win!!!
Keep up the good work.
Edit: I've also heard that caerulipes are extremely potent for their wieght. I could be wrong but I still say caer.
Edit2: The one I circled here in red looks just like a caerulipe. Don't get me wrong or quote me on this because I'm not an expert, but you have my guess.

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Edited by Jair (11/08/07 07:52 AM)
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cactu
culture and magic


Registered: 03/06/06
Posts: 3,913
Loc: mexicoelcentrodelconocimi...
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no men , that thing about scisor is good maybe is some circunstances, do you image is use a scisosr with those big clusters, weell,i really don´t like that method you guys use , to cut mushrroms i don´t consider natural way, i always took my find with my hand with micelium in the base this is a good taxonomic feuture sometime you don´t have to overlook, pseudorriza, or rhizomorfs, or a bluing in the base, when you pick a mushrroms you have to pick complety.. in all tips of mushrooms cultivatiion . tell you is not good to leave that mees ther after you maybe inoculate with your scissor a bacteia or let then enter free. so why you guys use scisor i don´t know, will like to do, i mean micelium can recover from those holes also you can put more susbtrate in the hole for the surroundings , is more likeli that next flush came in about 2 week latter so is not that destruction is all aboput the energy it put in each flush . don´t love scissor and never will. also scisor aplly some presure and damage the inside of the flesh , i will love to see and experiment of woodlover pick gentle by hand and other with scisor , you have to remenber also that destruction motivate the micelium to produce more, if you let the stem atacch all the conection wil be there ,if you pull or the conection simple the micelium will be estimulated to produce more fruit bodys , is like flowers some how how people over look this thing even you all are experience grower,
do some experiment i´m not telling lies.
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  cuando una rafaga del pensamiento nos pasa al lado se puede sentir que valio la pena haber vivido, y cuando ese pensamiento se convierte en sueño no paramos de soñar hasta realizarlo
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Jair
Smeghead



Registered: 06/08/07
Posts: 2,593
Loc: East Coast
Last seen: 5 years, 5 months
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: cactu]
#7610111 - 11/08/07 07:53 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
cactu said: no men , that thing about scisor is good maybe is some circunstances, do you image is use a scisosr with those big clusters, weell,i really don´t like that method you guys use , to cut mushrroms i don´t consider natural way, i always took my find with my hand with micelium in the base this is a good taxonomic feuture sometime you don´t have to overlook, pseudorriza, or rhizomorfs, or a bluing in the base, when you pick a mushrroms you have to pick complety.. in all tips of mushrooms cultivatiion . tell you is not good to leave that mees ther after you maybe inoculate with your scissor a bacteia or let then enter free. so why you guys use scisor i don´t know, will like to do, i mean micelium can recover from those holes also you can put more susbtrate in the hole for the surroundings , is more likeli that next flush came in about 2 week latter so is not that destruction is all aboput the energy it put in each flush . don´t love scissor and never will. also scisor aplly some presure and damage the inside of the flesh , i will love to see and experiment of woodlover pick gentle by hand and other with scisor , you have to remenber also that destruction motivate the micelium to produce more, if you let the stem atacch all the conection wil be there ,if you pull or the conection simple the micelium will be estimulated to produce more fruit bodys , is like flowers some how how people over look this thing even you all are experience grower,
do some experiment i´m not telling lies.
Very well said cactu, I pick my mushrooms by hand as well.
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cactu
culture and magic


Registered: 03/06/06
Posts: 3,913
Loc: mexicoelcentrodelconocimi...
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: Jair]
#7610122 - 11/08/07 07:59 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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thank you you are in my list ,i´m trying to change the world
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  cuando una rafaga del pensamiento nos pasa al lado se puede sentir que valio la pena haber vivido, y cuando ese pensamiento se convierte en sueño no paramos de soñar hasta realizarlo
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2859558484
Growery is Better



Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 8,752
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: cactu]
#7610253 - 11/08/07 09:01 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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these look like the ones people find in quebec, another unknown psilocye
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: 2859558484]
#7610363 - 11/08/07 09:52 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Do you have any info on the ones in Quebec?
The one circled in red is the largest of them. It kinda looks like a little blueberry pancake to me. Its 2 1/4 inches across.
as far as i know thats bigger than any caerulipe gets. also there is no ring present,it may have washed off from the weather these mushrooms seemed to be aproaching the later stages of life. the smallest mushrooms were tiny, 1/8 of an inch or less across and sporalating. this is smaller than caerulipe. the stems seem thinner than p.caerulipe.
Of pictures ive seen of p.caerulipe,it doesnt get as blue. could be wrong,anyone got any info?
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Jair
Smeghead



Registered: 06/08/07
Posts: 2,593
Loc: East Coast
Last seen: 5 years, 5 months
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7610410 - 11/08/07 10:04 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
warriorsoul said: Do you have any info on the ones in Quebec?
The one circled in red is the largest of them. It kinda looks like a little blueberry pancake to me. Its 2 1/4 inches across.
as far as i know thats bigger than any caerulipe gets. also there is no ring present,it may have washed off from the weather these mushrooms seemed to be aproaching the later stages of life. the smallest mushrooms were tiny, 1/8 of an inch or less across and sporalating. this is smaller than caerulipe. the stems seem thinner than p.caerulipe.
Of pictures ive seen of p.caerulipe,it doesnt get as blue. could be wrong,anyone got any info?
Yeah, as I said, I don't know too much about them. I do spot some similarities though. Upon further review, however, I do see where they probably aren't.
Maybe I should just stop talking and let the experts decide.
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haymaker
Mr Psychonaut




Registered: 10/26/07
Posts: 1,374
Loc: United Kingdom
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
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psilocybe warrioris?
-------------------- "Make hay while the sun shines" My Trade List
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fliped
The Lost One



Registered: 02/26/03
Posts: 2,879
Loc: Pacific Northwest
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
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Re: New Species of Psilocybe in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7610649 - 11/08/07 11:09 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Some of your mushrooms look identical to the Beaos i find here in the PNW. I just circled a couple that really have the Beao look.

Looks possibly like a little mixed collection.
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The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth


Registered: 08/13/03
Posts: 13,673
Loc: Smokey Mtns. TN
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
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Re: New Species of Psilocybe in Maine? [Re: fliped]
#7610918 - 11/08/07 12:13 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Alot of those woodloving psilocybe genuses all look similar, and theirs probably no doubt they are interspersed throughout the entire region. Perhaps the only reason people discover finds like these is because they are looking.
Those to me look alot like caerulipes, or a variant thereof, but I would love to see some natural photos of these in their habitat. That'd be awesome.
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fliped
The Lost One



Registered: 02/26/03
Posts: 2,879
Loc: Pacific Northwest
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
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Re: New Species of Psilocybe in Maine? [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
#7610925 - 11/08/07 12:15 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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yes habitat pics would be great!!
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jet li
The One


Registered: 07/09/07
Posts: 4,279
Loc: penis double yew
Last seen: 2 months, 11 days
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7611058 - 11/08/07 12:47 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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caerulipes can blue heavily.
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Species of Psilocybe in Maine? [Re: fliped]
#7611652 - 11/08/07 03:18 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Sorry, Habitat pics wont be possible. I only had a short time to grab these. maybe next year.
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Quankus
keep a dreamjournal


Registered: 11/18/04
Posts: 362
Loc: Benicia, CA and Monterey ...
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7611965 - 11/08/07 04:40 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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how could all of that only weigh one ounce? that doesn't add up correctly to me. either way congrats. the first find is always the best. and like others said: scissors or a blade or something other than ripping them out of their home.
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CyanoFriscosa
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: Quankus]
#7612175 - 11/08/07 05:41 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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One ounce dry. the mushrooms are small.
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fliped
The Lost One



Registered: 02/26/03
Posts: 2,879
Loc: Pacific Northwest
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
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Re: New Species of Psilocybe in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7614596 - 11/09/07 10:55 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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you think that was the last of them growing? There was no pins or anything at all?
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mattso
Malcontent



Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 329
Loc: Western WA
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7614630 - 11/09/07 11:02 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
warriorsoul said: Thanks! I'm friggin stoked about this! I feel like i was meant to find these little buggers.
I've been shroom hunting for a long time. This makes it all worth it, and then some.
Makes me smile, you writing this.... I can dig it. Grats, and enjoy.
Also, regarding species... It's important to recognise that, for whatever reason, East coast climate/gorwing conditions are not necessarily favorable to species that are traditionally West coast varieties.
I'd look to European species for an ID on this. You might start with doing a search and find out where Holly is commonly imported from. Mabe UK, maybe France, Germany....
matt,so
-------------------- "Humanity is entering into a time of consequences" --- - Winston Churchill
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mattso
Malcontent



Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 329
Loc: Western WA
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: New Species of Psilocybe in Maine? [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
#7614680 - 11/09/07 11:13 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Just did a tiny research... Holly (Ilex) is VERY commonly imported from Asia. China and Japan.
Hmmm.
-------------------- "Humanity is entering into a time of consequences" --- - Winston Churchill
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gmuralid
Holy Cow



Registered: 08/05/07
Posts: 405
Loc: India
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
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Re: New Species of Psilocybe in Maine? [Re: mattso]
#7614763 - 11/09/07 11:25 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Hey! Just got back from out of town, and THIS is what I miss? Damn. Im never leaving town again.
Sweetness. Congrats on the new find, Im excited for you!
Heheh.
-------------------- Wilderness. It defines me.
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: Quankus]
#7617659 - 11/10/07 05:39 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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scissors suck! This is the correct way to pick mushrooms. leaving a stub will, only rot and attract bacteria to the site.
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avidpicker
funnycolorsinmymushrooms



Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 1,388
Loc: Mushroom Mountain
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Those almost look like the same mushies i found over the summer in Pennsylvania.Nobody could tell me what they were.Good finds
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wikedferret
free man


Registered: 04/08/07
Posts: 487
Loc: wiked wonderland
Last seen: 15 years, 4 months
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if in fact it is a new species you should name it coon im memory of coon T_T <-- sad face
-------------------- lol i just lied to whoever was reading that.....
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LouiseLouise
starstruck



Registered: 11/02/04
Posts: 3,898
Loc: Searching w/my good eye c...
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7621355 - 11/11/07 09:24 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Nice find 
The only time scissors come in handy, imo, is when you're pickin dung lovers, it keeps all that mess out of the gills and they stay clean
-------------------- "That's why you get in close to them, and then take the picture!! Don't be a pussy!" ~CC
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: LouiseLouise]
#7629394 - 11/13/07 08:50 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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hey avidpicker, you got any pic?
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7630592 - 11/13/07 01:29 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Started a karo LC..Its growing..
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bluelou
NUTCASEdrugbucket!


Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 1,086
Loc: $hroom Central
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7631264 - 11/13/07 04:03 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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VERY COOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Never would believe it without pics,but you got some fresh shrooms there and if your in maine THATS REALLY UNIQUE! How freakin far can these mushies travel................................ GET PRINTS and GIVE AWAY!...update on the buzzzzzzzzz!! Thanks...something NEW HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-------------------- Have you tried my(black kow) pile style tek outdoors!!!!!!!!
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avidpicker
funnycolorsinmymushrooms



Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 1,388
Loc: Mushroom Mountain
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: bluelou]
#7631704 - 11/13/07 05:28 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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A few,but they're really shitty, the camera i had was crap. like i said the camera was crap.I found these in the spring.My next find i will post again with better pics.And to you warrior,congrats on the great finds
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BiG_StroOnZ



Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 3,323
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Quote:
Subbedhunter420 said: no the guy said they were DEFINITELY ACTIVE.
I'm blown away. the last 18 months have been out of control in the new species categories. also finding broader habitat ranges. we're finding em everywhere now.
The Age of Aquarius is a surprising one.
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: BiG_StroOnZ]
#7653727 - 11/19/07 07:29 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Transfered LC to wood chips(aspen)..It was only a couple days before i notice the mycelium growth,so it likes the Karo. anybody else growing the real bluefoots? should i put some outside soon or wait for the spring?
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Glacier Creek
The Chef



Registered: 09/23/07
Posts: 384
Loc: PNW
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great find, but RAPE!! RAPE!!!
--------------------
  Google "Earthly Info" to find my mushroom recipes. #1 baby.. yeah... WARNING: All messages posted under this profile are actually algorithmicly generated by an AI computer program. No truth or actual events are being generated, and as a result cannot be investigated for thier validity. (message 2345433)
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Bikerfool
Your Local Edgelord



Registered: 11/21/05
Posts: 1,577
Last seen: 5 months, 13 days
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Seems a little late to be staring an outdoor grow, especially if you're in Maine. The temperature here is barely getting above 40F right now.
-------------------- Just an angsty teen contributing to the pubs decline with contentless posts.
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: Bikerfool]
#7653940 - 11/19/07 09:06 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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rape?
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Cheezit
Feel like aStranger

Registered: 10/19/07
Posts: 843
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7654223 - 11/19/07 11:12 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Nice find. It doesn't surprise me really! It's awesome and amazing! But I bet we will by finding many more new patches as the time goes on..
I have a feeling like many places have been overlooked by the mycologists.
With the creations of new habitats and changing micro climates any thing is possible.
My town for instance has been nothing more then a small industrial town. The only knowledge of mycology in this town was probably passed down by a few people but they only concerned them selfs with a couple mushrooms. The rest were shunned and ignored. The area has been overlooked by open minded mycologists.
I feel that the spread of trade and the creations of new habitat will facilitate the spread and creation of strains and substrains.
Cactu.
I also don't believe in cutting the stems. If the species is rhyzomorphic the stem butts make good spawn.
All the stem butts from that haul could spawn a nice patch for future reference.
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: Cheezit]
#7654791 - 11/19/07 01:35 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Right,mushrooms are adapting to the new human environment. And they seem to like it, especially the magic ones.
-------------------- Some things can grow without the light.--RJD
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tyler_0_durden
Stranger

Registered: 10/28/07
Posts: 1,861
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
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some of those are monstrous. I dare you to eat the entire big clump at the top of the first picture lol...
-------------------- "As a man who has devoted his whole life to the most clear headed science, to the study of matter, I can tell you as a result of my research about atoms this much: There is no matter as such. All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particle of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together. We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent mind. This mind is the matrix of all matter." --Max Planck
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist


Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 48,276
Last seen: 1 hour, 6 minutes
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warriorsoul sent me a sample, here are a few photos.
Cheilocystidia, 400x

Cheilocystidia, 400x

Cheilocystidia, 1000x

Spore, 1000x

Spores, 1000x

Spores, 1000x

Forked cheilocystidia, 1000x

I only spent a couple minutes looking at it so I can't say for sure, but from what I have seen so far, this could be P. caerulipes. It doesn't have the subrhomboid spores of P. ovoideocystidiata.
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BoulderBoomer
Super Tramp



Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 347
Loc: Kanchanaburi Province, Th...
Last seen: 4 years, 16 days
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Couldn't you run a DNA analysis at a lab to confirm whether or not its a new species? I think it costs about $100...
-------------------- "We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of dreams." -Willy Wonka
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Strophariaceae
mycologist



Registered: 02/02/04
Posts: 109
Loc: Marvelous Marin County, C...
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
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Quote:
BoulderBoomer said: Couldn't you run a DNA analysis at a lab to confirm whether or not its a new species? I think it costs about $100...
In a word, no. Paying somebody to do sequencing isn't anywhere near that cheap. And "confirming whether or not its a new species" isn't nearly as easy as "run a sequence and ding!ding!ding!, new species!"
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sleepy
zZzZzZzZz


Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 3,888
Loc:
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? *DELETED* [Re: hoopershroomer]
#7895695 - 01/18/08 12:07 AM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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Post deleted by sleepyReason for deletion: .
Edited by sleepy (01/18/08 12:19 AM)
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BoulderBoomer
Super Tramp



Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 347
Loc: Kanchanaburi Province, Th...
Last seen: 4 years, 16 days
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: sleepy]
#7895810 - 01/18/08 01:12 AM (16 years, 15 days ago) |
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Yeah you're right Stroph, I confused that price with testing for the presence of metals. When sequencing DNA, isn't it possible to compare two samples and determine if they are the same species? I'm generalizing of course, I'm sure the procedure is more complex, but isn't the general idea possible? Assume for a second I'm not a geneticist before tearing me a new one
-------------------- "We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of dreams." -Willy Wonka
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CureCat
Strangest


Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 14,058
Loc: clawing your furniture
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Quote:
BoulderBoomer said: When sequencing DNA, isn't it possible to compare two samples and determine if they are the same species? I'm generalizing of course, I'm sure the procedure is more complex, but isn't the general idea possible?
Your question is really hard to answer because there is no "yes" or "no".
First of, it is possible to compare two samples and determine if they are different species, but not necessarily if they are the same species. The first problem is that you are not going to get a good perspective of the variation within a species by only having one or two collections to compare. The next issue is how closely related are the collections being compared? If you are not able to definitively say whether they are different species, then you have the trouble of deciding if in fact they are the same species, sub-species, strains, or a different species by only a few distinct base pairs.
So I suppose the "general idea" is maybe possible. I mean, like you said, it's way more complex. It would be like trying to mow the lawn with a pair of scissors. It might work. But there are other methods that are used ALONG WITH sequencing, in order to sort one species from another. Gene sequencing is only a tool, not a machine that spits out answers.
--------------------
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Workman
1999 Spore War Veteran



Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 3,598
Loc: Oregon, USA
Last seen: 8 hours, 1 minute
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Quote:
Alan Rockefeller said: warriorsoul sent me a sample, here are a few photos.
I only spent a couple minutes looking at it so I can't say for sure, but from what I have seen so far, this could be P. caerulipes. It doesn't have the subrhomboid spores of P. ovoideocystidiata.
Oh nice! I was hoping it wasn't another P. ovoideocystidia. I will do some careful measuring when I get a sample and see how it measures up. I am pretty excited now!
-------------------- Research funded by the patrons of The Spore Works Exotic Spore Supply My Instagram Reinvesting 25% of Sales Towards Basic Research and Species Identification 
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: Workman]
#7897419 - 01/18/08 01:29 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
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Nice pics!Thanks!what size is the spore? I know it wasnt an ovoid because of the lack of annulus. i think some of the confusion may have to do with the incurved margin, not any other good pictures of it really. but it is part of caerulipes description it is also described as the cap sometimes being very irregular.
Look forward to your findings workman!
-------------------- Some things can grow without the light.--RJD
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cactu
culture and magic


Registered: 03/06/06
Posts: 3,913
Loc: mexicoelcentrodelconocimi...
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7899339 - 01/18/08 09:31 PM (16 years, 14 days ago) |
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that look like a new one great work alan and warrior soul
--------------------
  cuando una rafaga del pensamiento nos pasa al lado se puede sentir que valio la pena haber vivido, y cuando ese pensamiento se convierte en sueño no paramos de soñar hasta realizarlo
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: cactu]
#7900892 - 01/19/08 09:35 AM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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What makes you think that Cactu? it looks like it has the features of caerulipes i guess we will know more when Workman does his measuring.
-------------------- Some things can grow without the light.--RJD
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Workman
1999 Spore War Veteran



Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 3,598
Loc: Oregon, USA
Last seen: 8 hours, 1 minute
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7901506 - 01/19/08 12:39 PM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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I think he meant new, as in new to us instead of new to science.
This still could be Psilocybe quebecensis as some of the spores could be considered mango-shaped but then there should be pleurocystidia. Its too bad there isn't a scale for those photos, but maybe there is something I can do about that.
Ok, check this out. I took the images that Alan did of spores at 1000x of some of the same collections that I have also done at 1000x. By measuring both his images and my own and taking the average I have come up with a crude conversion to get a rough idea of the size of the spores. On average, Alan's images are 3.6 microns larger than my own. So after measuring the spores of the Maine sample and subtracting 3.6 I come up with a size range of 9-14 microns. This could be off by as much as 1 micron (or more) but it gets us in the ballpark.
There are three known bluing psilocybes in the NE US.
Psilocybe ovoideocystidiata (spores rhomboid (7)8-9(12)) Psilocybe caerulipes (spores ellipsoid 7-10 microns) Psilocybe quebecensis (spores ellipsoid-subovoid-mango 8-14(16) microns)
Workman's crude estimate 9-14 microns
I can definately see some mango shaped spores and the spore size appears larger than expected for Psilocybe caerulipes. There is a good chance that this species is actually Psilocybe quebecensis but I won't know for sure until I have a sample in hand.
-------------------- Research funded by the patrons of The Spore Works Exotic Spore Supply My Instagram Reinvesting 25% of Sales Towards Basic Research and Species Identification 
Edited by Workman (01/19/08 05:28 PM)
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: Workman]
#7902873 - 01/19/08 06:32 PM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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Wow! It may be Psilocybe quebecensis,some of the mushrooms are very hemispheric. But where is the pleurocystidia? its very distinctive with their swollen apices. like cubensis and cyanescens also no mention of a forked cheilocystidia with quebecensis.
very interesting this may be a new species after all
i dont know what this means but psilocybe baoeocystis has mango shaped spores 10-12 and pleurocystidia is absent.
i wonder if all the basidia was 4 spored...
-------------------- Some things can grow without the light.--RJD
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Workman
1999 Spore War Veteran



Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 3,598
Loc: Oregon, USA
Last seen: 8 hours, 1 minute
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7903044 - 01/19/08 07:14 PM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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The pleurocystidia might be present but just not photographed. Alan didn't show pleurocystidia on your Pluteus but they exist. And I wouldn't put too much stock in my spore size estimate. It will be interesting to see how close my estimate is to reality though.
-------------------- Research funded by the patrons of The Spore Works Exotic Spore Supply My Instagram Reinvesting 25% of Sales Towards Basic Research and Species Identification 
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Cubie
Moderator




Registered: 01/11/08
Posts: 8,840
Loc: Down the rabbit hole...
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
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Did you take lots of prints? A chilly resistant strain could be valuable to us growers. -not to perverse commercialy- ,......0my hands are out :p
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BaldCuban
scruffy-looking


Registered: 03/29/00
Posts: 337
Loc: here, there, everywhere
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7903986 - 01/19/08 11:05 PM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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Very interesting indeed. Keep up the great work, everyone!
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist


Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 48,276
Last seen: 1 hour, 6 minutes
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: Workman]
#7904168 - 01/20/08 12:07 AM (16 years, 13 days ago) |
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The first two pictures are Panaeolus subbalteatus spores (darker, for size) next to a spore from this collection.


Next we have two basidium pics:


At first I thought these were pleurocystidia, but then I thought they might just be parts of basidium.
I spent a while looking for pleurocystidia and wasn't able to find anything else.


Cheilocystidia, broken away from the gill edge and stained blue.
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Workman
1999 Spore War Veteran



Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 3,598
Loc: Oregon, USA
Last seen: 8 hours, 1 minute
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If those Panaeolus subbalteatus spores are typical in size then my estimate is too high. Those structures are indeed basidia and basidioles and I see nothing pleurocystidia-like. Looks like we are back into the realm of P. caerulipes. I just need to wait until I get a sample in hand.
-------------------- Research funded by the patrons of The Spore Works Exotic Spore Supply My Instagram Reinvesting 25% of Sales Towards Basic Research and Species Identification 
Edited by Workman (01/20/08 11:28 PM)
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kactusking
Stranger
Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 8
Last seen: 16 years, 9 days
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Fuckin cool.
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sleepy
zZzZzZzZz


Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 3,888
Loc:
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Re: New Strain of Psilocybe? [Re: kactusking]
#7915040 - 01/22/08 02:56 PM (16 years, 10 days ago) |
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i dont suppose theres a chance these beauties will grow in the spring?
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Workman
1999 Spore War Veteran



Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 3,598
Loc: Oregon, USA
Last seen: 8 hours, 1 minute
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Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Workman]
#7962948 - 02/01/08 12:08 AM (16 years, 1 day ago) |
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I finally got a sample to examine and its not what I expected. Weird stuff. You might expect to collect known species in the NE like Psilocybe caerulipes or P. quebecensis, but instead recent collections turn out to be other things.
This appears to be a new species in the Section Aztecorum or at the very least a range extension of an existing species. A significant and unusual find worthy of further study.
Spores: ellipsoid to mango shaped (9.2)10-13(14.6) by 5.7-7.3(9.7) microns. Close to my 9-14 micron estimate based on Alan's microscopy.
Compare to: P. baeocystis (8.5)9.5-13.7(17) by (5)5.5-6.6(7.1) P. aztecorum var. bonetti (9)10-13(14) by 6-7.5(8)
Cheilocystidia: 19-31 by 5.3-8.6 microns occasionally bifurcate, very rarely trifurcate.
Compare to: P. baeocystis 20-32(44) by 4.4-6(9) P. aztecorum 20-45 by 5-8.2
Pleurocystidia: absent or very rare. A few bifurcate structures observed that might be pleurocystidia. More observations needed.
Basidia: 26-32 microns.
The mango shaped spores and cap fading whitish on drying seems to indicate a species in the Section Aztecorum.
The lack of common pleurocystidia rules out P. quebecensis.
P. caerulipes also has smaller spores and the cap doesn't fade whitish as seen in the Maine photo.
Psilocybe baeocystis is a good match microscopically but the spores are a bit too wide and that species is only known from the NW coast of the US.
A better match is Psilocybe aztecorum var. bonetii but this species is only known from the high mountains of Central Mexico (elevation 2000-3200 meters). It may be possible that the mountain climate is similar to Maine's climate.
A whole specimen should be sent to Gaston Guzman for examination. I'm sure a paper would soon follow.
-------------------- Research funded by the patrons of The Spore Works Exotic Spore Supply My Instagram Reinvesting 25% of Sales Towards Basic Research and Species Identification 
Edited by Workman (02/01/08 12:45 AM)
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sui
I love you.



Registered: 08/20/04
Posts: 31,853
Loc: Cali, Contra Costa Co.
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Workman]
#7963171 - 02/01/08 01:24 AM (16 years, 1 day ago) |
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Quote:
Workman said: I finally got a sample to examine and its not what I expected. Weird stuff. You might expect to collect known species in the NE like Psilocybe caerulipes or P. quebecensis, but instead recent collections turn out to be other things.
This appears to be a new species in the Section Aztecorum or at the very least a range extension of an existing species. A significant and unusual find worthy of further study.
Spores: ellipsoid to mango shaped (9.2)10-13(14.6) by 5.7-7.3(9.7) microns. Close to my 9-14 micron estimate based on Alan's microscopy.
Compare to: P. baeocystis (8.5)9.5-13.7(17) by (5)5.5-6.6(7.1) P. aztecorum var. bonetti (9)10-13(14) by 6-7.5(8)
Cheilocystidia: 19-31 by 5.3-8.6 microns occasionally bifurcate, very rarely trifurcate.
Compare to: P. baeocystis 20-32(44) by 4.4-6(9) P. aztecorum 20-45 by 5-8.2
Pleurocystidia: absent or very rare. A few bifurcate structures observed that might be pleurocystidia. More observations needed.
Basidia: 26-32 microns.
The mango shaped spores and cap fading whitish on drying seems to indicate a species in the Section Aztecorum.
The lack of common pleurocystidia rules out P. quebecensis.
P. caerulipes also has smaller spores and the cap doesn't fade whitish as seen in the Maine photo.
Psilocybe baeocystis is a good match microscopically but the spores are a bit too wide and that species is only known from the NW coast of the US.
A better match is Psilocybe aztecorum var. bonetii but this species is only known from the high mountains of Central Mexico (elevation 2000-3200 meters). It may be possible that the mountain climate is similar to Maine's climate.
A whole specimen should be sent to Gaston Guzman for examination. I'm sure a paper would soon follow.
WOW!
yet again im amazed. Awesome work workman!!!
-------------------- "There is never a wrong note, bend it." Jimi Hendrix
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casgoodie
weedwright


Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 770
Loc: terra
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: sui]
#7963205 - 02/01/08 01:42 AM (16 years, 1 day ago) |
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congratulations, nice to see a new species
-------------------- TRAPPED IN LINGUISTIC CONCEPTS
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Deity208



Registered: 09/03/07
Posts: 1,763
Loc: 1,762
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: casgoodie]
#7963271 - 02/01/08 02:19 AM (16 years, 1 day ago) |
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Congrats Warrior, thats fuckin rad.
--------------------
It's just like the story of the grasshopper and the octopus. All year long, the grasshopper kept burying acorns for winter, while the octopus mooched off his girlfriend and watched TV. But then the winter came, and the grasshopper died, and the octopus ate all his acorns. Also he got a race car. Is any of this getting through to you?
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cactu
culture and magic


Registered: 03/06/06
Posts: 3,913
Loc: mexicoelcentrodelconocimi...
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Deity208]
#7963849 - 02/01/08 08:29 AM (16 years, 19 hours ago) |
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you see , jaja , sice the begining of this thread i see your mushroooms where special , and the work of alan tell lot of things ,well then wm , define beuty , now only last for guzman to put it in heaven so we can all look at it ,
mexico share many especies with the east side of usa, in fact the last distribution of many species of tree and mushrooms end in mexico , in the valley of central mexico they grow in pinus hartewwiiand abies religiossa forest , aparently var . bonetii have been found in puebla, and there is a record i guees fron veracruz and hidalgo all in the east side of mexico,
when i lookk at your mushrooms they seem very familiar , and the impresion they gave me was of a new species, that i can almost garanty they will, so happy for you , and more and more i believe what jacobo grinberg said distance is a delusion , we are all conected,and we are one...........
all my best vibrations the address of gaston guzman are in the official north west thread and email.
--------------------
  cuando una rafaga del pensamiento nos pasa al lado se puede sentir que valio la pena haber vivido, y cuando ese pensamiento se convierte en sueño no paramos de soñar hasta realizarlo
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: cactu]
#7963998 - 02/01/08 09:14 AM (16 years, 18 hours ago) |
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Thanks Workman! Cactu your words make me smile.
The 1g bioassay showed high activity.
Met Jesus and had a nice talk.
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CureCat
Strangest


Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 14,058
Loc: clawing your furniture
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7964209 - 02/01/08 10:20 AM (16 years, 17 hours ago) |
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I've never met jesus during any of my bioassay experiences.
--------------------
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Subbedhunter420
Solitary Hunter



Registered: 12/30/06
Posts: 1,501
Loc: LA/Ventura County
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: CureCat]
#7964419 - 02/01/08 11:23 AM (16 years, 16 hours ago) |
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Ive never met jesus either.
but i have met myself and talked for a while...
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CureCat
Strangest


Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 14,058
Loc: clawing your furniture
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I have met myself. We didn't talk, we yelled. Mostly in horror.
Not doing that again.
--------------------
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GGreatOne234
Stranger
Registered: 12/23/99
Posts: 8,946
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7964551 - 02/01/08 11:59 AM (16 years, 16 hours ago) |
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Quote:
warriorsoul said:Met Jesus and had a nice talk.
i met the devil once face to face. it was all too real to disregard as just a vivid hallucination.
'seemed like nice enough of a guy, all that he wanted was my soul
it took me a long time to realize that satan does not excist.
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Workman
1999 Spore War Veteran



Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 3,598
Loc: Oregon, USA
Last seen: 8 hours, 1 minute
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: GGreatOne234]
#7964646 - 02/01/08 12:17 PM (16 years, 15 hours ago) |
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Hey GGreatOne234, your guess at this species being Psilocybe baeocystis was real close. It still surprises me that no one can seem to find an authentic P. caerulipes.
-------------------- Research funded by the patrons of The Spore Works Exotic Spore Supply My Instagram Reinvesting 25% of Sales Towards Basic Research and Species Identification 
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CureCat
Strangest


Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 14,058
Loc: clawing your furniture
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Workman]
#7964708 - 02/01/08 12:30 PM (16 years, 15 hours ago) |
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>It still surprises me that no one can seem to find an authentic >P. caerulipes.
Kind of like no one seems to find the real Ps. cyanofibrillosa.
--------------------
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Workman
1999 Spore War Veteran



Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 3,598
Loc: Oregon, USA
Last seen: 8 hours, 1 minute
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: CureCat]
#7964746 - 02/01/08 12:39 PM (16 years, 15 hours ago) |
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Exactly.
-------------------- Research funded by the patrons of The Spore Works Exotic Spore Supply My Instagram Reinvesting 25% of Sales Towards Basic Research and Species Identification 
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Workman]
#7964850 - 02/01/08 01:00 PM (16 years, 15 hours ago) |
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Workman,wasnt mj gonna send you some spores from caerulipes?
Edited by HerbBaker (02/01/08 01:37 PM)
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HerbBaker


Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7967035 - 02/01/08 10:45 PM (16 years, 5 hours ago) |
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It's believed Psilocybe aztecorum var. aztecorum comes from the lower altitude Psilocybe aztecorum var. bonetii Psilocybe baeocystis (PNW) and Psilocybe quebecensis (Quebec) split from Psilocybe aztecorum var. aztecorum (Mexico). It would seem most likely (geographically speaking) that the Maine species would be most closely related to Psilocybe quebecensis. if Psilocybe aztecorum var. bonetti was its closet ancestor it would put it on a different branch from Psilocybe aztecorum var. aztecorum. If its closet relative is Psilocybe quebecensis, what species came first?
the mango shaped spores are actually one of the things that differentiate P.baeocystis and P.quebecensis from Psilocybe aztecorum var.aztecorum.
It seems like this species is somewhere between baeocystis and quebecensis. aztecorum has few pleurocystidia. Unknown species has none that we know of so far. baeocystis has none. quebecensis has plearocystidia.
Edited by HerbBaker (02/02/08 09:53 AM)
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Workman
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7967161 - 02/01/08 11:19 PM (16 years, 4 hours ago) |
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The differences between both varieties of P. aztecorum and P. baeocystis are subtle. Guzman even mentions that the main difference is geographical and the species may be synonymous (page 328 TGP).
One notable feature of the Maine specimen is the occasionally bifurcate cheilocystidia. The majority have a long single neck but the forked ones are not rare. Only the P. baeocystis description mentions bifurcate cheilocystidia.
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HerbBaker


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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Workman]
#7967772 - 02/02/08 07:39 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Workman i got my info here.. Variation, Distribution, Ethnomycological Data and Relationships of Psilocybe aztecorum, a Mexican Hallucinogenic Mushroom Gastón Guzmán Mycologia, Vol. 70, No. 2. (Mar. - Apr., 1978), pp. 385-396.
"Psilocybe baeocystis as I studied in the type (Sipe 754, Nov. 1, 1945 ; MICH) and in many collections made in the Pacific Northwest, is very hygrophanous and, in some stages, quite similar in appearance to P. aztecorum. The only difference found in the Mexican fungus is in the shape of the spores in face view. In fact, the mango form of the spores of P. baeocystis is a good character which can be used to separate it from P. aztecorum.
It is probable that P. aztecorum originated from a subtropical species such as P. mexicana Heim which has the biggest spores of all species in the subtropics, (7.7-)8.8-9.9(-12) x (5.5-)6.6-7.7(-8.2) x 6-7 pm (from the study of the type in PC) and mycenoid fruit bodies, but without a white pileus, some subrhombic spores, and terricolous to sublignicolous habitat. Psilocybe mexicana, on the other hand, seems to have had its origin from tropical terricolous species such as those recently described by the author from evergreen tropical forests, which have small spores and brown cystidia. Thus, it seems that species of Psilocybe have small spores and brown cystidia in the tropics, moderately sized spores and hyaline cystidia in the subtropics and large spores and hyaline cystidia in the temperate or cold regions. This same phylogenetic sequence is observed in the size and complexity of the spores of Scleroderwza (Guzmin, 1970), which show small and simple spores in the tropics, as in S. sinnamariense Mont., and large and complex spores in temperate forests, as in S. hypogacuwz. Thus Psilocybe aztecorum is, in Mexico, one of the most highly evolved species of the genus, and it seems that P. baeocystis and P.quebecensis had their origin from this Mexican species, through two different phylogenetic ways, through the high mountains, Psilocybe cyanescens probably had its origin from some stirp of the subtropical species, close to P. mexicana. From this point of view, P. aztecorum var. bonetii is more primitive because of its smaller spores and presence at lower elevations."
The similarity to baeocystis is interesting. Are all the basidia 4 spored like baeocystis or quebecensis? or are they 1,2,3,and 4 spored like Psilcybe aztecorum?
Maybe this is a third distinct species descended from Psilocybe aztecorum that evolved parallel and seperate to quebecensis with this scenerio the maine species could have an explainable resemblance to Psilocybe baeocystis from its initial split with Psilocybe aztecorum var. aztecorum.
Edited by HerbBaker (02/02/08 10:18 AM)
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Workman
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7969463 - 02/02/08 04:43 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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The Maine species does appear to be intermediate between Psilocybe aztecorum and P. baeocystis. All basidia appeared to be 4 spored.
The phylogeny in that 1978 paper is highly speculative and could easily be completely wrong. But it does highlight the importance of your collection.
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Strophariaceae
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Workman]
#7971434 - 02/03/08 12:25 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I concur on it being somewhere in the P. aztecorum/baeocystis group. Can't comment much beyond that, though, as I have precious little personal experience observing that group beyond a few oddball P. baeocystis collections from Humboldt County.
Another characteristic to look for that might "nail it" in this group – what's the hygrophanous reaction like in fresh collections? As I remember it, P. baeocystis and P. aztecorum have a particularly strong hygrophanous reaction where they fade not just to a tan color like most Psilocybe, but down to an almost off-white color.
I forget whether that's true of all members of section Aztecorum or just P. aztecorum and baeocystis. (I don't have the Guzman monography handy, unfortunately.)
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CureCat
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Quote:
Strophariaceae said: Another characteristic to look for that might "nail it" in this group – what's the hygrophanous reaction like in fresh collections? As I remember it, P. baeocystis and P. aztecorum have a particularly strong hygrophanous reaction where they fade not just to a tan color like most Psilocybe, but down to an almost off-white color.
Quote:
Workman said: The mango shaped spores and cap fading whitish on drying seems to indicate a species in the Section Aztecorum.
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Strophariaceae
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#7972182 - 02/03/08 09:45 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
warriorsoul said: It's believed Psilocybe aztecorum var. aztecorum comes from the lower altitude Psilocybe aztecorum var. bonetii Psilocybe baeocystis (PNW) and Psilocybe quebecensis (Quebec) split from Psilocybe aztecorum var. aztecorum (Mexico). It would seem most likely (geographically speaking) that the Maine species would be most closely related to Psilocybe quebecensis. if Psilocybe aztecorum var. bonetti was its closet ancestor it would put it on a different branch from Psilocybe aztecorum var. aztecorum.
I wouldn't put to much into the concept of "subspecies" in this group. Its not like there's been any solid molecular studies or breeding experiments that would allow one to differentiate "species" from "subspecies" for this group, or, indeed, most other Psilocybe.
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Strophariaceae
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: CureCat]
#7972190 - 02/03/08 09:48 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
CureCat said:
Quote:
Workman said: The mango shaped spores and cap fading whitish on drying seems to indicate a species in the Section Aztecorum.
Is that based on Workman having seen actual fresh collections, or just based on having seen the pics at the beginning of this thread (where its kind of hard to distinguish color)?
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HerbBaker


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i didnt say anything about subspecies. The fading of the caps is real.
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CureCat
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Quote:
Strophariaceae said: Is that based on Workman having seen actual fresh collections, or just based on having seen the pics at the beginning of this thread (where its kind of hard to distinguish color)?
I don't know. I was just pointing out that workman had the same thoughts.
The photos are not hard for me to distinguish. I can see that a lot of those have faded to a very light, almost off-white colour.
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HerbBaker


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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: CureCat]
#7972570 - 02/03/08 11:46 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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oh ok.
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Workman
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I have just seen the pictures and not an actual fresh specimen. I will be attempting to isolate a culture from the gill fragments provided for microscopy. With luck I'll have something to look at next Fall. Until then I have pretty much done all I can do at this time.
I do have a dried PNW P. baeocystis sample somewhere but I have misplaced it for the moment. Once I find it I can do a comparative microscopy.
Quote:
Strophariaceae said:
Quote:
CureCat said:
Quote:
Workman said: The mango shaped spores and cap fading whitish on drying seems to indicate a species in the Section Aztecorum.
Is that based on Workman having seen actual fresh collections, or just based on having seen the pics at the beginning of this thread (where its kind of hard to distinguish color)?
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Strophariaceae
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: CureCat]
#7975656 - 02/03/08 10:15 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
CureCat said: The photos are not hard for me to distinguish. I can see that a lot of those have faded to a very light, almost off-white colour.
I dunno, the thing is, all Psilocybe fade with drying, but the P. aztecorum group does this more than others. Do the photos at the beginning of the thread unambiguously show stronger fading than you'd see on cyans? Maybe they do and maybe they don't – I have a hard time telling from those pics, but your mileage may vary.
Color accuracy is a place where you run up against the limitations of photography (and somebody like Taylor Lockwood or Mike Wood can tell you a lot about the difficulty of getting accurate color in photos), and really subtle color differences, like the ones between faded cyans and faded baeocystis, are something that kind of pushes those limitations. You'd probably be able to see it if you had samples of both in the same photo, but otherwise, not so easy.
Which, in a nutshell, is why it helps to be able to see fresh material.
Kind of a fine point though – those are definitely section Azetecorum-type spores, in any event.
(Colour? You going Brit on us, CureCat )
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CureCat
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I know what you mean about not getting true colour in photos... look at this thread for a perfect example (scroll down for the photo of the mushrooms true colour): http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/7973313#Post7973313
That said, most photos are still fairly accurate. In my experience, the images which deviate a LOT (to the point of not being able to distinguish the yellow/tan colour of the pileus of drying Ps. cyanescens compared to the off-white colour of the mushrooms in question) are fairly detectable, like in the photos in the link above.
To me, the photos of these mushrooms show a much lighter hygrophanous fading. Once this season, I had a patch produce some very pale mushrooms. The mushrooms which had come up 2 weeks before these were normal in colour, but these were noticeably light in colour. They were of the "Friscosa" variety, and I took some comparison photos of two of them next to two Ps. cyanescens with normal colouration. One each of the "Friscosa" and the Ps. cyanescens had completely faded, and you can see the clear difference between the off-white "Friscosa" and the tan-yellow Ps. cyanescens. The other two were in the mid stages of fading completely.


Oh, and I learned to spell on the internet, not so much in school. So I was exposed to different spellings without realizing there was a difference in North American vs. European English. I guess I saw the "-our" more than "-or", or maybe the "-our" just seemed like it made more sense. Whichever it was, by the time I realized that there was a difference (because I kept getting marked down on spelling tests in elementary school, and arguing with the teacher about it), I had gotten into the habit of using the European spelling, and didn't feel the need to make any changes.
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Edited by CureCat (02/04/08 12:07 AM)
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HerbBaker


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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: CureCat]
#7976961 - 02/04/08 09:14 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I'd like to know what parts of guzmans paper are under question, and why.has any of this been cleared up since 1978?
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Workman
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Workman]
#8047755 - 02/20/08 03:15 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Comparison to 2004 Oregon collection.

Spores ellipsoid to mango shaped (9.2)10-12(13.2) x 5.6-7.0 microns. Cheilocystidia occasionally forked. Pleurocystidia extremely rare, only one example observed.
After considering all of the features together and comparing it to the Oregon collection, I am going to have to say that the Maine species is Psilocybe baeocystis. If I had found them on the northwest coast I would have no hesistation in this identification. It is mainly the eastern location that is muddying things. The spores of the Maine material are a bit larger than expected but probably not enough to merit its own distinct species. In my opinion (as a nonprofessional) it is, at most, an eastern variant of P. baeocystis.
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Subbedhunter420
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Workman]
#8048842 - 02/20/08 07:37 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Nice! thats a very awesome find. At least we now know that multiple species are traveling for sure.
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Libertine
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GREAT find and outstanding thread!!! Congratulations. 
And a BIG thanks to everyone involved for the detailed info and the hard work in trying to figure out what these mushrooms are. Gives us NE hunters hope and added reason to get out in the field...great finds lead to great karma. If they are found in November there is a chance they could be found in the early spring. And if not who knows what else might be found growing out there.
-------------------- A mind is a terrible thing to taste...hehehe.
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Cubie
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Quote:
Subbedhunter420 said: Nice! thats a very awesome find. At least we now know that multiple species are traveling for sure.
i was thinking about that this morning while i was walking through the woods. its seems like theres only oysters and some other oyster looking mushrooms around my part of the woods. (it was flakier had orange and reddish stripes across the middle and white on top and bottom) bleh no words are coming to my brain
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HerbBaker



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Cubie]
#8110667 - 03/06/08 11:49 AM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Thanks! John Allen believes this may be a new species still. Are baeos found in clumps? the only pics i could find dont show them growing this way.
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Montanahunter420
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8111218 - 03/06/08 02:19 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
warriorsoul said: Thanks! John Allen believes this may be a new species still. Are baeos found in clumps? the only pics i could find dont show them growing this way.
He is also ape shit crazy. Personally I would value workman's opion over John Allens opion any day. Interesting find and congrats even though it was a while ago.
-------------------- All of my posts are purely fictional and for hypothetical purposes.
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HerbBaker



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Thanks! It isnt about whos opinion i value more... MJ has probably seen more P. baeocystis than anyone on this board. If he tells me they look a little different i listen.
Edited by HerbBaker (03/06/08 02:39 PM)
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Workman
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It is still possible thats it is a new species. I am working with limited information. I hope to produce a fresh specimen this Fall from spores for further examination.
But it is absolutely very closely related to P. baeocystis.
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Subbedhunter420
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Workman]
#8111616 - 03/06/08 03:35 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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would this find be comparable to the friscosa v. cyansescens complex?
like baeocystis v. baeocystis var. Maine? lol
im makin shit up now.
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Libertine
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I hope I am not running afoul of the rules with this question but I have a "general habitat" question.
I saw that you said that they were found along a grass line, slightly elevated from a wet wooded area warriorsoul...which is a great description of the specific habitat. But generally speaking...would you say the water standing or moving? And how would you characterize the overall terrain (swampy, flood plain, forest, lake area, valley, general elevation, etc.)? I am planning to get out within the next month and start searching so any clarification on the larger habitat would be appreciated.
If I did post an out of bounds question(s) I do apologize and I will delete the post if it is deemed to be so...I just thought asking would help any and all of us, in a general sense, planning to go hunting in the northeastern US this year.
-------------------- A mind is a terrible thing to taste...hehehe.
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HerbBaker



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Libertine]
#8183462 - 03/23/08 01:51 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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I still got some spores if any experienced growers wanna give these a shot, pm me.
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eutebius



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8185179 - 03/23/08 10:08 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Howdy all,
Just wanted to send a little holler of hope to you active Maine hunters out there, and to those of you who are simply happy to hear of wide-spread spores. I lived in Maine for the last two years, around the Farmington area, and often found cubensis in cow fields I'd traverse when mountain biking, especially in late summer. They're around.
E
-------------------- Read, with rigorous criticality, hilarity, and with a large soul.
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fliped
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: eutebius]
#8186396 - 03/24/08 09:37 AM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
eutebius said: Howdy all,
Just wanted to send a little holler of hope to you active Maine hunters out there, and to those of you who are simply happy to hear of wide-spread spores. I lived in Maine for the last two years, around the Farmington area, and often found cubensis in cow fields I'd traverse when mountain biking, especially in late summer. They're around.
E
are you saying you are finding cubensis in Maine???
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Subbedhunter420
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: fliped]
#8186410 - 03/24/08 09:40 AM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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Id like to see a picture of that. you would make a very big find if you found cubensis up there. about as big as the psilocybe baeocystis.
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fliped
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i would be very surprized to say the least if he was finding wild cubes in maine...lol
What up subbed!
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Subbedhunter420
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: fliped]
#8186544 - 03/24/08 10:18 AM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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What up Fliped! haha
I got another couple hundred subbs to upload tonight. And I will have another couple hundred to pick on wednesday.
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fliped
The Lost One



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Damn subbed!!! I am jealous...lol its starting to warm up a little bit up here hoping to see some subbs poppin up before too long... Well i am lookin forward to see the pics man....
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eutebius



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Yessir. I hear your skepticism, and I share it, as I'd ruled out cow pastures as a place to go foraging for mushrooms in general. Then, at a barbeque near the beginning of summer, I was talking with another local writer and a biology professor, and the both agreed with flippant grins that, "oh yea, they pop up on patties around the beginning of July, especially with rain." ...I was suprised and doubtful, but a few months later when I was riding with a few other guys, skirting a pasture, I saw pale splotches on patties in the distance. I would've investigated then, but one of my riding buddies was a straight colleague, and, you know. More to the point, I went back a few days later and found about a dozen fairly dried specimens that had pale blue at the stem base; but I didn't have a microscope, and without a positive fresh ID I didn't want to risk anything. Then, after the next rain, I returned to the field and found about a dozen, most with caps about 3-5 inches--enough to fill up my Camelback without getting obliterated. Spore prints were purplish-brown, and there was lots of blueing from the transport. The, er, "bioassay" was positive, though weak at 20g fresh. For whatever reason, they were positively potent at ~3.5 dry (probably because I ate more [grin]).
Considering this, the main lesson I (again) learned was that mushrooms are very adaptive. As any cultivator knows, mycellium suprise you, and will resurge or stall away without warning. Of course, an ecosystem is the best cultivator.
On,
EB
-------------------- Read, with rigorous criticality, hilarity, and with a large soul.
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fliped
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: eutebius]
#8187405 - 03/24/08 01:47 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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well seeing how Psilocybe cubensis does not naturally grow out of the tropical climates i would have to say someone had to introduce the mycelium to the field for it to grow one summer... This would have to be repeated every year for them to keep growing and for it to take hold over a whole pasture would be a very large outdoor grow... Well if what you say is true i would love to see pictures..
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eutebius



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: fliped]
#8187957 - 03/24/08 04:12 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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fliped, I agree--it seemed odd to me too when these older guys told me. One of them is a well-known non-fiction writer from that area--mostly labeled as a "nature writer"--and he said that he'd seen them while growing up there; the biologist laughed and said students often commented on "field trips". So, it just seemed like another instance in which field guides (like Audubon, which is a great guide) report dated consensus information, rather than taking new survey info from reliable sources, like university departments. I'm a rookie when it comes to most psychoactive species, but a cubensis find in ME makes sense if: 1)spores can freeze and thaw unharmed; 2) the right conditions for fruiting arise. Of course, a recent sample given due microscopy would seal it. Any Mainers out there willing to do the field work come August? PM me if you got the wild hare.
E
-------------------- Read, with rigorous criticality, hilarity, and with a large soul.
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Subbedhunter420
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: eutebius]
#8189807 - 03/24/08 11:31 PM (15 years, 10 months ago) |
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That is damn interesting. i got relatives in maine out in the boonies. I better take a fishing trip reeealll soon.
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HerbBaker



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I was just talking to a prominent mycologist that said baeocystis has been found in Connecticut also.
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CureCat
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8440037 - 05/24/08 12:09 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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Who dat??
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negrodamus
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: CureCat]
#8443379 - 05/25/08 12:03 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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those things are crazy man. hell of a find. how cold was it when you found these? maine in november, damn.........
-------------------- "Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffin glue"
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Libertine
Tarzan...King of Mars



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8444418 - 05/25/08 06:40 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
warriorsoul said: I was just talking to a prominent mycologist that said baeocystis has been found in Connecticut also.
Connecticut? Really? Wow, very cool... 
-------------------- A mind is a terrible thing to taste...hehehe.
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HerbBaker



Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: negrodamus]
#8446179 - 05/26/08 08:27 AM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
negrodamus said: those things are crazy man. hell of a find. how cold was it when you found these? maine in november, damn.........
I think it was in the mid to upper 30's at night, but we had some unusually warm weather the week before. Anyone know of a site to get old weather info?
I'm still waiting to here back from the mycologist i spoke with and i'm hesitant about saying his name until he gets back to me. I'm waiting to find out if there are any herbarium deposits made and and other details of the find.
If i had to make a case for it being a new species i would point out the difference in macro and the size difference in the spores. If Guzman separates subcubensis from cubensis by just the spore size, then a good case could be made here.
Psilocybe baeocystis already covers a wide size range, so to see a similiar type with even larger spore is curious, the spores of this eastern type aren't just bigger they are disproportionately wider compared to the length. this makes the shape different not just the overall size.
Also they did not blue when handled, baeos blue intensely within minutes.
The blue caps is what i first noticed when i found them, but it never increased from handling.
How does subbaeocystis sound?
Edited by HerbBaker (05/26/08 08:54 AM)
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HerbBaker



Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8455365 - 05/28/08 01:24 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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this was the response i got from Paul Stamets office.. Kinda lame..
Please read the statement from Paul below. Sorry I can't b of more help on your inquiry. I signed a company contract that prohibits me from addressing this kind of inquiry.. Jim Gouin Fungi Perfecti LLC Thank you for writing. Unfortunately, your request concerns a subject of great legal sensitivity. For our international customers or anyone who may not be aware of it, the cultivation or possession of mushrooms containing psilocybin or psilocin is illegal in the United States. Fungi Perfecti does not sell spores or cultures of any psychoactive mushroom, even though laws concerning these mushrooms may be more lenient in your locale. We can not answer any questions on the cultivation of Psilocybe or any mushroom containing psilocybin, psilocin or any other psychoactive compound. My employees sign contracts at the time of employment which state they will be fired (and have been!) for merely a suggestion on the manner of cultivation of these illegal mushrooms. My employees are not being rude; they are simply following strict company policy. They are doing their job. My work with Psilocybe mushrooms was covered under a Drug Enforcement Administration license. I have published new species in the scientific literature which legitimizes my research. Our business services the gourmet & medicinal mushroom market, a market which I believe is far more lucrative and important. Occasionally, those with Drug Enforcement Administration Licenses call me concerning availability of spores or cultures. I can make referrals to these individuals, only if they provide me with their DEA PBO license. Otherwise, on the advice of counsel, my hands are tied. Thank you for contacting us; I hope you will respect our position. Paul Stamets
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist


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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8455484 - 05/28/08 01:56 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Anyone know of a site to get old weather info?
http://weather.com shows the previous months recorded weather including how much precipitation fell, this months weather, and next months average weather. It also has live doppler radar maps so you can see exactly which areas are cloudy at any particular time.
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Subbedhunter420
Solitary Hunter



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Well paul stamets is a big figure in the mycological community. Im sure he wouldnt risk his credentials or license for these things. Too bad tho. Government and religion always gets in the way of scientific inquiry.
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HerbBaker



Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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The mycelium is very thin. I thought i had a contam for while doing the agar work, but after repeatably getting the same fuzz from the spores, i'm convinced this is how it is suppose to look.
Should have some good pics and prints this fall.

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sleepy
zZzZzZzZz


Registered: 01/17/05
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8506433 - 06/10/08 06:57 AM (15 years, 7 months ago) |
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do you know what type of wood chips they grow on?
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Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8506444 - 06/10/08 07:08 AM (15 years, 7 months ago) |
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Good work! And GREAT thread!
--------------------
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HerbBaker



Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8506609 - 06/10/08 09:05 AM (15 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
My work with Psilocybe mushrooms was covered under a Drug Enforcement Administration license. I have published new species in the scientific literature which legitimizes my research. Paul Stamets
So if someone can get a new species published it will legitimize the research.. seems like a catch twenty-two. Does one get the DEA license before or after? anyone have info on how this works?
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fliped
The Lost One



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8506997 - 06/10/08 11:09 AM (15 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
warriorsoul said: The mycelium is very thin. I thought i had a contam for while doing the agar work, but after repeatably getting the same fuzz from the spores, i'm convinced this is how it is suppose to look.
Should have some good pics and prints this fall.

hmmm, they look alot like the psilocybe beaocytis i pick in WA.

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HerbBaker



Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: fliped]
#8507281 - 06/10/08 12:47 PM (15 years, 7 months ago) |
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Nice pics, they certainly do look the same.
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fliped
The Lost One



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#8507301 - 06/10/08 12:55 PM (15 years, 7 months ago) |
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it could be something else since i have never heard of them growing in Maine... but we have about the same climate from WA to Maine... seems posible to me
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HerbBaker



Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: fliped]
#9478433 - 12/22/08 01:57 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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I figured this would be a good place to put this. hard to believe, but this thread was my first post at the Shoomery.. You've come a long way babeo 
(ANE) baeocystis (9.2)10 - 13(14.6) x 5.7 - 7.3(9.7) (PNW) baeocystis (8.5)9.5 - 13.7(17) x (5)5.5 - 6.6(7.1) Heim 1966 baeo 11.6 - 13.3(16.6x 6.8 - 7.6(10.8) P. aztecorum (10.4)12 - 14.0(17) x (6)6.6 - 7.7(8.8) var. bonetti (9)10 - 13.0(14)x 6.0 - 7.5(8.0)
Combined (8.5)9.5 - 14.0(17) x (5)5.5 - 7.7(10.8)
The only thing that has kept Psilocybe aztecorum var. bonetti seperate from P. aztecorum in tha past is the spore size, they are macroscopically indistinguishable from one another.
Compared to Roger Heim's 1966 British Columbia collection info, the Atlantic Northeast(ANE) species is well within the range of Pacific Northwest(PNW) Psilocybe baeocystis. At the same time, this info also puts P. aztecorum var. bonetti within these updated spore dimensions!
The large variance in spore size with this species, can likely be attributed to the varying number of sterigmata on the basidium. 1, 2 and 3-spored basidia will produce larger spores on average than 4-spored basidia.
Psilocybe aztecorum (Mexico)

Psilocybe baeocystis (PNW)

Psilocybe baeocystis (ANE)Atlantic Northeast

Psilocybe baeocystis (PNW)

Psilocybe aztecorum (Mexico)

This information helps confirm that they are all one species. Psilocybe baeocystis 1945 A breeding study should confirm this.
Can i have my cookie now?
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psilophile82
stilltrillchillpill>realdeal



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#9478501 - 12/22/08 02:10 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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WOW! that's all I can say.......
--------------------
  "chaos is the nature of order"
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Bobzimmer
Crawlin' Kingsnake



Registered: 09/07/08
Posts: 8,696
Loc: NY
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: psilophile82]
#9478727 - 12/22/08 03:02 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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This has been one of my favorite threads since I got here. Awesome! Don't have a cookie...how about a shroom!
-------------------- Mr. Mushrooms said: I will confess something that should be quite obvious, CC. I love mushrooms, i.e. fungi. I really do. I am talking about a strong feeling, i.e. emotion, for them. I think they are beautiful. I even dream of them.
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weiliiiiiii
Stranger


Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 9,711
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Bobzimmer]
#9479203 - 12/22/08 04:56 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Bobzimmer said: This has been one of my favorite threads since I got here. Awesome! Don't have a cookie...how about a shroom!
NO A COOKIE, ITS CHRISTMAS GET IN THE SPIRIT MAN
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HerbBaker



Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: weiliiiiiii]
#9479283 - 12/22/08 05:18 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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mmmmm mushroom cookies.

-------------------- Some things can grow without the light.--RJD
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weiliiiiiii
Stranger


Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 9,711
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#9479393 - 12/22/08 05:38 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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now thats what im talking about
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Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector


Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 13,018
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#9480002 - 12/22/08 08:01 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
This information helps confirm that they are all one species.
Depending on where one draws the line. I'm not a splitter or a lumper; I'm a splumper. Morphologically, yes, they seem like they might be the same species.
Quote:
A breeding study should confirm this.
Then, and only then, will be know for sure if you're a BCS person.
Nice work on the thread. I'd say you've come a long way. Then again, how would I know? Maybe you were always this good.
--------------------
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HerbBaker



Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
#9482837 - 12/23/08 11:49 AM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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Thanks senor, i now know what serendipity feels like.
Although P. baeocystis was fist discovered in 1945, it wasnt published till 1958, a year later than P. aztecorum.
Thanks for confirming that for me Alan.
P. aztecorum in Maine, indeed.
Flesh of the Gods.
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Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector


Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 13,018
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#9483120 - 12/23/08 12:44 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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I know we don't use common names when deciding "official" names, but if my memory of history serves me right, Teonanacatl was the first published name.
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Dreamster1
Old School



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#9560031 - 01/06/09 07:56 PM (15 years, 25 days ago) |
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This is just AWESOME! Flesh of the gods in Maine! I am in New Hampshire, will keep an eye out next fall!
How did your propagation trial go?
GREAT work
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phishhead
down to fragglerock...



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Posts: 1,733
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Dreamster1]
#9569428 - 01/08/09 07:42 AM (15 years, 23 days ago) |
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yeah how did your propogation work out? And workman did you get anything going? Would love to see some more of those guys. Was that one flush all you found there warrior?
-------------------- "Moderation is the key to life..."
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Workman
1999 Spore War Veteran



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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: phishhead]
#9569961 - 01/08/09 10:18 AM (15 years, 23 days ago) |
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Unfortunately I haven't gotten to it yet, but its on my list. I am hoping to start several temperate species in the next few weeks as time allows. I'll make entries into my journal as things progress.
-------------------- Research funded by the patrons of The Spore Works Exotic Spore Supply My Instagram Reinvesting 25% of Sales Towards Basic Research and Species Identification 
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HerbBaker



Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 2,506
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: Workman]
#9758903 - 02/08/09 05:07 AM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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This is what is published by Guzman in the description of P. baeocystis in the Genus Psilocybe. (1983)
"The main difference seems to be geographical distribution. Maybe, P. baeocystis is a merely synonymous of P. aztecorum"
Hopefully Cactu will have some luck finding some specimens of aztecorum.
-------------------- Some things can grow without the light.--RJD
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sleepy
zZzZzZzZz


Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 3,888
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#9760770 - 02/08/09 02:57 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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were any more examples found this past fall?
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inski
Cortinariologist



Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5,720
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#9762141 - 02/08/09 07:04 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Hi warriorsoul, I was just wondering, is the mycelium from your mushrooms similar to this?
 This is a multi spore inoculation on a mixture of sterilized sawdust and rye grass seed from this collectionSect. Aztecorum. inski.
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BlimeyGrimey
Collector of Spores




Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 3,788
Loc: Puget Sound
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: inski]
#9781165 - 02/11/09 09:24 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Inski, Those pictures look very similar to my current baeocystis culture on barley grain.
The Maine collection resembles my baeo finds very closely.
-------------------- Message me for free microscopy services on Psilocybe, Panaeolus, and Gymnopilus species. Looking for wild Panaeolus cinctulus and Panaeolus olivaceus prints.
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inski
Cortinariologist



Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5,720
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: BlimeyGrimey]
#9781324 - 02/11/09 09:49 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Hmm, interesting! Does the mycelium change as it grows from finely linear to slightly rhizomorphic? I will make some new pictures soon, this mycelium is extremely fast growing, the container is 250ml and it is 80% colonised after 11 days at around 26 degrees celsius! I do suspect this species to be closely related to Psilocybe baeocystis. It would be good to see your culture for comparison, how fast is it growing on barley and at what temperatures. I forgot to mention the sawdust used is aged Pinus radiata soaked over night then rinsed off with hot water, mixed in a 4-1 ratio with soaked rye grass seed, there's a pinch of calcium carbonate added also. inski.
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BlimeyGrimey
Collector of Spores




Registered: 08/24/05
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: inski]
#9781839 - 02/11/09 11:05 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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My baeo culture seemed to do fine on malt agar but it slowed down when it was placed into the barley. I keep all my colonizing jars at room temp (about 70f).
So far the growth is linear only. I'll take pics of mine in a week once the mycelium has spread out enough to show its growth pattern.
The aged Pinus wood you are using is a good idea. I've noticed that baeos don't growing from fresh wood. They tend to like the older decayed wood. I've been thinking of trying a grass seed and composted douglas fir sawdust mix.
-------------------- Message me for free microscopy services on Psilocybe, Panaeolus, and Gymnopilus species. Looking for wild Panaeolus cinctulus and Panaeolus olivaceus prints.
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inski
Cortinariologist



Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5,720
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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: BlimeyGrimey]
#9781899 - 02/11/09 11:12 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Yes, this species also prefers decomposed wood, I don't know what made me experiment with the rye grass seed mixture, I have made a post in Mushroom grow logs and pictures with some images! inski.
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Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector


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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: inski]
#9789491 - 02/13/09 08:13 AM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Creativity is the backbone of hypotheses.
--------------------
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist


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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: inski]
#11281761 - 10/20/09 12:51 AM (14 years, 3 months ago) |
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They are growing. (from gill fragments, which are visible)

With P. cyanescens (todays finds) in the background

I just put this dish into a mycobag of wild bird seed. Hope it doesn't contaminate, those gills could not have been sterile. But I don't see anything else growing...
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Joeisthevolcano
Myconaut



Registered: 09/15/09
Posts: 300
Loc: Seattle, Wa, USA
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wow. that is awesome!!! glad to see theyre back! happy huntings!
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German Kahuna
Facepalmer of Stoopid


Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 15,798
Loc: On a Chemical Vacation
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Looks like clean culture. I usually do at least one transfer, though, just to make sure. Oh, and nice haul there.
-------------------- "Vegetarian" [ /ˌvedʒəˈteəriən/] - Ancient slang meaning "village idiot who can't hunt, fish or ride".
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Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector


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Nice culture. Proper pH could knock down the bacteria. It is surprising that there doesn't seem to be any other contaminant mycelium growing with that many fragments. Like GK said, I would do a transfer or two if for no other reason than to see if it differentiates. The morphology seems slightly different from other baeos I have seen.
--------------------
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist

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Re: Psilocybe aztecorum in Maine? [Re: HerbBaker]
#28311776 - 05/08/23 06:19 PM (8 months, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
HerbBaker said: I was just talking to a prominent mycologist that said baeocystis has been found in Connecticut also.
Can confirm, I just got a DNA sequence back from https://www.inaturalist.org/observations/138564397, which is just south of Willington, Connecticut. 100% match for Psilocybe baeocystis.
I also have been sent samples of DNA verified P. baeocystis from Cape Cod, Massachusetts, Manchester, New Hampshire and eastern North Carolina.
My guess is that this find from Maine is also P. baeocystis due to the mango shaped spores in https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/7895201#7895201.
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3way_beef
Registered: 01/15/22
Posts: 31
Loc: downeast
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Psilocybe baeocystis is listed on the Maine mycological association species index, and I believe I read from a local mycologist that he found this species when visiting a property for sale where the developer had chipped all the trees in site
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