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Offlineg00ru
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"Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" *DELETED*
    #7582067 - 10/31/07 07:16 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by guruu

Reason for deletion: fdas



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Invisibledespisedicon
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: g00ru]
    #7582073 - 10/31/07 07:20 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I'm schizophrenic too and we trip all the time.


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: despisedicon]
    #7582080 - 10/31/07 07:22 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

despisedicon said:
I'm schizophrenic too and we trip all the time.




:rolleyes:


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OfflineLedHead
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: g00ru]
    #7582090 - 10/31/07 07:26 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

if it hasnt happend yet probably not. if its not in your genes its not in your genes. my grandma had schizo and i used to get kinda nervous when i tripped i.e. o man i hope ill come down after this. after tripping about 100 times now im pretty sure im good to go but you never know man.


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InvisibleMoo456
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: g00ru]
    #7582093 - 10/31/07 07:27 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah I think it has a lot to do with how much a person lets experiences impact them.

But no, just because it hasn't done something bad doesn't mean it wont. The more often you introduce the alien endorphins, the more changes that will occur in your brain. Having those type of signals too often will cause your brain to write too much irrelevent information making it harder to function in the world.

This may be opinion, but i think LSD and LSA are the worst when it comes to long term effects, so dont use those too often.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Moo456]
    #7582141 - 10/31/07 07:42 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I kind of agree with Moo here, I think a greater liklihood accompanies LSD as opposed to shrooms.

I think it all depends upon the user, not their family.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: g00ru]
    #7582183 - 10/31/07 07:53 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

guruu said:I realize there is a chance of course, and that I should always take extreme caution (set and setting, etc.) but if it hasn't already happened, is there a pretty good chance that it never will?



Well, the fact you've had many psychedelic experiences but have never manifested symptoms of schizophrenia as a result is a big plus. On the other hand it's important to remember that schizophrenia in most cases manifests itself during the teens and twenties, so statistically you're still at an increased risk simply by virtue of your age and your lineage. If you want to continue to use hallucinogens I can't think of any good reason to stop; just keep using them "responsibly" (by which I mean don't trip after sleep deprivation, ginormous doses, etc..) and if you should experience any noticeable symptoms of schizophrenia/psychosis treat them with the utmost concern. (And obviously stay far away from drugs with a reputation for inducing psychosis such as methamphetamine.)


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Land_Crab]
    #7582214 - 10/31/07 08:02 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Lsd's been nothing but nice to me, but then again, my strongest dose was 1.5 hits and it came close to my "sweet spot." While I was enjoying it, I remember thinking 2 would have been perfect... I have generalized/social anxiety issues but this apparently doesn't effect the trip in a negative way... From what I've heard, I'd be more careful with psilocybin because it supposedly knows exactly what buttons to push when, to make you beg for mercy when you're getting a little too cocky and least expecting it... I never experienced this with lsd and hope never will. Having said that, it might be necessary at times to bring you back down and let you know who's boss or if what you're after is troubleshooting and unearthing problems that you want to resolve in your life and things of that sort...


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Offlinex2and2makes5
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Land_Crab]
    #7582216 - 10/31/07 08:03 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

my brother is schizto, however he's only my half brother. thought i do still worry about that seeing as i have yet to take my first mushroom trip. His symptoms began to surface long before he took shrooms though, back when he was only smoking pot. I find myself to be far more sound mentally than he was.


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Edited by x2and2makes5 (03/19/09 05:03 PM)


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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: x2and2makes5]
    #7582234 - 10/31/07 08:07 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I've tripped on acid and shrooms about 50 times all together... the only time I had an experience where shit happened that almost seemed schizophrenic, was this one time when I shroomed and convinced myself that everybody on the internet was actually me on a different account. It scared the shit out of me, as I decided I was a festering sore of a person and using the internet to convince myself I was rational, but I realized how wacky the idea was an hour or two after it got into my head.

Is that really schizophrenic-type stuff? How exactly do you define symptoms of schizophrenia?


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You really are the worst kind of person.



Edited by Tchan909 (10/31/07 08:08 PM)


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Offlinexpl0de
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #7582287 - 10/31/07 08:28 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Tchan909 said:
I've tripped on acid and shrooms about 50 times all together... the only time I had an experience where shit happened that almost seemed schizophrenic, was this one time when I shroomed and convinced myself that everybody on the internet was actually me on a different account. It scared the shit out of me, as I decided I was a festering sore of a person and using the internet to convince myself I was rational, but I realized how wacky the idea was an hour or two after it got into my head.

Is that really schizophrenic-type stuff? How exactly do you define symptoms of schizophrenia?



i think schizophrenia is more of thinking that people are always after u
anyways i dont think its good to even be worrying that ur not mentally healthy


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: xpl0de]
    #7582319 - 10/31/07 08:38 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks for the knowledge. I feel pretty safe, and have no schizo tendencies whatsoever. I just wanted to talk about it because the last thing you need going into a shroom trip is worrying about whether you are schizophrenic or not (because if you're worrying about it, the shrooms will give you ample evidence with which to worry).


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Offlineopensaysme
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: g00ru]
    #7582370 - 10/31/07 08:52 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Schizophrenia is a series of symptoms not just one thing. Also the definition on it is still disputed to this day among psychologists.

Whoever said acid is more likely to make mental illness come about than shrooms is completely wrong. I could see where you're coming from i guess in that acid's duration is a lot longer which would cause someone to be in that altered state for a greater amount of time. But shrooms can be just as damaging to the fragile psyche. Trust me.


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OfflineDimensionX
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: opensaysme]
    #7582521 - 10/31/07 09:54 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Funny thing about the idea of insanity, as long as you are doing what other people expect you to do, you are classed as sane. You can be a real arrogant jerk, obsessed with putting other people down and deluded about your own status etc. But you wont be classed as insane, you will just be known as a jerk. This behaviour seems to be insane to me, but since so many other people do it, its regarded as normal human behavior. But if you start seeing yourself or other people from a perspective their not used too or have never even considered, suddenly your know as insane. Which would you rather be, a sane conformist, or an insane genius :grin:


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Offlineyageman
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: opensaysme]
    #7582541 - 10/31/07 10:02 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

If I want to a psychologist and told them about all the crazy shit I have seen while on psychedelics they would label me as schizophrenic after the first few sessions,(after I told them how some of these ideas still feel very real to me).

I have deaths on both sides of my family because of this "disorder".
(suicides).

I didnt know this until after I had tripped atleast 60 times.
I can tell you that I experience these drugs differently than most people.

Every trip was epic, and it never lost its magic or "didnt give me visuals".....lol

I unlike some trippers understand schizophrenia and how these psychedelic states of mind have a whole fucking lot to do with the schizophrenic state of mind.

I would be diagnosed in a heart beat.
I have a close friend who is schizophrenic. He doesnt have a job, and lives off of his girlfriend and gov cheese.
I know exactly what he is going through because I have been to some similare places.
In reality though, sadly he is just a somewhat normal guy on alot of meds that make his fat ass skinny, and he doesnt feel like he should have to get a job. He is so damn comfortable with the fact that he has a moderate case of "schizophrenia".


I too am sick of people babbling about how people whos family's have a history of mental illness should never think its ok to even try these substances.
Thats just not something I would ever say to someone.

I have seen the fine line between schizophrenia and what is considered to be normal.
Thus, I am fully schizotypal and psychedelics did nothing but interest the hell out of me and teach me uncommon shit that I wouldnt give up for almost anything.

The most fucked up thing about this topic is the fact that some of these people are just really fucking good at seeing the depth of the psychedelic experience.
I know that my families history has something to do with how I experienced these drugs for so many years.
How different my experiences are from your average joe.

When I first picked up the saxophone at the age of 10, they actually thought I might be autistic because of how I could play after a few lessons, and how I interacted with the teacher.
As it turns out I have great verbal skills and am somewhat normal although I do exibit signs of mental issues. If you were to meet me you would have no idea that I have been to strange and unspeakable places.
I have more schizophrenia in my genes than almost anyone.
I just used it to my advantage as strange as it sounds.
I was a person who for some reason had a choice it would seem.
Go figure after 170 or so trips I stopped using psychedelics because I saw that the next trip could be the best ever, but I might not come back with my mind intact to the point where I can put myself back together or differentiate between "tripping balls in an uncommon way", and being somewhat normal.

Im not autistic and am not schizophrenic. To some degree these supposed curses are clearly blessings aswell. This is very clear to me anyways.

Too many blurred lines out there.

I would tend to say, that If you have a family history of mental illness(namely schizophrenia), you might be very special in the realm of tripping. Be careful would still be my last word though.

Nobody should be deprived of the psychedelic experience, especially if they are genetically better than your average joe when it comes to experiencing these drugs.

Its a slippery slope.

I too am sick of hearing people say that you are an idiot if you are genetically "inferior" and decide to take a psychedelic drug.

Thats just because people who say that dont know the half of it.

If you wonder about what schizophrenia has to do with the psychedelic experience, read up on it or ask denise mckenna.................lol.

That fuckin guy was never just messing around.


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[quote]Me_Roy said:
You moron. Material is material is material.  No 'thing' fixes any situation.  If anything were so simple we would be living in a much better world.[/quote] <-----the dumbest thing I have ever read in my life.
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OfflineDimensionX
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: yageman]
    #7582567 - 10/31/07 10:20 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I agree with you totally Yageman. Most people cant handle the schizophrenic type consciousness. But that is more their inability to cope with it rather than anything innately wrong with it. In the past people with these traits were regarded as mystics, who had knowledge other people weren't able to attain.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: DimensionX]
    #7582620 - 10/31/07 10:46 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

exactly..........

Its not all black and white.
There are alot of colors out there......lol


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[quote]Me_Roy said:
You moron. Material is material is material.  No 'thing' fixes any situation.  If anything were so simple we would be living in a much better world.[/quote] <-----the dumbest thing I have ever read in my life.
Thanks shroomery.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: yageman]
    #7582689 - 10/31/07 11:34 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

The term "schizophrenic" is bullshit, it's just a word that combines many different mental disorders into one thing which is improperly diagnosed. Doctors now diagnose each disorder separately because "schizophrenic" is so vague and not real.

quote]opensaysme said:
Schizophrenia is a series of symptoms not just one thing. Also the definition on it is still disputed to this day among psychologists.

Whoever said acid is more likely to make mental illness come about than shrooms is completely wrong. I could see where you're coming from i guess in that acid's duration is a lot longer which would cause someone to be in that altered state for a greater amount of time. But shrooms can be just as damaging to the fragile psyche. Trust me.




Exactly..


Edited by Caribou_Lou (10/31/07 11:35 PM)


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InvisibleTripityDooDaDay
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Caribou_Lou]
    #7582720 - 11/01/07 12:08 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Caribou_Lou said:
The term "schizophrenic" is bullshit, it's just a word that combines many different mental disorders into one thing which is improperly diagnosed. Doctors now diagnose each disorder separately because "schizophrenic" is so vague and not real.

quote]opensaysme said:
Schizophrenia is a series of symptoms not just one thing. Also the definition on it is still disputed to this day among psychologists.

Whoever said acid is more likely to make mental illness come about than shrooms is completely wrong. I could see where you're coming from i guess in that acid's duration is a lot longer which would cause someone to be in that altered state for a greater amount of time. But shrooms can be just as damaging to the fragile psyche. Trust me.


 

Exactly.. 




:thumbup:


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: DimensionX]
    #7582860 - 11/01/07 02:27 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

DimensionX said:Most people cant handle the schizophrenic type consciousness. But that is more their inability to cope with it rather than anything innately wrong with it. In the past people with these traits were regarded as mystics, who had knowledge other people weren't able to attain.



It's true that psychosis, or schizophrenia come in different flavors. But two very common ingredients are hallucinations (usually auditory) and/or severe delusions. Paranoid schizophrenia would be the classic example of this. Such hallucinations, which are usually unpleasant and most frequently manifest themselves auditorily as real voices of self-attack, playing on an individuals insecurities almost like the Puppet Master® and causing the person to get very upset. Add the possibility of the becoming absolutely convinced s/he is a targets of persecutive conspiracies and we're almost totally over the zone of genuine pathological cognitive and likely behavioral tendencies
There are other types of schizophrenia even more debilitating such as catatonic schizophrenia in which people become frozen in place almost like statues for hours or days. Other 'schizophreniacs' (i.e. "undifferentiated") are sometimes able to function on at least a basic level, though schizophrenia is degenerative in that the symptoms tend to get more severe over time.
There are accepted, specific, and quite objective qualifications to determine if someone is really 'sick' -- and schizophrenia is generally the most debilitating mental disorder we know of. This is not to denigrate the importance of analyzing our (contemporary Western) over-tendency to want to pathologize and categorize 'abnormal' human behavior, because that is a very, very important point. But this very legitimate criticism must be tempered with the convictions and knowledge that people who are disturbed enough to lose their ability to function basically and for extended periods of time more often than not need help and fall outside the limits of psychosociocultural norms.


Edited by Land_Crab (11/01/07 02:38 AM)


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: yageman]
    #7582945 - 11/01/07 04:10 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

yageman said:
Nobody should be deprived of the psychedelic experience, especially if they are genetically better than your average joe when it comes to experiencing these drugs.



:thumbup:

Quote:

landcrap said:
This is not to denigrate the importance of analyzing our (contemporary Western) over-tendency to want to pathologize and categorize 'abnormal' human behavior, because that is a very, very important point.



Everything comes in it's own degrees.  Many schizophrenics are functional and contributing members of society.  Many people who don't understand schizophrenia think of it as an illness, rather than a different state of mind for those who have it on a smaller scale.

edit: had to edit, post didn't make sense..kinda tired.


Edited by Helixx (11/01/07 04:20 AM)


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Offlineopensaysme
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Helixx]
    #7583042 - 11/01/07 06:34 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Yea but psychosis is different than schizophrenia.... i have personally witnessed psychosis in two of my friends.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: opensaysme]
    #7583076 - 11/01/07 07:01 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

=P


schizo ing out is good for everyone!


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: g00ru]
    #7583196 - 11/01/07 08:29 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

It would be one thing if you were feeling emotionally unstable and decided, hey why not? But if you're feeling well and prepared, go for it. I've been fine, that's just me. Anyway have a safe trip.:tongue2:


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Offlineopensaysme
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: blackfir]
    #7583598 - 11/01/07 11:04 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Yageman, have you stopped using psychedelics for good?

I read your post, i was just wondering if you feel you'll ever decide to get your feet wet again.

I'm interested in what people who have used a lot of psychedelics over the years have to say about why they decided to stop and what they've gained from it.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Land_Crab]
    #7583632 - 11/01/07 11:11 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

psychedelics are enlightening theyll just clear your shit up


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Offlineopensaysme
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Mastamike1118]
    #7583658 - 11/01/07 11:19 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I don't think that they're enlightening themselves.

I think they open up a shortcut to temporary enlightenment, which could promote you to work toward true enlightenment in everyday life. A glimpse if you will.

They can be very helpful in my opinion, but used in the wrong way they can also be quite detrimental.

I use them myself for both spiritual and recreational purposes, for me its great although i know some for whom its been bad.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: g00ru]
    #7583747 - 11/01/07 11:46 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

guruu said:
So...we've all read the above plenty of times. It's a common disclaimer. I just recently found out that my biological grandfather (whom I've never met) was schizophrenic. I've done psychedelics a number of times and have had some pretty powerful trips. I'm 19 years old, have a great life, and am mentally quite healthy.

I'm directing this question at anybody who is knowledgeable with regards to mental illness and psychedelics: If I've already tripped plenty of times and have had no recognizable change in mental health, is there still a chance that future trips could push me over the edge ? (although in my case I'm not even sure there is an edge to be pushed over). Don't take a future increase in trip intensity into account, I'm quite sure many of my trips have been intense enough to theoretically induce a mental illness.

I realize there is a chance of course, and that I should always take extreme caution (set and setting, etc.) but if it hasn't already happened, is there a pretty good chance that it never will?




The onset of schizophrenia generally begins around age 20 and gets progressively worse over time.

If you are predisposed, using stimulants and psychedelics (including dissociatives) may heighten the chances of development.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Crystal G]
    #7583909 - 11/01/07 12:30 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

hell yea i agree opensaysme one of my friends gets caught up in repetitive thought patterns its horrible to see him do it to himself when he could just as easily be out of it enjoying himself tripping...


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OfflineVisionary Tools
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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: g00ru]
    #7584088 - 11/01/07 01:33 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

So...we've all read the above plenty of times. It's a common disclaimer. I just recently found out that my biological grandfather (whom I've never met) was schizophrenic.

Ahh, schizophrenia. It sounds so much more professional than "That person is mental and I haven't a clue what's really wrong with them."
http://www.manchester.ac.uk/press/title,39950,en.htm

I'm directing this question at anybody who is knowledgeable with regards to mental illness and psychedelics: If I've already tripped plenty of times and have had no recognizable change in mental health, is there still a chance that future trips could push me over the edge?

Set and setting is key. I suffer from depression. One day, I wasn't really listening to my body, experimented with a research chemical, and overdosed. Fever, felt awful, patterns and visuals were happening so fast it was like being on a roller coaster but so fast it was nauseating, but at least it was only closed eye. fucked with my sleeping pattern for days, and I suffered a nervous breakdown when coming down.

You can't say really until you know yourself and your substance. Each new experience can have the risk, disappointments, but also pleasure and insights.

? (although in my case I'm not even sure there is an edge to be pushed over). Don't take a future increase in trip intensity into account, I'm quite sure many of my trips have been intense enough to theoretically induce a mental illness.

There you go. Now you know it's not the drug that pushes one into psychosis, it's stress, be it physical or mental. Or in my case, stupidity, taking unknown RC's, then tripping out in totally the wrong mindset.

I realize there is a chance of course, and that I should always take extreme caution (set and setting, etc.) but if it hasn't already happened, is there a pretty good chance that it never will?

As long as you feel good, feel relaxed, and don't really have any major worries bugging you. And when dosing, be careful.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Visionary Tools]
    #7584236 - 11/01/07 02:18 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Thanks to the above, that was a very useful post.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Visionary Tools]
    #7584402 - 11/01/07 03:09 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Visionary Tools said:
Ahh, schizophrenia. It sounds so much more professional than "That person is mental and I haven't a clue what's really wrong with them."





LOL, its so true... i swear psychiatrists/psychologists just label anything that they dont understand as "schizophrenic." they do have typical behaviors though that characterize them--disorganized pattern of thought, completely scatterbrained, difficulty in verbal communication with other human beings, things like that.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Land_Crab]
    #7584669 - 11/01/07 04:32 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Personally I believe "schizophrenia" is just a label for any extremely serious mental issue in which psychologists have little understanding of whats actually happening. Realistically the psychologist would have to be "insane" as well in order to understand the individuals perception of reality.
Why such a strong correlation between schizophrenia and psychedlics?
Schizophrenia in my understanding is the collapse of the self. They have an identity crisis so powerful that they don't know WHAT they are anymore. The voices they hear are actually their own thoughts, they feel so disassociated with their own thoughts that when they hear themselves vocalize in the mind they interpret them as external voices. What is the most powerful aspect of the psychedelic experiance? THE LOSS OF A SELF, EGO LESS, REALIZING YOU DONT EXIST THE WAY YOU ONCE ASSUMED. This being said it is obvious why psychedlics can trigger schizophrenia. Marijuana is also like shrooms but a much much more mild sense of egoloss, you get a more third person perception of yourself.
My family has a huge record of schizophrenia and iv done shrooms many times and have evolved spiritually quite drastically.
In my opinion schizophrenia is a "disease" only in the mind and IS NOT a result of a malfunctioning brain.

It can be overscome and cured only to produce a more aware person.

An insane person drowns in the smae thing a mystic swims in.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: soldatheero]
    #7586280 - 11/02/07 12:37 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Soldatheero, it sounds like you have never met a schizophrenic person, i know schizophrenic people and they have more sense of who they are than the majority of people i have met or know. Schizophrenia is not a disease.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Helixx]
    #7586507 - 11/02/07 03:04 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I have a small story to contribute.

Last time I dosed shrooms I had overall a pretty good time. It was a mild dose of about 1.8g which is all I really need to get high nowadays.

As I was coming down, my tripping buddy and I smoked a fat J. I had'nt smoked anything for about 4 months so I was blazed off my ass. I started getting crazy paranoia freshmen year of college from smoking weed which ultimately led to my quitting for good. Now everytime I try a little, I get "happy high" for a small while and then I just become paranoid and depressed because I feel guilty for smoking or something...

Anyways, these paranoia are always benign in nature, and usually dont affect anyone outside of my own head too much. I just become withdrawn, as I attempt to straighten my head out, and make some sense of life, despite that I am high as shit.

So this trip was ending and I smoked a J, and soon I was off my rocker. I was seeing shpongle faces in the ocean background of a video game we were playing. These hallucinations were so intense that I had to stop playing cause I was afraid I was truly losing my mind.

Suddenly I remembered that my family has a small circle of mentally unstable folks, and that I have a genetic potential for crazyness. At this point I convince myself that I am truly mad, and become extremely quiet as I try to calm myself and assimilate this new way of life. "Being insane isnt so bad right? I mean, I won't get to do what I want to do, and my family will probably be very sad..." I thought to myself, opening new pathways for self mental torture.

Since I tried LSD I have decided that it is too long of an experience for me to truly enjoy. Shrooms are just right for me. They last long enough to do a few cool things, and they end just when its starting to get old.

In conclusion, I have come to believe that I have the mental capacity to truly lose the plot, and become "insane" and or just dumb. Everytime I come close to either, I realize that I can come back, with a little mental effort. This is comforting to me, and allows me to take mushrooms with a little less concern.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: psychonautix]
    #7586717 - 11/02/07 06:59 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Hasn't anyone mentioned the fact that this would exclude everyone (on average)?

There's several sources for this information, but basically, even if your faimly is limited to 2 parents, there is a 75 percent chance you'll have a history. Add to that whether or not YOU have a mental illness, and you'll raise the odds to 88% (presuming even distribution).

So are only 12% of the population able to trip?

This seems like a dumb concept


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: johnm214]
    #7587358 - 11/02/07 11:15 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

^^Are you including all mental disorders, or just schizophrenia? Because I understand many families have SOME sort of disorder, but psychedelics drugs are known to trigger specifically some type of schizophrenia.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Helixx]
    #7587376 - 11/02/07 11:19 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Helixx said:
Soldatheero, it sounds like you have never met a schizophrenic person, i know schizophrenic people and they have more sense of who they are than the majority of people i have met or know. Schizophrenia is not a disease.




This is a really silly statement.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: opensaysme]
    #7587588 - 11/02/07 12:13 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

yea, schizophrenics CAN be tamed, but sometimes they have brief episodes... it generally happens when they think the universe is coming out to get them, because all the hidden signs, all the voices, the coincidences that are are so SURREAL it comes together and finally collapses. It is a mark of synchronicity at its finest.

i recall when i was in the psych ward, i tried to help out one REALLY schizophrenic girl who thought that 3 of her friends were out to kill her, and she could hear their voices in her head plotting evil horrible shit to do to her. now ive had this happen to me before so i tried to help her and reason with her.

i asked her how they could read her thoughts and see exactly what she was doing, and she somehow convinced herself that her friends had a magic ball that could see and hear everything that she was doing. LOL no seriously... she actually called the police several times after hearing that the voices were coming over to kill her parents or some shit.

anyways, i asked a few questions about "them," whether they work or were students, and she said they were students. it was on a weekday in the daytime so i said "they should still be in school at this time. how is it possible that theyre hovering over this magical crystal ball stalking you all day?" to which she replied "i dunno... let me ask them." LOL. then she laid on her bed and talked to the voices for a bit.

i tried again. i tried speaking to her voices. i made sure to say quite offensive things to them to provoke a reaction out of "them." but i noticed they did not respond to me, and i asked her if they even made a comment about me, to her, in her brain, and she said no. i said "but if they can see and hear everything that youre doing and whats going on around you, then howcome they couldnt hear me talking shit about them?" to which she was baffled. I could tell it was at that starting point that she began to question whether her delusions were real.

Unfortunately, I departed the day after so I could not work more with her. but I think she worsened over time. Its a pity that none of the psychiatrists at the clinic care enough about the patients to treat them by playing into their games and spotting the fallacies in their logic, and proving it to them. Instead, they just restrain em and sedate em. it solves nothing.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: soldatheero]
    #7587730 - 11/02/07 12:52 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

soldatheero said:
An insane person drowns in the smae thing a mystic swims in.



thumbs up


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Konyap]
    #7587744 - 11/02/07 12:56 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

pychonautix, people see faces in generally everything we possibly can.
less lookin up at the clouds was nuff to drive one mad


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Mastamike1118]
    #7588159 - 11/02/07 02:47 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Mastamike1118 said:
psychedelics are enlightening theyll just clear your shit up




not necessarily.. trust me.. i became "mentally ill" because of LSD, and my family history , you know genetics! did it first when i was 12 (LSD that is) and was diagnosed bipolar when i was 12... and in the following 4 years i went through 4 vials.. i don't even know the nu mber of times Ive tripped but approximately half a thousand times in a 4 year period, usually in large doses... I'm not demonizing LSD or advocating its use the only thing I'm advocating is to think seriously about what you put in your body, and then make the decision...... you never know, shit happens


--------------------



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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: leafing]
    #7588297 - 11/02/07 03:30 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

leafing said:


not necessarily.. trust me.. i became "mentally ill" because of LSD, and my family history , you know genetics! did it first when i was 12 (LSD that is) and was diagnosed bipolar when i was 12... and in the following 4 years i went through 4 vials.. i don't even know the nu mber of times Ive tripped but approximately half a thousand times in a 4 year period, usually in large doses... I'm not demonizing LSD or advocating its use the only thing I'm advocating is to think seriously about what you put in your body, and then make the decision...... you never know, shit happens




No offense dude but I can't respect your opinion if what your saying is true. That is a text book definition of irresponsible and stupid.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: JstHereFrTheCake]
    #7588388 - 11/02/07 03:57 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Well if what hes saying is true he was just young and he learned his lesson.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Moo456]
    #7588451 - 11/02/07 04:10 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

i dont see how a drug like lsd would make somebody bipolar. schizo maybe, but bipolar???

i see alcohol as more of a drug that makes people bipolar. alcoholics, and bipolars, are typically people who just cant control their emotions, in my opinion.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Moo456]
    #7588452 - 11/02/07 04:10 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I'm sure hes aware it was irresponsible, thats not the point.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: soldatheero]
    #7588632 - 11/02/07 04:58 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I don't believe there is a direct cause and effect relationship between psychedelics and mental illness but their effect on consciousness should definitely be studied further. I think for leafing, improper usage of LSD at such a young age acted as a catalyst since he was already predisposed to such condition.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Land_Crab]
    #7588733 - 11/02/07 05:31 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Mental illness or the lack thereof, translation; it's non-existent. Whatever those believe is what manifests into reality. The Law of Attraction is very real, anyone who takes Psychedelics or Entheogens should know why (DMT!?). If you don't, it's because human consciousness is nothing more than a dream state. What you experience when you're awake is in actuality, merely a dream, whether you'd like to believe it or not. Your dreams are closer to reality than anything.

The idea of heaven, "Christ-Consciousness" or the fourth-dimensional mind-state; is when all humans on this planet realize this, and heaven is then brought to Earth (metaphorically speaking). Heaven is not some mystical place you go to when you die. It's the complete opposite; it's a mental state that all beings will experience through enlightenment, while they're alive. This is heaven, this is paradise, and we just have been interfered with since day one on this planet. That's why it hasn't happened yet, however now we have nature on our side. The biggest polar shift in human consciousness begins now, a mental paradigm will initiate fully by 2008. From there, everything will take its all-natural course.

How is this going to happen? When will it happen? Right now as you read this. During the "Age of Aquarius" aka. The Apocalypse to the Greeks, oh and don’t be deceived, Apocalypse means “The Revealing.” The New Age starts after the Age of Aquarius, 2008-2012.

Oh and as a side note, if ANYTHING, regarding mental illness or a family history of illness. The reason there’s an on-going history or repetitive cycle of this “illness” is the result of not cleansing the mental psyche. There’s only one way to do this, through Psychedelics or Entheogens.

Entheogen -

Any plant or chemical substance that induces a mystical experience.

En - Greek: "into or within" to encapsulate.

Theo - Greek: God

Gen - Greek: To generate or engender - "to bring into existence"

The word is derived from the Greek word "Theo" or "God" and "Genesis" which means "becoming". The word entheogen literally means, "becoming god" or "becoming godlike".

Psychedelic - To make the mind clear or visible. Latin: Psyche - meaning mind, delos - meaning to make clear or visible

PS. Excuse me for my enthusiasm.


Edited by BiG_StroOnZ (11/02/07 05:36 PM)


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: BiG_StroOnZ]
    #7589042 - 11/02/07 06:53 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Entheogen -

Any plant or chemical substance that induces a mystical experience.

En - Greek: "into or within" to encapsulate.

Theo - Greek: God

Gen - Greek: To generate or engender - "to bring into existence"

The word is derived from the Greek word "Theo" or "God" and "Genesis" which means "becoming". The word entheogen literally means, "becoming god" or "becoming godlike".

Psychedelic - To make the mind clear or visible. Latin: Psyche - meaning mind, delos - meaning to make clear or visible



excellent information


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: JstHereFrTheCake]
    #7589642 - 11/02/07 10:03 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

JstHereFrTheCake said:
Quote:

leafing said:


not necessarily.. trust me.. i became "mentally ill" because of LSD, and my family history , you know genetics! did it first when i was 12 (LSD that is) and was diagnosed bipolar when i was 12... and in the following 4 years i went through 4 vials.. i don't even know the nu mber of times Ive tripped but approximately half a thousand times in a 4 year period, usually in large doses... I'm not demonizing LSD or advocating its use the only thing I'm advocating is to think seriously about what you put in your body, and then make the decision...... you never know, shit happens




No offense dude but I can't respect your opinion if what your saying is true. That is a text book definition of irresponsible and stupid.




He's got a point, you should respect his opinion. If someone who doesn't know anything about psychedelics were to read this thread and see the post saying that all they do is "clear your shit up," they could be seriously mislead.

Leafing gave another perspective on the issue, one thats more real in my opinion. It's a good warning to those that could possibly have trouble with these experiences.

Wouldn't want some kid dosing a stupid amount of LSD because he's confused and thinks that "PSYCHEDELICS ARE THE ANSWER!!!".


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: opensaysme]
    #7590047 - 11/03/07 01:38 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

opensaysme said:
Quote:

JstHereFrTheCake said:
Quote:

leafing said:


not necessarily.. trust me.. i became "mentally ill" because of LSD, and my family history , you know genetics! did it first when i was 12 (LSD that is) and was diagnosed bipolar when i was 12... and in the following 4 years i went through 4 vials.. i don't even know the nu mber of times Ive tripped but approximately half a thousand times in a 4 year period, usually in large doses... I'm not demonizing LSD or advocating its use the only thing I'm advocating is to think seriously about what you put in your body, and then make the decision...... you never know, shit happens




No offense dude but I can't respect your opinion if what your saying is true. That is a text book definition of irresponsible and stupid.




He's got a point, you should respect his opinion. If someone who doesn't know anything about psychedelics were to read this thread and see the post saying that all they do is "clear your shit up," they could be seriously mislead.

Leafing gave another perspective on the issue, one thats more real in my opinion. It's a good warning to those that could possibly have trouble with these experiences.

Wouldn't want some kid dosing a stupid amount of LSD because he's confused and thinks that "PSYCHEDELICS ARE THE ANSWER!!!".




Children don't need Psychedelics, this is obvious. However there's a reason for this, and it’s because a child's natural mind state is highly-psychedelic. In the human-beings' stages of adolescence (Typically 0-12 Years), the natural DMT levels are exceedingly elevated; a newborn's natural DMT levels are in fact remarkably high, and as they get older their DMT levels begin to wean.

Typically, once puberty is set in motion the levels begin to rapidly drop. This is a result of Testosterone in Men, and Estrogen in Woman; These hormones almost have a cataclysmic affect on the bodies’ natural production of endogenous DMT.

Could I go in greater detail? Of course, but I’ll keep it simple and leave it for your own investigation...

Example: The first time you consumed the Psilocybe, your initial reaction was more in likely, “What is this?” or as I like to call it, “I feel like I’m a kid again.”


Edited by BiG_StroOnZ (11/03/07 01:39 AM)


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: BiG_StroOnZ]
    #7590491 - 11/03/07 09:20 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Children don't need Psychedelics, this is obvious. However there's a reason for this, and it’s because a child's natural mind state is highly-psychedelic. In the human-beings' stages of adolescence (Typically 0-12 Years), the natural DMT levels are exceedingly elevated; a newborn's natural DMT levels are in fact remarkably high, and as they get older their DMT levels begin to wean.

Typically, once puberty is set in motion the levels begin to rapidly drop. This is a result of Testosterone in Men, and Estrogen in Woman; These hormones almost have a cataclysmic affect on the bodies’ natural production of endogenous DMT.

Could I go in greater detail? Of course, but I’ll keep it simple and leave it for your own investigation...

Example: The first time you consumed the Psilocybe, your initial reaction was more in likely, “What is this?” or as I like to call it, “I feel like I’m a kid again.”




Yeah, when you look at little kids walking around it really is like they are tripping. They're staring wide eyed at everything like they're seeing it for the first time (which in many cases they are). I have no doubt that the ages of 5-10 were the happiest years of my life, for just that reason.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: opensaysme]
    #7590637 - 11/03/07 10:44 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

opensaysme said:
Quote:

JstHereFrTheCake said:
Quote:

leafing said:


not necessarily.. trust me.. i became "mentally ill" because of LSD, and my family history , you know genetics! did it first when i was 12 (LSD that is) and was diagnosed bipolar when i was 12... and in the following 4 years i went through 4 vials.. i don't even know the nu mber of times Ive tripped but approximately half a thousand times in a 4 year period, usually in large doses... I'm not demonizing LSD or advocating its use the only thing I'm advocating is to think seriously about what you put in your body, and then make the decision...... you never know, shit happens




No offense dude but I can't respect your opinion if what your saying is true. That is a text book definition of irresponsible and stupid.




He's got a point, you should respect his opinion. If someone who doesn't know anything about psychedelics were to read this thread and see the post saying that all they do is "clear your shit up," they could be seriously mislead.

Leafing gave another perspective on the issue, one thats more real in my opinion. It's a good warning to those that could possibly have trouble with these experiences.

Wouldn't want some kid dosing a stupid amount of LSD because he's confused and thinks that "PSYCHEDELICS ARE THE ANSWER!!!".




shit yea but telling people that itll fuck you up mentally isnt going to help them neither


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: Mastamike1118]
    #7590643 - 11/03/07 10:48 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

oh god i know what you mean..
psychedelics and depression do not mix!!!!!!
for me it always increases the risk of a bad and very sad trip :frown:


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: BiG_StroOnZ]
    #7591149 - 11/03/07 01:38 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Can you send me a link to where you got this information. I thought that DMT in the human brain was just speculation and little about it was understood. My childhood was happy and new but it wasn't psychedelic.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: jellyfish]
    #7591160 - 11/03/07 01:41 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

jellyfish said:
Can you send me a link to where you got this information. I thought that DMT in the human brain was just speculation and little about it was understood. My childhood was happy and new but it wasn't psychedelic.




Well they aren't actually tripping but you can draw a strong parallel.


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Re: "Those with history of family illness should not do psychedelics" [Re: g00ru]
    #7591169 - 11/03/07 01:43 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Taking mushrooms gave me sensations that surprised me a lot. They weren't new sensations; I simply hadn't experienced them since I was a little child. I definitely think there is something to this idea.

That said, while it is a fact that the human brain produces and uses DMT to some end, I don't think it is a fact that the younger you are, the more DMT you have. I would like to know where this piece of info comes from.


--------------------
Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



Edited by Tchan909 (11/03/07 01:43 PM)


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