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OfflineVisionary Tools
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Registered: 06/23/07
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Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist?
    #7597417 - 11/05/07 05:28 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

See how they turn on each other, when they need scapegoats for token appeasement. So it's all Rumsfeld's fault! Hate him! He's your Emanuel Goldstein.

Memos Prove Rumsfeld Directed Psychological Terror Campaign
Hyping climate of fear, threat of violence to achieve political objectives is the very definition of terrorism

New Pentagon memos released by the Washington Post prove that ex-U.S. defense secretary Donald Rumsfeld directed a psychological campaign of terror in order to achieve political objectives, making Rumsfeld himself a terrorist according to the very definition of the term.

"Donald Rumsfeld, the former United States defence secretary, tried to maintain an atmosphere of fear in America as part of the Iraq war propaganda campaign, a series of leaked memos has shown," reports the London Telegraph.

In an April 2006 memo, Rumsfeld encouraged Pentagon officials to "Keep elevating the threat" and "Talk about Somalia, the Philippines etc. Make the American people realise they are surrounded in the world by violent extremists".

(Article continues below)

Rumsfeld also urged his staff to concoct "bumper sticker statements" (mindless clichés) in an attempt to garner continued support for the occupation of Iraq.

In the most telling e mail, the former defense secretary ordered the Pentagon to "link Iraq to Iran," heralding the birth of the now saturated propaganda talking point that Iran is fueling the violence in Iraq and helping to kill U.S. troops, despite the fact that British officials patrolling the Iran-Iraq border admit that there is "No concrete proof that Iran is supplying Iraq."

Rumsfeld's obsession with micro-managing every aspect of the propaganda offensive upon the American people led to him disseminating anything up to 60 "snowflakes" or memos every single day, much to the chagrin of Pentagon employees.

His insistence that an artificial climate of fear be maintained in America about the threat of new terror attacks in order to sell the unpopular war in Iraq are the smoking gun for criminal charges to be initiated.

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By several of the very definitions of terrorism, Rumsfeld has provably engaged in terrorism, by hyping the threat of terror to achieve a political objective.

Definitions of terrorism

- A psychological strategy of war for gaining political ends by deliberately creating a well-founded climate of fear among the civilian population.

- The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence against people or property to coerce or intimidate governments or societies.

- The systematic use of terror, the deliberate creation and exploitation of fear for bringing about political change.

- The use of - or threatened use of - criminal violence against civilians or civilian infrastructure to achieve political ends through fear and intimidation, rather than direct confrontation.

- The calculated use of violence (or threat of violence) against civilians in order to attain goals that are political or religious or ideological in nature; this is done through intimidation or coercion or instilling fear.

Under any of the definitions of terrorism listed above, Rumsfeld has demonstrably engaged in terror by artificially hyping the fear of new attacks as part of a strategy to achieve a political objective.


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: Visionary Tools]
    #7597570 - 11/05/07 07:33 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

this is hillarious...

But how people are afraid of terrorism is beyond me. We had more people die of the flu in 2001 than in the WTC in america, and the other years... yeah, enough said.


People get the government they deserve... when they're willing to elect assholes to protect us from far more remote threats than can be prevented by an eight dollar flu shots, they reap the consequences


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: johnm214]
    #7597630 - 11/05/07 08:09 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

johnm214 said:
People get the government they deserve... when they're willing to elect assholes to protect us from far more remote threats than can be prevented by an eight dollar flu shots, they reap the consequences




Seems overly simplistic to me. :yawn:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #7598170 - 11/05/07 11:42 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

in what way?

I'm just talking about prioritizing risk. Why worry about remote possibilities when we're dying from very real ones at a higher rate?

Not to discount the economic effect of heuristic public histeria, but seriously... I've never seen a terrorist, yet I've been harassed by the police plenty (car searched, et cet). Just saying we have bigger threats out there, and our overreliance on remote fears hurts us in other ways.


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OfflineVisionary Tools
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: johnm214]
    #7598239 - 11/05/07 12:06 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

johnm214 said:
this is hillarious...

But how people are afraid of terrorism is beyond me. We had more people die of the flu in 2001 than in the WTC in america, and the other years... yeah, enough said.


People get the government they deserve... when they're willing to elect assholes to protect us from far more remote threats than can be prevented by an eight dollar flu shots, they reap the consequences




Correction, yanks get the government Diebold wants! And here, we get the cream of the arseholes that all promise the same thing, and deliver nothing.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: Visionary Tools]
    #7598384 - 11/05/07 12:45 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

johnm214 said:
in what way?




The thought that the way people vote determines that they deserve every single consequence that comes from the decisions of those who represent them. Elections might have something to do with how individuals choose to vote, but how politicians act has everything to do with the interests that they stand for, which often can seem to have little to do with these individuals and what they wish to see happen.

The further power is centralized away from the sovereignity of every person, the less the government represents the people. The political system and the ways that actions occur is far too complex to make a general assertion that the people deserve the government they get. In an ideal sense, it is true, but the harsh reality is that it isn't. The last presidental election was called so closely, with Al Gore actually winning the popular vote, and, quite presumably, we would not be in Iraq as we are today, nor would be on the brink of war with Iran, for absolutely no justification beyond secret interests. But, then, who knows how Al Gore and his administration would have acted in place of Bush, or how the rest of the course of reality would have occured if he had won. :shrug:

So, like I said, overly simplistic. I wasn't referring to your statements concerning how miniscule the threat of terrorism is in terms of death count. Terrorism's effects do not really lie there, anyways. Terrorism destabilizes society. The attack on the World Trade Center had little to do with the amount of death, less to do with symbolism, and everything to do with taking out a nexus point of the United States' economy. Considering that the Pentagon was attacked as well (fortunately, the Pentagon is not a skyscraper :hehehe:), this makes perfect sense.

I, however, feel that terrorism is successfully countered by alleviating its source, which would seem to be oppression. The United States found guerilla tactics to be successful agansit the British. A terrorist's response to empire, sneaking into the heart of the beast in order to disrupt its heart, is misguided as Bush seeking to proliferate democracy by lopping off the head of the Hydra. Ten more grow back. Now the empire tries to control its people to prevent further acts to destabilize it, which is an act that, in itself, destabilizes the empire, as it obstructs the sovereignity of every individual, which subsequently limits the free market, which is the source of the empire's vitality.

Democracy exists in the free marketplace. It lies within symbiotic relationships that benefit both. Diplomacy and economic incentives are far more effective to counter terrorism than threats and control, quite possibly because they alleviate the source of terrorism instead of aggravating the sore spot. After all, this is the same planet, and we are one species. :earth:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #7598860 - 11/05/07 03:10 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I personally agree.

You can make an argument that the current state of politics prevents us from
having people that truly represent us, but the fact that citizens have allowed
it to get that far is also their own fault.

It ultimately boils down to the population's willingness to remain educated on
important matters and to perform their civic duties.

The nation has largely failed on both points and so the power in our republic
has been allowed to drift further and further from us.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #7603002 - 11/06/07 02:42 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:


I, however, feel that terrorism is successfully countered by alleviating its source, which would seem to be oppression.




The current practitioners of the vast majority of international terrorist acts are the most oppressive people on the planet. Please remove your head from whence it is stuck.


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7604731 - 11/06/07 09:11 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

zappa is right, but the difference is who they feel oppressed by.

The radical islamists claim to feel oppressed by the US, perhaps in some ways correctly due to UN and US interference... They want to oppress others, not themselves, since they make the proposed rules.


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Offlinea_guy_named_ai
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #7605011 - 11/06/07 10:11 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:


The attack on the World Trade Center had little to do with the amount of death, less to do with symbolism, and everything to do with taking out a nexus point of the United States' economy.




I have to absolutely disagree with this, for obvious reasons. Terrorism is not a means of warfare to defeat the enemy in direct combat. Terrorism is a form of ultimately psychological warfare to scare people into submission. I cannot see how any intelligent person with the intent to hurt America or beat everyone into submission would spend so much energy in attacking the wtc. It is not like America can't run without the buildings. Really, they're hardly necessary at all. Our economy being hurt had nothing to do with the wtc building. It had to do with psychological warfare. It was absolutely symbolic, and it was meant to be.

But as far as Rumsfeld, and cheney..just scapegoats, really. They arn't the only people by far, and I think when things like this happened I have to point the finger at the American people and ask, what did you expect? The general populace may not have as much information as a cia director, but every single person has the responsiblity for every single vote he makes, to research and be educated and not be deceived by crooked politicians.


Edited by jonathan_206 (11/07/07 11:12 AM)


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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
    #7605334 - 11/06/07 11:56 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Ummmm Attacking the WTC centers, a place where goldmansachs and all these high level accounting firms and brokers did business being completely symbolic is a load of bologna. It was a direct attack on american business and what it represents, the one into the pentagon was just a "fuck you" to the military, who knows where the 4th plane was heading.

If the terrorists were to strike something completely symbolic, or some social systempunkte, why not attack the Statue of Liberty or Washington Monument?


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OfflineVisionary Tools
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
    #7605774 - 11/07/07 07:07 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

The_Red_Crayon said:
Ummmm Attacking the WTC centers, a place where goldmansachs and all these high level accounting firms and brokers did business being completely symbolic is a load of bologna. It was a direct attack on american business and what it represents, the one into the pentagon was just a "fuck you" to the military, who knows where the 4th plane was heading.

If the terrorists were to strike something completely symbolic, or some social systempunkte, why not attack the Statue of Liberty or Washington Monument?




Larry Silverstein didn't take out a massive insurance policy on those landmarks a week prior to the attacks. It would have been very inconsiderate of the terrorists to bomb those.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: Visionary Tools]
    #7606099 - 11/07/07 09:40 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Visionary Tools said:

Larry Silverstein didn't take out a massive insurance policy on those landmarks a week prior to the attacks. It would have been very inconsiderate of the terrorists to bomb those.




This bullshit again?


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Offlinea_guy_named_ai
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
    #7606459 - 11/07/07 11:13 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

If the terrorists were to strike something completely symbolic, or some social systempunkte, why not attack the Statue of Liberty or Washington Monument?




How would this instill terror into the american people? It doesn't.


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
    #7607032 - 11/07/07 01:36 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

The_Red_Crayon said:
who knows where the 4th plane was heading.





I think most people know where it was going


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: BrAiN]
    #7607520 - 11/07/07 03:52 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

your mom's butt?


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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


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InvisibleLuddite
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Re: Shock Horrror! Rumsfeld a terrorist? [Re: BrAiN]
    #7607532 - 11/07/07 03:56 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

http://www.masada2000.org/

http://www.masada2000.org/islam.html

http://www.jihadchat.com/index.php?act=idx

http://www.apostatesofislam.com

http://www.faithfreedom.org

http://www.faithfreedom.org/forum/index.php

http://www.unitedamericancommittee.org/

http://www.activistchat.com/phpBB2/index.php

http://www.activistchat.com

http://islam-watch.org/CommunityServer/forums/default.aspx

http://islam-watch.org


http://www.justifythis.blogspot.com/

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2829059.stm

http://www.islam-watch.org/

http://www.homestead.com/prosites-prs/

http://tinyurl.com/23porv

http://www.shoaheducation.com/muslimnazi.html

http://www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com/gallery/

http://www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com/gallery/pages/6-Mein%20Kampf_jpg_jpg_jpg.htm

http://www.papillonsartpalace.com/moslem.htm

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

http://atheism.about.com/cs/islamandviolence/

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/asiapcf/southeast/08/17/martyr.culture/index.html

http://muslim-quotes.netfirms.com/jihad.html

http://www.domini.org/openbook/home.htm

http://www.persecution.org

http://frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=9583

http://www.danielpipes.org/

http://www.angelfire.com/hi5/kafirdomunity/action.htm

http://www.geocities.com/khola_mon/BTaliban/Bangla_Taliban_Photos.html

http://www.bwoi.cjb.net

http://www.chechentruth.cjb.net/

http://www.anti-cair-net.org/

http://www.arabsforisrael.com

http://www.rotter.net/israel/

http://www.geocities.com/khola_mon/Islam.html

http://www.geocities.com/milkmandan2003/TalibanOnline1.html

http://www.truthtree.com/Debating/posts/755.html

http://www.isralert.com/archives/2005/03/deceit_thy_name.php

http://www.factsandlogic.org

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d191/zakirnaik/zakicaptured.gif

http://www.islamicthinkers.com/index/images/SHIAS_NO_MUSLIM.jpg

http://www.prophetofdoom.net/

http://www.venusproject.com/prophet_of_doom/toc.html

http://www.venusproject.com/prophet_of_doom/quotes1.html#terrorism

http://www.pmw.org.il/

http://tinyurl.com/ydc9qj




According to these links the Quran has been changed over time.

http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-myths-koran-manuscripts.htm

http://www.al-islam.org/encyclopedia/chapter8/3.html

http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Text/

http://www.jodkowski.pl/re/MBright.html

http://cremesti.com/amalid/Islam/Yemeni_Ancient_Koranic_Texts.htm

---------

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles.php?article_id=5197

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles.php?article_id=5237

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles.php?article_id=5258


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