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Offlinepasteface
pasty


Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 122
Last seen: 13 years, 8 months
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
    #7594961 - 11/04/07 03:15 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

jonathan_206 said:
I don't know a whole lot about dmt, but I know for a fact that a synthetic molecule does not have to be exactly the same to get grouped into the dmt "family". It's kind of like animal naming. There's a kind of animals and then different variational groups within that kind. But this is all often arbitrary  classification...





Ok you're right and wrong, there ARE many types of DMT but you really need to do some research. When people here say "DMT" without anything else in front of it (5-MeO for example) they are talking about N,N DMT which is a very specific molecule. Its like H2O is H2O is H2O. Two hydrogens, one oxygen arranged in a very specific way. N,N DMT is a bit more complex but the same idea applies, if it is even ONE atom off then its not N,N DMT.

Quote:

jonathan_206 said:
I'm not a chemist so I can't tell you the exact minute differences, but I used the example before of Hoffman and lsd. Hoffman synthesized MANY types of Lsd before he discovered lsd 25. What that means is it was close enough to put it in the same group, and they may have had similar effects, but it was not the exact same thing.





Again when people talk about LSD, they are talking about LSD-25. And again a very very specific molecule that is synthesized in a very very specific way. If you sold any other LSD analog on the street you would be accused of ripping people off and something violent would probably happen.

Also you said so yourself that you're not a chemist. So you have no way of evaluating any information you hear for truth or not and I hate to break it to you but what you currently believe is way off base.


Quote:

jonathan_206 said:
This btw, is one reason I think why designer drugs are notorious for going bad, because the molecule somewhere along the way might have had some change where it might even be minute, but it can have serious health risks.





designer drugs are notorious for being bad (they don't "go" bad, they were that way to begin with) because they are some one elses favorite combination of MDMA, 2C*, meth, and various other RC's and stimulants which may or may not also be you're favorite combination and the pills ingredients get misrepresented by not-so-honest and forgetful drug dealers as other things or other amounts. So while you think you were just getting 65 mg of MDMA, you instead get some random dose of 2CB and meth. That and the media needed stories on slow news days back in the late 80's early 90's. (and still do, this year they were warning parents where i live about meth that is flavored and colored like candy, as if someone would give meth away for free to anyone much less kids)


I don't mean to offend you but you're lack of knowledge and the way you feel you are absolutely correct is shocking and scary for someone on boards such as these. You need some good shrooms or acid to crack that little mind of yours imo :smile:


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InvisibleHelp on the Way
Slipknot420

Registered: 08/12/00
Posts: 2,893
Loc: Another World
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
    #7595567 - 11/04/07 05:51 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Sorry to be so blunt but you clearly know nothing about chemistry and you are making an idiot of yourself.


Quote:

jonathan_206 said:
I don't know a whole lot about dmt, but I know for a fact that a synthetic molecule does not have to be exactly the same to get grouped into the dmt "family". It's kind of like animal naming. There's a kind of animals and then different variational groups within that kind. But this is all often arbitrary classification...




This makes no sense. The drug DMT is not a family, and so doing DMT does not mean you are doing any drug in a huge family of chemicals. DMT is only one specific chemical, which stands for n,n-dimethyltryptamine. Yes it is in a family of chemicals (as are ALL chemicals) which are called tryptamines, and some tryptamines are more like DMT (n,n-dimethyltryptamine) than others, but there are no arbitrary classifications. There is one specific chemical structure that a molecule must have to be called DMT, and anything similar to it is NOT dmt. THere is only 1 DMT, and it is the exact same chemical in nature and in the lab.

Quote:

I'm not a chemist so I can't tell you the exact minute differences, but I used the example before of Hoffman and lsd. Hoffman synthesized MANY types of Lsd before he discovered lsd 25. What that means is it was close enough to put it in the same group, and they may have had similar effects, but it was not the exact same thing.




NO there is only 1 LSD. The others were lysergic acid chemicals, similar in structure, but NONE of the others were LSD (lysergic acid diethylamide). The 25 just means that it was the 25th lysergic acid that he made. These are different chemicals...they have similar structures but they are NOT the same. That is like saying the words "Dog" and "Dot" are the same because they are similar. They are not. These drugs are not the same things. DMT made in a lab is the exact same chemical as DMT found in nature. Albert Hoffman only made 1 LSD...the others are not still LSD's. There is only 1 LSD, there is only 1 DMT.



Quote:

I certainly didn't ask for all the attention.

Move on.




We are all focusing on this because you keep continually flooding misinformation on a board that is designed to clear up ignorance regarding this type of subject. DO SOME RESEARCH and learn something about chemistry before you go on these rants of misinformation.


Ok im done


--------------------
:shocked: *Divine Moments of Truth* :shocked:


"Limitless undying love which shines around me like a million suns - it calls me on and on across the universe" ~ John Lennon

"Once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right" ~The Grateful Dead

"Religionists, with their guaranteed eventual paradise, of which they know nothing, taking it all on 'faith,' can't be expected to understand or sympathize with those with a yen to storm the Gate of Heaven and see for themselves what all the praying's about!" ~Robert Hunter


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Invisiblemaggotz


Registered: 06/24/06
Posts: 7,539
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: Help on the Way]
    #7596212 - 11/04/07 08:21 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

:handth:


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Offlinea_guy_named_ai
Stranger
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Registered: 09/24/07
Posts: 767
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Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: maggotz]
    #7596527 - 11/04/07 09:21 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I have done research and I'm not a chemist, but I research what I talk about.

I have done research and it said hoffman synthesized MANY types of lsd.

And this isn't something that was new to me either, I knew they could have little differences.

I still hold my case.


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InvisibleHelp on the Way
Slipknot420

Registered: 08/12/00
Posts: 2,893
Loc: Another World
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
    #7599530 - 11/05/07 06:08 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

jonathan_206 said:


I have done research and it said hoffman synthesized MANY types of lsd.






omg no he didnt he only made 1 LSD...the others werent LSD they are lysergic acid derivitives but NOT LSD....wow

and as for being opposed to synthetic drugs...i really hope you never take tylenol, or any synthetic lab made antibiotics...



as for the original post, i cant even imagine trying DMT as my first psychedelic. Even low doses are pretty intense feeling, though nothing near a breakthrough. But the positive is that it is very short lasting. The thing is that i am not sure how much insight would be achieved from the low doses of dmt....

i think a low dose of shrooms would be the best start...but that is just my opinion


--------------------
:shocked: *Divine Moments of Truth* :shocked:


"Limitless undying love which shines around me like a million suns - it calls me on and on across the universe" ~ John Lennon

"Once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right" ~The Grateful Dead

"Religionists, with their guaranteed eventual paradise, of which they know nothing, taking it all on 'faith,' can't be expected to understand or sympathize with those with a yen to storm the Gate of Heaven and see for themselves what all the praying's about!" ~Robert Hunter


Edited by Help on the Way (11/05/07 06:14 PM)


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Offlinestrangladesh
masterOFpuppets
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Registered: 10/17/05
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Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: enesi]
    #7611597 - 11/08/07 03:07 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Oh there are ones that ship...trust me...

Again lets not talk about what is natural...lsd i not any more natural then 2ce


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Offlinetihkal
Stranger

Registered: 10/29/07
Posts: 8
Last seen: 16 years, 2 months
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: sleepy]
    #7621326 - 11/11/07 09:12 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

sleepy said:
as to the question of dose, i think its important to make the experience as enjoyable (cough) as possible, but relize that with a massive dose, there won't be a chance for fear to be there because the ego is totally dead. its the middle doses where people feel strong effects and sense where this may lead...
thats where bad trips tend to happen. but then again, like it's been said, in the right environment a bad trip is good.
good luck with guiding, that's the best part imo, to see the person on their first/important voyage






Yep. Thats why I was saying I like to give 'em a strong dosage the first time out. (i think)Letting go of your ego is the first important lesson in psychedelic travels. Well said .


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InvisibleHelp on the Way
Slipknot420

Registered: 08/12/00
Posts: 2,893
Loc: Another World
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: tihkal]
    #7621335 - 11/11/07 09:16 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

the good thing about a strong blast of DMT is that there is no time to really fight the ego loss....high doses of acid or mushrooms can get really scary during the long journey toward ego loss until it is finally reached


--------------------
:shocked: *Divine Moments of Truth* :shocked:


"Limitless undying love which shines around me like a million suns - it calls me on and on across the universe" ~ John Lennon

"Once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right" ~The Grateful Dead

"Religionists, with their guaranteed eventual paradise, of which they know nothing, taking it all on 'faith,' can't be expected to understand or sympathize with those with a yen to storm the Gate of Heaven and see for themselves what all the praying's about!" ~Robert Hunter


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Offlinetihkal
Stranger

Registered: 10/29/07
Posts: 8
Last seen: 16 years, 2 months
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
    #7621376 - 11/11/07 09:33 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

lysergic acid diethylamide, N,N-diethyl-D-lysergamide

There's only one LSD!

"LSD (LSD-25) is an ergoline derivative. It is commonly produced from reacting diethylamine with an activated form of lysergic acid. Activating reagents include phosphoryl chloride [52] and peptide coupling reagents [53]. Lysergic acid is made by alkaline hydrolysis of lysergamides like ergotamine, a substance derived from the ergot fungus on rye, or, theoretically, from ergine (lysergic acid amide, LSA), a compound that is found in morning glory (Ipomoea tricolor) and hawaiian baby woodrose (Argyreia nervosa) seeds"-wp


There are four possible isomers of LSD. iso-LSD, L-LSD, L-iso-LSD, and LSD. Only LSD is psychoactive.

The difference in LSD is really only the way it is stored, handled, and taken. By taken I mean that 4 drops of liquid from a properly handled container in the freezer is going to be a hell of a lot different trip than four hits on a sugar cube that has been in your backpack for a week. LSD is very unstable and fragile. Light and heat cause it to decompose rapidly. It is easy to fuck it up if the rules are not followed. Thats why I don't like blotter much either. That's what I think anyway.


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Offlinetihkal
Stranger

Registered: 10/29/07
Posts: 8
Last seen: 16 years, 2 months
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: Help on the Way]
    #7621384 - 11/11/07 09:37 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah It's an insane rocket blast straight into universal consciousness!

"Load universe into cannon, point at brain, Fire!" -TM


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InvisibleYHWH
Fuck, I'm drunk
Male

Registered: 09/30/07
Posts: 189
Loc: downstairs
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: Freedom]
    #7622068 - 11/11/07 01:52 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Personally, I think if you're going to do DMT (first time psychedelic or not) you should take a high dose and break through. If you're gonna do DMT do a lot. It's better to be completely out of your head than not breaking through and having the weird feelings of DMT, but still kinda aware of everything, you know?

This is just my opinion though.


--------------------
I never felt as empty as I feel today...


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Invisiblesleepy
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Registered: 01/17/05
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Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: Help on the Way]
    #7624238 - 11/12/07 12:44 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Help on the Way said:
the good thing about a strong blast of DMT is that there is no time to really fight the ego loss....high doses of acid or mushrooms can get really scary during the long journey toward ego loss until it is finally reached




"I think psychedelics are safer in large doses(i'm not talking about thumbprint sizes though) as far as bad trips go. They override your ego's defenses in large enough doses. you can't think your having a bad trip because you can't think at all beacause there is no you. :grin: Terrance McKenna and Andrew Weil MD have said this also."
-Chinacat72 
Come back ChinaCat!  :indian:


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Offlineehem
Stranger

Registered: 12/23/09
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Last seen: 12 years, 3 months
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: Freedom]
    #11704832 - 12/23/09 08:52 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

explain more.


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Offlineehem
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Registered: 12/23/09
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Last seen: 12 years, 3 months
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: ehem]
    #11704846 - 12/23/09 08:56 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

please


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Offlinephx1
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Registered: 07/13/07
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Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: tihkal]
    #11705000 - 12/23/09 09:33 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

tihkal said:
Yeah It's an insane rocket blast straight into universal consciousness!

"Load universe into cannon, point at brain, Fire!" -TM




You mean -AW


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Offlinealchemist smurf
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Re: Do you think low dose smoked DMT would be a good intro to psychedelics? [Re: Helixx]
    #14780877 - 07/17/11 09:14 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

The electrons would'nt be working the same way or something like that. I read that somewhere.


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