|
Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 21,287
Loc: The Ocean of Notions
Last seen: 5 months, 23 days
|
Finnegan's Wake...
#7578551 - 10/30/07 09:41 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Has anyone actually read this?
What a bunch of tripe.
If this is a great work of literature, you can truss me up and put an apple in my mouth, because I'm a fucking pig.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
|
Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
|
|
You don't get it. It's a work of genius.
Sure, you have to know old-school Irish to really grok it, but R.A. Wilson and T. McKenna explain how it's loaded with incredible puns and explanations of the Function of the Universe and the Purpose of Life.
It also has no beginning or end, but goes around in a loop, which is pretty cool, imo.
|
Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 21,287
Loc: The Ocean of Notions
Last seen: 5 months, 23 days
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: Middleman]
#7578606 - 10/30/07 09:53 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
I'm 99% sure that a goodly percentage of those words are just made up.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
|
DirtMcgirt
in a pinch



Registered: 10/20/04
Posts: 2,213
Loc: city of angels
|
|
I agree. I always respected it for its ambition but really I found it pretentious and think its favor is the result of celebrity. It was Joyce's final work. Everybody wants/wanted it to be an English language masterpiece.
-------------------- "And we, inhabitants of the great coral of the Cosmos, believe the atom (which still we cannot see) to be full matter, whereas, it too, like everything else, is but an embroidery of voids in the Void, and we give the name of being, dense and even eternal, to that dance of inconsistencies, that infinite extension that is identified with absolute Nothingness and that spins from its own non-being the illusion of everything."
|
Hyper_Panda_GO
Team Action!


Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 9,720
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
|
|
I'll read it before I die, guarantted, but not now
-------------------- There is no valid reason you should be reading this
|
Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 21,287
Loc: The Ocean of Notions
Last seen: 5 months, 23 days
|
|
I tried to read it.
But seriously, it is just inpenetrable.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
|
Individual
Bass Addict


Registered: 12/20/06
Posts: 6,666
Loc: Reality Loophole
|
|
Quote:
Hyper_Panda_GO said: I'll read it before I die, guarantted, but not now
Same goes for me. Guaranteed.
-------------------- THE PHILOSOPHY OF LIBERTY <---
|
WhiskeyClone
Not here


Registered: 06/25/01
Posts: 16,509
Loc: Longitudinal Center of Canada ...
|
|
A lot of people, including friends of Joyce, believe the book is a joke, meant to bait pretentious members of the literary community into praising it as a masterpiece. I've read a few excerpts, and it looks pretty unreadable.
-------------------- Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man. For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire. Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it. ~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"
|
Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
|
|
If you've read some of R.A.W.s comments about it in Prometheus Rising, and listened to McKennas lectures about it, you'd know that it IS a joke, but also a work of literary genius.
|
Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 21,287
Loc: The Ocean of Notions
Last seen: 5 months, 23 days
|
|
Quote:
WhiskeyClone said: A lot of people, including friends of Joyce, believe the book is a joke, meant to bait pretentious members of the literary community into praising it as a masterpiece. I've read a few excerpts, and it looks pretty unreadable.
Quote:
End here. Us then. Finn, again! Take. Bussoftlhee, mememormee! Till thousandsthee. Lps. The keys to. Given! A way a lone a last a loved a long the riverrun, past Eve and Adam's, from swerve of shore to bend of bay, brings us by a commodius vicus of recirculation back to Howth Castle and Environs.
Quote:
though a day be as dense as a decade, no mouth has the might to set a mearbound to the march of a landsmaul, in half a sylb, helf a solb, holf a salb onward the beast of boredom, common sense, lurking gyrographically down inside his loose Eating S.S. Collar is gogoing of whisth to you sternly how -- Plutonic loveliaks twinnt Platonic yearlings -- you must, how, in undivided reawlity draw the line somewhawre.
And, last but not least...
Quote:
The answer, to do all the diddies in one dedal, would sound: from pulling himself on his most flavoured canal the huge chesthouse of his elders (the Popapreta, and some navico, navvies!) he had flickered up and flinnered down into a drug and drunkery addict, growing megalomane of a loose past. This explains the litany of septuncial lettertrumpets honorific, highpitched, erudite, neoclassical, which he so loved as patricianly to manuscribe after his name. It would have diverted, if ever seen, the shuddersome spectacle of this semidemented zany amid the inspissated grime of his glaucous den making believe to read his usylessly unreadable Blue Book of Eccles, édition de ténèbres, (even yet sighs the Most Different, Dr. Poindejenk, authorised bowdler and censor, it can't be repeated!) turning over three sheets at a wind, telling himself delightedly, no espellor mor so, that every splurge on the vellum he blundered over was an aisling vision more gorgeous than the one before t.i.t.s., a roseschelle cottage by the sea for nothing for ever, a ladies tryon hosiery raffle at liberty, a sewerful of guineagold wine with brancomongepadenopie and sickcylinder oysters worth a billion a bite, an entire operahouse
Yes, it is possible to tease some meaning out of some of those sentences. But there are probably 50 pages of actual content in a 500+ page book.
Quote:
Joyce himself said;
I've put in so many enigmas and puzzles that it will keep the professors busy for centuries arguing over what I meant, and that's the only way of insuring one's immortality.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
|
Quote:
Hyper_Panda_GO said: I'll read it before I die, guarantted, but not now
Take good care of yourself. I'm with Madtown. It's pretentious crap and a great grand glorious fuck you to all academic suckers who buy into it.
--------------------
|
Hyper_Panda_GO
Team Action!


Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 9,720
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: zappaisgod]
#7581568 - 10/31/07 04:43 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
I just like being amused by wordplay
It's the same deal with Pynchon, I hardly udnerstand what the fuck the man is talking about but I love immersing myself in his work
Also I'll need SOMETHING to do when i retire and smoke hookah through the rest of my day
-------------------- There is no valid reason you should be reading this
|
Hyper_Panda_GO
Team Action!


Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 9,720
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
|
|
Heh, I love how a topic about pretentious literary merit has one of my topics in the related thread box
-------------------- There is no valid reason you should be reading this
|
FleaAccela
Hip-HopEncyclopedia


Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 562
Last seen: 12 years, 3 months
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: zappaisgod]
#7581584 - 10/31/07 04:46 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
waste of paper, waste of time.
i once heard someone say "i just got done finishing 'finnegan's wake'".
i didnt say anything back to be nice, but wtf. you don't just pick it up and run through it like it's a fucking bukowski novel or some shit. are you kidding me?
naked lunch makes perfect fucking sense in comparison.
--------------------
I love rolling... my Katamari!!!
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: FleaAccela]
#7581629 - 10/31/07 05:00 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Two things 1. Naked Lunch makes perfect sense. No qualifiers necessary 2. Pynchon writes in ENGLISH. I have no idea what language Joyce used.
--------------------
|
Hyper_Panda_GO
Team Action!


Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 9,720
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: zappaisgod]
#7581719 - 10/31/07 05:37 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Pynchon, as well as Joyce, borrows from other languages
-------------------- There is no valid reason you should be reading this
|
lavod
Seal Whisperer


Registered: 06/23/06
Posts: 5,440
Loc: Over the rainbow
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: zappaisgod]
#7581724 - 10/31/07 05:40 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
93 Joyce used the language of a learned guru in a hypnagogic state. 93 93/93
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
|
Quote:
Hyper_Panda_GO said: Pynchon, as well as Joyce, borrows from other languages
He does?
--------------------
|
Hyper_Panda_GO
Team Action!


Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 9,720
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: zappaisgod]
#7581843 - 10/31/07 06:13 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Yes
I mean he doesn't incorporate them into his writing as much as Joyce does, but he does throw around sayings, names, sentences, and letters to give the situation a more authentic feel
I really wish I could quote of the top of my head but I can't but I know I'm right
-------------------- There is no valid reason you should be reading this
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
|
Having read almost all of Pynchon's work I must say that any comparison of gibberish to the Irish loon is not just off by degree. You can read (well I can) Pynchon without a translation.
--------------------
|
Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: zappaisgod]
#7582223 - 10/31/07 08:04 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
zappaisgod said:
Quote:
Hyper_Panda_GO said: I'll read it before I die, guarantted, but not now
Take good care of yourself. I'm with Madtown. It's pretentious crap and a great grand glorious fuck you to all academic suckers who buy into it.
What is with all the negativity? Some of you guys are so un-shroomy.  
|
bbaeker
baeker



Registered: 10/21/07
Posts: 66
Last seen: 14 years, 3 months
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: Middleman]
#7582486 - 10/31/07 09:37 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
dont worry middleman, these people just dont understand. im reading it out loud to my 1 1/2 yr old son, he loves it. sometimes he speaks the same language hah.
|
Hyper_Panda_GO
Team Action!


Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 9,720
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: zappaisgod]
#7582784 - 11/01/07 01:09 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Oh I didn't realize we were talking about the extent of foreign tongue
I thought it was in general
My bad
-------------------- There is no valid reason you should be reading this
|
TheCow
Stranger

Registered: 10/28/02
Posts: 4,790
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
|
|
If really want to read the book you need to get another book that acts as a guide to the real book. It will explain all of the weird shit Joyce is saying. Ive gone through the first 50 or so pages doing this, and in reality the book is fairly interesting. Not sure Ill ever finish it though, Ulysses on the other hand, is an incredible book
|
bbaeker
baeker



Registered: 10/21/07
Posts: 66
Last seen: 14 years, 3 months
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: TheCow]
#7593995 - 11/04/07 10:08 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
hey could you suggest a good book to do this with? I've been looking for something like that but im not sure where to go and what to look for.
|
Penguarky Tunguin
f n o r d


Registered: 08/08/04
Posts: 17,192
|
Re: Finnegan's Wake... [Re: bbaeker]
#7594023 - 11/04/07 10:16 AM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Joseph Campbell's A Skeleton's Key to Finnegans Wake
and
John Bishop's Joyce's Book of the Dark: Finnegans Wake
FW probably is the grandest joke of all time. Completely Irish and completely trickster. However, that doesn't stop it in anyway from being a literary masterpiece.
-------------------- Every mistake, intentional or otherwise, in the above post, is the fault of the reader.
|
|